Do you really want Azamara to fail?

[aliaschief]

4 minutes ago, blag said:

Whilst the sentiments expressed here by 'the usual suspects' are probably correct, my experience on three cruises with Azamara in the last year lead me to say that in some areas standards have, most definitely, dropped.

Before the howls of protest begin, let me cite just a few examples, one being a long-standing issue, others probably being a localised or temporary supply issue.

Firstly, despite being listed, there has been no Boddington's bitter on board on any of our cruises (different ships, different locations, but including north-western Europe) this year. And, if my recollection is correct, on our most recent cruise the choice of bottled beers, was limited to just two.

Secondly, there were no Brussels sprouts (or rock salt*) available throughout our Christmas cruise.

Thirdly, the quantity and choice of spirits provided in suites has diminished.

I freely admit that, in the grand scheme of things, these are not sufficient to justify cancellation or avoiding Azamara**, but, nevertheless, I believe they are symptomatic.

For those who have leapt in to defend Azamara (many of whom have merely repeated what the OP stated) I think it is important to apply some perspective. From my perspective, standards have dropped.

 

* eventually, I bought some rock salt at a port and gave it to Maitre d'.

**On the other hand, for future cruises, I am now seriously thinking about booking with Azamara's closest competitors, and nearer the time will be scrutinising their CC boards for evidence of similar 'supply' issues.

IMO and experience it’s not that standards have dropped but the availability of products has. New and in some case shortages of crew also have impacted the industry.
Winery and distilleries having problems attaining glass bottling. Poor winery growing year resulting in shortages of champagne, plus population drank it up in the pandemic, causing shortages. Many times,  post pandemic it’s not the cruise lines problem that you can’t get a favorite product. it’s the company struggling to keep up supply and demand and shipping delays.
A cruise line can only serve what they receive. Here in CC we have seen that entire pallets of fresh veggies being rejected as not acceptable. Not a business you can always run to local grocery store and stock up. Recent cruises I couldn’t get Crown Royal on a cruise and river cruise. The crew reply was no matter how many times we order just can’t get it. However,  it is onboard the cruise I’m presently on. 👏🏻👏🏻

Web site issues according to IT friends probably could have been addressed and fixed before implementing but I yield to patience and understanding as we have almost two hundred days of booked days on Azamara. Frustrating yes. Confidence overrides.

 

[blag]

27 minutes ago, laurieb said:

Bitters and Brussels sprouts, really??  That’s what you would base  your opinion of dropping standards?

Yes. (Not 'Bitters', by the, way). And for me, at least, Brussels are a fundamental part of Christmas.

You have ignored the other issue, just in case you would care to dismiss that as well,

Please take the time to re-read what I said. The important word was 'symptomatic'.

To the some (with the rose-tinted glasses) the examples I cited may not be evidence of lowering of standards, but since at least one of these is long-term, they are certainly not indicative of an improvement.

[blag]

21 minutes ago, aliaschief said:

1 hour ago, blag said:

Expand  

IMO and experience it’s not that standards have dropped but the availability of products has.

Maybe, but for a whole year?

You refer to wine and glass shortages, but Boddingtons is not a wine, nor is it supplied in bottles.

I am prepared to give Azamara time to resolve matters, but I remain sceptical. I might add that I have not even looked at the new web site despite having one future cruise booked.

[cruiseaholic78]

2 hours ago, blag said:

Whilst the sentiments expressed here by 'the usual suspects' are probably correct, my experience on three cruises with Azamara in the last year lead me to say that in some areas standards have, most definitely, dropped.

Before the howls of protest begin, let me cite just a few examples, one being a long-standing issue, others probably being a localised or temporary supply issue.

Firstly, despite being listed, there has been no Boddington's bitter on board on any of our cruises (different ships, different locations, but including north-western Europe) this year. And, if my recollection is correct, on our most recent cruise the choice of bottled beers, was limited to just two.

Secondly, there were no Brussels sprouts (or rock salt*) available throughout our Christmas cruise.

Thirdly, the quantity and choice of spirits provided in suites has diminished.

 

 

* eventually, I bought some rock salt at a port and gave it to Maitre d'.

**On the other hand, for future cruises, I am now seriously thinking about booking with Azamara's closest competitors, and nearer the time will be scrutinising their CC boards for evidence of similar 'supply' issues.

We returned to Azamara in March for the first time since Covid and once again we absolutely loved it.

We had better entertainment in our 10 days onboard than on 35 days Oceania round Australia at Christmas. (BBQ white night and of course Azamazing evening)
Closest competitors? I presume that you are referring to Oceania? Then you might be disappointed, no Brussel sprouts, roast potatoes or xmas pudding. This was their “typical” Christmas dinner and it wasn’t that good either! To say nothing about the BS we had regarding the Hull cleaning Saga,!

 

Edited April 20, 2023 by cruiseaholic78

[paf225]

2 hours ago, blag said:

 

Firstly, despite being listed, there has been no Boddington's bitter on board on any of our cruises (different ships, different locations, but including north-western Europe) this year. And, if my recollection is correct, on our most recent cruise the choice of bottled beers, was limited to just two.

 

I too miss the Cream of Manchester.  As you mention I haven't been able to track one down over the last 3 or 4 cruises even though it was listed as available on most of them.  Lately I've taken solace in Groslch and Pilsner Urquell but I do miss the creamy shimmering curtain of Boddington's.

 

I know this is a serious topic but all the little special treats and treatments onboard an Azamara ship have contributed to the enjoyment I've experienced on every cruise.

 

Regards,  Paul

[Grandma Cruising]

3 hours ago, blag said:

Whilst the sentiments expressed here by 'the usual suspects' are probably correct, my experience on three cruises with Azamara in the last year lead me to say that in some areas standards have, most definitely, dropped.

Before the howls of protest begin, let me cite just a few examples, one being a long-standing issue, others probably being a localised or temporary supply issue.

Firstly, despite being listed, there has been no Boddington's bitter on board on any of our cruises (different ships, different locations, but including north-western Europe) this year. And, if my recollection is correct, on our most recent cruise the choice of bottled beers, was limited to just two.

Secondly, there were no Brussels sprouts (or rock salt*) available throughout our Christmas cruise.

Thirdly, the quantity and choice of spirits provided in suites has diminished.

I freely admit that, in the grand scheme of things, these are not sufficient to justify cancellation or avoiding Azamara**, but, nevertheless, I believe they are symptomatic.

For those who have leapt in to defend Azamara (many of whom have merely repeated what the OP stated) I think it is important to apply some perspective. From my perspective, standards have dropped.

 

* eventually, I bought some rock salt at a port and gave it to Maitre d'.

**On the other hand, for future cruises, I am now seriously thinking about booking with Azamara's closest competitors, and nearer the time will be scrutinising their CC boards for evidence of similar 'supply' issues.

We had a long chat with the Hotel Director on our recent cruise and he was telling us all about the supply problems they have been having. They had problems sourcing a number of items. Examples were escargots - these were on the menu at the beginning of the cruise, but had vanished by the end. Schweppes tonic was in short supply when we boarded, but he had managed to find some in Rio (we saw it come aboard) and it lasted for the full (transatlantic) voyage. He also told us that for a while they couldn’t source Tanquery gin - not because of a shortage of gin, but because Tanquery had problems with the supply of their bottles.

I’d also say that in 12 cruises I don’t remember ever seeing either sprouts or rock salt!

[Mrs Miggins]

I would suggest that everyone reads the splendid Live on Pursuit = Lisbon to Rome by Cavaallier.

From the first entry where details of the current issues in Germany are noted - to the last resume of the trip.  This is from a first time Azamara cruiser !

 

I really think the post by Blag was a wind up.   Wouldn't think that most onboard would know or care about Boddingtons - and if Rock Salt is a priority then as he says it is easily sourced by the person who needs it.  If there are no supply issues in Italy I would be surprised.  Apparently both Railworkers and Airport workers have been on strike very recently.  Personally I would be happy if I never saw a Brussel Sprout again - mainly forced on us in the UK at Christmas.  

[uktog]

When I travel at Christmas I do not expect a cruise line or hotel overseas to replicate a Scottish family Christmas (differs from English, American, Canadian etc etc etc). 
😂😂

[blag]

24 minutes ago, Grandma Cruising said:

I’d also say that in 12 cruises I don’t remember ever seeing either sprouts or rock salt!

We, too had a similar discussion with Hotel Director, who told us that the Boddingtons problem was one of location (i.e. outside Europe), but when we challenged this (because it wasn't available on our Baltic/Scandinavia cruise, either*) she became rather confused and vague. Furthermore we were given the same reason on our most recent cruise, with an update that as soon as we reached European waters it would be available, but when we reached European waters, it was not.

As for the rock salt: I ask for it, but the supply dried up mid-cruise.

Sprouts: they are on the menu in Prime C!

 

[Grandma Cruising]

3 minutes ago, blag said:

We, too had a similar discussion with Hotel Director, who told us that the Boddingtons problem was one of location (i.e. outside Europe), but when we challenged this (because it wasn't available on our Baltic/Scandinavia cruise, either*) she became rather confused and vague. Furthermore we were given the same reason on our most recent cruise, with an update that as soon as we reached European waters it would be available, but when we reached European waters, it was not.

As for the rock salt: I ask for it, but the supply dried up mid-cruise.

Sprouts: they are on the menu in Prime C!

 

You’re right, sprouts are one of the side dishes in Prime C - we’d forgotten because it’s not something we’d order. Didn’t know they carried rock salt - we’d have asked if we’d known. We get fed up of the salt pots that don’t pour due to condensation!

[Mrs Miggins]

Out of curiosity have just read up on Boddingtons Beer.   Apparently I can still buy it in cans in my local supermarket but it is rarely available in pubs.  In 1900 more than 6000 were poisoned by it and 70 people died. Despite this it was popular up to the 1980's despite it being sold to Whitbreads.  It started to fail in the 90's when the brewery moved away from Manchester.  The popularity of this type of beer has been falling for years.  Now owned by one of the huge conglomerates.

 

[excitedofharpenden]

17 minutes ago, Mrs Miggins said:

Out of curiosity have just read up on Boddingtons Beer.   Apparently I can still buy it in cans in my local supermarket but it is rarely available in pubs.  In 1900 more than 6000 were poisoned by it and 70 people died. Despite this it was popular up to the 1980's despite it being sold to Whitbreads.  It started to fail in the 90's when the brewery moved away from Manchester.  The popularity of this type of beer has been falling for years.  Now owned by one of the huge conglomerates.

 

They had the best TV adverts for Boddingtons!

 

Phil

[excitedofharpenden]

12 hours ago, norn iron said:

Don, I returned to cruising with Azamara post Covid in October 2021 and to date have completed a further three cruises with them since then.

I didn't observe any loss of standards, so I'm somewhat confused by your comment.

 

In fact, since last August I've convinced my sister and her husband to upgrade to Azamara, they have now completed two cruises and are totally sold on the product.

 

Maybe it's time you returned to see that the product is as good as it ever was.

Likewise. I had a fantastic cruise on Journey and that was after the Dream Team of Johannes, Heike and Eric parted. 

 

Phil 

[excitedofharpenden]

9 hours ago, norn iron said:

 I get that, Iit was just from your earlier post you were indicating standards had fallen when they haven’t. In this case I’m speaking from experience rather than speculation.

I agree. Armchair experts. There are a few and even reading the pages of this site won't find a true picture because it can be a place of extremes. Personal experience is the only real way. 

 

Phil

[blag]

39 minutes ago, Mrs Miggins said:

Out of curiosity have just read up on Boddingtons Beer.   Apparently I can still buy it in cans in my local supermarket but it is rarely available in pubs.  In 1900 more than 6000 were poisoned by it and 70 people died. Despite this it was popular up to the 1980's despite it being sold to Whitbreads.  It started to fail in the 90's when the brewery moved away from Manchester.  The popularity of this type of beer has been falling for years.  Now owned by one of the huge conglomerates.

 

Duhh!

Popularity had a significant resurgence when they introduced the beer in a can with a widget. The widget generated a gaseous creamy head which made the beer more like a pint of traditional draught beer when pulled through a 'tight sparkler'.

Contrary to what you state, the beer is still popular and is readily available.

As for the poisoning in 1900, it hardly seems worth mentioning nearly a century-and-a-quarter later.

Let's not get sidetracked into a debate about the popularity of the beer: the fact of the matter being discussed is that, popular or not, it is listed on Azamara's drinks lists but isn't provided.

[Mrs Miggins]

38 minutes ago, excitedofharpenden said:

They had the best TV adverts for Boddingtons!

 

Phil

Yes even I remember them - Melanie Sykes (Spice Girl and Anna Chancellor (4 Weddings) in the 90's then they tried again in 1917.  Still not the beer of choice in the soft South of England !

[Mrs Miggins]

29 minutes ago, blag said:

Duhh!

Popularity had a significant resurgence when they introduced the beer in a can with a widget. The widget generated a gaseous creamy head which made the beer more like a pint of traditional draught beer when pulled through a 'tight sparkler'.

Contrary to what you state, the beer is still popular and is readily available.

As for the poisoning in 1900, it hardly seems worth mentioning nearly a century-and-a-quarter later.

Let's not get sidetracked into a debate about the popularity of the beer: the fact of the matter being discussed is that, popular or not, it is listed on Azamara's drinks lists but isn't provided.

i was sidetracked by your claim that a lack of Boddingtons, Brussel Sprouts (frozen even worse than fresh) and rock salt was indicative a fall in standards onboard.

 

[hamrag]

8 hours ago, Lisaten said:

I agree, most people should just find something better to do. But I am on the May 6 cruise out of Chioggia; the port change alone was a shock. There is no evidence AT ALL of Onward being in any port we will visit.  So, we take a leap of faith and leave Florida to travel all the way to Venice in HOPES of actually going on a cruise......

We too are on that cruise, and received our e-tickets including itinerary and Express boarding pass etc. a couple of weeks ago. We also received an email advising that check-in will be at the port, and cannot be done in advance on-line due to the new IT system (sic). Not sure what 'evidence' you need for the ship being in any of our ports. If you mean viewing the various port schedules via the internet sites, they are notorious for being inaccurate and are rarely up-to-date.....certainly in Europe!

 

We have no doubts whatsoever, remain totally chilled, and are eagerly anticipating the ship sailing from Chioggia at or around the scheduled sailaway time!

[Lindy028]

16 hours ago, Mackdogmolly said:

I absolutely don’t want them to fail and I am not canceling my one upcoming confirmed booking. That said, my TA has been trying without success to confirm another booking for 2 weeks, so I have decided not to book any more cruises until everything has been sorted out.

That is exactly how we feel, I am desperate to get back onboard after a dreadful year, but do not need any extra stress. We have identified 2 cruises we would like to book but have come to the conclusion that it would be prudent to wait until things are properly sorted. So please Azamara sort things out ASAP, we are desperate to give you our hard earned money in exchange for the wonderful onboard experience! However we won’t wait forever, we will sadly look elsewhere.

[john1970]

I think that most people want Azamara to grow and succeed. However, they can't keep making excuses for terrible service and communication. They have to get a hold of this situation especially for the passengers who have booked air with them. Blaming RCCL etc is going to get very old very quickly. All cruise lines have issues at the moment but if you are booked with Azamara that doesn't really give much comfort. I won't book anything with them until they can offer a consistent booking service. I know the ship service is great but that is only part of the customer experience.

[AJCM]

Azamara, Seabourn, Regent Seven Seas - have a look at the other CC boards and you’ll find similar concerns about a drop in standard. I accept that there are staffing and supply problems not just in the cruise industry but across many industries world wide. Despite this, we had another wonderful experience with Azamara Pursuit on a B2B2B in Sep 22. Why get upset about things that neither cruise staff nor yourself can do anything about; especially when they’re trivial matters (food items; drinks, etc)?

 

Even so, this system transition has caused a legitimately major concern for people who are starting, or will soon, their upcoming cruises. It’s not acceptable that Azamara has not specifically ensured these current guests have their records completely correct. We’re not cruising with Azamara until 2024 and so I’m not worried whether our points are correct or not, as I know it will be addressed in good time. However, if we were due to start cruising anytime now and the documentation wasn’t sorted I’d be very concerned. It’s pretty clear, I think, that they’ve stuffed up.

 

Who knows, but an optimistic view is that Azamara on land administration may actually improve, having separated from RCI,  once their systems and staffing have settled down. From my experience, their on land operation doesn’t need to do much to bring about  improvement.

 

I can very easily live without brussel sprouts being on my plate. Thanks for highlighting though. Having been warned, we’ll certainly pack some vegemite for our next cruise. Maybe others could pack some frozen BS and/or a six pack, just to be sure they’ll have what they want.

[Host Jazzbeau]

8 hours ago, blag said:

Thirdly, the quantity and choice of spirits provided in suites has diminished.

There are no longer four bottles of various spirits in the cabin when you arrive, but the Butler will bring you whatever you ask for.  It's hard to me to agree that a 1L bottle of Hendricks represents a drop in standards!  [But it seems that many people don't know you can ask, or are reluctant to do so.  As we say in NY:  "If you don't ask, you don't get."]

[Ilovemygarden]

Sorry - but a lack if Brussels sprouts on board would be a very good reason for me to book! 😀

[laurieb]

21 hours ago, donaldsc said:

Nobody who has cruised on Azamara wants them to fail. Those of us who have cruised on Azamara did so because they had a wonder product.  We cruised on them 5 or 6 times.  However that was then and now is now.  I have not cruised on them post covid but it sounds as if they are having problems keeping up their former high standards.  Fixing the apparent current issues is their problem and the fact that they are under new management is their problem and not ours.

 

DON

We’ve cruised with them 7 times post Covid with 4 more booked so far- 2 booked since the conversation.  Besides the supply chain issues that every cruise line experienced, we haven’t seen any decline.  Their high standards are very much intact!  

[blag]

7 hours ago, Mrs Miggins said:

If there are no supply issues in Italy I would be surprised.  

No supply issues here!