Why Such Low Fares on HAL's Newest Ship?

[cruz-in]

Good Evening, 

 

We just booked an inside gaurnetee on a February sailing of the Nieuw Statendam for less than $1200 (total for two including all taxes and fees). I was surprised to see such a low rate for a ship that is just a month old.  Other lines newer ships command much higher rates for the first year or so. 

 

Thoughts on why HAL is discounting the Nieuw Statendam so soon? 

 

Thanks

 

Edited January 4, 2019 by cruz-in
typos

[Despegue]

New ship but not a new type...Nieuw Statendam is an almost exact copy of her sister, Koningsdam. Up to the same carpet colours in the lounges and restaurants.

[kazu]

Some may not to be anxious to sail her and instead choose to sail the oldest ship in the fleet (and pay a higher price) before she leaves the fleet.

 

I actually haven't seen one itinerary on this ship yet that calls to me 😉 

[foodsvcmgr]

Unsold space within the next month will be discounted until it is filled.

Normal practice for all ships.

Fares further out are quite high, just not at the market topping level of Celebrity Edge.

[JimnKaren]

Some cruisers shy away from 'new' ships for the first few months in order to allow the crew to create good, working teams.

 

Good friend is leaving on Konigsdam on Friday, having done Nieuw Statendam just prior. She commented that the MDR service was disorganized. True, that ship has been in service for a month, but there are still little things that need to be worked on.

 

Because there are many who stay away, HAL discounts the price to tempt people to join. Let us know your impressions once you have returned. OK? OK!

 

Jim

[cruz-in]

23 minutes ago, JimnKaren said:

Some cruisers shy away from 'new' ships for the first few months in order to allow the crew to create good, working teams.

 

Good friend is leaving on Konigsdam on Friday, having done Nieuw Statendam just prior. She commented that the MDR service was disorganized. True, that ship has been in service for a month, but there are still little things that need to be worked on.

 

Because there are many who stay away, HAL discounts the price to tempt people to join. Let us know your impressions once you have returned. OK? OK!

 

Jim

Hi Jim, 

 

Will do on reporting back on our experience. 

 

Understand your point, and it seems logical. Although on other lines the early cruises on thier new vessels tend to command the highest prices.

 

Heavily discounting a new vessel runs counter to what I have seen in the industry. Heck, HAL's newest ship has prices that are competitive with Carnival for the similar duration and timeframe.  

 

Can't get on Celebrity in Feburaury for anywhere near these prices. 

[Nymich]

3 hours ago, cruz-in said:

Good Evening, 

 

We just booked an inside gaurnetee on a February sailing of the Nieuw Statendam for less than $1200 (total for two including all taxes and fees). I was surprised to see such a low rate for a ship that is just a month old.  Other lines newer ships command much higher rates for the first year or so. 

 

Thoughts on why HAL is discounting the Nieuw Statendam so soon? 

 

Thanks

 

I thought lower fares was a good thing?   Having just sailed NS it is/was a great thing!

Edited January 4, 2019 by Nymich

[OVgirl]

3 hours ago, cruz-in said:

Good Evening, 

 

We just booked an inside gaurnetee on a February sailing of the Nieuw Statendam for less than $1200 (total for two including all taxes and fees). I was surprised to see such a low rate for a ship that is just a month old.  Other lines newer ships command much higher rates for the first year or so. 

 

Thoughts on why HAL is discounting the Nieuw Statendam so soon? 

 

Thanks

 

 

They are offering at least 2 price points. One is restricted (nonrefundable) and the other flexible. Of course at this point you are in penalty phase.

 

Come on over and join the rollcall. Looks like we'll be having a wave from PortEverglades webcam.

[cruz-in]

Oh Heavens, not meaning to complain about the price being low. 🙂

 

Just wondering if there was something I was missing about why. 

 

Thanks for all the inputs/thoughts. 

[Jammu2]

Edge for feb is about $1200 per person net of the $300 offer. So double.

 

We have 3 cruises booked. Two on HAL and one on X. We booked an Eclipse Hawaii cruise because we get a good deal once a year through M-Life. Otherwise we prefer the HAL experience. But I do see more "value" on Holland America than I see on other cruise lines. I, too, am a little worried by this.

 

 

Is it possible that the some core HAL customers are departing to Viking, Oceania, etc? Small ships. Superior service. Closer to the ocean, as someone at Celebrity speculated (they are having similar discussions). 

 

I like bargains. But I would hate to lose that HAL experience just as I am getting into it!

[cruising cockroach]

Maybe the primary HAL market is shrinking, or limited as in the capacity-market balance has been broken.  Too many ships/too much capacity and the other lines have the sizzle and/or hype.

[AtlantaCruiser72]

I have noticed for years that HAL struggles to fill their ships in the Caribbean and even on the newer vessels they cannot command the fare premium of their mainstream peers. There are numerous factors that contribute to this, most notably lack of brand awareness and/or a perception of HAL as floating nursing home. I think those two factors lead many consumers to pass over looking at HAL.

[mcrcruiser]

 Comparing a trans Atlantic  Nov 1 ,2020 on  RCCL allure of the Seas from Barcelona to Miami is a lot less costly  than Nieuw Statendam 's Trans Atlantic from Rome  for a  ocean balcony cabin  .Of course Allure is also more than twice the tons of NS  .Thus a much larger pax  .The economy of size  

 

 Not in all cases is NS less costly for similar itineraries

[mcrcruiser]

3 minutes ago, AtlantaCruiser72 said:

I have noticed for years that HAL struggles to fill their ships in the Caribbean and even on the newer vessels they cannot command the fare premium of their mainstream peers. There are numerous factors that contribute to this, most notably lack of brand awareness and/or a perception of HAL as floating nursing home. I think those two factors lead many consumers to pass over looking at HAL.

 Yes you do make several good points .We will see if HAL can attract a younger demograhic  ,on out March 2019  Caribbean cruise .That time is spring break  & a good test for having or not having youth on our cruise

Edited January 4, 2019 by mcrcruiser

[iancal]

It is a basic supply and demand issue.  Too many empty cabins to fill so they drop the price.  Caribbean is very competitive.  Lots of choice, lots of great ships.

[Aquahound]

14 hours ago, Despegue said:

New ship but not a new type...Nieuw Statendam is an almost exact copy of her sister, Koningsdam. Up to the same carpet colours in the lounges and restaurants.

 

Well, Koningsdam was a new type of ship and it was the same story for her.  I cruised K'dam when she was HAL's newest and greatest, yet my verandah stateroom was only about $80/night.  And it still didn't sell out.  I was told on board we sailed about 800 under capacity.  

 

I had the same questions back then as the OP does today.  I've never seen a brand new ship sailing for so cheap.  

[LoveHAL]

Having sailed on the Premiere voyage of the Nieuw S., it was a wonderful experience. I did not find the dining room to be disorganized. Sure, every once in a while on the 14-day voyage the MDR (fixed seating) the dinner took 10 minutes "longer", but we were always in and out between 1 hour 15 minutes and 1 hour 30 minutes. Again, disorganized??? Half the staff came from the Kdam (the same ship) so they already knew the drill and HAL's standards.

 

If the prices are low, take advantage of it..... and I suspect you will be smiling at the end of the voyage. The ship is amazing. In my opinion, it sets a new and wonderful standard for HAL. 

[cruz-in]

Thanks everyone.

 

We are thrilled to be going on the NS when she is so new...and thrilled at the value proposition. 

[Hlitner]

I would assume the prices are low because they cannot fill the ship.  Personally, we would not even consider that ship in the Caribbean....during February.  In fact, even though we like HAL (we are 5 Star Mariners) it is the last line we would book for a Caribbean cruise for many reasons.  But lets just consider one the NS itineraries...the 7 day Feb 17 cruise.   It departs its first port (Grand Turk) at 3 PM meaning everyone must be aboard by 2:30 pm.  If we wanted a nice day on the beach it would be time to think about getting back to the ship by 1:30....which is not a good thing.  Their next port, San Juan, has a scheduled 1pm arrival.  If the US authorities are a little slow, folks will not even be able to get off the ship until 1:30.  That is less then 1/2 of a day...and when you consider that a majority of HAL cruisers like to eat their dinner early, those folks will have no more then 3 hours in San Juan....not enough time for a beach day or even many tour options.  And the last port, Half Moon Cay shows a 3pm departure..so everyone must be aboard by 2:30 which means packing-up by 2.  Another partial beach day?  I do understand that the ship must leave Little Salvador Island somewhat early since they have to cruise around 300 miles and arrive at the Port Everglade Pilot Station at the proper time.   But when you look at the overall itinerary they only list a single port where there is a full day.  

 

And then consider their Feb 10 itinerary.  It leaves Grand Cayman at 4pm meaning everyone must be aboard by 3:30.  If folks want to go to a beach they will need to be heading back to the port by 2:30...which is not a good thing.  And then they get to Cozumel at 11am....which means that any decent beach chairs would have been rented by passengers from other ships who arrived at the normal early morning time.

 

Now lets compare that to an Oceania Riviera cruise on Feb 17.  That ship is in Costa Maya (1st port) from 8 - 6.  Their next port is Belize and they are also there from 8-6.  And their final port is Havana and that is an 8 am arrival and does not depart until noon the following day.  So all of their ports are full days (with an overnight in Havana).  

 

We could post example after example of how HAL's idiotic itineraries do not stack up against the competition.  In the Caribbean many folks go for the sun/sand and they want long port days so they have plenty of time to go to the beach, shop, etc.  Sure, there are quite a few HAL cruisers who could care less about itineraries and do not even bother to get off the ship.  But that is not the majority of the Caribbean cruisers.

 

A few years ago we did back to back Westerdam cruises in the Caribbean (our first and last Caribbean cruise on HAL) and the port times were awful.  We were leaving most ports by 3 or 4 while the competition was staying at those same ports until 5...and then sometimes beating us to the next port the following morning!  But even worse, when we would return to the Westy there would be the same "Glenn Miller" favorites from the HAL Cats.  No Caribbean band, no steel drums, no Bob Marley music!   On that Westy cruise another passenger (long time friend) got a good laugh when he suggested that HAL had taken one of their 100 year old customers, put him in an office, and told him to develop the itineraries.  And of course he could care less about port times because he never took his walker ashore!

 

My point is that HAL does not develop their itineraries to please many Caribbean cruisers who want full days in their ports...and we are talking 8-5 (or later).  For many potential customers the NS itineraries are a non-starter...and they immediately look to other lines/ships for those full days.  And although I am a senior (all too typical of HAL cruisers) and do enjoy Glenn Miller music, it is not what I want to hear in the Caribbean.  And I sure do not want to hear a typical HAL house band trying to play Caribbean music with a keyboard (that sounds like an organ) and a regular guitar.  My goodness, if Jimmy Buffet had played his music the way they do on HAL....he would still be a total unknown.  But we do give credit where it is do, and love the BB King concept on HAL (which is only on about half the ships).

 

Hank

[MauiWowie57]

56 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

My point is that HAL does not develop their itineraries to please many Caribbean cruisers who want full days in their ports...and we are talking 8-5 (or later). 

Outstanding post. I'll have to go back and look, but it always SEEMED as though the in-port times with Carnival were a lot longer. I'll postulate that port charges are lower for less desirable times, and that might be a driving factor - and help contribute to the theories about why HAL has such low rates (or appeared to, to some posters) for Caribbean cruises. 

[OVgirl]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

I would assume the prices are low because they cannot fill the ship.  Personally, we would not even consider that ship in the Caribbean....during February.  In fact, even though we like HAL (we are 5 Star Mariners) it is the last line we would book for a Caribbean cruise for many reasons.  But lets just consider one the NS itineraries...the 7 day Feb 17 cruise.   It departs its first port (Grand Turk) at 3 PM meaning everyone must be aboard by 2:30 pm.  If we wanted a nice day on the beach it would be time to think about getting back to the ship by 1:30....which is not a good thing.  Their next port, San Juan, has a scheduled 1pm arrival.  If the US authorities are a little slow, folks will not even be able to get off the ship until 1:30.  That is less then 1/2 of a day...and when you consider that a majority of HAL cruisers like to eat their dinner early, those folks will have no more then 3 hours in San Juan....not enough time for a beach day or even many tour options.  And the last port, Half Moon Cay shows a 3pm departure..so everyone must be aboard by 2:30 which means packing-up by 2.  Another partial beach day?  I do understand that the ship must leave Little Salvador Island somewhat early since they have to cruise around 300 miles and arrive at the Port Everglade Pilot Station at the proper time.   But when you look at the overall itinerary they only list a single port where there is a full day.  

 

And then consider their Feb 10 itinerary.  It leaves Grand Cayman at 4pm meaning everyone must be aboard by 3:30.  If folks want to go to a beach they will need to be heading back to the port by 2:30...which is not a good thing.  And then they get to Cozumel at 11am....which means that any decent beach chairs would have been rented by passengers from other ships who arrived at the normal early morning time.

 

Now lets compare that to an Oceania Riviera cruise on Feb 17.  That ship is in Costa Maya (1st port) from 8 - 6.  Their next port is Belize and they are also there from 8-6.  And their final port is Havana and that is an 8 am arrival and does not depart until noon the following day.  So all of their ports are full days (with an overnight in Havana).  

 

We could post example after example of how HAL's idiotic itineraries do not stack up against the competition.  In the Caribbean many folks go for the sun/sand and they want long port days so they have plenty of time to go to the beach, shop, etc.  Sure, there are quite a few HAL cruisers who could care less about itineraries and do not even bother to get off the ship.  But that is not the majority of the Caribbean cruisers.

 

A few years ago we did back to back Westerdam cruises in the Caribbean (our first and last Caribbean cruise on HAL) and the port times were awful.  We were leaving most ports by 3 or 4 while the competition was staying at those same ports until 5...and then sometimes beating us to the next port the following morning!  But even worse, when we would return to the Westy there would be the same "Glenn Miller" favorites from the HAL Cats.  No Caribbean band, no steel drums, no Bob Marley music!   On that Westy cruise another passenger (long time friend) got a good laugh when he suggested that HAL had taken one of their 100 year old customers, put him in an office, and told him to develop the itineraries.  And of course he could care less about port times because he never took his walker ashore!

 

My point is that HAL does not develop their itineraries to please many Caribbean cruisers who want full days in their ports...and we are talking 8-5 (or later).  For many potential customers the NS itineraries are a non-starter...and they immediately look to other lines/ships for those full days.  And although I am a senior (all too typical of HAL cruisers) and do enjoy Glenn Miller music, it is not what I want to hear in the Caribbean.  And I sure do not want to hear a typical HAL house band trying to play Caribbean music with a keyboard (that sounds like an organ) and a regular guitar.  My goodness, if Jimmy Buffet had played his music the way they do on HAL....he would still be a total unknown.  But we do give credit where it is do, and love the BB King concept on HAL (which is only on about half the ships).

 

Hank

It's a good thing that your details about HAL Caribbean cruises aren't current. Especially since you don't cruise HAL in February.

[Sir PMP]

It's a ship for people who don't like the ocean, you can only see the ocean from the aft pool, if you can find a spot.

These ships are build to be inside and see everything from behind glass...

[RuthC]

43 minutes ago, OVgirl said:

It's a good thing that your details about HAL Caribbean cruises aren't current. Especially since you don't cruise HAL in February.

His details about the music on HAL is several years past current, also.

[Despegue]

7 minutes ago, Sir PMP said:

It's a ship for people who don't like the ocean, you can only see the ocean from the aft pool, if you can find a spot.

These ships are build to be inside and see everything from behind glass...

 

ever been on a Pinnacle vessel, Sir Pimp?

They have a very good amount of open-deck space.

 

what I do concur is the fact that she misses the panoramic elevators ( you gotta love them on Vista and Signature vessels), and the Crows-nest Observation lounge is  by far not as nice as on Celebrity vessels, but that goes for the whole HAL fleet.

 

 

 

[Sir PMP]

Y

3 minutes ago, Despegue said:

 

ever been on a Pinnacle vessel, Sir Pimp?

They have a very good amount of open-deck space.

 

what I do concur is the fact that she misses the panoramic elevators ( you gotta love them on Vista and Signature vessels), and the Crows-nest Observation lounge is  by far not as nice as on Celebrity vessels, but that goes for the whole HAL fleet.

 

 

yes 7 days on the 'King, not much to see from the promenade, tinted glass up in the crows, not much else more to see..