Prinsendam Problems

Onboard the Prinsendam holiday cruise and we have had multiple problems with our cabin. Mostly no AC followed by lots of banging when ever we hit a wave. We were on deck 7 forward but I insisted that we be moved. Many forward cabins are without AC. They only moved us when we ordered a meeting with the Hotel Manager. There is a real lack of leadership from Sr crew onboard.

Never again will I sail onboard the Prinsendam!

 

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Edited December 23, 2016 by gentlemancruiser

What cabin number please.

Sorry to hear that you had a problem. We've cruised three times on her doing TA.s Our first one was to Cape Town had a Ocean View on Main Deck can't remember which one but well forward one of the E cat. cabins never had a problem with noise & our AC worked so can't speak to that.

Allan

Sorry that you are having problems.

 

Hope your new cabin is better.

Sorry, posted on wrong thread

Edited December 24, 2016 by Lady Arwen
Wrong post, sorry

Hope all goes well with your new cabin. Working HVAC and plumbing are non-negotiable basic requirements. I am surprised that they moved you, the usual report here is that no other cabins were available.

We had a similar problem (noise) on the Maasdam but they were able to move us to a more central part of the ship. That cured us of forward cabins but obviously any cabin can have HVAC problems. Some how we have avoided those.

We were moved because the ship is not full. But mostly because I told them I must see the hotel manager. Only about 650 onboard so LOTS of open cabins. New cabin on deck 5 is better.

 

 

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Someone had the same problem (no A/C) on Prinsendam on our cruise in the Med. They did find another stateroom for them.

Tip from Cruise Critic about cabin choices:

 

Not saying that guarantee cabins aren't worth the gamble for an upgrade, but if you want assurance that you won't be in a pitching, noisy cabin, these cabins aren't the way to go. A guarantee cabin isn't actually a type of cabin but, rather, a method of booking a cabin. You pick a minimum cabin level you'd be comfortable in, and the cruise line assigns you a cabin close to booking dates based on availability.

 

The potential for an upgrade is appealing, and if you're cruising on a budget and don't have a particular issue with any of the cabin dilemmas listed above, then it could be worth your while to see what a guarantee might deliver. But your guarantee also could place you squarely above the anchor, next to a crew entrance or below the theater. With guarantee cabins, you lose your ability to complain about what you end up with.

HAL guidelines for cabin temperature are 73-77 degrees, which can feel hotter or colder due to where you are traveling or the humidity level. To say their is "no A/C" is alarming, because the ventilation system is tied into the fire suppression system and the humidity control system as well.

Any of the forward cabins on deck 5,6,7 are to be avoided. Very noisy with the wave hitting the hull. The seas were only 7ft. but plenty of rocking and lots of banging. You hear every wave!! We were in 261 and at 1am we could count the time between waves

 

 

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The banging sounds like "hogging" in high seas where the waves hit the bow on an angle. Very natural in some sea conditions. We had this happen when in 20 foot seas for 4 days. Luckily it was not a big problem for us.

WE once had a cabin on the Prinsendam on deck 7 near the bow - very nice and quiet in general with easy access to the bow - BUT incredibly noisy in the afternoon and evenings because of the noise from the theatre below. We heard every performance twice without having to go downstairs and LOTS of rehearsals....

HAL guidelines for cabin temperature are 73-77 degrees, which can feel hotter or colder due to where you are traveling or the humidity level. To say their is "no A/C" is alarming, because the ventilation system is tied into the fire suppression system and the humidity control system as well.

 

The only fire suppression system in passenger areas is the sprinkler system, and it is not tied into the ventilation system. In a fire situation, the entire ventilation for an entire "vertical fire zone" can be shut down, and there are fire dampers that will close when the temperature at the damper reaches a set temperature.

 

The banging sounds like "hogging" in high seas where the waves hit the bow on an angle. Very natural in some sea conditions. We had this happen when in 20 foot seas for 4 days. Luckily it was not a big problem for us.

 

Never heard this referred to as "hogging". Hogging is a condition where the ship is either loaded so that the bow and stern have a deeper draft than the center of the ship (when looked at sideways, the ship is "frowning" or the two ends are drooping in relation to the middle), or in a seaway, with a particular distance between waves, the center is supported by a wave crest, while the two ends are in the troughs. This will cause stress to the hull, but no appreciable noise.

 

Seas slapping the hull in the area of the bow, where it flares up from the waterline will cause booming noises on just about any ship. Also, if the ship is being driven at a particular speed where the length, hull shape, wave period, wave height, and wave direction creates a harmonic situation, the ship can "stagger" with each wave, with noise and vibration. Sometimes, in order to make the itinerary, the speed cannot be changed, up or down, enough to get out of the harmonic zone.

Tip from Cruise Critic about cabin choices:

 

Not saying that guarantee cabins aren't worth the gamble for an upgrade, but if you want assurance that you won't be in a pitching, noisy cabin, these cabins aren't the way to go. A guarantee cabin isn't actually a type of cabin but, rather, a method of booking a cabin. You pick a minimum cabin level you'd be comfortable in, and the cruise line assigns you a cabin close to booking dates based on availability.

 

The potential for an upgrade is appealing, and if you're cruising on a budget and don't have a particular issue with any of the cabin dilemmas listed above, then it could be worth your while to see what a guarantee might deliver. But your guarantee also could place you squarely above the anchor, next to a crew entrance or below the theater. With guarantee cabins, you lose your ability to complain about what you end up with.

 

????

 

Nowhere did the OP say that they booked a guarantee cabin.

 

Even if they did, I would imagine that nonfunctional AC would provide a reason for complaint, as even with a guarantee cabin, one should assume HAL would provide a cabin where the systems actually work.

The guarantee cabin excuse is right up there with it was not hot, it was your imagination, I was on the ship three months ago and we had AC, or you should not expect the AC to function properly in warm climates.

 

Go figure.

The only fire suppression system in passenger areas is the sprinkler system, and it is not tied into the ventilation system. In a fire situation, the entire ventilation for an entire "vertical fire zone" can be shut down, and there are fire dampers that will close when the temperature at the damper reaches a set temperature.

 

 

 

Never heard this referred to as "hogging". Hogging is a condition where the ship is either loaded so that the bow and stern have a deeper draft than the center of the ship (when looked at sideways, the ship is "frowning" or the two ends are drooping in relation to the middle), or in a seaway, with a particular distance between waves, the center is supported by a wave crest, while the two ends are in the troughs. This will cause stress to the hull, but no appreciable noise.

 

Seas slapping the hull in the area of the bow, where it flares up from the waterline will cause booming noises on just about any ship. Also, if the ship is being driven at a particular speed where the length, hull shape, wave period, wave height, and wave direction creates a harmonic situation, the ship can "stagger" with each wave, with noise and vibration. Sometimes, in order to make the itinerary, the speed cannot be changed, up or down, enough to get out of the harmonic zone.

 

Thank you very much. I call it that because the 4th Officer we asked used that term for it.

I've always lived in fear of lack of HVAC (or total HVAC inop) on cruise ships. Fortunately my only Prinsendam cruises was a verandah cabin, north-facing for the duration of a northern hemisphere transit during the cool season for the most part.

 

Liked my last long cruise where there was a large opening window on 2 sides of a corner cabin.

Onboard the Prinsendam holiday cruise and we have had multiple problems with our cabin. Mostly no AC followed by lots of banging when ever we hit a wave. We were on deck 7 forward but I insisted that we be moved. Many forward cabins are without AC. They only moved us when we ordered a meeting with the Hotel Manager. There is a real lack of leadership from Sr crew onboard.

Never again will I sail onboard the Prinsendam!

 

We sailed on the Prinsendam for eight months last winter. I found all of the staff, Senior and lower, to be competent and extremely cooperative. What few problems we did experience were quickly corrected with no fuss or ado. One night, due to a water overflow problem, we were even given a different cabin to use without either expecting it or requesting it. The only ongoing problem we experienced was the repeated failure of at least one of the eight passenger elevators. But they were always worked on quickly. I cannot fault HAL for their for their responsivenesss to problems.

 

Scott & Karen

The only fire suppression system in passenger areas is the sprinkler system, and it is not tied into the ventilation system. In a fire situation, the entire ventilation for an entire "vertical fire zone" can be shut down, and there are fire dampers that will close when the temperature at the damper reaches a set temperature.

 

 

....

 

My error, I should have said the ventilation "smoke suppression" system instead of fire suppression, which is as you state a factor of the sprinkler system - as was explained here about the HACV system, cabin air pressure ....and open balcony doors and the need to keep any corridor smoke out of the cabins if there was a fire some where else on the ship. At least that is how I remembered the explanation.

 

Now hopefully you can help us also understand how it happens there is "no A/C" in some cabins. Is this a localized venting problem, a master unit problem - what goes wrong with an A/C system so that is breaks down entirely and what does it take to fix them.

 

We learned a lot from you about passengers who put things into the plumbing system that cause back-ups in the linked systems, but what causes A/C to go out completely? TIA

Yes, cabins are slightly positive pressure, and passageways slightly negative pressure, so that smoke does not pass from the passageways to the cabins.

 

Now, marine HVAC 101. Instead of pumping refrigerant all around the ship, like your home AC does, we use "chilled water" (common in industrial and commercial buildings as well) which is a fresh water loop cooled by the AC refrigerant in the engine room to about 10*C (50*F). This water is pumped around the ship to cool the air.

 

Now, ventilation is segregated by fire zone. So, between each set of fire doors in the passageway, is a separate ventilation system, with its own set of supply and exhaust fans. This is further broken down by public spaces and sets of cabins (all in that fire zone on one or two decks).

 

As with all well designed HVAC systems, 20% of a space's (cabin or public space) volume is supplied per hour as fresh air. 20% of the space's volume is exhausted to outside to balance the fresh air intake. 80% of the space's volume is recirculated. Each of these air systems (supply, exhaust, and recirculation) is handled differently when it comes to cooling.

 

Supply air, since it covers multiple spaces (maybe two bars, or 40 cabins), this air comes from outside, through the fan, and into a "battery room" (typically those large "white spaces" running down the middle of cabin decks), where the fans, filters, and cooling coils for several systems are. These cooling coils are cooled by the chilled water pumped up to them, and are controlled by a master thermostat that controls the amount of chilled water flowing through the coil. This air is then supplied to the spaces (public space or cabins) at around 19-20*C (66-68*F).

 

The exhaust air is taken care of by the bathroom exhaust vent in cabins, and by exhaust fans in public spaces. This cool air (cooler than outside, warm by comparison to the spaces) passes an "enthalpy wheel" that takes heat from the outside fresh air to "pre-cool" that, and sends that heat out with the exhaust.

 

The recirculation air is what gives the most problems in cabins. Each cabin has its own small fan and cooling coil that takes the 80% of the cabin's volume, and cools it using its own supply of chilled water. Instead of modulating the chilled water the way the supply coils do, this unit simply has a solenoid valve that starts and stops the flow of chilled water to the coil. This fan coil unit is what is controlled by the cabin thermostat, and the thermostat operates this solenoid valve.

 

Probably the most common source of complaints about "no AC" in a cabin is a plugged air filter at the cabin's fan coil unit. These disposable filters are changed regularly, but there are, as you can imagine, a whole lot of them, so it becomes a full time job. A different, and much rarer problem would be air in the chilled water piping, as this can disrupt the flow of water and hence affect the amount of cooling. All of the systems are equipped with automatic air vents, but sometimes you can get a pocket of air stopping flow to a few cabins. These are the problems if air flow is adequate, but temperature is not, bearing in mind that the cruise lines, like most hotels, only guarantee a 70-74*F range in the cabin/room.

 

If air flow is insufficient, then either a motor damper has failed (motor dampers adjust the air flow to public spaces), or a fire damper has failed (fire dampers have thermal links that melt and close the damper when it senses a fire (high temperature). Fire dampers need to be manually reset, which requires climbing into the overhead, typically in the passageways.

 

So, the AC system will typically not "break down completely", unless the chilled water system, with its multiple redundant pumps fails. Each fire zone having its own set of fans and fan coil units creates redundancy, so you would at most lose one zone, or a block of cabins. And, again, the whole 20%, 20%, 80% concept relies on "air balance", which opening balcony doors, or propping open doors to outside decks will defeat, with attendant loss of cooling.

Onboard the Prinsendam holiday cruise and we have had multiple problems with our cabin. Mostly no AC followed by lots of banging when ever we hit a wave. We were on deck 7 forward but I insisted that we be moved. Many forward cabins are without AC. They only moved us when we ordered a meeting with the Hotel Manager. There is a real lack of leadership from Sr crew onboard.

Never again will I sail onboard the Prinsendam!

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

The 'Prinsendam' was built in 1988! It has sailed beyond its 'cruiselife' & needs to be sold or delivered to the scrapyard! :mad:

The 'Prinsendam' was built in 1988! It has sailed beyond its 'cruiselife' & needs to be sold or delivered to the scrapyard! :mad:

Is it really just a matter of age? I suppose it could be but one thing that struck me about this ship, when I was researching this specific cruise (the holiday cruise currently underway) a week or so before the cruise embarked, was how empty it seemed the ship was to be. The OP even relayed how their relocation was partially a matter that there were empty cabins available. Do we have any idea how empty this ship runs on average as compared to other ships in the line? This ship does seem to exist solely to fulfill certain expectations for itineraries offered and different (small-ship) cruise experiences offered, but if those offerings are keeping even such a small ship somewhat empty, then the age of the ship is not the only issue. (Of course, the two issues are probably linked, each causing the other.)

The 'Prinsendam' was built in 1988! It has sailed beyond its 'cruiselife' & needs to be sold or delivered to the scrapyard! :mad:

 

Sorry, but it is not past it's cruise life. A/C problems can happen on any ship and do. Scroll above for a very good explanation on A/C problems. She just underwent a very expensive dry dock and refit so HAL is certainly willing to invest in her ;)

 

Is it really just a matter of age? I suppose it could be but one thing that struck me about this ship, when I was researching this specific cruise (the holiday cruise currently underway) a week or so before the cruise embarked, was how empty it seemed the ship was to be. The OP even relayed how their relocation was partially a matter that there were empty cabins available. Do we have any idea how empty this ship runs on average as compared to other ships in the line? This ship does seem to exist solely to fulfill certain expectations for itineraries offered and different (small-ship) cruise experiences offered, but if those offerings are keeping even such a small ship somewhat empty, then the age of the ship is not the only issue. (Of course, the two issues are probably linked, each causing the other.)

 

Prinsendam is a very popular ship and usually sells out. There only has to be one cabin available to accommodate the OP ;) and, thankfully they could be accommodated. Her prices are higher due to her smaller size and many unique itineraries and she is still the most profitable ship in the fleet on a per passenger basis.