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Empress of The Seas

BigAl94

By BigAl94,
in Royal Caribbean International

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John&LaLa "Live from...." Rare

John&LaLa

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, twangster said:

 

Any legitimate media source will go to Royal for validation because they have to.  So by your measure, the score can never be greater than one.  

 

Anyone can create a rumor to generate clicks and ad revenue on their site.  

 

Is Matt a legitimate media source🤔

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twangster "Live from...." Rare

twangster

Posted
Posted
18 minutes ago, John&LaLa said:

 

Is Matt a legitimate media source🤔

 

I know he puts a lot of effort into validating information before posting compared to some sites that jump early on any tidbit without due diligence.  Until last year he didn't have any ads so for nearly a decade he operated his site with no point in wild speculation trying to drive traffic.    Many sites today are all about click bait ad revenue, he isn't one of them.  Those sites only care about driving ad revenue and care little about accuracy.  He does, very much so, and getting it wrong is personal so he takes his time before posting.  

 

Anyone can cite "inside sources" without really having any.  Matt doesn't.  He is accredited as "media" with Royal and gets invited to media events and cruises like many other accredited and registered media outlets.  If I'm not mistaken he was on the Oasis 2019 media cruise with folks right here from CC after she came back from amplification before going into service.  He only reached out to Royal both times with respect to Empress in the past few weeks in response to wild speculation, not to generate it.

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Pratique

Pratique

Posted
Posted
36 minutes ago, John&LaLa said:

 

I'm not a finance guy, but I never understood why they don't do that with the whole fleet

I'm not either but I think it makes more sense for the airline industry. Under U.S. tax laws there is some benefit in being able to depreciate assets but leasing back a part of their fleet gives them more flexibility to adjust fleet size as needed while managing capital expenditures. Cruise lines don't typically adjust fleet size, since the ships come in and typically stay until they are retired. My thought was that Royal 1) needs some cash and 2) is planning on phasing Empress out anyway or at least getting in a better position given the unknowns about the future. Just a WAG.

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Pratique

Pratique

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, twangster said:

He only reached out to Royal both times with respect to Empress in the past few weeks in response to wild speculation, not to generate it.

Royal isn't going to tell him or anyone else anything they aren't prepared to announce publicly. This is one of those things that will be held close to the vest to protect the shareholders and comply with SEC regulations.

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twangster "Live from...." Rare

twangster

Posted
Posted
Just now, Pratique said:

Royal isn't going to tell him or anyone else anything they aren't prepared to announce publicly. This is one of those things that will be held close to the vest to protect the shareholders and comply with SEC regulations.

 

Stating a ship is for sale isn't misleading investors, to the contrary actually.  Carnival made that clear prior to sending their ships to scrap.

 

So what do you expect to be announced first?  That Carnival has sold off P&O and Seabourn or that Empress is sold?    Both are claimed by TW based on "inside sources".   Given the state of things both are possible.  One of their reports state "...a lot of people in the industry think..." - that's hardly validated information.  Of course many people just read the headline and jump on social media to post the breaking news.

 

I do find it curious that when asked about selling more ships during the recent investors call that Royal didn't give any hint that was in the works.  Instead the response suggested otherwise.  If Royal was thinking about it or days away from a deal you wouldn't think they would mislead investors in such an affirmative manner.  An open ended response like being open to any possibility would not have misled investors.  They didn't take that approach.  Their response suggested that wasn't currently in the works.

 

Only time will tell.  

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John&LaLa "Live from...." Rare

John&LaLa

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

Stating a ship is for sale isn't misleading investors, to the contrary actually. ........ They didn't take that approach.  Their response suggested that wasn't currently in the works.

 

Only time will tell.  

 

Didn't Fain make a recent comment that nothing was for sale, but there is a possibility.

Edited by John&LaLa
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twangster "Live from...." Rare

twangster

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Pratique said:

What are the chances that Empress was sold to a holding company and leased back to Royal?

 

Most ships in general are held by single ship shell or holding companies.  Think beyond cruise ships this is a very common practice with shipping in general and has been for a while. 

 

A component that drives this, as I understand it, is liability after an accident or incident.  Ship accidents tend to be pretty costly events.  One ship hits another and causes it to sink - worst case or one of many worst case examples.  Company owning offending ship can be held legally liable for significant sums that could consume the entire fleet if all ships were held in one company.   By placing each ship in its own holding company there can be limits to liability in a worst case scenario.  The whole company isn't lost, just the value of the ship in that holding company.  

 

I may not have that represented completely accurately but that's the gist of it.

 

So all (or most) ships are already in holding companies all by themselves.

Edited by twangster
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Merion_Mom

Merion_Mom

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, wildbill437 said:

Check out the site portal worldcruises2.com Empress decommissioned in Greece for more information on this subject.This site is in Portuguese. 

Your post does not give adequate information to access this topic.

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twangster "Live from...." Rare

twangster

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, wildbill437 said:

https://www.portalworldcruises2.com/2020/08/empress-of-the-seas-e-descomissionado-na-grecia.html

 

This doesn't support the sale of the ship as predicted by some here.

 

"... at the port of Souda, on the island of Crete, for an indefinite period. "

 

"Also according to the publication, the ship can remain in place until cruise operations are resumed. "

 

Current score:  Valid sources against sale of ship 3, valid sources for sale of ship 0

 

Only time tell...

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snaefell

snaefell

Posted
Posted

My experience with RCI would lead me to be sceptical of anything they say & past experience with the media in general would not be much different,IMO they are only really interested in anything which will cause a stir.

Just wondering as we are in totally unknown territory with Covid & the way forward is so unclear at present if many of the suggestions being heard are ideas being bandied about as ways to cope with the situation,whether it be sales of individual ships or whole brands,perhaps pretty much anything is being considered as a way to handle what is one hell of a mystery tour(or cruise!?).

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Kbonner

Kbonner

Posted
Posted
14 hours ago, livingonthebeach said:

The source, Michael Juliano, the reporter for Tradewinds, is an award-winning journalist ......

Maybe this Michael communicated with the same reputed RCI rep that told me my  refunds should arrive within 5-7 business days. 

They came at day 118.......

So---- I am still with Aliaga for the Empress.

P.S. Never trust a company that has tricked zillion of customers.

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livingonthebeach "Live from...." Rare

livingonthebeach

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Kbonner said:

Maybe this Michael communicated with the same reputed RCI rep that told me my  refunds should arrive within 5-7 business days. 

They came at day 118.......

So---- I am still with Aliaga for the Empress.

P.S. Never trust a company that has tricked zillion of customers.

 

I'm glad you got your refund and sorry you had to wait 118 days.  There is definitely a need for better transparency on RCI's part. 

 

FTR, It was Matt of RCBlog (site blocked on CC), associated with a TA taking cruise bookings and whose site is filled with click-through ads, who is rehashing RCI's canned statements.  Michael, an industry expert and journalist for Tradewinds, (a subscription only publication covering the maritime industry), is the reporter refuting RCI's canned statements. 

 

 

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Extra Kim

Extra Kim

Posted
Posted

Both Carnival and Royal have said that it will take years before they will sail with a full fleet.

 

What makes you think that Empress would be one of the ships that they start sailing with? If you ask me, Empress would be one of the last ships that would be put back in use in the Royal fleet. Why would they keep the oldest and smallest ship in the fleet for years without it making any money? 

 

Empress will end up on a beach in the Med.

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livingonthebeach "Live from...." Rare

livingonthebeach

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, John&LaLa said:

 

Didn't Fain make a recent comment that nothing was for sale, but there is a possibility.

 

I believe it was Jason Liberty, during the Q2 earnings call, who was quoted as saying that when asked the question by an analyst:
 

"Will Royal Caribbean Group sell or retire more cruise ships? The company is evaluating all options according to Jason Liberty, executive vice president and chief financial officer, speaking on Royal Caribbean’s second quarter earnings call on Monday"

 

https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/23354-royal-caribbean-group-evaluating-ship-sales.html

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RFerrington

RFerrington

Posted
Posted
16 hours ago, John&LaLa said:

L&S in 3...2...1

 

I'm in this drama right now.  Not going well.  They are refusing to L&S to Odyssey even though others have been doing it regularly.  If they don't allow me to L&S to Odyssey I will just CWC and take the FCC.  Frustrating.  Better luck to you.

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