Will ships be stopped from sailing from British ports before 17th May?

[cruisenewbie1976]

4 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

Me too.

 

Our world has changed, we have to adapt and change too 

So if you decide, for example, that the cinema isn't a safe place to be but I consider it to be an acceptable risk, we should close down all the cinemas because you don't want to go?

[cruisenewbie1976]

Just now, Dermotsgirl said:

They aren't doing it for you.  They would be forced to take  decisions  to protect themselves because others want their old way of living back, with no compromises to the Covid world we now live in 

Exactly, personal risk. 

How do you suggest we do about a new way of living then? More government rules that tell us how to live our life?

[Dermotsgirl]

Just now, cruisenewbie1976 said:

So if you decide, for example, that the cinema isn't a safe place to be but I consider it to be an acceptable risk, we should close down all the cinemas because you don't want to go?

In an equitable society, we all change our behaviour so that everyone can go to the cinema.  It's not about the individual, this 'living with it' has to mean everyone can live with it. 

[ace2542]

It comes down now to survival of the fittest. Is that not what life is? 

[terrierjohn]

34 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

Masks should remain for life. There has bee no Flu season nor much of a Cold season this year because of that.

 

Do nightclubs really need to reopen? Do town centres really need to be turned into drunken warzones with conflicts between drunken groups restarting every weekend when they see each other for years on end?

I suspect the lockdown and very limited social distancing has had far more influence on this years flu season, but masks will have helped however I remember Whitty giving them a very low protection rating compared with most other measures.

I have no comments on your other points, apart from to ask you to remember your teens and twenties, and how miserable we would have been if our life had been subject to these covid restrictions.

[cruisenewbie1976]

Just now, Dermotsgirl said:

In an equitable society, we all change our behaviour so that everyone can go to the cinema.  It's not about the individual, this 'living with it' has to mean everyone can live with it. 

But I don't think you can legislate for that sort of thing. It would be similar to bringing in a law to make people cover their mouth when they cough. Most people will do the right thing naturally in not wanting to cause harm to others, but I think mandatory instructions start to turn us into a Chinese way of living. 

[Dermotsgirl]

2 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

Exactly, personal risk. 

How do you suggest we do about a new way of living then? More government rules that tell us how to live our life?

I haven't got the answers - it's just that I hear this term 'we've just got to live with it' quite a lot, and I'm just asking what it actually means.

 

I was trying to find out what the proponents of this theory actually mean by it and how they think it would work in practice.

 

 

 

 

[terrierjohn]

34 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I'm hoping you detected my sarcasm 😉

It was and my "like" signified my total agreement.

[Dermotsgirl]

3 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

But I don't think you can legislate for that sort of thing. It would be similar to bringing in a law to make people cover their mouth when they cough. Most people will do the right thing naturally in not wanting to cause harm to others, but I think mandatory instructions start to turn us into a Chinese way of living. 

That's why 'living with it' will be incredibly difficult.

 

People accept change because they WANT it, and unfortunately most  people are unwilling to change their lives - they want their old life back 

[cruisenewbie1976]

2 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

That's why 'living with it' will be incredibly difficult.

 

People accept change because they WANT it, and unfortunately most  people are unwilling to change their lives - they want their old life back 

And nothing is stopping people changing and you'd hope they would do they right thing. But they make that choice. The alternative is a totalitarian way of living where we're dictated to.  

[yorkshirephil]

3 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I haven't got the answers - it's just that I hear this term 'we've just got to live with it' quite a lot, and I'm just asking what it actually means.

 

I was trying to find out what the proponents of this theory actually mean by it and how they think it would work in practice.

 

 

 

 

It is a bit of a moveable feast as we don't know how things will work out, it may be as simple as just having a jab each year depending whether it keeps mutating or dies out. We have lived with flu for many years and lots of people probably don't give it a second thought even though it kills thousands every year. I am sure we can adapt accordingly, we seem to be doing it with green issues.

[zap99]

30 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

Sorry, I used the wrong word - I meant to say minimising.

 

The question is, how to we behave to minimise risk, when we are in the living with it stage?

 

do we 

 

A)  Everyone carry on like its 2019 and get rid of all restrictions

 

B)  Everyone change their way of living, maybe permanently

 

C) Personally carry on like it's 2019 but expect other people to change their way of living  

Probably the answer is B, various behaviour changes are acceptable. Hygiene, avoiding drunken raves etc🤣

[ace2542]

3 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

Agree.  I think on board restrictios will be lifted as soon as they can.  If by June 21st everything is lifted including social distancing, then that should be the same on the ships.

What about the crew onboard? Now way in hell they are vaccinated by June 21st. By no stretch of the imagination is that going to happen. I think it will be generally understand that most passengers will take the vaccine though Carnival will likely require it anyway. But the crew will not be vaccinated for some time to come. So surely masks and everything else will be around for a while longer yet?

[zap99]

21 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

But I don't think you can legislate for that sort of thing. It would be similar to bringing in a law to make people cover their mouth when they cough. Most people will do the right thing naturally in not wanting to cause harm to others, but I think mandatory instructions start to turn us into a Chinese way of living. 

This past summer we had 2 SC holidays ,2 long weekends in hotels and numerous meals in restaurants. On a Saturday in St Ives in June the place was very crowded. We went somewhere else. We would probably do the same this year. Our behaviours will change a bit, but that will be an individual decision. If folk are happy in a crowded pub , their choice, but we may go somewhere else.

[zap99]

5 hours ago, Selbourne said:

But passenger behaviours and activities are very different on a cruise ship than in a hotel, with set time activities and the ‘herding’ that this creates. Far more akin to large gatherings than hotels are IMHO. 

Large hotels have set time activities as well. Breakfast, dinner, bingo, four tops tribute group.

[cruisenewbie1976]

10 minutes ago, zap99 said:

This past summer we had 2 SC holidays ,2 long weekends in hotels and numerous meals in restaurants. On a Saturday in St Ives in June the place was very crowded. We went somewhere else. We would probably do the same this year. Our behaviours will change a bit, but that will be an individual decision. If folk are happy in a crowded pub , their choice, but we may go somewhere else.

Couldn't agree more! 

[Esprit]

I'll happily adapt to continue doing stuff I enjoy, like ballroom and Latin dancing.

I wont notice the wife wince through her face mask when I step on her toes! 😂

 

[Selbourne]

1 hour ago, Dermotsgirl said:

As I say, what does living with it actually look like, in real terms. 

 

 

We will all have different views on this but, for what it’s worth, here’s mine. Between 5,000 and 25,000 people die each year in the UK from flu yet, other than the offer of an annual jab to all (now) over 50’s, we have continued with life as normal. Presumably, once all those who are vulnerable from covid are vaccinated (which will be end April for 99% of those who fall in that category) and are offered an annual booster to deal with variants (in the same way as flu) then I see no reason for us to have to live with continual restrictions of any kind and endure the resultant crippling effect on our economy and people’s lives and jobs.
 

I have always said that just because you can do something doesn’t mean that you have to. In my ‘living with it’ world, we all make decisions based upon the risks that we are prepared to take, but just because we might not wish to do something doesn’t mean that others should be prevented from doing so. I could think of nothing worse than going to a nightclub or a crowded pub at night, but if my adult children wish to do so then why not? In reality, if they contract covid they will most likely be asymptomatic or have very mild symptoms. Yes, they could pass it on to me, but I will be vaccinated (as they will be, for that matter). More people will have an annual covid jab than currently have a flu jab, so I genuinely believe that we should get to a place well before the end of this year where we shouldn’t let it affect any aspect of our lives whatsoever going forward, other than the need to have the jab every year. 
 

Covid will still present some risk, but the risks of continuing to let it rule our lives are far greater IMHO, so I would therefore ‘live with it’ and let us all do what we feel comfortable with. 

[Selbourne]

45 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Large hotels have set time activities as well. Breakfast, dinner, bingo, four tops tribute group.

Not the hotels I use Zap 😉 

[zap99]

3 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Not the hotels I use Zap 😉 

Good quality bingo at the Dorchester. Caesars palace in las Vegas have some good turns. Have you never been to Warner's? Jane McDonald is on this year. 🤣

[davecttr]

Simple cultural changes would help, like wearing a mask when out and about in the flu season, especially if you have the sniffles. A bit like wearing seatbelts

[Adawn47]

1 hour ago, Dermotsgirl said:

As I say, what does living with it actually look like, in real terms. 

 

 

No-one will know the answer to that until we're doing it

Avril

[Son of Anarchy]

Spanish flu back in 1918/19 killed an estimated 54 million people. 

 

Life continued after Spanish flu:

 

Another World War

Several episodes of genocide in a variety of countries

Proxy wars

 

On a postive note:

Neil Armstrong walked on the moon

Woodstock

Glastonbury (more than once)

Etc

[Son of Anarchy]

16 minutes ago, zap99 said:

Good quality bingo at the Dorchester. Caesars palace in las Vegas have some good turns. Have you never been to Warner's? Jane McDonald is on this year. 🤣

Badness who we've seen a couple of times on shorter PandO cruises are also doing a couple of turns at Warners.

[Windsurfboy]

I think we must live with it and I'm in the Selbourne camp.

 

If it's something I really enjoy I will accept the risk, if it's something just OK then perhaps not.

 

So I will see my family and close friends 

 

As for restaurants and pubs,  I think we will change behaviour, perhaps having fewer meals out but going for gastronomic delights. Wasn't  a great pub goer , even less know, except when a close friend visits and he like his pint.

 

Never thought of shopping as a pleasure,  even less now

 

Holidays will continue unabated,  but we will look to hotels with space and privacy,  however as flights and airports are the riskiest and least pleasant part of any overseas holiday, will go on fewer but longer holidays in nicer hotels. If you're taking a risk make it worth it.

 

I will take the risk to spend 24hrs on a plane to see grandchildren in Australia when we can, but will turn left for more space

 

Definitely want to cruise again, but only when it becomes enjoyable and sociable

 

Will still windsurf in South Africa,  the great whites haven't caught me yet

 

No nightclubs for many years, but remembering back a long time, Saturday night out was a big part of my youth so if I was 18 I'd just do it.

 

Behaviour will change but not giving up things I enjoy.

 

So it's not back to pre covid , but not hiding away