Cruiseline White House meeting 9 October

[Arizona Wildcat]

Multiple sources reported that a virtual conference between executives of the cruiselines and VP Pence was held at 2pm EST today. Cruise Hive reported that CDC representatives were scheduled to attend.

Hopefully this group will shortly publish details of how cruising will resume and clarify guidelines both for now and after a vaccine.

I could not find announcement of What was decided.

[RICCruisers]

Here is the readout from the video conference. Don’t get too excited. Not a whole lot of detail. We need to find out what “backstopping” entails. 

 

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/readout-vice-presidents-call-u-s-cruise-industry/?utm_source=miragenews&utm_medium=miragenews&utm_campaign=news

Edited October 9, 2020 by RICCruisers

[marieps]

Make that no detail.

[Arizona Wildcat]

28 minutes ago, RICCruisers said:

Here is the readout from the video conference. Don’t get too excited. Not a whole lot of detail. We need to find out what “backstopping” entails. 

 

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/readout-vice-presidents-call-u-s-cruise-industry/?utm_source=miragenews&utm_medium=miragenews&utm_campaign=news

Don't you just love politicians.  So it goes back to the committee who will then issue a recommendation to the White House.  The White House will then issue a document at some point saying something.

Am thinking this takes a couple weeks.  2020 is "slip sliding away" as Simon & Garfunkel would say.

[markeb]

3 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

What kind of transportation are your referencing? All the major airlines require masks of all passengers, and crew, and according to the news, it is enforced. Better recheck your sources.

Not mandated. They’re doing it on their own...

 

No federal mandate. Which was the point. 

[nocl]

1 hour ago, grandgeezer said:

What kind of transportation are your referencing? All the major airlines require masks of all passengers, and crew, and according to the news, it is enforced. Better recheck your sources.

however the airlines are doing it themselves. there is no directive by the FAA or any other government agency. they have each decided to set their own rules and enforce it themselves, because they found out the safer passengers feel the more will fly so it's in their interest to enforce it 

 

according to reports the CDC would have required masks on all mass transit, including buses, trains, subways, air planes, etc.

 

so no I do not to recheck my sources but if you do a search on CDC masks transportation you will find a current story on the CDCs attempt to put the rule in olace.

Edited October 10, 2020 by nocl

[Arizona Wildcat]

1 hour ago, markeb said:

Not mandated. They’re doing it on their own...

 

No federal mandate. Which was the point. 

The Federal government does not have authority over ALL transportation.  Only interstate.  A Presidential order would be tied up in court as no matter if logical powers not assigned to the Feds are reserved to the states.

[markeb]

Just now, Arizona Wildcat said:

The Federal government does not have authority over ALL transportation.  Only interstate.  A Presidential order would be tied up in court as no matter if logical powers not assigned to the Feds are reserved to the states.

 

Yes. That's the long answer that I didn't feel like writing. 10th Amendment...

 

Most of the public health authority in the US is at the state and local level. The federal government has significant authority at the borders, and interstate. But otherwise, it's mostly state, tribal, county, and city authority. And it would be tied up in court.

 

And transportation is its own little world as well, as you say.

[nocl]

7 minutes ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

The Federal government does not have authority over ALL transportation.  Only interstate.  A Presidential order would be tied up in court as no matter if logical powers not assigned to the Feds are reserved to the states.

no one has challenged the one preventing evictions which has even less justification, much to my surprise.

 

it would not have been a presidential order it would have been a CDC action under their quarantine powers when insufficient action is being taken by local authorities.

 

it would certainly be a new use, but less of a stretch then their eviction rule, which no one has challenged.

Edited October 10, 2020 by nocl

[Arizona Wildcat]

1 hour ago, nocl said:

no one has challenged the one preventing evictions which has even less justification, much to my surprise.

 

it would not have been a presidential order it would have been a CDC action under their quarantine powers when insufficient action is being taken by local authorities.

 

it would certainly be a new use, but less of a stretch then their eviction rule, which no one has challenged.

Arizona and surrounding states have all issued eviction bans.  Mostly by governors and cities.  Multiple lawsuits filed in my state.  All being handled in state and municipal courts.

Would think Feds would only have primary authority in DC, Federal leases and possibly some tribal lands.

[ExArkie]

13 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

...  2020 is "slip sliding away" as Simon & Garfunkel would say.

Actually, I think that was just Paul Simon after the duo went their separate ways.

[Fouremco]

14 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

Don't you just love politicians.  So it goes back to the committee who will then issue a recommendation to the White House.  The White House will then issue a document at some point saying something.

Am thinking this takes a couple weeks.  2020 is "slip sliding away" as Simon & Garfunkel would say.

 

30 minutes ago, ExArkie said:

Actually, I think that was just Paul Simon after the duo went their separate ways.

You are both right. Paul Simon wrote and recorded the song after the duo's 1970 breakup, so he was the first to sing "Slip Slidin' Away". However, the two have reunited several times and have sung "Slip Slidin' Away" together on many occasions, including at "The Concert in Central Park" in 1981, before one of the largest concert audiences in history.

[39august]

Wow. Cold chills just at the mention of Concert in Central Park. What an experience! I hope we hear more soon from that Pence meeting. 

[Arizona Wildcat]

That was a great concert.

 

"Thanks for the memories"

[Fouremco]

Just now, Arizona Wildcat said:

That was a great concert.

 

"Thanks for the memories"

👍

[Tomato53]

I'd like to have been a fly on the wall at that meeting

[Fouremco]

1 hour ago, Tomato53 said:

I'd like to have been a fly on the wall at that meeting

There's another popular landing place for flies! 

[nocl]

On 10/9/2020 at 7:41 PM, nocl said:

no one has challenged the one preventing evictions which has even less justification, much to my surprise.

 

it would not have been a presidential order it would have been a CDC action under their quarantine powers when insufficient action is being taken by local authorities.

 

it would certainly be a new use, but less of a stretch then their eviction rule, which no one has challenged.

It took longer than I would have expected but the first law suite has been filed against the CDC to overturn their eviction ban. The eviction ban, if allowed to stand, would have represented a dramatic increase in the authority granted the CDC. Far beyond anything done in the past.

 

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/522502-landlords-housing-industry-sue-cdc-to-overturn-eviction-ban

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, nocl said:

It took longer than I would have expected but the first law suite has been filed against the CDC to overturn their eviction ban. The eviction ban, if allowed to stand, would have represented a dramatic increase in the authority granted the CDC. Far beyond anything done in the past.

 

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/522502-landlords-housing-industry-sue-cdc-to-overturn-eviction-ban

and it has what to do with cruising?  Just sayin...

[nocl]

42 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

and it has what to do with cruising?  Just sayin...

It was brought up in a couple of topics during discussions about the limit on CDC power to quarantine, which as we all know is what gives them the power to issue the no sail order. 

[LGW59]

10 minutes ago, nocl said:

It was brought up in a couple of topics during discussions about the limit on CDC power to quarantine, which as we all know is what gives them the power to issue the no sail order. 

CDC is surely being tested as never before.  Unprecedented times for all, as much as I miss cruising, I support what they have done thus far.  As for evictions, tragic, far more so than not cruising, which is a whimsical luxury.

[nocl]

17 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

CDC is surely being tested as never before.  Unprecedented times for all, as much as I miss cruising, I support what they have done thus far.  As for evictions, tragic, far more so than not cruising, which is a whimsical luxury.

The restriction on cruising does match up with the CDC authority (at the US boarders) the eviction ban within the states not so much.

[LGW59]

8 minutes ago, nocl said:

The restriction on cruising does match up with the CDC authority (at the US boarders) the eviction ban within the states not so much.

really no idea what you are saying here.  CDC has authority to restrict cruising, hence they have done it for 8 month now.  States can enact their own travel/entry bans, many have and continue to do so.  My state is one of those.

[markeb]

32 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

really no idea what you are saying here.  CDC has authority to restrict cruising, hence they have done it for 8 month now.  States can enact their own travel/entry bans, many have and continue to do so.  My state is one of those.

The CDC issued a federal moratorium on evictions under its public health authorities. I don’t think that’s ever been done before. The CDC definitely has authority at international ports of entry and interstate, including cruising. But evictions would normally have been a state thing, like the travel/entry bans you mentioned. I think the authorities are different enough that the eviction moratorium is just a curiosity to cruising, but we’ll see.

[chengkp75]

8 hours ago, nocl said:

It took longer than I would have expected but the first law suite has been filed against the CDC to overturn their eviction ban. The eviction ban, if allowed to stand, would have represented a dramatic increase in the authority granted the CDC. Far beyond anything done in the past.

 

https://thehill.com/policy/finance/522502-landlords-housing-industry-sue-cdc-to-overturn-eviction-ban

While it may be more than has ever been done in the past, the ban is based on an existing CFR that give the CDC the power to do so.  42CFR70.2 grants them the authority, if the CDC feels that state or local measures are insufficient to preclude the transmission between states, to intervene with their own measures.  The CDC is saying that evictions could lead to infected persons traveling interstate to find housing.