Carnival Corporation Arrogance

[Thrak]

50 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

They are confined to their cabins so that any further cases that develop don't spread to other passengers. There are people stationed in every corridor to ensure people don't leave their cabins.

 

The only exception is those in inside and oceanview cabins who have been allowed up onto an upper deck, in controlled groups, to get fresh air and exercise. They must wear masks and gloves and remain one metre away from other passengers.

 

My wife saw this on FB today. She read the rest of it to me where it says they are offering expanded TV offerings, in-cabin meals from a menu, games to play in the cabin, etc.

[Ombud]

5 hours ago, chipmaster said:

Huh

 

I really like the shallow thinking from RCCL, they are all bad and dangerous and you are not welcome as customers, now that is shallow and arrogance taking to another level!

 

"Royal Caribbean said it would not allow people with passports from China, Hong Kong or Macau to board its ships, or anyone who traveled there in the past 15 days."

From Princess' website 2 days ago:

#1: right upfront. Been in or through affected area in last 14 days? Not boarding. 

 

Also on website is how they are trying to improve quarantine with more movies, online games, menu options, ect

[LeeW]

OP has eight posts but refers to all of us as "we."  Nobody is twisting his/her arm to cruise.  This is a problem that is going to last a while and both cruise lines and countries are going to take a while to adjust.

[brisalta]

35 minutes ago, Thrak said:

 

My wife saw this on FB today. She read the rest of it to me where it says they are offering expanded TV offerings, in-cabin meals from a menu, games to play in the cabin, etc.

 

Princess published the following on their web site

https://www.princess.com/news/notices_and_advisories/notices/diamond-princess-guest-experience.html

Guest Experience on Diamond Princess

Updated February 6, 2020 at 7:30 PM PT

Guest Experience on Diamond Princess

Our team on board Diamond Princess, supported by our shoreside colleagues, is actively working to care for our guests to ensure their comfort and well-being. These are such unusual circumstances so our team has activated new in-room entertainment offerings which include:

• Eight (8) new satellite TV channels
• More than 80 new video-on-demand releases, including movies in various languages, concerts and in-cabin fitness videos
• Cruise Director Show (The Wake Show) in English and Japanese
• Printed newspapers in 36 languages
• Pre-printed trivia, daily puzzles, games and arts and crafts
• Radio Taiso (popular calisthenics) videos
• Kids’ activity packs
• Food & beverage options offered via room service
• Outdoor time for guests in interior staterooms (under the guidance of Japanese Ministry of Health)

 

Edited February 8, 2020 by brisalta

[tcc8v]

The following is from a Cruise Critic news item (Feb. 7):

 

"The bigger issue for cruisers on the current sailing is where Westerdam goes from here. With Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong, The Philippines and other countries denying entry to cruise ships -- even ones with no suspected cases of the disease onboard -- Westerdam's potential ports to disembark guests at in Asia are now severely restricted."

 

So apparently national authorities think that, in Asia at least, international cruising presents an unacceptable risk of disease transmission in the current epidemic.  How can a customer be faulted for thinking the same?
 

[Ombud]

So change cruises. Next time buy insurance

Edited February 8, 2020 by Ombud

[Cruizer Diana]

22 hours ago, TNTLAMB said:

Actually I was thrilled that the OP was able to clear up the spread of this virus by laying it all at the feet of the Evil incompetent Carnival corporation....... Shut 'em down = problem solved. WHY oh WHY couldn't multiple country's ministry of health, WHO and CDC have seen it as a Carnival Plot from the git go. Why of course Carnival would forego millions in revenue and spend millions more to spread a virus that clely instea if being named after a Mexican Beer (sic) should have been called the Carniva Virus. Thank Goodness the word will soon be spread world wide by individual effort on social media ROFLMAO

 

IMHO, a little over the top in the rhetoric based on what was known at the time and what we know now.

I agree with TNTLAMB & hobbyfarmer2. Corporations involved with travel have to depend on what their government and the locals in their ports tell them. They can't make decisions based on information they are not aware of. 

 

By the way, the Diamond Princess is based in Asia and Chinese are a large percentage of the passengers. The infected passenger boarded on January 20th without symptoms. He had been in China on January 10th, but not in Wuhan. I doubt a majority of the passengers would have been happy if the cruise had been cancelled on January 20th.

 

Note that the NCL Jade departed Hong Kong on 2/1/20. They are in the same limbo as the Westerdam. Neither ship has reported illness, but they are not being allowed to dock in most Asian ports now, because of extreme caution. HAL has cancelled their Westerdam 2/15/20 cruise; NCL has not cancelled their 2/13/20 Jade departure. Perhaps the OP should criticize NCL, too??? 

 

I've had the norovirus twice---never on the over 400 days I've sailed on Holland America or other cruise line ships. I got it from my mother, when she came back from the cardio unit at a California hospital and again when spending Christmas in Victoria, BC, Canada--never figured out the source. You can catch a virus any time, any place. 

 

I probably would have considered cancelling and eating the cost, if I'd been booked on a cruise in Asia this month. I also probably would have fully hoped that HAL would have cancelled and refunded my entire booking amount. That said, why do people think that corporations should shoulder the entire burden of the cost? The cruiseline has many costs that they have to eat, whether or not they cancel. They are obligated to pay the crew, provide room and board or fly crew home, pay for docking fees for the ship if they leave it empty, etc. Are all of the airlines are allowing people to cancel flights without some penalty? Are hotels allowing cancellations for pre-paid stays without penalty? I doubt it. 

 

Edited February 8, 2020 by Cruizer Diana

[bluesea321]

2 hours ago, Cruizer Diana said:

Are the airlines allowing people to cancel flights without some penalty? I doubt it. 

 

As a matter of fact, yes. I live in Houston and when there is tropical storm or hurricane headed our way the airlines allow passengers to change their trips without penalties. IMO CCL should allow changes on Asian itineraries impacted by the coronavirus.

[OzKiwiJJ]

2 hours ago, Cruizer Diana said:

 

Are all of the airlines are allowing people to cancel flights without some penalty? Are hotels allowing cancellations for pre-paid stays without penalty? I doubt it. 

 

Apparently not in all cases. I've seen some posts on a Crystal forum, where Crystal Symphony is also getting bounced all over Asia due to port refusals, that some passengers have incurred huge costs in flight change fees or cancellations and hotel booking cacellations, especially those through hotel booking agencies.

[casofilia]

While I wish that the temperature "Thermal Imaging" will help I think that need to be even more proactive in "discovering" where people have travelled recently.   If their 30 day rule is enforced by really close examination of passports that would help  (and slow down embarkation enormously!!).

 

However when Corona virus has been defeated my concern would be combating Noro.   Easy to bring it on board, simple to spread and very annoying to everyone.

[Ombud]

1 hour ago, Sillyjilly said:

Not any different than port changes due to weather. Get over it.

I personally have no issue with the port changes but it might be a good marketing tool. Not a refund but rebooking especially since the other biggies (RCCL & NCL) are offering less

[pink845]

Ombud:   Very well said. Exactly correct.  "They can control the epidemic on their vessels as soon as people stop lying on health questionnaires."  Very very true.   If only the world were perfect.      However, on our last two cruises on Princess (Parent Carnival), there were no health questionnaires at all.    I later questioned them on it and Guest Relations told me that this questionnaire was on the Ocean Medallion.  Well, not everyone has access to the Ocean Medallion.  And I searched all the little tabs on that program and still did not find any questionnaire.  I  believe now they are going to reinstate those health questionnaires, however, I am pretty sure that people will still lie on them as they have done in the past.    

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, pink845 said:

Ombud:   Very well said. Exactly correct.  "They can control the epidemic on their vessels as soon as people stop lying on health questionnaires."  Very very true.   If only the world were perfect.      However, on our last two cruises on Princess (Parent Carnival), there were no health questionnaires at all.    I later questioned them on it and Guest Relations told me that this questionnaire was on the Ocean Medallion.  Well, not everyone has access to the Ocean Medallion.  And I searched all the little tabs on that program and still did not find any questionnaire.  I  believe now they are going to reinstate those health questionnaires, however, I am pretty sure that people will still lie on them as they have done in the past.    

Untill the recent re-implementation of the health questionnaires, we have not had to fill them out on any of our many many cruises in the last few years. I doubt that there was a questionnaire required for passengers who boarded the Diamond Princess on 20th January in Hong Kong. At that time there was no restriction on people boarding in Hong Kong, otherwise no-one would have boarded at that port.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Aus Traveller

[brisalta]

3 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Untill the recent re-implementation of the health questionnaires, we have not had to fill them out on any of our many many cruises in the last few years. I doubt that there was a questionnaire required for passengers who boarded the Diamond Princess on 20th January in Hong Kong. At that time there was no restriction on people boarding in Hong Kong, otherwise no-one would have boarded at that port.

 

I suspect that they at some point in the future they will start screening passengers at check in using a hand held medical pyrometer to check for fever like they do in some hospitals.  😉

[geoherb]

On 2/7/2020 at 9:08 PM, Mike45LC said:

My wife was quarantined for the flu.  She too spent her time in the cabin; she was too miserable to want to go out!  I was not sick at all. 

 

I was very unhappy with the ship for refusing to allow me to bring her a dinner from the Main Dining Room; she was allowed room service or whatever I could bring her from the buffet or the International Café.  Lousy way to spend a cruise!

 

I was sailing solo, so I was limited to the room service menu. Fortunately I found plenty that I liked on it, especially the key lime pie verrine. I felt much better the second day, but still couldn't go out except to the medical center until I cleared three of the semi-daily temperature checks. Thankfully I was on a ship that had on-demand videos to watch.

[thinfool]

48 minutes ago, pink845 said:

  I  believe now they are going to reinstate those health questionnaires, however, I am pretty sure that people will still lie on them as they have done in the past.    

 

Basic misunderstanding of human nature....no one is going to spend $1,000's on airfare and a cruise and then take a chance by telling the truth on a health form.  Long time travelers commonly called them 'Liars forms'.  A useless effort IMO.

[Aus Traveller]

11 minutes ago, thinfool said:

 

Basic misunderstanding of human nature....no one is going to spend $1,000's on airfare and a cruise and then take a chance by telling the truth on a health form.  Long time travelers commonly called them 'Liars forms'.  A useless effort IMO.

Yes. The new form used by Princess asks about previous travel to China and/or Hong Kong.

[capriccio]

51 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Yes. The new form used by Princess asks about previous travel to China and/or Hong Kong.

 

For anyone interested in seeing the new form, it is post #725 on https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2730230-princess-ships-corona-virus/page/29/

 

[Thrak]

2 hours ago, pink845 said:

Ombud:  I  believe now they are going to reinstate those health questionnaires, however, I am pretty sure that people will still lie on them as they have done in the past.    

 

Those forms are worthless and the pencils they provide to fill them out probably spread far more germs than the forms prevent.

 

2 hours ago, brisalta said:

 

I suspect that they at some point in the future they will start screening passengers at check in using a hand held medical pyrometer to check for fever like they do in some hospitals.  😉

 

That is fine with me but won't work for those who are infected (with whatever) but aren't showing any signs of infection yet.

[brisalta]

2 hours ago, Thrak said:

 

Those forms are worthless and the pencils they provide to fill them out probably spread far more germs than the forms prevent.

 

 

That is fine with me but won't work for those who are infected (with whatever) but aren't showing any signs of infection yet.

 

I agree that it will not work for those that are infected and in the early incubation stages before symptoms display.

[caribill]

6 hours ago, casofilia said:

While I wish that the temperature "Thermal Imaging" will help I think that need to be even more proactive in "discovering" where people have travelled recently.   If their 30 day rule is enforced by really close examination of passports that would help  (and slow down embarkation enormously!!).

 

I have 83 entry/exit stamps on 34 pages in my passport. Some of the stamps are impossible to read. I would expect a check-in clerk would spend at least 15 minutes if closely examining my passport and still not be able to read all of the stamps.

[hm9912]

10 hours ago, brisalta said:

 

I suspect that they at some point in the future they will start screening passengers at check in using a hand held medical pyrometer to check for fever like they do in some hospitals.  😉

Agreed!

Every passenger should have their temperature taken at embarkation and denied boarding if they have a fever to protect all the other passengers.

 

Howard

[Ombud]

15 hours ago, bluesea321 said:

 

As a matter of fact, yes. I live in Houston and when there is tropical storm or hurricane headed our way the airlines allow passengers to change their trips without penalties. IMO CCL should allow changes on Asian itineraries impacted by the coronavirus.

They are. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Ombud

[Fat Albert]

21 hours ago, Cruizer Diana said:

 

IMHO, a little over the top in the rhetoric based on what was known at the time and what we know now.

I agree with TNTLAMB & hobbyfarmer2. Corporations involved with travel have to depend on what their government and the locals in their ports tell them. They can't make decisions based on information they are not aware of. 

 

By the way, the Diamond Princess is based in Asia and Chinese are a large percentage of the passengers. The infected passenger boarded on January 20th without symptoms. He had been in China on January 10th, but not in Wuhan. I doubt a majority of the passengers would have been happy if the cruise had been cancelled on January 20th.

 

Note that the NCL Jade departed Hong Kong on 2/1/20. They are in the same limbo as the Westerdam. Neither ship has reported illness, but they are not being allowed to dock in most Asian ports now, because of extreme caution. HAL has cancelled their Westerdam 2/15/20 cruise; NCL has not cancelled their 2/13/20 Jade departure. Perhaps the OP should criticize NCL, too??? 

 

I've had the norovirus twice---never on the over 400 days I've sailed on Holland America or other cruise line ships. I got it from my mother, when she came back from the cardio unit at a California hospital and again when spending Christmas in Victoria, BC, Canada--never figured out the source. You can catch a virus any time, any place. 

 

I probably would have considered cancelling and eating the cost, if I'd been booked on a cruise in Asia this month. I also probably would have fully hoped that HAL would have cancelled and refunded my entire booking amount. That said, why do people think that corporations should shoulder the entire burden of the cost? The cruiseline has many costs that they have to eat, whether or not they cancel. They are obligated to pay the crew, provide room and board or fly crew home, pay for docking fees for the ship if they leave it empty, etc. Are all of the airlines are allowing people to cancel flights without some penalty? Are hotels allowing cancellations for pre-paid stays without penalty? I doubt it. 

 

 

[Fat Albert]

The Noro virus is from feces. The virus is not airborne or a blood pathogen. It is human feces that is ingested by a person through mouth, nose or eyes. The feces comes from dirty hands with micro feces on them and is spread on handles, buttons, railings, utensils and various other ways to spread it around. You then touched the feces and touched your eyes, nose or mouth and put the feces into your body.  This is not an airborne virus or blood pathogen , it is from human feces .