Gratuity Removal Too Easy?

[Harvey1976]

It's highly illegal for a restaurant to take a percentage of tips in the US. I have also not seen, anywhere, any evidence at all that Royal keeps any portion of the daily gratuity.

 

It happens in the UK so maybe that’s me just being synical.

[Biker19]

I had a problem with the unfriendly manner in which people were responding to me.

Par for the course in a tipping thread.

[Mikew0805]

Allow me to apologize. I prefer not to take on a sassy tone just because I feel attacked. That's why I have. I'm sorry. I just really feel like the responses were out-of-line compared to what I actually said.

 

They were out of line, and in an attacking nature. Some people are nasty when they are behind the anonymity of the internet.

 

I don't have kids (thank goodness) but yeah... $500 bucks for gratuities is a lot of money, and I agree that the staff deserve it so long as service standards are met.

[Beverley Foster]

I have spoken to lots of staff including bar staff and also my daughter worked for carnival for 2 years ..... THEY DO NOT RECEIVE YOUR GRATUITY .... it's just the same in the Resteraunt business. If you leave it on the bill and pay by card the company gets it. If you give cash you know they get it.

 

Last cruise I was on a couple of weeks ago I was chatting to one of the bar tenders and he was very unhappy as he never gets any of the bar gratuities. He told me he would be sacked by the company if he made it widely known.

 

 

 

 

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[Mikew0805]

It's not that simple.

 

 

Royal's tipping policy:

 

 

"Any modifications or adjustments to your gratuities are required to be requested before you depart your cruise ... In the unlikely event that a guest onboard being charged the daily automatic gratuity does not receive satisfactory service, the guest may request to modify the daily amount"

 

From a technical standpoint, it's discretionary. It has to be. But reading their policy hardly reads as though it's some sort of optional charge. The spirit of the policy is not really optional. If people want to play technicality games to save a few bucks and screw poor workers, then they should be prepared to be judged when they defend this uncivil behavior publicly. Telling people you are (not YOU) partaking in behavior that most of society finds repulsive is opening the door to ridicule.

 

 

And the only way to remove gratuities at guest services on the last day is in the unlikely event the guest does not receive satisfactory service. And if you have cruised before, which you have, you know that the chances of these people receiving unsatisfactory service that justifies removing the gratuities at guest services is a near zero. So these people, to be in line with the policy, would have to be liars as well, and tell guest services all about their make believe horrible service with every member of the crew they came in contact with.

 

 

It seems that the guest services personnel really just make exceptions and remove the gratuities, sparing the passenger the responsibility of inventing a fake reason about why they weren't satisfied with the overall guest experience.

 

Do you have blinders on? If you think that there is no reason to remove gratuities at all then you are mistaken. I had to "remove" them on one cruise... the NCL Star. That piece of junk worthless excuse for a cruise line should rot at the bottom of the ocean.

 

The reason I put remove in quotations is because even though I didn't pay them, the crew still received the gratuities. I am not sure though, in a teamwork environment, that they should have.

 

While I don't think that people should remove gratuities just because they do not want to pay them... it's not my money, I can do nothing about it, and really it's none of my business. However, your level of satisfactory service, and my level may be two different things.. we are different individuals you know. One example of this for ME is CCL now asking if once a day service in the cabin is okay. Well, if they ever make it mandatory, then the room stewards gratuity will be cut in half as well. Some people are ok with that level of service, and to continue paying what they always have. I am not okay with it.

 

Not everyone is out to screw someone over, and regardless of these "stories" of what is overheard at guest relations, I really doubt that many people remove gratuities.

[rukkian]

so calling some a cheapskate was being nice????

 

If the shoe fits. If you read, I never called anybody anything. I simply said, if somebody wants to be a cheapskate, they can.

[Mikew0805]

I have spoken to lots of staff including bar staff and also my daughter worked for carnival for 2 years ..... THEY DO NOT RECEIVE YOUR GRATUITY .... it's just the same in the Resteraunt business. If you leave it on the bill and pay by card the company gets it. If you give cash you know they get it.

 

Last cruise I was on a couple of weeks ago I was chatting to one of the bar tenders and he was very unhappy as he never gets any of the bar gratuities. He told me he would be sacked by the company if he made it widely known.

 

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I worked for Carnival... your daughter is wrong, and if staff said that to you they are trying to get you to feel sorry for them so you will tip more in cash. This is all BS. :rolleyes:

[Dennis#1]

It is so much easier to prepay your gratuities. And then tip your stateroom attendant and dining room staff extra in cash for outstanding service above and beyond.

[BNBR]

Well, if they ever make it mandatory, then the room stewards gratuity will be cut in half as well. Some people are ok with that level of service, and to continue paying what they always have. I am not okay with it.

 

Have you considered sailing on a cruise line that provides the level of service that you desire? Continuing to sail when you aren't happy about something and stiffing the cruise staff to "teach them a lesson" or whatever, it's kind of petty, no?

[deliver42]

I agree this is all BS. The family can't afford, or doesn't want to pay $500.00 grats, and that the cruise line should pay their people more. OK, then they'll just raise the price of the cruise to make you feel better.Of course, then you'd say the cruise should cost less. It's lose, lose for the cruise line.

[rukkian]

I'm really not. I've been forced to justify my feeling that dropping $750'ish (with other tips) on one week's vacation (on top of the thousands we spend to actually go) is a bit out-of-line with other vacations I take where I also eat out the entire time, drink beverages, have daily housekeeping service, uber around, etc. Again, I love the staff. They work hard. I reward them for their efforts on each and every cruise. I just think Royal Caribbean, who makes "I imagine" billions in profit, can afford to give more to their staff. Multiplying gratuities in one room by four to start with feels a little out of line. Again, I said earlier, maybe I'm just a control freak. Even if the gratuities did add up to be that much if I did it all personally, it would be nice to see how it all adds up and where I spent it.

 

I will have 4 in our cabin for spring break (our 2 teenage sons will be with us) and the thought of the overall bill for service charge seemed high until I figured out how it gets broke down and thinking about the actual overall cost. I know on vacation that if we go out to eat 3 meals each day, that we would easily end up spending more in tip than what the actual service charge that goes to the wait staff covers. If you take the total, it seems high, but (imo) looking at the actual costs each day for each part of the service charge is really small in the grand scheme of things.

[DirtyDawg]

I have spoken to lots of staff including bar staff and also my daughter worked for carnival for 2 years ..... THEY DO NOT RECEIVE YOUR GRATUITY .... it's just the same in the Resteraunt business. If you leave it on the bill and pay by card the company gets it. If you give cash you know they get it.

 

Last cruise I was on a couple of weeks ago I was chatting to one of the bar tenders and he was very unhappy as he never gets any of the bar gratuities. He told me he would be sacked by the company if he made it widely known.

 

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I don't doubt that restaurant staff and bartenders have told you they prefer cash but it's not because they don't get the tips from credit card sales, it's because the credit card tips are harder to 'avoid' tax on. With credit card tips, there is a 'paper trail'. With cash, no such paper trail. The tax authorities LOVE paper trails.

[BNBR]

I will have 4 in our cabin for spring break (our 2 teenage sons will be with us) and the thought of the overall bill for service charge seemed high until I figured out how it gets broke down and thinking about the actual overall cost. I know on vacation that if we go out to eat 3 meals each day, that we would easily end up spending more in tip than what the actual service charge that goes to the wait staff covers. If you take the total, it seems high, but (imo) looking at the actual costs each day for each part of the service charge is really small in the grand scheme of things.

 

That's correct. If you ONLY ate breakfast, lunch, and dinner on a cruise ship, you would be tipping the equivalent of $2.03 per person for each meal. In "eating out at American restaurant" terms, that would be a $10 average per person per meal. For the level of service and quality on a cruise ship, that's obscenely cheap. An omelette at a nice resort will run $15 - $25 alone... And of course, that's not factoring in any additional dining you might do, snacking, etc.

[gingersvp]

That's correct. If you ONLY ate breakfast, lunch, and dinner on a cruise ship, you would be tipping the equivalent of $2.03 per person for each meal. In "eating out at American restaurant" terms, that would be a $10 average per person per meal. For the level of service and quality on a cruise ship, that's obscenely cheap. An omelette at a nice resort will run $15 - $25 alone... And of course, that's not factoring in any additional dining you might do, snacking, etc.

 

THIS, totally. I travel with 3 kids and I do think that we'd easily spend $500 in gratuities on dining out for 7 days. Yes we could have a few meals that don't require a gratuity, but then you'd add on housekeeping at your hotel for 7 days. I think the cruise line rates are honestly lower.

 

For the "optional" vs. included question on gratuities. If cruise lines raise rates to cover the gratuities and it's no longer optional this increases their overall revenue stream by that amount, as well as the taxable income for the cruise line. From there, they'd pay the staff which would narrow their income margin. By separating it out and listing it as a gratuity it's no longer the cruise line's revenue and only the staff are paying taxes on it. Honestly, I'd say that's the crux of American tipping culture - the businesses are keeping their taxable revenue down by the gratuity amount and reducing the corporate tax liability.

[slug33ukuk]

Its probably an American thing........I think most "BRITS" think that "tips" should be earned, not taken for granted, ....a "tip" is for going above and beyond your normal duties.....when on Princess line there is %15-18 added to all drinks.....its fine if a waiter asks and brings a drink.....but if I go to the bar and get them myself....why should I pay a "service charge" when the barman is just doing his job?.....and before anyone has a go at me....I do "TIP" various employees......if the service is outstanding

[BRENT AND DIANNA]

I just cannot imagine someone's crude being so bad to warrant removal of gratuities. The staff work their butts off and even if you run into one ride person, why punish the entire crew? Maybe it's because I live in a city where we tip for everything, but I just don't understand. We also tip cash for a job well done in addition to the prepaid gratuities.

 

 

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[DirtyDawg]

THIS, totally. I travel with 3 kids and I do think that we'd easily spend $500 in gratuities on dining out for 7 days. Yes we could have a few meals that don't require a gratuity, but then you'd add on housekeeping at your hotel for 7 days. I think the cruise line rates are honestly lower.

 

For the "optional" vs. included question on gratuities. If cruise lines raise rates to cover the gratuities and it's no longer optional this increases their overall revenue stream by that amount, as well as the taxable income for the cruise line. From there, they'd pay the staff which would narrow their income margin. By separating it out and listing it as a gratuity it's no longer the cruise line's revenue and only the staff are paying taxes on it. Honestly, I'd say that's the crux of American tipping culture - the businesses are keeping their taxable revenue down by the gratuity amount and reducing the corporate tax liability.

 

Cruise lines pay very, very little corporate income tax. Take a look at Royal's or Carnival's SEC documents.

[davekathy]

Its probably an American thing..."tips" should be earned, not taken for granted...

 

Not this Yank. Also agree.

[BRENT AND DIANNA]

In addition, I feel that gratuaties should be added when you book the cruise just like taxes and dock fees as they are going to charge you for them anyways. Maybe if they did that, people wouldn't have them removed.

 

 

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[frugaltravel]

I find it amusing how so many people assume the worst when they see others removing the auto gratuities. Wouldn't it be nice if we imputed good to others instead of judging them? How do we know they are not removing the auto gratuities in order to give cash tips even higher than the auto gratuities?

 

It is pretty funny to see how people react. Maybe a bit of MYOB would be in order. :D

[Biker19]

Cruise lines pay very, very little corporate income tax. Take a look at Royal's or Carnival's SEC documents.

Though that may be going up with the recent proposals in the tax bill.

[grapau27]

I think if they are ‘optional’ then you should have the option to not have them taken each day on your account but only within a set timeframe after boarding.

 

Anything after that and it should involve a brief discussion with someone of authority to establish the problem.

 

To leave it to the last day is poor, I’d imagine the stateroom attendant would be around the morning of departure if no issue had been raised or alternative tip given.

Unless someone had a serious issue taking gratuitys off at any time but especially at the last minute is wrong and it should be investigated.

[grapau27]

Waiting to remove all gratuities at the end of a cruise is a slap in the faces of the crew.

 

Before removing the gratuities, why not address the problem right away with Guest Services?

 

When the respective issues are not addressed and rectified, may we suggest removing gratuities only for that one or two particular day(s) but not for the entire cruise?

 

Fair?

I agree, address the issue don't be mean and stiff the crew.

[grapau27]

The fact that they waited until the end of the cruise is nauseating.If they had a problem, report it, and let the cruise line correct it. I highly doubt they were confused. They just wanted to get off cheap. I also doubt they gave out encelopes, which, by the way, eliminates the rest of the people that participate in the pool.

I agree and they probably leave it till the last minute because they don't want to risk retribution by the crew.

[grapau27]

Because the "problem" for these lowlifes is paying gratuity in the first place. It has nothing to do with the staff or performance.

Your absolutely spot on.