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Princesss fined $40 million for pollution

Charles4515

By Charles4515,
in Princess Cruises

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500adverbs

500adverbs

Posted
Posted
Hold your horses on your supposed superior judgement there.

We've dine the Hawaii cruise out of LA 4 times and only been able to tender into Lahaina once out of all 4. Just because you're not feeling the wind currently doesn't mean it isn't rougher in shore where the tenders land, or that it isn't forecast to be higher winds later on - which could prevent tenders from returning to the ship, thus stranding passengers.

I highly, highly doubt it has anything to do with this news - as the violations were three plus years ago, and the investigation and court cases have just wrapped up...and Princess has made major changes since the initial incident...

Much, much more likely that it actually is high winds/seas as the Captain noted to you all last night.

 

The wind hasn't been mentioned today - it's all been about security. Turns out we are going ashore and we even get time tacked on the end. I'm sorry to have jumped the gun but it was the first thing I saw on Cruise Critic today and I couldn't help but think that, especially given, again, that wind was NOT mentioned today at all. You may have read more into what I wrote than what was there. If I had felt superior, you can bet I would have written more. Just posting breaking news, that's all. Read it with a matter of fact tone.

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Reader0108598

Reader0108598

Posted
Posted (edited)
save the waves is royal carribbean

 

planet princess is princess, but they hardly ever mention it

 

Has the name of the chief engineer been published anywhere?

 

Oops meant the one where they wanted us to reuse ourt towels. We all know that was just a cost savings ploy. I sail both lines so my error. They both did it.

 

Just saw your question,I did not get the name of the chief engineer but will check later.

 

Thanks

Reader

Edited by Reader0108598
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HAPPY RETIREES

HAPPY RETIREES

Posted
Posted

This news is devastating. It will certainly harm the cruise industry and so it should. We hear all about the environment safety concerns, on and on....... We have cruised 30 times on Princess and feel as guilty as hell. I think of all the wonderful pristine waters we sailed on the 2016 World cruise, I pray we were not polluting the waters with oil then. Our 2018 world cruise is with HAL hopefully they will have better standards. Totally unbelievable.

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CruiserBruce

CruiserBruce

Posted
Posted
The wind hasn't been mentioned today - it's all been about security. Turns out we are going ashore and we even get time tacked on the end. I'm sorry to have jumped the gun but it was the first thing I saw on Cruise Critic today and I couldn't help but think that, especially given, again, that wind was NOT mentioned today at all. You may have read more into what I wrote than what was there. If I had felt superior, you can bet I would have written more. Just posting breaking news, that's all. Read it with a matter of fact tone.

 

Somebody said recently an apology with a "but" in it really isn't an apology.

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azbirdmom Great Review Rare

azbirdmom

Posted
Posted
The official statement from the DOJ doesn't really support the idea that the corruption came "from the top":

 

 

 

From https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/princess-cruise-lines-pay-largest-ever-criminal-penalty-deliberate-vessel-pollution

 

Thank you for sharing that link. As a loyal Princess cruiser, I think that this is sickening. The original news stories mentioned the Caribbean Princess, our least favorite ship in the fleet. But the shenanigans apparently extended to other ships as well. I hope they truly make the necessary changes both to the ships and the mindset of the employees who committed these crimes against the environment.

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txjim09

txjim09

Posted
Posted
Pleading guilty and getting hit in the pocket for $40M is an apology. Trial is over. Time to move on.

 

$40M is a fine, not an apology. Pleading guilty is an admission and a decision for expediency, not an apology. And it's not time to move on, it's time to share opinions with Princess regarding the lack of oversight over crew performing known illegal acts.

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Corfe Mixture

Corfe Mixture

Posted
Posted (edited)

What I can't understand is that the original offence took place off the coast of the U.K. which means it fell under the jurisdiction of the MCA who normally prosecute pollution offences. Also, the ship is registered in Bermuda and, as we see from all the discussions about the Jones Act, the US authorities clearly regard it as an overseas vessel.

 

Despite all this, the offence was prosecuted in the USA. :confused:

Edited by Corfe Mixture
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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted
$40M is a fine, not an apology. Pleading guilty is an admission and a decision for expediency, not an apology.

 

But the video statement by Jan Swartz is an apology, (beginning at the 0:38 mark). No if, ands or buts. Not sure what difference it makes, but for people clamoring for an apology, it is out there.

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sfaaa

sfaaa

Posted
Posted (edited)
$40M is a fine, not an apology. Pleading guilty is an admission and a decision for expediency, not an apology. And it's not time to move on, it's time to share opinions with Princess regarding the lack of oversight over crew performing known illegal acts.

 

Directly from President of Princess:

We are very sorry that this happened and have taken additional steps to ensure we meet or exceed all environmental requirements.

 

Sounds like an apology to me.

Edited by sfaaa
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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted
What I can't understand is that the original offence took place off the coast of the U.K. which means it fell under the jurisdiction of the MCA who normally prosecute pollution offences. Also, the ship is registered in Bermuda and, as we see from all the discussions about the Jones Act, the US authorities clearly regard it as an overseas vessel.

 

Despite all this, the offence was prosecuted in the USA. :confused:

 

The DOJ Press Release (linked in Post #23 above) lays out a systemic problem that spanned almost a decade and impacted the waterways of many different countries. The joint task force probably chose the U.S. for the prosecution due to heavier potential penalties.

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JimmyVWine Great Review Rare

JimmyVWine

Posted
Posted (edited)
IMO its rouge officers onboard these ships that attempt to cut corners.

I agree with the post that says its not directed from the corporate office.

 

Though it is hard to imagine that Captains who know the when, how and where of the installation of center stairways on a ship are in the dark about waste water discharges. Whether it climbs beyond the bridge is unknown. But I doubt that a few rogue officers could implement a plan of environmental compliance avoidance for a decade without anyone above the waterline knowing about it.

 

According to papers filed in court, the Caribbean Princess had been making illegal discharges through bypass equipment since 2005, one year after the ship began operations. The discharge on Aug. 26, 2013, involved approximately 4,227 gallons, 23 miles off the coast of England within the country’s Exclusive Economic Zone. At the same time as the discharge, engineers simultaneously ran clean seawater through the ship’s overboard equipment in order to create a false digital record for a legitimate discharge.

 

Caribbean Princess used multiple methods over the course of time to pollute the seas. Prior to the installation of the bypass pipe used to make the discharge off the coast of England, a different unauthorized valve was used. When the Department of Justice investigative team conducted a consensual boarding of the ship in Houston, Texas, on March 8, 2014, they found the valve that crew members had described. When it was removed by Princess at the department’s request, it was found to contain black oil.

 

In addition to the use of a magic pipe to circumvent the oily water separator and oil content monitor required pollution prevention equipment, the U.S. investigation uncovered two other illegal practices which were found to have taken place on the Caribbean Princess as well as four other Princess ships – Star Princess, Grand Princess, Coral Princess and Golden Princess. One practice was to open a salt water valve when bilge waste was being processed by the oily water separator and oil content monitor. The purpose was to prevent the oil content monitor from otherwise alarming and stopping the overboard discharge. This was done routinely on the Caribbean Princess in 2012 and 2013.

 

The second practice involved discharges of oily bilge water originating from the overflow of graywater tanks into the machinery space bilges. This waste was pumped back into the graywater system rather than being processed as oily bilge waste. Neither of these practices were truthfully recorded in the oil record book as required. All of the bypassing took place through the graywater system which was discharged when the ship was more than four nautical miles from land. As a result, discharges within U.S. waters were likely.

Edited by JimmyVWine
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Colo Cruiser

Colo Cruiser

Posted
Posted
Though it is hard to imagine that Captains who know the when, how and where of the installation of center stairways on a ship are in the dark about waste water discharges. Whether it climbs beyond the bridge is unknown. But I doubt that a few rogue officers could implement a plan of environmental compliance avoidance for a decade without anyone above the waterline knowing about it.

 

 

No plan just opportunity.......

I would chalk it up to old tricks of the trade.

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thinfool

thinfool

Posted
Posted

Jan Swartz has not been in place all that long....the offending practice predates her taking up her position as president.

 

With that in mind, I am reminded of the details involved with the recent scandal at Wells Fargo. The trail of wrongdoing found its way up the chain of command to a mid-level executive who is no longer employed.

 

The widespread practice as reported with Princess is likely the tip of the iceberg. I am going to bet that all cruise lines have 'gotten right' in the months that have passed while this investigation was happening.

 

The judgment involving supervision by a judge over 78 ships across all Carnival lines is telling indeed. This issue may well be rooted in the corporate family at Carnival headquarters.

 

Stay tuned.

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