Future booked cruises with All Included? Tips no longer included.

[Cap_D]

This is a "sensitive subject" for some reason, and I don't mean with posters.  Maybe we should just stick to worrying about cookiegate. 

[deliver42]

Now we have gratuitygate. Another sneaky takeaway by Celebrity's wonderful leaders.

[Dolebludger]

I don’t know what there is to confirm either. I was just guessing that the moderator might want Celebrity confirmation, in light of the “flack” Celebrity has gotten here recently for reducing inclusions. 

[mac_tlc]

1 minute ago, Dolebludger said:

I don’t know what there is to confirm either. I was just guessing that the moderator might want Celebrity confirmation, in light of the “flack” Celebrity has gotten here recently for reducing inclusions. 

The pdf is posted to Celebrity's TA web site, .... and its still there....so.....

[mac_tlc]

5 minutes ago, deliver42 said:

Now we have gratuitygate. Another sneaky takeaway by Celebrity's wonderful leaders.

For the Retreat it's gratuitygate and OBCgate, and OBCgate is a bigger amount. 

[Cap_D]

Someone may want to screenshot the posts.  Just saying..... 

[chrisn-au]

7 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

For the Retreat it's gratuitygate and OBCgate, and OBCgate is a bigger amount. 

It is really simple - the retreat which was expensive in all likelihood has become very expensive while loosing I just don't want to think advantage when booking. It is disappointing  as we have loved our first ss experience on the Beyond and I am sure will love our next on Apex next month, but time to look elsewhere - not in an angry way just a “well that’s a shame sort of way”

 

Anyway if I think prices are bad on the cruise , I just need to look at the truly prohibitive prices of BC Australia  to Europe (or the US) airfares 

[mac_tlc]

5 minutes ago, chrisn-au said:

It is really simple - the retreat which was expensive in all likelihood has become very expensive while loosing I just don't want to think advantage when booking. It is disappointing  as we have loved our first ss experience on the Beyond and I am sure will love our next on Apex next month, but time to look elsewhere - not in an angry way just a “well that’s a shame sort of way”

 

Anyway if I think prices are bad on the cruise , I just need to look at the truly prohibitive prices of BC Australia  to Europe (or the US) airfares 

We also loved our E-class Retreat experiences and have two more booked early next year. After that? A family trip to Alaska next August in 4 SV's and then nothing on Royal or Celebrity -- first time in over 20 years. Their pricing and customer disregard don't warrant our $$$.

 

Looking at MSC YC and Oceania, with a quick glance at Viking, but their payment policy and wheelchair "inconsistencies" have stopped us from serious consideration.

 

mac_tlc

Edited August 29, 2023 by mac_tlc

[Dolebludger]

We have to remember that Celebrity is giving over a month notice on the non-inclusion of  gratuities with AI and Retreat bookings after Oct. 4. And there is no law preventing price increases on cruises. Especially when prior notice is given. If any of us do not like the “little baby steps” Celebrity is taking back to full “mass market” status, we have the option of booking an existing mass market line for less money, or opt for a line offering the perks we want. 

[CHEZMARYLOU]

1 hour ago, jelayne said:

I see no reason to remove the gratuities.  If one booked with AI they were built in to that cost, if one booked cruise only then they could add them at booking or have them charged to their on board account.

 

The crew have nothing to do with the continuing changes, cuts or increased prices why penalize them.

 

 

I agree in principle but when booking the Retreat and losing the prepaid gratuities and the OBC I wonder if there will be a price decrease in Retreat categories.  I plan on doing some mock bookings to compare prices on a cruise we are interested in but don't want to do until 2025.

[chrisn-au]

27 minutes ago, Dolebludger said:

Celebrity is taking back to full “mass market” status, we have the option of booking an existing mass market line for less money, or opt for a line offering the perks we want. 

Nicely put - it is great to have choice. 

[remarcm]

.......and we will still call it ALL Included?

[Ken the cruiser]

21 minutes ago, Dolebludger said:

We have to remember that Celebrity is giving over a month notice on the non-inclusion of  gratuities with AI and Retreat bookings after Oct. 4. And there is no law preventing price increases on cruises. Especially when prior notice is given. If any of us do not like the “little baby steps” Celebrity is taking back to full “mass market” status, we have the option of booking an existing mass market line for less money, or opt for a line offering the perks we want. 

Very true, and because of X’s current approach, they have now slipped down to #4 on our goto cruising list behind PCL, HAL, and NCL. They used to be #1 when cruising started back up and HAL was a distant #4.
 

Now once the 20% penalty for booking a cruise with a refundable deposit goes away and they start introducing more intriguing B2B combinations rather than their normal cookie cutter itineraries, maybe our opinion may change in a few years. As they say, time will tell. 😉

[Cap_D]

I've got an open onboard FCC, and need for a 2025 Easter trip.  But, very reluctant to do anything earlier, now or weeks from now (when I guess I could reprice if there were a decrease?).  I think the deposit amount would have to be increased since the reservation would be for Retreat.  And, then we are locked in to whatever this becomes or gets mixed up into.  This is annoying because my family is exactly the new target in terms of two working parents, child, preferences, etc.  And, we prize consistency.  We just aren't lemmings and have plenty in common with this community.  (We didn't have designs to use the solarium)  

 

But, we know we can do just as well at Harbour Island or another Bahamas location, visit family in Florida at a nice hotel, without the drama.  Ritz, Hyatt Place, or 7-11 will always have sausage.  Not so sure about Celebrity (and why is that even something one would even wonder or write about on a Monday night?). 

 

Everyone always said to me or others, "Don't worry, once you're on the ship it's going to be fantastic." And it generally was. And, we also knew what it was going to cost. There was no having to whip out the wallet so to speak all the time, which is just annoying on vacation.  (I would love not to touch a pen or plastic card for a few days).  We knew we'd get some good food, have some options, and some good weather.  Now, the same people who would have said don't worry, are most everyone posting here or all the other cookiegate type threads.

 

A year In a half ago, despite whatever  improvements I would have made, I came back from a cruise the first one, and would have recommended it to anyone.  I knew from my own experience, that on board it would be great. If it wasn't someone would take care of it if you asked. They'd have plenty of food, sausage and oatmeal at breakfast, some free cookies occasionally, and even better cookie in Eden Cafe, etc.  A silly charge for gelato, but plenty of free ice cream, and OBC to cover however much gelato you might eat.  If there was a need, a typical response would be something like no problem, I'll see if I can find it.  Maybe there'd be a charge, but you wouldn't feel like you'd be ripped off.  Now, there may be no one to look, and there might not even be anything to find ... Given the silence, maybe no one would even care. 

 

I would be extremely worried of being embarrassed or worse if I recommended a cruise and Celebrity today to someone who is going to be taking it at some point in the future and didn't know about all of what is going on.  Maybe they'd have a great time, would be great stuff on board, but it's just not a certain thing, and other than more money going to Celebrity, there doesn't seem to be anything that's going to change for the better. That's in front of the scenes, and also behind the scenes. 

 

Yikes. 

 

Edited August 29, 2023 by Cap_D

[tigervixxxen]

I think the alarming thing is that something is truly changing on a daily basis. I’ve only been actively posting here again for a couple months in advance of my cruise and all the “issues” are piling up in just the short time I’ve been paying attention. The only one that truly impacts me so far is the reduced MDR offerings and I’ll see how I feel about that in person. DH tires of the MDR on a good day so we’ll see how problematic it becomes. But it really is making me think twice about booking our next cruise. 

[RichYak]

2 hours ago, Dolebludger said:

If any of us do not like the “little baby steps” Celebrity is taking back to full “mass market” status…

This one seems to me to be a big baby with quite the long stride. 

[Dolebludger]

Yes, as I understand it, without “tips included” tips are charged at so many dollars per day per person automatically. As all my X cruises have been in the Retreat, I don’t know what that rate is, and I’m curious what that automatic tip rate is. Do you know?

[chrisn-au]

56 minutes ago, tigervixxxen said:

I think the alarming thing is that something is truly changing on a daily basis.

The only thing that I can hope is that they have had a set of changes to be rolled out over this current qtr. Get them all done, take the hit with frustrated customers and then move on. If it continues beyond October they really would have lost the plot as far as I am concerned. I understand tough decisions need to be made and I have no entitlement however please please please do it and then move on with reset in the new world . Whether Celebrity is the right line for me ongoing is a different discussion 

[Cap_D]

What's the TA reaction to all this?  We don't use one, but at some point I presume they get fed up unless their cut is going up too.  My impression is they have been promoting Celebrity well, and they'd have said it was a safe suggestion as compared to MSC or Princess, and if not looking for go karts, NCL.  Meanwhile there not a lot of evidence that Celebrity could handle the volume on their own or count on as many direct leads to make up for lost TA channel traffic.  

 

Grasping for what makes Celebrity a top choice for anyone after we add up the small cuts, account for the bigger changes and price, the intentional instability in the product, decrease the number of cheerleaders?  Retreat at 2k per day + gratuities + extras and excursions for a Retreat room? 

 

Assuming Retreat is 2k a day, even for comparison, if it's 1200 a night at a nice hotel, and one would use 800 a day after day, per room, for food and beverage, the total seems high to get in return an LED light show featuring a few dancers with cost spread across 1200 rooms, having to deal with asking specially for oatmeal, sausage, a good cookie, coffee (once they kill off Bacio), paying for pizza (once they make that extra), tilapia, odd cuts of beef, being solicited to buy a wine opener (true story), chair hogs, plus out of pocket expenses.    

Edited August 29, 2023 by Cap_D

[VitaminSea53]

20 minutes ago, Dolebludger said:

Yes, as I understand it, without “tips included” tips are charged at so many dollars per day per person automatically. As all my X cruises have been in the Retreat, I don’t know what that rate is, and I’m curious what that automatic tip rate is. Do you know?

How much are gratuities on a Celebrity cruise?

• $17.50 USD per person, per day for Inside, Ocean View, and Veranda cabins.
• $18.00 USD per person, per day for Concierge Class and AquaClass cabins.
• $21.00 USD per person, per day for those staying in The Retreat.
•  
• dated April 2023

[NMTraveller]

3 minutes ago, Cap_D said:

What's the TA reaction to all this? 

I think that you saw this earlier today...

[Dolebludger]

Yes, at $21/pp/per day for two, it would be $294 price increase on a 7 day cruise for two in the Retreat. A much bigger deal than $2.40 cookies. But it is all adding up to be enough to cause some second thoughts. I’m not advising anybody ti ditch Celebrity, as I don’t know what everybody’s priorities are. Mine are such that lack of included cokes and beer in the suite mini fridge is a deal breaker. It is sad. The way things were in 2018 and 2019, I really liked the Retreat. And I suspect these inclusion cuts are far from over. 

Edited August 29, 2023 by Dolebludger

[wineoclock]

It’s all so confusing. I don’t try and plan a holiday to end up confused. 
Another thread that will probably be deleted as well. 

[Cap_D]

28 minutes ago, wineoclock said:

It’s all so confusing. I don’t try and plan a holiday to end up confused. 
Another thread that will probably be deleted as well. 

They would never do that! 

[the penguins]

7 hours ago, jelayne said:

I see no reason to remove the gratuities.  If one booked with AI they were built in to that cost, if one booked cruise only then they could add them at booking or have them charged to their on board account.

 

The crew have nothing to do with the continuing changes, cuts or increased prices why penalize them.

 

 

There is a difference for X especially when they have to reduce prices on particular cruises.

A look at the maths ( sorry math) illustrates the point:

Let's assume that at the original fare the allowance for AI added $100 a day to the cost. Of this tips are $18 leaving X $82.

Now if the price has to be reduced to say $70 the tips portion remains at $18 leaving X $52.

Now when AI excludes tips in the first example X still gets $82 but in the second if X reduces the cost to $70 it still gets the full $70.

This was always the problem of including tips in any "package" as the tips go straight to the crew and X only gets the balance.