NCL Refund Request

[sparks1093]

All three of the major cruise line companies (NCLH, RCL, CCL) are listed on the US stock market and do their accounting in accordance with US accounting rules and practices.

 

Under those rules, if a service charge can be removed, it can be collected and distributed to the crew without being considered to be income by the cruise lines. Payments made to the crew with those funds are also not an expense to the cruise line and are not considered to be salary for the crew. This provides several benefits to the crew because depending upon their home country income received in this way might not be taxed, or taxed at a lower rate (outside of national retirement taxes for example).

 

There are two primary reasons why one can be pretty sure that the money is being passed on to the crew. 1. If NCL kept any of the money it would be material to their SEC filings and would need to be reported. Especially since it would not be a normal accounting practice. 2. If they were in fact keeping the money and not passing on to the crew, then there would not be any reason for them to allow customers to modify or remove it.

 

The fact that they still allow it to be modified is the biggest argument that they are following accounting rules and passing the entire DSC amount on to the crew. If they were not they would not have any reason to provide the option to modify or remove.

 

The amounts for drinks that cannot be removed or modified might be a different story since it cannot be reduced.

 

If NCL was keeping a part of the service charge before going public then would they need to report this on their SEC filings since it was a practice before going public? Because NCL has always said that a part of the service charge was used for crew incentive programs, which likely had to be accounted for differently than the amount paid directly to the cruise.

[RDC1]

If NCL was keeping a part of the service charge before going public then would they need to report this on their SEC filings since it was a practice before going public? Because NCL has always said that a part of the service charge was used for crew incentive programs, which likely had to be accounted for differently than the amount paid directly to the cruise.

 

The rules I mentioned apply to both public and private companies. THe biggest difference if they were private, is that you would not have the SEC files to review. The accounting rules remain the same. History does not impact the requirement.

 

The day it becomes non-removable/ non-modifiable is the day where the money must flow into the company as income, and any payments to the crew would be considered salary. With all of the ramifications that entails.

[RobertoF]

OP, do not feel bad, I have been waiting two months now for an NCL refund. They keep telling me it is "coming". I will never deal with this dishonest company again.

Edited August 5, 2016 by RobertoF

[luddite]

OP, do not feel bad, I have been waiting two months now for an NCL refund. They keep telling me it is "coming". I will never deal with this dishonest company again.

 

What sort of refund are you waiting for?

[Crusin6]

OP, do not feel bad, I have been waiting two months now for an NCL refund. They keep telling me it is "coming". I will never deal with this dishonest company again.

 

 

Dishonest company...well I agree but only to a point

 

 

I really think they have massive cash flow problems and are holding on their cash as long as possible

 

Plus they have either fired much of their back office staff....or more than likely ncl forced them out...or even possibly many went running for the hills ahead if a nervous breakdown lol

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

[RobertoF]

What sort of refund are you waiting for?

 

I am waiting for a service charge refund. And before everyone gets high and mighty about how I am a freeloading cretin for having asked for a service charge refund, I individually took care of the people who took care of me (apologies to the people washing my dishes and chopping my veggies but I think NCL needs to take care of you). Now NCL is holding onto my money because it wants to and because it can. But people should be aware of the kind of company NCL is, because I have cruised them all and NOBODY has ever pulled the type of garbage NCL has pulled. They are the Comcast of cruising.

[luddite]

I am waiting for a service charge refund. And before everyone gets high and mighty about how I am a freeloading cretin for having asked for a service charge refund, I individually took care of the people who took care of me (apologies to the people washing my dishes and chopping my veggies but I think NCL needs to take care of you). Now NCL is holding onto my money because it wants to and because it can. But people should be aware of the kind of company NCL is, because I have cruised them all and NOBODY has ever pulled the type of garbage NCL has pulled. They are the Comcast of cruising.

 

Well, that clears things up and we do understand your problem.

[swedish weave]

If they remove it because they can and they are cheap it has an effect upon everyone else by making the crew work for nothing and thus....they are unhappy. It actually IS everyone's business.

 

I don't know of ANY crew member who works for nothing. Exaggerations are not a good way of impressing those who read the posts.

[Responder]

I am waiting for a service charge refund. And before everyone gets high and mighty about how I am a freeloading cretin for having asked for a service charge refund, I individually took care of the people who took care of me (apologies to the people washing my dishes and chopping my veggies but I think NCL needs to take care of you). Now NCL is holding onto my money because it wants to and because it can. But people should be aware of the kind of company NCL is, because I have cruised them all and NOBODY has ever pulled the type of garbage NCL has pulled. They are the Comcast of cruising.

I love the Comcast analogy....right on.

 

As I mentioned before, I use Visa and a simple phone call to them gave me an instant credit...all I had to do to follow up was send them a copy of my refund request and they took it from there.

 

I also took care of the people who took care of me...I actually gave out more than the refund I requested.

 

All the cruise critic boards seem to thrive with those who live in their own self ordained moral spheres.

 

They are now firing up their flame throwers...;)

[Computer Nerd]

I am waiting for a service charge refund. And before everyone gets high and mighty about how I am a freeloading cretin for having asked for a service charge refund, I individually took care of the people who took care of me (apologies to the people washing my dishes and chopping my veggies but I think NCL needs to take care of you). Now NCL is holding onto my money because it wants to and because it can. But people should be aware of the kind of company NCL is, because I have cruised them all and NOBODY has ever pulled the type of garbage NCL has pulled. They are the Comcast of cruising.

 

awwww, why do you have to disrespect comcast that way. ;) :D

[zqvol]

All three of the major cruise line companies (NCLH, RCL, CCL) are listed on the US stock market and do their accounting in accordance with US accounting rules and practices.

 

Under those rules, if a service charge can be removed, it can be collected and distributed to the crew without being considered to be income by the cruise lines. Payments made to the crew with those funds are also not an expense to the cruise line and are not considered to be salary for the crew. This provides several benefits to the crew because depending upon their home country income received in this way might not be taxed, or taxed at a lower rate (outside of national retirement taxes for example).

 

There are two primary reasons why one can be pretty sure that the money is being passed on to the crew. 1. If NCL kept any of the money it would be material to their SEC filings and would need to be reported. Especially since it would not be a normal accounting practice. 2. If they were in fact keeping the money and not passing on to the crew, then there would not be any reason for them to allow customers to modify or remove it.

 

The fact that they still allow it to be modified is the biggest argument that they are following accounting rules and passing the entire DSC amount on to the crew. If they were not they would not have any reason to provide the option to modify or remove.

 

The amounts for drinks that cannot be removed or modified might be a different story since it cannot be reduced.

 

Please don't add logic to these types of discussions. The people who tend to rant in these threads don't like it and the terms you used are too complicated for them to understand.

[swedish weave]

All three of the major cruise line companies (NCLH, RCL, CCL) are listed on the US stock market and do their accounting in accordance with US accounting rules and practices.

 

Under those rules, if a service charge can be removed, it can be collected and distributed to the crew without being considered to be income by the cruise lines. Payments made to the crew with those funds are also not an expense to the cruise line and are not considered to be salary for the crew. This provides several benefits to the crew because depending upon their home country income received in this way might not be taxed, or taxed at a lower rate (outside of national retirement taxes for example).

 

There are two primary reasons why one can be pretty sure that the money is being passed on to the crew. 1. If NCL kept any of the money it would be material to their SEC filings and would need to be reported. Especially since it would not be a normal accounting practice. 2. If they were in fact keeping the money and not passing on to the crew, then there would not be any reason for them to allow customers to modify or remove it.

 

The fact that they still allow it to be modified is the biggest argument that they are following accounting rules and passing the entire DSC amount on to the crew. If they were not they would not have any reason to provide the option to modify or remove.

 

The amounts for drinks that cannot be removed or modified might be a different story since it cannot be reduced.

 

This rhetoric is interesting, but the accuracy is doubtful.

 

If the funds are tightly regulated, can you explain how the cruise lines can include them in the booking bonus programs ? Why do the cruise lines insist on keeping the funds and distributing them at their discretion instead of immediately dispensing them to the crew?

Why are the funds not distributed to the crew of the ship that provided the service instead of being distributed fleetwide ? Why do the cruise lines take two months or longer to return the DSC when guests request it ?

 

Sorry --- I don't think you are presenting the whole story on this.

[NLH Arizona]

Please don't add logic to these types of discussions. The people who tend to rant in these threads don't like it and the terms you used are too complicated for them to understand.

It is so refreshing to be able to read accurate information from a reliable source who has the facts, instead of reading just opinions. Thanks RDC1 for explaining it in a way that everyone can understand it. Edited August 6, 2016 by NLH Arizona

[CJ AND JOHN]

My daughter and her family have just returned from their first cruise. It was a gift from us to help them recover from a traumatic 6 months. They Spent their time relaxing by the pool with the children so did not use many facilities. I had told them they could adjust the charges but were told by staff that they couldn't. Only on return did they become aware that they should have asked for a form which was only available onboard and obviously they don't have one. They need help. Does anyone have a blank copy of the form and if so could you please let me have a copy for them as they only have 60 days to claim ans the daily charges for the children were rediculous. Much appreciated if you can scan it in or send it to me

[CruiseAF]

I love tipping cash and making sure the right amount of money gets to the right person. I’ve never paid DSC but have in most cases spent more money on the people that matter most.

 

Example: I almost always give my room steward $100 for the week unless they are horrible which is rare. I eat in the specialty restaurants every night and end up tipping at least $10 per night sometimes more. The bartenders get $1 per drink (that could be another $100 in itself) and I’ll always tip out dealers on a win (but I don’t count that since it’s house money)

 

So there you go, the people that scratch my back get scratched. That’s how the system is supposed to work. My waiter should be tipping out his busboy and dishwasher. My room steward should be tipping out his assistant.

 

Not “let me give all my tips to the owner of the restaurant and let them do what they see fit”

 

Do you see how retarded that sounds...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[KeithJenner]

Not “let me give all my tips to the owner of the restaurant and let them do what they see fit”

 

Do you see how retarded that sounds...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

 

It doesn’t sound even slightly retarded to me. It is what we do every day in various interactions with companies.

 

I don’t see it as giving tips to the owner. I see it as paying the price that the owner has set and leaving the agreement between them and their staff between those people.

 

Sounds quite sensible to me.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sam Ting]

My daughter and her family have just returned from their first cruise. It was a gift from us to help them recover from a traumatic 6 months. They Spent their time relaxing by the pool with the children so did not use many facilities. I had told them they could adjust the charges but were told by staff that they couldn't. Only on return did they become aware that they should have asked for a form which was only available onboard and obviously they don't have one. They need help. Does anyone have a blank copy of the form and if so could you please let me have a copy for them as they only have 60 days to claim ans the daily charges for the children were rediculous. Much appreciated if you can scan it in or send it to me

 

Tell them to dispute it with the credit card. The contract says they can be adjusted, and that’s what they asked the cruise line to do.

[April42749]

My daughter and her family have just returned from their first cruise. It was a gift from us to help them recover from a traumatic 6 months. They Spent their time relaxing by the pool with the children so did not use many facilities. I had told them they could adjust the charges but were told by staff that they couldn't. Only on return did they become aware that they should have asked for a form which was only available onboard and obviously they don't have one. They need help. Does anyone have a blank copy of the form and if so could you please let me have a copy for them as they only have 60 days to claim ans the daily charges for the children were rediculous. Much appreciated if you can scan it in or send it to me

 

Children often require more attention than adults, so I don't find the dsc "ridiculous" at all.

[ColeThornton]

My daughter and her family have just returned from their first cruise. It was a gift from us to help them recover from a traumatic 6 months. They Spent their time relaxing by the pool with the children so did not use many facilities. I had told them they could adjust the charges but were told by staff that they couldn't. Only on return did they become aware that they should have asked for a form which was only available onboard and obviously they don't have one. They need help. Does anyone have a blank copy of the form and if so could you please let me have a copy for them as they only have 60 days to claim ans the daily charges for the children were rediculous. Much appreciated if you can scan it in or send it to me

 

 

They used plenty of the services. It's impossible not too. If they paid the DSC they probably didn't tip the workers cash. If you remove the DSC now how are they planning on tipping those who served them and cleaned up after them? :confused:

[CruiseAF]

It doesn’t sound even slightly retarded to me. It is what we do every day in various interactions with companies.

 

I don’t see it as giving tips to the owner. I see it as paying the price that the owner has set and leaving the agreement between them and their staff between those people.

 

Sounds quite sensible to me.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

 

Name a business besides cruises that does something similar. Basically to make gratuities required and then disperse to employees as it sees fit.......

 

Would you like this done everywhere you go? Restaurants, hotels, department stores, gas stations... it sounds like you wouldn’t mind.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[Toofarfromthesea]

I wish more people would refuse to pay the DSC. In the short term it would hurt me, because I pay them, and so if enough people don't pay them the rest of us make up the difference. But I am ok with that in the short term, because I think they are a big fraud.

 

They are just cruise fare. NCL gets to exempt them from advertised cruise fare by pretending they are "discretionary," but then they make it virtually impossible to not pay them. They are an artifice designed to mislead about cruise fare, just like hotel resort fees and the like. They are also regressive in that they apply across the board without regard to cruise fare, cabin type (except a tiny increase for suites), number in cabin, and age. They are designed to trick the market and are anti-competitive. They are a major scourge in the industry and should be abolished industry wide.

 

Tips are not taxed in some countries so folding them into the fare would hurt the crew from those countries. All because some people won't just be decent human beings and do the right thing. But by all means, resist The Man, by sticking it to the crew.

[Toofarfromthesea]

If they remove it in the future, they will also remove me from their passenger manifest.

 

Their choice..

 

I have a feeling that the crew you stiffed won't mind.

[KeithJenner]

Name a business besides cruises that does something similar. Basically to make gratuities required and then disperse to employees as it sees fit.......

 

Would you like this done everywhere you go? Restaurants, hotels, department stores, gas stations... it sounds like you wouldn’t mind.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

 

I spend lots of money with lots of companies who take my money and then pass some of it on to their employees.

 

It happens all the time. Nothing retarded about that setup as far as I can see. It’s much easier for everyone, and I don’t mind one little bit. That’s why I just pay the DSC and get on with enjoying my holiday rather than spending time getting things deducted from my bill so that I can go around paying people individually. That certainly doesn’t sound like a fun way of spending my holiday time.

 

If that is indeed “retarded” then I happily am just that.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[123linz123]

Disputing a charge is accusing the company you are disputing of a criminal act. It requires that you participate in a law enforcement investigation of the person who has charged your account without authorization. Not sure that a slow refund equates to a criminal act.

 

If it's criminal (and I know it is, I looked it up) then why do the CC companies participate?

[123linz123]

I think the DSC is a big con. Don't get me wrong, I pay it. But I doubt it goes where any cruise line says it's going to. I wish it did.