Carnival’s CEO states that they will not require vaccinations

[harkinmr]

37 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

Well, so be it. I've read and watched enough videos that are published by the three cruise lines to know what they've done to mitigate the virus. What is missing is real guidelines from the CDC so that their expectations can be met. 

 

If you think that I'm wrong on this, would you list enlighten me as to what expectations the CDC has published to help the cruise lines? I've read the CSO, so please don't quote that. i've already stated what is wrong with the CSO. 

You say you've read the CSO, so you don't want to hear what is in it. That is exactly where I would direct you. What else do you want to hear? The CDC is not going to write the plans to meet the framework they've set out.  That's the cruise line's job. The cruise lines need to respond with something other than: "it's not workable".  If it's not, then what do they suggest?  Feel-good videos are not a plan.  A plan is a written set up steps that will be taken by the cruise lines in response to the phases and requirements set out in the CSO.  Just saying that the CSO should be eliminated is not a valid plan.  Hopefully, the cruise lines are making their concerns and ideas heard as part of the ongoing working group's efforts.  Don't know what else to say.

Edited April 24, 2021 by harkinmr

[BlerkOne]

22 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

That would be a helpful threshold, would it not? Has the CDC given that as a guideline to the cruise lines? is that percentage in the CSO? I don't think so. 

You do know the cruise lines and the CDC are communicating and the cruise lines have stated that is their preferred way forward and not some crackpot lawsuit. It is the only reasonable path forward. Give and take - compromise - and not posturing or making unilateral demands. Communication. What a concept.

[BlerkOne]

You know who writes cruise port security plans? The cruise lines. With some guidance from government agencies, and the whole thing has to be approved by USCG. But the plans are written by the cruise lines. That is not unlike the approach taken by the CDC with Covid.

[Radiioman46]

2 hours ago, harkinmr said:

You say you've read the CSO, so you don't want to hear what is in it. That is exactly where I would direct you. What else do you want to hear? The CDC is not going to write the plans to meet the framework they've set out.  That's the cruise line's job. The cruise lines need to respond with something other than: "it's not workable".

You stated it's not the CDC's job yet the CDC is in charge. They are the ones with the power to say when cruising can start. The cruise lines have stated their case. The CDC has not stated what their expectations are for acceptance, nor have they responded to the cruise lines. The CDC is supposed to be the 'experts', yet they can't get their act together to get this under control forcing the cruise lines to start cruising elsewhere.

 

I stated that I have read the CSO, and that is why I don't need you to quote it back to me. I already know what's in it and more importantly what's missing. 

[harkinmr]

6 hours ago, Radiioman46 said:

You stated it's not the CDC's job yet the CDC is in charge. They are the ones with the power to say when cruising can start. The cruise lines have stated their case. The CDC has not stated what their expectations are for acceptance, nor have they responded to the cruise lines. The CDC is supposed to be the 'experts', yet they can't get their act together to get this under control forcing the cruise lines to start cruising elsewhere.

 

I stated that I have read the CSO, and that is why I don't need you to quote it back to me. I already know what's in it and more importantly what's missing. 

 

The cruise lines have stated their case in the public arena, not in writing (other than NCL).  The CDC has set out the expectations as to how things can move forward.  It's up to the cruise lines to tell them IN WRITING how they will accomplish that.  Complaining that the CSO is "unworkable", without further explanation and alternatives, is not the right move.  But now the lines have been given the opportunity to be heard, both in person and as part of a working group.  

 

The CDC is an expert in the areas of public health and infectious diseases.  It's not their job to write up a plan as to how a line will meet the expectations set out.  The lines are the experts in their arena and must tell the CDC, IN WRITING, how they will accomplish what needs to be done and then go through the approval process.  

 

The cruise lines are playing a game here, betting that if they raise enough of a stink that they will be allowed to proceed without regulations and oversight.  I think that is a bad bet.

[Radiioman46]

1 hour ago, harkinmr said:

 

The cruise lines have stated their case in the public arena, not in writing (other than NCL).  The CDC has set out the expectations as to how things can move forward.  It's up to the cruise lines to tell them IN WRITING how they will accomplish that.  Complaining that the CSO is "unworkable", without further explanation and alternatives, is not the right move.  But now the lines have been given the opportunity to be heard, both in person and as part of a working group.  

 

The CDC is an expert in the areas of public health and infectious diseases.  It's not their job to write up a plan as to how a line will meet the expectations set out.  The lines are the experts in their arena and must tell the CDC, IN WRITING, how they will accomplish what needs to be done and then go through the approval process.  

 

The cruise lines are playing a game here, betting that if they raise enough of a stink that they will be allowed to proceed without regulations and oversight.  I think that is a bad bet.

Like I said earlier, YMMV.

[firefly333]

2 hours ago, harkinmr said:

 

The cruise lines have stated their case in the public arena, not in writing (other than NCL).  The CDC has set out the expectations as to how things can move forward.  It's up to the cruise lines to tell them IN WRITING how they will accomplish that.  Complaining that the CSO is "unworkable", without further explanation and alternatives, is not the right move.  But now the lines have been given the opportunity to be heard, both in person and as part of a working group.  

 

The CDC is an expert in the areas of public health and infectious diseases.  It's not their job to write up a plan as to how a line will meet the expectations set out.  The lines are the experts in their arena and must tell the CDC, IN WRITING, how they will accomplish what needs to be done and then go through the approval process.  

 

The cruise lines are playing a game here, betting that if they raise enough of a stink that they will be allowed to proceed without regulations and oversight.  I think that is a bad bet.

As even you note ncl has put it in writing and the cdc hasnt responded. 

[harkinmr]

Just now, firefly333 said:

As even you note ncl has put it in writing and the cdc hasnt responded. 

Right.  Not in writing, but a "no" response is certainly implied based on repeated statements by the CDC that cruising will restart using the CSO framework.  NCL specifically asked for a release of the CSO.  That, apparently, is not going to happen.  There may in fact be a more detailed response to NCL as the CSO is revised within the working group setting.  We will see.

[kdr69]

2 hours ago, harkinmr said:

The lines are the experts in their arena and must tell the CDC, IN WRITING, how they will accomplish what needs to be done and then go through the approval process.  

NCL has done this and still no approval process to go through. 

[harkinmr]

6 minutes ago, kdr69 said:

NCL has done this and still no approval process to go through. 

See post #887.

[BlerkOne]

The CDC has not responded to the NCL proposal. Whatever happened to no news is good news. Such pessimists.

[Radiioman46]

23 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

The CDC has not responded to the NCL proposal. Whatever happened to no news is good news. Such pessimists.

Well, you know there is a time and place for everything..........

[skridge]

On 4/23/2021 at 10:13 AM, OceanZena said:

What does that mean? "Don't tread on me flag?" And what does that have to do with the conversation? Why do those who disagree continue seem to deflect away from the topic with crazy stuff like this? 

 

And where did I spread "misinformation?"Since you're directly quoting me with this reply please quote exactly where I spread this "misinformation"? Thanks. 

"This is a virus that is pretty easy to avoid just by doing very simple things"  It wasn't very hard to find misinformation.  This quote is completely absurd.  There have been 32 million confirmed cases of Covid in the US.  The number is more than likely well north of that figure.  We are a population of 331 million people.  That number is 500k less because of the virus..  To say that it is easily avoidable is spreading misinformation.  

[Radiioman46]

5 minutes ago, skridge said:

"This is a virus that is pretty easy to avoid just by doing very simple things"  It wasn't very hard to find misinformation.  This quote is completely absurd.  There have been 32 million confirmed cases of Covid in the US.  The number is more than likely well north of that figure.  We are a population of 331 million people.  That number is 500k less because of the virus..  To say that it is easily avoidable is spreading misinformation.  

Well, I guess it depends on your definition "easily avoidable" means, since around 300 million ppl found a way to not get it. Using your numbers, I didn't fact check the numbers. 

[firefly333]

9 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

Well, I guess it depends on your definition "easily avoidable" means, since around 300 million ppl found a way to not get it. Using your numbers, I didn't fact check the numbers. 

He was claiming someone said it and saying its nonsense. His wife caught covid and still battling long term side effects. .. he meant the opposite. Sarcasm.

[OceanZena]

14 minutes ago, skridge said:

"This is a virus that is pretty easy to avoid just by doing very simple things"  It wasn't very hard to find misinformation.  This quote is completely absurd.  There have been 32 million confirmed cases of Covid in the US.  The number is more than likely well north of that figure.  We are a population of 331 million people.  That number is 500k less because of the virus..  To say that it is easily avoidable is spreading misinformation.  

That is not "misinformation" but a fact. I have no idea why you're spouting all those numbers---another try at deflection? Covid IS easily avoidable by taking very simple precautions. Your saying that it's "misinformation" actually is misinformation! 

 

I've been following the precautions for 14 months now and....no Covid. 

[OceanZena]

17 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

Well, I guess it depends on your definition "easily avoidable" means, since around 300 million ppl found a way to not get it. Using your numbers, I didn't fact check the numbers. 

As of 4/24/21 the current worldwide Covid numbers stands at 146 million who have been infected. (124 million of those people have recovered). In a world of 8 billion people, that's less than 2% of the population. Therefore, 98% of the world still hasn't got Covid. 

 

After over a year since Covid began, it's logical to conclude by those numbers that Covid is easily avoidable since 98% of the population has avoided getting it. 

[BlerkOne]

52 minutes ago, Radiioman46 said:

Well, you know there is a time and place for everything..........

It's been less than 3 weeks. But since NCL would require vaccines for all, I'm not sure how that plays in Florida. Also masks, controlled shore excursions, etc., with certain cults.

 

One item I noticed in the letter is NCL is only preparing for a one-off covid case and apparently not considering, however remote, of a serious outbreak such might occur with a variant, especially given the variety of vaccines NCL would accept.

 

Many of what NCL proposes they will have to do anyway, so nothing is stopping them from moving forward with preparations.

 

[BlerkOne]

36 minutes ago, OceanZena said:

I've been following the precautions for 14 months now and....no Covid. 

Simple handwashing or touching your face is not going to stop an airborne virus.

[OceanZena]

Just now, BlerkOne said:

Simple handwashing or touching your face is not going to stop an airborne virus.

Tell that to 98% of the world who have managed to avoid it for over a year now. 

[SwordBlazer Cruising]

I will give some fact here and that’s all I will say. The CDC is communicating with the cruise lines. FACT.  
 

The issue is the formula for the CSO is using data and real world solutions from the fall of 2020, meaning vaccines and other forms to combat Covid were not available or allowed. That’s the issue. 

[bamaone]

23 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

Speaking of political statements, which President said it was a hoax and later suggested ingesting bleach, and continues to make racist statements?

You are a liar. Your post is false. He never suggested ingesting bleach. Your false post leaves you with no credibility. And your racist narrative shows you want racial discontent. You must think keeping everybody at each other’s throat will keep your party in power.

Edited April 24, 2021 by bamaone

[BlerkOne]

54 minutes ago, OceanZena said:

Tell that to 98% of the world who have managed to avoid it for over a year now. 

FACT: That number decreases every day.

 

I believe about 900,000 new cases yesterday.

 

 

[BlerkOne]

2 minutes ago, bamaone said:

You are a liar. Your post is false. He never suggested ingesting bleach. Your false post leaves you with no credibility. 

I asked a simple question and never identified an individual, didn't state a fact. Your reading comprehension leave a lot to be desired.

[bamaone]

Just now, BlerkOne said:

I asked a simple question and never identified an individual, didn't state a fact. Your reading comprehension leave a lot to be desired.

As does your posting