Oasis of the Seas: Denied (5/14/16)

[TravelerThom]

But you still can't fly with the EDL, it's no different than a Passport card. If you want to go the Grand Canyon, Cali or Florida by air, you still need a passport.

You are not allowed to fly into the US without a passport booklet (there are a few other items that are accepted, but not an EDL or passport card), however from the Toronto area you could drive to Buffalo (where the prices are often less expensive) and fly from there on an Ontario EDL.

 

I'll repeat that I have had a passport for over 40 years, and given my travel desires I wouldn't be without it. BUT a passport is not necessary for many people (despite claims to the contrary) for the traveling they wish to do.

 

BTW I think it is legal for US citizens (and presumably Canadian citizens) to fly into Canada without a Passport booklet, as Canadian regulations do not require US citizens to have a Passport. The catch is that Canada requires documentation for onward travel, and you probably would not be able to get a commercial air carrier to accept that the EDL or Passport card you intended to use to return to the US by surface was sufficient.

[FLSteve11]

 

I'll repeat that I have had a passport for over 40 years, and given my travel desires I wouldn't be without it. BUT a passport is not necessary for many people (despite claims to the contrary) for the traveling they wish to do.

 

 

I would make a slight addendum to that. A passport is not necessary for the traveling they wish do to, so long as no issues come up to change that plan (whether through their own fault or not). You can do a closed loop cruise with just a BC and drivers license, lots of people do. This works, so long as no unfortunate events occur. You miss the embark, you miss returning to the boat after an excursion, you get sick and need to be medically evacuated, etc. Think of it like insurance for closed loop cruises. You don't need it...until you need it!

[TravelerThom]

I would make a slight addendum to that. A passport is not necessary for the traveling they wish do to, so long as no issues come up to change that plan (whether through their own fault or not). You can do a closed loop cruise with just a BC and drivers license, lots of people do. This works, so long as no unfortunate events occur. You miss the embark, you miss returning to the boat after an excursion, you get sick and need to be medically evacuated, etc. Think of it like insurance for closed loop cruises. You don't need it...until you need it!

Being a physicist, I tend to look at estimated numbers to get a first order approximation. In a typical week in January 2016 there were 166,000 (lower) cruise berths leaving from Florida ports. Gross estimate #1: half of those passengers (many first timers) do not have a passport, so 83,000 non-passport holders. Gross estimate #2: not over 0.01% (166) of the total passengers will need emergency use of a passport (I think that 166 is way high, but I'm trying to be conservative); based on Gross Estimate #1 83 of those passengers already have a passport, and 83 passengers are stuck. Gross Estimate #3: it costs the stuck passengers 3 days @$250/day plus $135 for the emergency passport, so a cost close enough to say 3 days and $1000 (additional airfare, etc will have to be paid whether you have a passport or not, and merely having a passport does not guarantee that you will find an available airplane seat).

 

Now change the scenario and have all those 83,000 non-passport holders get passports at $135 each, for a total cost of $11,205,000. Compare the "insurance cost" of $11,205,000 for passports to the out-of-pocket expense of $83,000 ($1,000 to each of the 83 non-passport holders), and that is an extremely profitable insurance business that the Passport office is running.

 

If you change to 90% of passengers already having passports and only 10% (16,600) passengers not already in possession of a passport, the new passport cost for that 10% would be $2,241,000, and the projected out of pocket expense of not having a passport would be $17,000 (10% of the 166 emergency need passengers =~17 times $1,000 each). Again an exorbitant cost for insurance versus the amount of actual loss covered.

 

Note that in the several cases in the last few years that a closed loop cruise aborted outside the US (due to fire, electrical malfunction, etc), Homeland Security has given a blanket waiver for those without passports to return on charter flights without getting a passport.

 

Unless you think that considerably more than 166 cruise passengers departing Florida each week end up needing a passport for an emergency, the cost/benefit ratio is terrible. Most insurance schemes are very profitable for the seller, and the return to the purchasers is quite low.

[heatherandfred]

This reminds me of a story where I dropped my mom off at the docks at 57th St in NY. I went food shopping afterwards(lived in the BX) at the time. I received a frantic phone call just as I was bagging my groceries saying 'I forgot my passport!!'

So I rush home and find her passport, race all the way down to 57th in my car and literally she was the only one standing there and I gave her the passport. This was pre 9/11.

Sorry this happened to you.

[nbsjcruiser]

Being a physicist, I tend to look at estimated numbers to get a first order approximation. In a typical week in January 2016 there were 166,000 (lower) cruise berths leaving from Florida ports. Gross estimate #1: half of those passengers (many first timers) do not have a passport, so 83,000 non-passport holders. Gross estimate #2: not over 0.01% (166) of the total passengers will need emergency use of a passport (I think that 166 is way high, but I'm trying to be conservative); based on Gross Estimate #1 83 of those passengers already have a passport, and 83 passengers are stuck. Gross Estimate #3: it costs the stuck passengers 3 days @$250/day plus $135 for the emergency passport, so a cost close enough to say 3 days and $1000 (additional airfare, etc will have to be paid whether you have a passport or not, and merely having a passport does not guarantee that you will find an available airplane seat).

 

Now change the scenario and have all those 83,000 non-passport holders get passports at $135 each, for a total cost of $11,205,000. Compare the "insurance cost" of $11,205,000 for passports to the out-of-pocket expense of $83,000 ($1,000 to each of the 83 non-passport holders), and that is an extremely profitable insurance business that the Passport office is running.

 

If you change to 90% of passengers already having passports and only 10% (16,600) passengers not already in possession of a passport, the new passport cost for that 10% would be $2,241,000, and the projected out of pocket expense of not having a passport would be $17,000 (10% of the 166 emergency need passengers =~17 times $1,000 each). Again an exorbitant cost for insurance versus the amount of actual loss covered.

 

Note that in the several cases in the last few years that a closed loop cruise aborted outside the US (due to fire, electrical malfunction, etc), Homeland Security has given a blanket waiver for those without passports to return on charter flights without getting a passport.

 

Unless you think that considerably more than 166 cruise passengers departing Florida each week end up needing a passport for an emergency, the cost/benefit ratio is terrible. Most insurance schemes are very profitable for the seller, and the return to the purchasers is quite low.

 

 

You took up an awful lot of space to tell us the obvious. Of course most insurance schemes are profitable for the seller - they wouldn't sell it otherwise. Insurance all boils down to whether or not you want to take the personal risk in not having it. I'm 54 years old and have been paying house insurance for almost 30 years. I'm in the hole big time but its a risk I'm not willing to take and that's what it boils down to.

 

Regarding the passport issue. That is more than an insurance thing in truth. Our ten year passport cost $150 or $15 a year. In this day an age it makes no sense not to have one considering the cost of travelling. I'll spend $4K a year travelling and cruising so balking at $15 makes no sense on whatever level one might consider. In the case of the OP, had they had passports, they would all have been able to travel to Nassau to meet the ship and would have at least saved some part of their trip - a trip they spent a lot on and got nothing out of.

Edited May 22, 2016 by nbsjcruiser

[TravelerThom]

You took up an awful lot of space to tell us the obvious...

IMO thinking that insurance covering a multi-hundred-thousand dollar house, and that has a return on monies paid in of maybe 90% is the same as "insurance" covering a loss of approximately $1000 and that has a return of less than 1% of the monies paid in, is missing the “obvious” point.

 

My passport costs me about $1 per international trip I take, so I consider its cost insignificant. A family of three who think they might never need a passport might be justified in thinking that spending over $500 to get passports is not worthwhile.

 

BTW if you thought my post “took up an awful lot of space” you didn’t have to copy and repost the whole thing.

[Pennyscandy]

Have you called your travel agent? They may be able to intercede. Hope this will be resolved for you. We fly in the night before because delays happen. It's an extra expense to spend then night before, but in our 47 yrs my husband and I have traveled, we have seen all kinds of things happen. So sorry this happened. Call your travel agent. Good luck

[Isaboo]

I'm so sorry OP! :( Please do go on a cruise in the future but remember that the main objective for embarkation day is to get on the boat. We always try to get on as soon as they will let us..

[CHolliwood]

This story makes me ill, I could not imagine the feeling. I truly feel for you.

 

My brother in-law and his GF had missed a cruise out of New Orleans a year ago, I think it was Carnival or NCL.

 

His GF booked the cruise and flights herself, however when she booked the flights on Orbitz, she didn't fully understand the date/price matrix and booked a cheaper flight, not realizing it was actually the day after the cruise departed.

 

Fast forward 4 weeks later when they were supposed to fly out on a Saturday evening for their Sunday cruise, they realized the flight they had booked was for Monday night.

 

As there are only so many flights from Toronto to New Orleans that would get them there in time, and the fact that they would have to pay full price for another flight, they decided to not go on the cruise.

 

No $$ back on this one.

Edited June 3, 2016 by CHolliwood

[MAlagich]

With an eye on perspective, there are far worse things that can happen than missing an embarkation. That said...it's been 5 days since we attempted to board Oasis of the Seas and still a raw, exposed nerve sends waves of pain, anguish, and regret throughout my chest and down into my abdomen when the very suggestion of a cruise comes to mind.

 

My wife is taking it better than I am, at least these past few days. Her face wrought with tears and frustration as she attempted to distract our 20-month old daughter at the customs counter while I placed one phone call after another...not easy to forget.

 

We're first-time, would-be cruisers. Inexperience, poor time management, and some misfortune led us to this point: 25 min late for our 12:30-3:30pm check-in window. The ship leaves at 5:00pm.

 

Our shuttle driver made a valiant effort to get us there. Briefing us along the way, he warned clearing customs would be the biggest concern. Suitcase in hand, I scurried ahead of my wife and daughter to alert officers of our arrival.

 

To our relief, customs was quite accommodating and made quick work of our processing as they whisked us through security. As this was going on, a customs officer was radioing back and forth with someone on the Oasis. The already infrequent responses from the ship became even more tenuous.

 

Mere steps away from the stairs, a response came in through her ear piece that stopped her dead in her tracks. She looked at us and shook her head.

 

So. Close.

 

Here's where I wish future me could have interceded.

"We have a toddler with us!"

"My daughter and I only have passport cards, which are insufficient to meet you downline in Nassau!"

 

Perhaps something would have softened the heart of the individual on the other end.

 

The time was 4:00p. A full hour before departure.

 

I spent the next 5 hours calling, booking, pleading. I even looked into taking a ferry to Freeport, then perhaps swimming to Nassau. Ultimately, flying was the only option and I was getting mixed answers on whether or not a US passport card was sufficient to fly to the Bahamas. I finally rented a car and drove down to Miami International in order to get a definitive "No".

 

All options exhausted, we decided to fly home to Dallas the following day.

 

...

 

Once home, I spoke with a very sympathetic soul on the RCCL escalations team who was surprised we weren't let on-board given an hour remained. She asked that I first check with our trip insurance (LeisureCare) to see if our situation is covered. It is not - trip delays need to be at least 12 hours. I'll call the escalation team back today, but I'm not holding out much hope. We can't afford to take another trip for a while.

 

For those who share a similar experience or know someone who has (particularly with RCCL)...any positive experiences getting back on a ship with nominal cost? Refunds? Any success reaching out to Mr. Bayley's office? Or am I just a dolt who needs to come to terms with the fact that I'm at-fault for not getting us there in time?

 

TL;DR - I went full-Griswold and caused us to miss our cruise. Any chance of full or partial credit towards another?

 

-Chris

 

 

Hi Chris!

 

I'm sorry to read about your situation. Reading through some of the comments I would like to offer some assistance & advice for you.

 

1. Your "Passport Card" if not a PASSPORT per say. Its called a Global Entry card. Yes you may use this card to Cruise as long as it Originates and Ends in the US. You may also use the card to cross boarders into Canada & Mexico. It is always best to have the Passport/Passbook in the event that you have to fly in or out of another country. If your cruise had stopped in Porto Rico you would have had no problem being it is a US territory.

 

2. Most likely you are going to loose what fair you paid, but I have had success in contacting Michael Bayley & executive levels of management. His direct e-mail is:

 

mbayley@RCCL.com

 

Hopefully someone will reach out to you and offer some sort of compensation.

 

3. Lastly another person wrote about getting on the ship late. The Fact of the matter is it is US Boarder & Customes Protection that states when the last passenger can embark the ship..

 

This cut of is strict and definitive. It's is exactly 60 minutes before the ship is to depart. RCCL has no say at that point as they are required to file a full passenger manifest.

 

I hope this helps! & I look forward to hearing the results!

[southnam]

For how we arrived late? Simple.. we took an unnecessary trip down to Miami and miscalculated the time required to get back in time. I blew it.

I am very impressed at the OP for his handling of this unfortunate situation. I have seen people lose it over smaller issues that were 100% their fault.

 

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

[tlatrice]

This story makes me ill, I could not imagine the feeling. I truly feel for you.

 

My brother in-law and his GF had missed a cruise out of New Orleans a year ago, I think it was Carnival or NCL.

 

His GF booked the cruise and flights herself, however when she booked the flights on Orbitz, she didn't fully understand the date/price matrix and booked a cheaper flight, not realizing it was actually the day after the cruise departed.

 

Fast forward 4 weeks later when they were supposed to fly out on a Saturday evening for their Sunday cruise, they realized the flight they had booked was for Monday night.

 

As there are only so many flights from Toronto to New Orleans that would get them there in time, and the fact that they would have to pay full price for another flight, they decided to not go on the cruise.

 

No $$ back on this one.

 

Oh my God! How sad!!!!

[uksimonusa]

Hi Chris!

 

I'm sorry to read about your situation. Reading through some of the comments I would like to offer some assistance & advice for you.

 

1. Your "Passport Card" if not a PASSPORT per say. Its called a Global Entry card. Yes you may use this card to Cruise as long as it Originates and Ends in the US. You may also use the card to cross boarders into Canada & Mexico. It is always best to have the Passport/Passbook in the event that you have to fly in or out of another country. If your cruise had stopped in Porto Rico you would have had no problem being it is a US territory.

 

2. Most likely you are going to loose what fair you paid, but I have had success in contacting Michael Bayley & executive levels of management. His direct e-mail is:

 

mbayley@RCCL.com

 

Hopefully someone will reach out to you and offer some sort of compensation.

 

3. Lastly another person wrote about getting on the ship late. The Fact of the matter is it is US Boarder & Customes Protection that states when the last passenger can embark the ship..

 

This cut of is strict and definitive. It's is exactly 60 minutes before the ship is to depart. RCCL has no say at that point as they are required to file a full passenger manifest.

 

I hope this helps! & I look forward to hearing the results!

 

A Passport Card is not the same as a Global Entry Card.

[constable145]

Oh my God! How sad!!!!

I think you misplaced sad for another word that starts with S and ends with tupid.

 

That isn't missing a fine print detail. It is painfully obvious what date you are booking after you click on the cheaper flight listed on the matrix.

 

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

[jandlcruise]

Thank you for your kind expressions. Our policy provides 100% protection against severe circumstances (such as sickness) and partial protection for trip delay... but the delay needs to be 12-hours or longer and well documented.

 

We had to slog through 2 accidents on the I-95, made a wrong turn, and had 2 unscheduled stops for the little one. At most an 1.5 hour delay.

 

We were on that cruise and are so sorry about what happened. We arrived by car the day before and it took us at least an hour to go 20 miles at the end of the trip on I95. Unless you travel that often it is impossible to know how awful it can be. If we had been trying to navigate all that on the day of the cruise I would have been a basket case. Please don't let this deter you from cruising Oasis in the future. It was truly and wonderful ship.

[mollyeilis]

I think you misplaced sad for another word that starts with S and ends with tupid.

 

That isn't missing a fine print detail. It is painfully obvious what date you are booking after you click on the cheaper flight listed on the matrix.

 

Jinkies.

 

I had a very smart and savvy friend manage to book a roundtrip flight exactly backwards. Very costly international mistake on her part.

 

I personally sit there, reading everything out loud (preferably with at least one other person in the room listening to me, to make sure it sounds right), not assuming but reading every word, to make sure I"m doing it right. I've been booking travel for myself since I was 19 or so, and I'm beyond that age now, but I still do it. Because mistakes happen, and it doesn't mean anyone was stupid.

[fdthird]

Sorry you missed your cruise, but Royal has rules and you have to understand the reason they stick to them. Once you start bending rules, they go away!

[reallyitsmema]

Sorry you missed your cruise, but Royal has rules and you have to understand the reason they stick to them. Once you start bending rules, they go away!

 

The OP is fully aware of the rules and came back to this thread many times, taking full responsibility for their actions.

 

You might want to finish this thread and then move on to the update thread to see the good news.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2365816

[xxHadleyxx]

The OP is fully aware of the rules and came back to this thread many times, taking full responsibility for their actions.

 

You might want to finish this thread and then move on to the update thread to see the good news.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2365816

 

I agree--OP was reasoned and levelheaded and responsible in how they presented things. I was impressed.

[Aboat1]

The best advice I ever got from a fellow cruiser when I was terribly disappointed in something that happened to us on a cruise was...."Just think, you will have a great story to tell the rest of your life."

 

We tell our story first and often. We can now laugh about it. Give yourselves time. Try cruising again, and enjoy your time with your family...after all you have a great story to tell!:)

[BlueHerons]

We flew in the night before but visited Miami before heading to port. A couple accidents on the I-95, a missed turn, and some unscheduled stops for our daughter sapped an already stressed timeline. Again...my fault. But I always had 5pm on my mind.

 

Thank you for your kind expressions. Our policy provides 100% protection against severe circumstances (such as sickness) and partial protection for trip delay... but the delay needs to be 12-hours or longer and well documented.

 

We had to slog through 2 accidents on the I-95, made a wrong turn, and had 2 unscheduled stops for the little one. At most an 1.5 hour delay.

 

I just want to point out, as a South Florida resident, that people constantly come to the Florida Departures Board and insist that it only takes them 30 minutes to get between Fort Lauderdale and Miami.

 

This could not be further from the truth.

 

I make the drive 3 times a week at all time of day and night and it has never taken me less than 60 minutes to get from Las Olas to either downtown or South Beach.

 

On multiple occasions it has taken me three hours.

 

On a regular basis due to accidents and roadwork, 90 minutes.

 

If there is an accident on I95 the police will shut down the entire stretch and allow no traffic through because there are no shoulders wide enough for emergency vehicles. Police are instructed not to stop for speeding on that stretch of I95.

 

So sorry you went through this, glad it worked out in the end!

[cruiselvr04]

So sad for you! What a huge disappointment!

 

Our first cruise we had no idea about about anything. It was arranged by a travel agent. We flew in the same day getting into Miami at 1 pm for a cruise that left at 4 pm. Didn't know then that was dumb. We had a great time by the way.

 

Fast forward 27 years. More then 30 cruises now. We always fly or drive in at least the day before and are at the ship by 1000 or so boarding day. Found cruise critic a few cruises in and have gotten invaluable info from these boards. I do hope you will try again some day. Cruising is great fun and our favorite way to vacation by far.

 

Next time you will have loads of information from here to help you. And you can drive to Galveston ( the day before) and catch a ship there.

[Rosy1013]

This thread broke my heart! So sorry that happened to you, OP! It did help me finally convince my husband, first-time cruiser, that arriving in port a day prior is well-worth it.

[crusin gator]

Thank you for your kind expressions. Our policy provides 100% protection against severe circumstances (such as sickness) and partial protection for trip delay... but the delay needs to be 12-hours or longer and well documented.

 

We had to slog through 2 accidents on the I-95, made a wrong turn, and had 2 unscheduled stops for the little one. At most an 1.5 hour delay.

 

 

 

I want to put in my 2 cents... OP I am so sorry for what has happened to ya'll.

Can you ask the insurance company about your fears for your baby as far as the Zika virus?? As I know you both had concerns for all of you.

 

We are going on our cruise in 12 days and we live 4 hours away. I am considering maybe we should stay the night before???

 

I hope everything works out for ya'll.

[mumbumone]

My brother in law and family just boarded majesty today and they were so late, that they reopened the gate up and let them through security. I thought for sure they would never let them on.