Petoonya Posted March 26, 2020 #101 Share Posted March 26, 2020 33 minutes ago, Paulchili said: While this specifically refers to a mechanical failure I wonder if it would apply to cancellations due to COVID? Yeah- it's a conundrum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #102 Share Posted March 27, 2020 5 minutes ago, Petoonya said: Yeah- it's a conundrum. Mechanical failure is definitely the fault of the cruise line - pandemic may be called a force of nature (like a hurricane or a war) beyond their control? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petoonya Posted March 27, 2020 #103 Share Posted March 27, 2020 Just now, Paulchili said: Mechanical failure is definitely the fault of the cruise line - pandemic may be called a force of nature (like a hurricane or a war) beyond their control? I agree. And travel insurance companies are not in any better shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatbush Flyer Posted March 27, 2020 #104 Share Posted March 27, 2020 Read the full Oceania T&Cs. https://www.oceaniacruises.com/Documents/Legal/10812/US-TicketContract.pdf If O cancels a cruise (for whatever reason), they will offer you a 100% refund of the cruise fare paid. Of course, as you're seeing now, O is also providing the option of a higher percent FCC. Just a month ago, for those of us on Nautica and Insignia, it was refund plus FCC in varying proportions depending on itinerary/dates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clo Posted March 27, 2020 #105 Share Posted March 27, 2020 3 hours ago, edgee said: In the short run they will be shut out but when/if they appear to actually be on verge of bankruptcy, political pressure will yield them some financial help, IMHO. I have a few businesses that I boycott for ethical reasons. I would add any cruise company that accepting money from the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #106 Share Posted March 27, 2020 25 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said: If O cancels a cruise (for whatever reason), they will offer you a 100% refund of the cruise fare paid. Can you please point out the section where it says so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoverian Posted March 27, 2020 #107 Share Posted March 27, 2020 This article may help a bit. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/03/26/cruise-line-bailout/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clo Posted March 27, 2020 #108 Share Posted March 27, 2020 32 minutes ago, clo said: I have a few businesses that I boycott for ethical reasons. I would add any cruise company that accepting money from the US. Looks like the cruise lines definitely will not be eligible for bailout $$$. Good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #109 Share Posted March 27, 2020 57 minutes ago, Hanoverian said: This article may help a bit. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/03/26/cruise-line-bailout/ Do you have a link for non-subscribers or else the gist of the article? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flatbush Flyer Posted March 27, 2020 #110 Share Posted March 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Paulchili said: Can you please point out the section where it says so? Am I the only one who reads the fine print?https://www.oceaniacruises.com/Documents/Legal/10812/US-TicketContract.pdf Pg 2 Carrier's Discretion #4: a. If We cancel the Cruise or CruiseTour before it has started, We will refund the full Cruise Fare or CruiseTour Fare that We have actually received (less any air or accommodation charges incurred). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clo Posted March 27, 2020 #111 Share Posted March 27, 2020 7 minutes ago, Paulchili said: Do you have a link for non-subscribers or else the gist of the article? 11 minutes ago, Paulchili said: Do you have a link for non-subscribers or else the gist of the article? Mea culpa, WaPo 🙂 Like hotels and airlines, cruise companies have seen their business decimated by the coronavirus pandemic and economic shutdowns. But unlike those industries, major cruise operators don’t locate their headquarters in the United States, so they will not have access to $500 billion in aid for large employers in the massive stimulus bill, the industry’s trade group said Thursday. Language in the 883-page bill passed by the Senate says that to be eligible for aid from the $500 billion fund, companies must be certified as “created or organized in the United States or under the laws of the United States” as well as having “significant operations in” and a majority of employees based in the United States. Major cruise companies have located their primary headquarters overseas, which for years has allowed them to pay almost no federal taxes and avoid some U.S. regulations. To staff their ships, the companies rely heavily on foreign workers from the Philippines, Indonesia and India. AD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdoraBelle Posted March 27, 2020 #112 Share Posted March 27, 2020 12 minutes ago, Paulchili said: Do you have a link for non-subscribers or else the gist of the article? http://archive.is/96WyG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #113 Share Posted March 27, 2020 12 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said: Am I the only one who reads the fine print?https://www.oceaniacruises.com/Documents/Legal/10812/US-TicketContract.pdf Pg 2 Carrier's Discretion #4: a. If We cancel the Cruise or CruiseTour before it has started, We will refund the full Cruise Fare or CruiseTour Fare that We have actually received (less any air or accommodation charges incurred). Thank you - I missed that. Mea culpa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #114 Share Posted March 27, 2020 11 minutes ago, AdoraBelle said: http://archive.is/96WyG Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate-AHF Posted March 27, 2020 #115 Share Posted March 27, 2020 WAPO Article is now free to read: https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/cruise-lines-early-source-of-coronavirus-infections-out-of-bailout-package/ar-BB11LAuE?li=BBnb7Kz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger b Posted March 27, 2020 #116 Share Posted March 27, 2020 Resuming any Time soon !! Highly un -lightly British Government say up to a YEAR !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #117 Share Posted March 27, 2020 2 hours ago, roger b said: Resuming any Time soon !! Highly un -lightly British Government say up to a YEAR !!!! I guess to our Dear Leader's disappointment, the church pews will not be packed with joyful celebrants on Easter- nor will his empty hotels, golf resorts and spas be full with guests - the real reason why he is so anxious to get back to normal ASAP. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingpong1 Posted March 27, 2020 #118 Share Posted March 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Paulchili said: I guess to our Dear Leader's disappointment, the church pews will not be packed with joyful celebrants on Easter- nor will his empty hotels, golf resorts and spas be full with guests - the real reason why he is so anxious to get back to normal ASAP. Can we please leave individual political leanings and biases at the door, before entering this room? 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #119 Share Posted March 27, 2020 53 minutes ago, pingpong1 said: Can we please leave individual political leanings and biases at the door, before entering this room? "Just the facts, ma'am" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawaiidan Posted March 27, 2020 #120 Share Posted March 27, 2020 17 hours ago, Paulchili said: This is what I am seeing: Passenger Bill of Rights The Members of the Cruise Lines International Association are dedicated to the comfort and care of all passengers on oceangoing cruises throughout the world. To fulfill this commitment, our Members have agreed to adopt the following set of passenger rights: 2. The right to a full refund for a trip that is canceled due to mechanical failures, or a partial refund for voyages that are terminated early due to those failures. While this specifically refers to a mechanical failure I wonder if it would apply to cancellations due to COVID? Translation ; The cruise lines would like to treat nice and passengers give them the right to apply for a refund. This is a "we aim to treat everyone well and will listen to any complaint and will listen to those complaints". As I read this, there are no "WILL", SHALL" MUST" It is in no way a contract. that supersedes the actual contracts of the ships/companies. Just a mission statement. it Guarantees nothing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawaiidan Posted March 27, 2020 #121 Share Posted March 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, Paulchili said: "Just the facts, ma'am" your prejudice is showing Paul.... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #122 Share Posted March 27, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Hawaiidan said: Translation ; The cruise lines would like to treat nice and passengers give them the right to apply for a refund. This is a "we aim to treat everyone well and will listen to any complaint and will listen to those complaints". As I read this, there are no "WILL", SHALL" MUST" It is in no way a contract. that supersedes the actual contracts of the ships/companies. Just a mission statement. it Guarantees nothing Agreed but I refer you to post #104 above by FF who clarified the issue - he found the correct ruling about refunds. Edited March 27, 2020 by Paulchili Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulchili Posted March 27, 2020 #123 Share Posted March 27, 2020 1 minute ago, Hawaiidan said: your prejudice is showing Paul.... Like I said - just the facts - not trying to hide anything. Everything is in plain view. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clo Posted March 27, 2020 #124 Share Posted March 27, 2020 5 hours ago, Paulchili said: "Just the facts, ma'am" It's not like you're making this up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanandJim Posted March 28, 2020 #125 Share Posted March 28, 2020 14 hours ago, clo said: It's not like you're making this up. +1 A large part of their plan is to make it uncomfortable for us to speak about their tactics. notice how uncomfortable those conversations are becoming- 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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