Nieuw-Amsterdam denied entry Casablanca port.

[jakkojakko]

http://www.gaystarnews.com/article/gay-cruise-claims-it-was-banned-morocco010712

 

‘Our port agent in Casablanca has advised us that authorities in Morocco have, despite previous confirmations, now denied our scheduled visit,’ RSVP Vacations and Holland-America Line said in a joint statement.

 

It seems Morocco does not like gay's.

 

http://www.telegraaf.nl/buitenland/12469235/__Marokko_weert_gayboot__.html

 

It is big news in Dutch newspapers and tv.

 

http://www.bikyamasr.com/71381/all-gay-cruise-to-morocco-cancelled-blame-on-government/

[sail7seas]

HAL has no say or choice. It is no reflection on them.

 

Any port can refuse any ship it appears.

 

[jakkojakko]

HAL has no say or choice. It is no reflection on them.

 

Any port can refuse any ship it appears.

 

 

It is the reason for refusal that is remarkable

[sail7seas]

Yes, of course.

[localady]

How unfortunate and short sighted on the part of the Moroccan Government. Think of all those tourist dollars, gay or otherwise, that also remained on the ship. :rolleyes:

 

It is too bad that in this day and age that discrimination is still so visible.......:o

[Willem Ruys]

I THINK it was over 20 years ago but the Cayman Islands refused to allow the LEEWARD to come into Georgetown while on a gay charter and don't recall either the ship or details but Belize either denied entry to a gay charter or if they did allow it many locals were viciously unkind, as are many in Jamaica and St. Lucia in particular, often violently attacking visiting gay passengers. KNOW about where you're going no matter who you are, or your sexuality, or religion, or ethnic background.

[igraf]

Agree with them or not, it is refreshing to see principles prevailing over a quick buck. Not every country is so quick to sell out.

 

I find myself questioning HAL's decision to send a gay charter to a country that punishes gay men. Perhaps HAL should put the safety of the passengers over profits.

 

igraf

 

 

 

 

How unfortunate and short sighted on the part of the Moroccan Government. Think of all those tourist dollars, gay or otherwise, that also remained on the ship. :rolleyes:

 

It is too bad that in this day and age that discrimination is still so visible.......:o

[Essiesmom]

Agree with them or not, it is refreshing to see principles prevailing over a quick buck. Not every country is so quick to sell out.

 

I find myself questioning HAL's decision to send a gay charter to a country that punishes gay men. Perhaps HAL should put the safety of the passengers over profits.

 

igraf

 

Sometimes the charter dictates the itinerary. The itinerary for this cruise bears no relation to what the ship is doing the rest of the season in Europe. So I would guess that RSVP chose the ports. EM

[kazu]

It is the reason for refusal that is remarkable

 

Having just returned from MOrocco - it's not remarkable at all. this country has a very strict code of ethics (even including smoking in public).

 

Actually I am surprised this charter selected/and or didn't investigate if they could do a different port with HAL. Morocco's stand is well known.

 

Just as we ladies must cover our shoulders and knees in churches in most European countries, Morocco has rules all onto itself. It's conservatism is well known.

 

Please don't misunderstand - I'm not condoning it - just saying that's the way it is - and yes, for the ship to dock there would put people at risk in that country JMHO:o

[innlady1]

It sounds to me as if RSVP did not do their homework. It seems they should/would choose ports of call that are gay-friendly.

[jakkojakko]

Having just returned from MOrocco - it's not remarkable at all. this country has a very strict code of ethics (even including smoking in public).

 

Just as we ladies must cover our shoulders and knees in churches in most European countries, Morocco has rules all onto itself. It's conservatism is well known.

 

 

Yes this is well known. However they are denying that this is the reason, so they apparently don't want the bad publicity:

 

Despite the companies’ statements, the Moroccan government denied that they had said no to the ship arriving in the country.

Morocco’s Tourism Minister Lahcen Haddad reported that no official decision had been made to prevent the ship from stopping in Morocco.

 

Given the state's laws and customs, maybe it had been better to avoid this stop given the nature of the cruise. Perhaps the charter specifically wanted to visit Morocco.

[English_in_Spain]

What I don't understand is why this has come up at this late stage.

 

When the call at the port was originally scheduled, was it not mentioned by HAL that this was a charter? Did no one think to mention that this was a 'gay' charter?

 

If it was not previously mentioned then I think that maybe HAL is at fault for not anticipating a potential problem in a Muslim country.

 

[Himself]

Having just returned from MOrocco - it's not remarkable at all. this country has a very strict code of ethics (even including smoking in public).

 

Actually I am surprised this charter selected/and or didn't investigate if they could do a different port with HAL. Morocco's stand is well known.

 

Just as we ladies must cover our shoulders and knees in churches in most European countries, Morocco has rules all onto itself. It's conservatism is well known.

 

Please don't misunderstand - I'm not condoning it - just saying that's the way it is - and yes, for the ship to dock there would put people at risk in that country JMHO:o

 

In the United States people dress for church like they are going to the beach except in the poor areas. Poor people wear their Sunday best!

[arewethereyet]

Morocco is almost 100% muslim. This is no surprise. The surprise is that this port was scheduled at all. This would be a worthy story if the ship was denied entry to Baltimore. Casablanca, not so much.

[IRL_Joanie]

The OP quoted directly, a joint statement from HAL and RSVP:

 

Quote:

‘Our port agent in Casablanca has advised us that authorities in Morocco have, despite previous confirmations, now denied our scheduled visit,’ RSVP Vacations and Holland-America Line said in a joint statement.

 

Now, this tells me that both HAL and the RSVP Vacations DID do their Research and had received permission to visit at least this port of call.

 

For some reason, whether it is a local port authority or someone higher up, the ship and its passengers were denied entry to the port.

 

We, here in our homes and countries do not feel this is right. And thank Goodness for that.

 

HOWEVER, we can not denigrate nor berate any country or religion for their laws. As I understand it, it is a Law and being Gay can get you anywhere from 6 months to 3 years in prison!!!

 

I copied this below from a PDF I got after I Googled Arabic Law Gay Morocco:

 

Deleted the portion of pdf as it was nothing but coding gibberish, please go to the link and read right at the top the penalties for being found Gay.

http://www.asylumlaw.org/docs/sexualminorities/MoroccoWikipedia.pdf

 

Sad to see this but I have to respect the rights of other religions and governments and respect them when they stick to their mores/laws.

 

Joanie

[Himself]

Agree with them or not, it is refreshing to see principles prevailing over a quick buck. Not every country is so quick to sell out.

 

I find myself questioning HAL's decision to send a gay charter to a country that punishes gay men. Perhaps HAL should put the safety of the passengers over profits.

 

igraf

 

Knowing the hard stand of Morocco on Gays, why would a gay cruise even want to go there?

[peaches from georgia]

Sometimes the charter dictates the itinerary. The itinerary for this cruise bears no relation to what the ship is doing the rest of the season in Europe. So I would guess that RSVP chose the ports. EM

Surely the ultimate decision to approve ports or not would be HAL's to make before the itinerary was set. I would think any charter group would submit a list of desired ports to the cruiseline, but would not be able to dictate

where the ship goes.

[tonymontana111]

That's very homophobic of the Maroccan government. HAL is not to be blamed of course, but I do feel with those that are injured by this decision.

[innlady1]

Surely the ultimate decision to approve ports or not would be HAL's to make before the itinerary was set. I would think any charter group would submit a list of desired ports to the cruiseline, but would not be able to dictate

where the ship goes.

 

I would think so as well. As I said, it seems RSVP didn't do their homework...nor did HAL.

[localady]

Agree with them or not, it is refreshing to see principles prevailing over a quick buck. Not every country is so quick to sell out.

 

I find myself questioning HAL's decision to send a gay charter to a country that punishes gay men. Perhaps HAL should put the safety of the passengers over profits.

 

igraf

 

Very sad that you find discriminatory behavior/outward discrimination as "principles prevailing over a quick buck"

[PathfinderEss]

Most are aware of Morocco stance on Gays. So I ask the same as OP, why would RSVP as a group or Hal try to go into Morocco? Seems a little strange to me, did RSVP or Hal really think Morocco wasn't going to abide by their own laws?

[Oslo Dutch]

Atlantis did visit Egypt a couple of years ago which went fine.

 

Morocco is a bit of a different thing. In the Netherlands (and I suppose also in the rest of Western Europe) the Moroccans immigrant community has a very bad reputation, especially when it comes to tolerance towards the gay community. So I already frowned when I saw RSVP advertising a call at Casablanca, so this cruise was definitely a no go from the start.

 

It must have been a good selling point and the ship leaves the EU which means purchases on board do not get taxed. But I still find it a little naive to go there in the first. And even if they would have gotten there, who would be held responsible for the safety of guests ashore?

 

They are better off in Malaga today.... and they must have raised a hell lot of taxes on bar purchases this week.... Europe should be happy :-)

[SwissMyst]

UN report: Morocco exhibits differing private and public attitudes about homosexuality: http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/publisher,IRBC,,MAR,469cd6af0,0.html

[bishop84]

I also find it somewhat surprising that RSVP and/or HAL choose to schedule Morocco on the cruise knowing the attitude towards homosexuality in that country. However it seems that they had advance permission from national politicians to call but this could have been overridden by a local official or politician at the last moment when they found the guests on the ship were homosexual.

 

As Oslo Dutch states they have to leave the EU in order not to pay duty and other taxes. This basically means that to avoid taxes, duty, etc. they would have to call at a North African country* so maybe they thought Morocco was the most tolerant?

 

* as the rest of the cruise is Spanish ports I guess calling at Gibraltar may not have been an option?

 

If the call was indeed replaced with Malaga then Spain can levy duty and tax on the cruise. Knowing how RSVP cruisers party that may add up to quite a few Euros! (But maybe not enough to bail out their banks!)

[arewethereyet]

I also find it somewhat surprising that RSVP and/or HAL choose to schedule Morocco on the cruise knowing the attitude towards homosexuality in that country. However it seems that they had advance permission from national politicians to call but this could have been overridden by a local official or politician at the last moment when they found the guests on the ship were homosexual.

 

As Oslo Dutch states they have to leave the EU in order not to pay duty and other taxes. This basically means that to avoid taxes, duty, etc. they would have to call at a North African country* so maybe they thought Morocco was the most tolerant?

 

* as the rest of the cruise is Spanish ports I guess calling at Gibraltar may not have been an option?

 

If the call was indeed replaced with Malaga then Spain can levy duty and tax on the cruise. Knowing how RSVP cruisers party that may add up to quite a few Euros! (But maybe not enough to bail out their banks!)

There aren't a lot of options in that case. Algeria? Of course you did say "most tolerant", so it is relative.