How is it Possible That a Container Ship Collided with a USN Destroyer Near Japan?

Welcome to Cruise Critic! If you'd like to participate on our forums by joining in the conversation, please Register Now! Be sure to visit our FAMOUS Roll Call forums, where you can meet other cruisers sailing with you and share a tour or shore excursion and SAVE MONEY!

Ask a Cruise Question
Post your general cruise questions here.
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
All times are GMT -4.
The time now is 06:32 PM.
#1
Evergreen CO
155 Posts
Joined Jul 2016
Makes me kinda unsettled that this kind of thing can actually happen. Neither ships radar saw the other? Unlikely. The only plausible explanation is that the bridge crew on both ships weren't paying attention for an extended period of time. Don't modern ships have collision avoidance alarms?

If this could happen to a USN Destroyer, it's not out of the question that it could happen to a cruise ship. Makes one wonder.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/...-japan-n773521
#2
Miami, Florida
60 Posts
Joined Jan 2017
In the past 60 years the US Navy has had many more fatalities (completely removed from any hostile action) than the entire worldwide cruise industry.

We should be thankful that they are not allowed to drive or operate cruise ships.
#3
Brisbane, Australia
717 Posts
Joined Oct 2008
Originally posted by CHPURSER
In the past 60 years the US Navy has had many more fatalities (completely removed from any hostile action) than the entire worldwide cruise industry.

We should be thankful that they are not allowed to drive or operate cruise ships.
They didn't see each other? Or neither one wanted to move from what they thought was their "given" route. Unbelievable!
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature


2005, P&O, Pacific Sun, South Pacific Islands
2006, P&O, Pacific Sun, South Pacific Islands
2007, Celebrity Summit, Alaska
2008 P&O, Pacific Sun, New Zealand and Pacific Islands
2008 Celebrity Millenium New Zealand
2009 Dawn Princess, Sydney to Southampton
2010 Pacific Dawn - North Queensland
2010 Pacific Sun - comedy cruise
2010 Rhapsody of the Seas - South Pacific
2011 Celebrity Infinity - South America & Antarctica
2011 P&O Sun, Fremantle to Sydney
2012 Pacific Dawn - South Pacific
2013 Diamond Princess, Beijing to Bangkok
2013 Pacific Pearl South Pacific
2014 MSC Orchestra and Preziosa - Mediterranean
2014 Sea Princess - Papua New Guinea
2015 RCI Mariner of the Seas - South East Asia
2015 Victoria Lianna - Yangtze River Cruise
2015 Diamond Princess Japanese Cruise
2016 Regal Princess - Baltics
#4
Romsey England
11,244 Posts
Joined Mar 2009
Hmmmm.

Nothing in this report gives us a clue as to who or what was at fault, so why the theorising from thousands of miles away.

The fault of the destroyer captain?
Or the container-ship captain?
Or some other officer or a local pilot on either ship?
Or even some other ship which baulked one of those vessels.

A navigational or steering or other mechanical mal-function?

The weather?
We know it was dark, we don't know if it was foggy or stormy.

So how about we learn more before hypothesising.
Or better still, wait for the marine safety experts' report.

JB
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Anyone who looks like their passport photo is too ill to travel (Will Kommen)
#6
Atlanta,Ga
356 Posts
Joined Jan 2013
Hmmmm, One wonders, Where IS the OP: Navybanker when we need his honest and knowledgeable input when we need it. I hope they do find those missing sailors. I was always under the impression that actual collisions between ships, regardless of nations, were extremely rare, or possibly not given the news coverage.

Mac.
#7
Atlanta,Ga
356 Posts
Joined Jan 2013
Hmmmm, One wonders, Where IS the OP: Navybanker when we need his honest and knowledgeable input when we need it. I hope they do find those missing sailors. I was always under the impression that actual collisions between ships, regardless of nations, were extremely rare, or possibly not given any news coverage.

Mac.
#8
Patriot Nation
4,518 Posts
Joined Jul 2008
Originally posted by John Bull
Hmmmm.

Nothing in this report gives us a clue as to who or what was at fault, so why the theorising from thousands of miles away.

The fault of the destroyer captain?
Or the container-ship captain?
Or some other officer or a local pilot on either ship?
Or even some other ship which baulked one of those vessels.

A navigational or steering or other mechanical mal-function?

The weather?
We know it was dark, we don't know if it was foggy or stormy.

So how about we learn more before hypothesising.
Or better still, wait for the marine safety experts' report.

JB
Size dictate's.

The biggest ship has the right of way cuz it's the hardest to turn.
.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature

Platinum +
The cure for anything is salt water .
Sweat, Tears,or
The Sea !!

Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. ~Mark Twain


NCL Dream Bermuda June2008
NCL Dream Bermuda Oct. 2008
NCL Spirit Bermuda Sept. 2009
NCL Spirit Boston to Quebec Sept.2009
NCL Spirit Quebec to Boston Oct. 2009
NCL Spirit Bermuda June 2010
NCL Sun W. Caribbean Nov.2010
NCL Dawn Bermuda Sept. 2011
NCL Dawn Bermuda Oct. 2011
NCL Dawn Bermuda June 8th 2012
NCL Dawn Bermuda June 22 2012
NCL Dawn Bermuda Sept 2012
NCL Dawn Boston to Quebec Oct. 2012
NCL Dawn Quebec to Boston Oct. 2012
NCL Dawn Western Caribbean Apr. 14th 2013
NCL Dawn North bound Repo Apr. 21st 2013
NCL Dawn Bermuda Sept. 2013
NCL Dawn South bound Repo Nov. 2013
NCL Dawn Bermuda July 11 2014
NCL Dawn Boston to Quebec Sept. 12 2014
NCL Dawn Quebec to Boston Sept. 19 2014
NCL Dawn Bermuda Oct. 10 2014
NCL Dawn Bermuda Sept. 4 2015
NCL Dawn Bermuda August 26th 2016
NCL Dawn Bermuda June 9th 2017
Do not be afraid of dying, be afraid of not living life to it's fullest !
#9
Coastal GA USA
20,932 Posts
Joined Nov 2007
If you relish reading these things, go to cargolaw.com.

http://www.cargolaw.com/index-new.html

Some very amusing incidents... EM
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Booked: Carnival Magic 8/26/17; Carnival Splendor 1/14/18
Carnival Pride B2B 21 nites 2/19/17 Caribbean
Carnival Glory 8/27/16
MSC Divina 5/7/16
Carnival Fascination 22 Feb 2016 Bahamas
MSC Divina 11/20-23/2013 Bahamas
Coral Princess 17 July 2013 Alaska
Celebrity Silhouette 22 May 2013 Adriatic & Italy
Queen Elizabeth 15 May 2013 4 nights
Celebrity Infinity 16 April 2013 B2B San Diego to Harwich
Nieuw Amsterdam Mediterranean 4/30 - 5/24/2012
Millennium B2B2B 2/6-20/2012 Caribbean
Caribbean Princess 10/29/2011 Caribbean Islander NY to FLL
Celebrity Solstice 5/1/2011 FLL to Barcelona
Carnival Fascination 2/28/11 Bahamas
QM 2 12/8/2010 Caribbean Delights
Celebrity Summit 10/24/10 B2B NY to San Juan
Emerald Princess 8/29/10 Western Caribbean
Diamond Princess 5/29/10 B2B Alaska
Westerdam 2/7/10 Eastern & Southern Caribbean
Carnival Dream 10/27/09 Transatlantic
Carnival Sensation 6/18/09 Bahamas
Carnival Splendor 5/17/09 B2B Mexi-not to Canada
Oosterdam 2/28/09 San Diego to Rome 32 nights
Carnival Fascination 12/13/08 Bahamas
QE 2 7/31/08 Lands of Fire and Ice
Celebration 3/27/08 Bahamas
Celebration 1/26/08 Bahamas
Norwegian Spirit 10/20/07 CTN
Elation 4/23/07 B2B Bahamas
Zenith 8/2006 Bermuda
Calypso 7/2005 Greek Isles
Star Princess Inaugural 2/2002 Pacific Rim Singapore to LA 26 nights
Millennium 8/2000 Baltic
Fantasy 6/1999 Bahamas
Royal Princess 1/1999 Buenos Aires to Manaus
Home Lines Oceanic x 2 1973 NYC to Nassau 7 nights
Homes Lines Homeric x2 Eastern Caribbean 1972 10 nights
#10
Philly burbs, PA.
11,019 Posts
Joined Sep 2008
Originally posted by mnocket
Makes me kinda unsettled that this kind of thing can actually happen. Neither ships radar saw the other? Unlikely. The only plausible explanation is that the bridge crew on both ships weren't paying attention for an extended period of time. Don't modern ships have collision avoidance alarms?

If this could happen to a USN Destroyer, it's not out of the question that it could happen to a cruise ship. Makes one wonder.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/...-japan-n773521
This is pure speculation with no basis in fact at this point. The only ones who are in a position to know for sure what happened on these ships and provide a plausible explanation is their Captains - and I don't believe there has been any information released yet by either or them to the general public. How it was possible remains to be seen and will ultimately be a matter of fact and events, not speculation.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
[SIGPIC]

RCI / Celebrity cruises:
RCI Sovereign
RCI Majesty (twice)
RCI Grandeur (3 times - Maiden voyage +2)
RCI Adventure (3 times)
RCI Voyager
RCI Navigator (twice)
RCI Mariner
RCI Serenade
RCI Jewel
RCI Oasis (twice)
RCI Explorer (twice)
RCI Independence (twice)
RCI Freedom
RCI Allure
RCI Liberty
Celebrity Summit
Celebrity Equinox
Celebrity Equinox 3/18
Celebrity Reflection 6/18
Celebrity Solstice 4/19
Upcoming:




#11
Romsey England
11,244 Posts
Joined Mar 2009
Originally posted by [email protected]
Size dictate's.

The biggest ship has the right of way cuz it's the hardest to turn.
.
Yes, and because it takes the longest time to change speed.

But we don't know whether a decision not to give-way was the cause.
Shoot the navy captain now, ask questions later ????????????

JB
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Anyone who looks like their passport photo is too ill to travel (Will Kommen)
#12
Ontario
2,704 Posts
Joined Mar 2012
Originally posted by John Bull
Yes, and because it takes the longest time to change speed.

But we don't know whether a decision not to give-way was the cause.
Shoot the navy captain now, ask questions later ????????????

JB
I don't think the U.S. Navy investigators and senior command will be lurking here on CC in order to get information regarding the accident or find out what they should do with the Captain.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
When you are courting a nice girl an hour seems like a second. When you sit on a red-hot cinder a second seems like an hour. That's relativity.
- Albert Einstein

#13
Romsey England
11,244 Posts
Joined Mar 2009
Originally posted by DirtyDawg
I don't think the U.S. Navy investigators and senior command will be lurking here on CC in order to get information regarding the accident or find out what they should do with the Captain.

You misunderstand my post, Dawg

"Shoot now & ask questions later" isn't my suggestion to the Navy brass.
It's my criticism of those on this thread who've already decided that the Navy captain was at fault.

JB
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Anyone who looks like their passport photo is too ill to travel (Will Kommen)
#14
Philly burbs, PA.
11,019 Posts
Joined Sep 2008
Originally posted by John Bull
You misunderstand my post, Dawg

"Shoot now & ask questions later" isn't my suggestion to the Navy brass.
It's my criticism of those on this thread who've already decided that the Navy captain was at fault.

JB
Agree. Or are drawing assumptive conclusions as to cause without any factual information yet available.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
[SIGPIC]

RCI / Celebrity cruises:
RCI Sovereign
RCI Majesty (twice)
RCI Grandeur (3 times - Maiden voyage +2)
RCI Adventure (3 times)
RCI Voyager
RCI Navigator (twice)
RCI Mariner
RCI Serenade
RCI Jewel
RCI Oasis (twice)
RCI Explorer (twice)
RCI Independence (twice)
RCI Freedom
RCI Allure
RCI Liberty
Celebrity Summit
Celebrity Equinox
Celebrity Equinox 3/18
Celebrity Reflection 6/18
Celebrity Solstice 4/19
Upcoming:




#15
The Big Easy
18,683 Posts
Joined Oct 2006
Originally posted by [email protected]
Size dictate's.

The biggest ship has the right of way cuz it's the hardest to turn.
Originally posted by John Bull
Yes, and because it takes the longest time to change speed.
They're both power driven vessels, offshore where neither was constrained by draft. That means vessel on the right has right-of-way. It has nothing to do with size.

This is in no way a judgement of fault but at first glance....since the container ship has bow damage and the destroyer has starboard side damage...the indication is the container ship had right-of-way.
#17
Charleston SC
2,128 Posts
Joined Oct 2011
[quote=mnocket;53324565]Makes me kinda unsettled that this kind of thing can actually happen. Neither ships radar saw the other? Unlikely. The only plausible explanation is that the bridge crew on both ships weren't paying attention for an extended period of time. Don't modern ships have collision avoidance alarms?

If this could happen to a USN Destroyer, it's not out of the question that it could happen to a cruise ship. Makes one wonder.
/quote]

The "only" plausible explanation....NO. There could have been a mechanical failure of some sort on the DDG.

The container ship could have been on auto pilot with a minimum crew on the bridge at that hour. (it happened around 2-3am) while the Navy vessel would have had a full watch crew on the bridge, cic as well as topside lookouts. someone would have seen or noticed a large container ship of her starboard side and thus could have taken an emergency course change. (2 screws and 4 gas turbine engines those destroyers are fast and quite nimble. Especially compared to a cargo ship) Having been on a navy ship that had mechanical failures it is a viable reason.

Just tossing that out there before some folks start blaming the crew of the navy ship before any facts are known.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
This message sent using a piece of fruit.
#18
SoCal Gal
5,123 Posts
Joined Dec 2011
Originally posted by TheOldBear
Another link to a story and discussion [some knowledge posters] is at the US Naval Institute 'news' site
https://news.usni.org/2017/06/16/des...-merchant-ship
Thanks for the link. Interesting reading.

As a current USN reservist, my heart hurts for those sailors missing.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature





Save
Save
#20
Connecticut
11,473 Posts
Joined Sep 2005
Originally posted by [email protected]
Size dictate's.

The biggest ship has the right of way cuz it's the hardest to turn.
.
Other things being equal, yes the less maneuverable has right of way-- but there are a number of other governing conditions: in an overtaking situation, the ship being passed has right of way, in a crossing situation the one to starboard of the other has right of way - among many others.

It is pointless to speculate right now, given the lack of information.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Six US Navy ships,
25+ cruises: Orient (1), Holland America (11), Norwegian (6), Carnival (1), Princess (1), Celebrity (3), Cunard (2), Royal Caribbean (1) - (1996-2017).
Coming up: Holland America - September 2017