New ship 2022

just announced on Twitter that another new ship is coming in 2022. It’s going to be a sister ship to the 2020 ship.

http://www.pocruises.com/new-ship-2022/?utm_content=sf180235729&utm_medium=spredfast&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=p&o%20cruises&sf180235729=1

Apologies for any dodgy formatting, an posting from phone.

Oh dear, another giant. I have a nasty feeling that, the way things are going, in six to eight years time Azura and Ventura will be the smallest ships in P&O's fleet. I know some people like big ships, but Aurora and Arcadia are plenty big enough for me, and I loved Adonia. (I've yet to try Oriana and Oceana.)

Oh dear, another giant. I have a nasty feeling that, the way things are going, in six to eight years time Azura and Ventura will be the smallest ships in P&O's fleet. I know some people like big ships, but Aurora and Arcadia are plenty big enough for me, and I loved Adonia. (I've yet to try Oriana and Oceana.)

Couldn’t agree more. What a shame P&O are going down this route

Azura was too big for me or rather it had too many people on it for the available facilities

Love Britannia but big enough for us. Really hoping they keep some of the smaller ships. ..... one goood thing is that the big ships cant do Venice so they have to keep a few.

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Just been looking and it seems that these new ships will be the joint 3rd biggest cruise ships in the world, just behind RCI’s Oasis class of ships. Now I do like the bigger ships, but I’ve avoided these behemoths as I think they distance you from the sea, you might as well be in a hotel so I also feel pando are going the wrong way. They should have worked on a version of Britannia that works, I.e. one with a central staircase and a proper promenade deck.

Although these new mega-ships won’t suit many ‘traditional’ cruisers (new ships rarely do), I do feel that P&O is doing the right thing for the future success of their brand.

We have cruised on all the P&O ships over the past 22 years, other than Arcadia (a situation which will be rectified this year) and the clientele has changed enormously. We were in our early 30’s when we first cruised with P&O on the then 12 month old Oriana. We were younger than 99% of the passengers, most of whom were wealthy retirees. Throughout the cruise, we heard regular moans from people complaining about how they didn’t like this ‘massive’ new ship and how they much preferred Canberra.

As most people know, the glory days of gold plated pensions is mostly over, now that it is known that they were never affordable in the first place! Final salary / defined benefit pensions are now almost extinct in the private sector and even the comparatively far better public sector pension schemes are contributory and a little less generous than they used to be. So pensioners of the future will not enjoy the pension incomes of their parents generation and P&O will not be able to rely on this segment of the population to anywhere near the same extent.

Add to this the vast increase in the number of cabins that they have to fill. I was looking at the 1996 brochure for our first cruise. It bragged that there were around 45 cruises to choose from that year and the biggest ship was Oriana. Now they have as many cruises as that every few months and Oriana is the smallest ship!

Then, finally factor in that cruising is now starting to appeal to all generations and that younger people want bigger resort style ships with all the variety and choice that they offer.

Once you consider all the above, the rapidly changing passenger demographic and the fact that bigger ships are more cost efficient to run per passenger (hence why cruises are comparatively cheaper now than when we first cruised), it makes absolute sense for P&O to go in that direction.

Do I like it? Not really. We prefer the smaller ships as the overall cruise experience suits us better. But the new ships, particularly Britannia, offer far better facilities and appeal far more to the likes of our adult children. For what it’s worth, we also find that the bigger ships don’t feel as congested as the smaller ships inside on a dull sea day, so there are some other advantages.

So, although we would be gutted if the likes of Aurora and Oriana eventually leave the P&O fleet as more and more of the mega-ships are introduced, my business head tells me that if I was the CEO of P&O, I would be doing exactly as they are.

We like the bigger newer ships, primarily because they have excellent accessible cabins, and quite a lot more of them than the older smaller ships. Yes they are really only floating hotels but that's the beauty of cruising, your hotel room moves you around the world to experience lots of exciting places, and still provides you with a safe haven to return to each night.

Having read up on the small amount of information available, it does seem as though they will have fairly extensive wrap round promenade decks, where most of the speciality dining will be located, utilising some of the prom deck for Al Fresco dining, and presumably lots of bars and entertainment venues. I just hope that the lifts are much bigger than on Britannia and the stairways are adequate, and finally I do sincerely hope the balconies are at least double the size of those on Britannia.

If P&O meet my minimum requirements then I hope I am still around to enjoy cruising on these new ships for many years to come.

Oh dear - another megalith. I can see I'll have to defect to Fred Olsen.

Absolutely great news.

I think this is fantastic news! Selbourne, I completely agree with you - P&O have to do this as it makes complete financial sense for their survival in the cruise industry. Where they may loose some customers, what they will gain will outweigh that. As much as I hate the word, but P&O needs to appeal to us “Millennials” - we are now growing chunk of their revenue and appealing to us ensures custom for the future.

There is an interesting financial side to this which was revealed in one of the papers about a year ago.

As time is going on, the 45+ generation are happy to pay for more expensive cabins maybe with large amounts of obs included. They can be flexible to get deals and are more likely to cruise as a couple. As an overall group, the spend on ‘extras’ that P&O make money from isn’t that high.

Conversely the 25-45 generation look for cheaper / discounted up front cost but are used to the ‘bolt-on’ culture. They are also more likely to cruise as a family or larger group. Their spend on ‘extras’ is higher by a fair margin.

So yes P&O are cashing the cash by cashing the 25-45 group. I’m in that group, I see it as no bad thing.

If I was in the 45+ group, I’d be upset that a brand I live is slowly shifting focus but that’s life. It also clearly markets Cunard for the 45+ group and isn’t trying to appeal to the 16-24 group who can go on an all inclusive cruise with various others.

So which ship(s) is(are) going to be retired first, Arcadia, Oriana, Oceana? Or do Carnival reckon the cruise industry will grow enough to retain the old ships, not that 25 years is old for a ship.

Couldn’t agree more. What a shame P&O are going down this route

Azura was too big for me or rather it had too many people on it for the available facilities

I think the major decisions in the industry are decided by the people at Carnival Corporation for example. The individual brands have to cope with the decisions made at the top. Cruising is becoming more popular but probably not at the rate at which the new ships and particularly the berths on them are arriving.

One problem the corporations have is getting in with an order at the shipyard before your rivals do. If your rivals get all the experienced builders booked up solid you have tough decisions to make. Similarly, what do you do with the older ships you wish to phase out. If you scrap them you probably would get half as much money as you would if you sell them as working ships. This gives rise to the possibility of budget operators employing them and being up and coming rivals.

If you go out for a meal at a restaurant locally these days people do not look the same or behave as they did ten or twenty years ago, so why should the next generation of people cruising. Things have changed from when I started and will continue to do so. P&O simply need to keep in touch with what people are going to be like and want to do over the next decade. Things will change as we go along and prices should reduce further as capacity is exceeding the market, late booking seems to be a good idea if you want a bargain.

Regards John

I agree with most of what's been said on both sides. It's good it's another new ship, just a shame she'll be oversized like her sister.

Sure it makes more sense for the company to go this route, but doing that it slowly moving away from the existing customer base. (broadly speaking).

So which ship(s) is(are) going to be retired first, Arcadia, Oriana, Oceana? Or do Carnival reckon the cruise industry will grow enough to retain the old ships, not that 25 years is old for a ship.

That is a sad prospect, but you are right.

I'd imagine they'd be eventually retired by age - Oriana, Ociana, Arcadia and by that time the 'twins' (Ventura and Azura) will be classed as old and 'quaint'.

Of course these things do happen, after all they can't keep old ships going forever. If they did the Canberra and the Straths would still be in service.

It's a shame though, especially when people get attached to a particular ship. It'd be one thing to go from the Canberra to the Oriana, but as the insdustry moves towards these 'mega-ships', it's even more noticable.

This is an interesting topic and shows that you can't suit all of the people all of the time. I think Selbourne gave a very good overview of the future of cruising and completely hit the nail on its head...its what the up & coming potential cruisers will be looking for...a lower initial booking price and then compensate it by what they will spend on board.

For myself the Azura/Ventura size of ship suits me but one of the reasons is that I tend to lose my bearings on bigger ships ( an age thing)....so that it can take me a good few days to know where I am!. Anything bigger and I would be " completely lost at sea" :D

Couldn’t agree more. What a shame P&O are going down this route

Azura was too big for me or rather it had too many people on it for the available facilities

You have hit the nail on the head. Big ships are fine if they have the proper facilities for the number of pax. My problem with huge ships is that they seldom do, particulalrly when is comes to embarkation, shuttle buses and the nightmare that is a tender port!

I do prefer the slightly smaller ships but the business model of the industry is going for stack em high. It's easy to hark back to the golden days of cruising but things will always change and we do tend to forget that things were not perfect back then either and that some of the modern innovations are good eg freedom dining.

I'm looking forward to it personally. I've sailed on Britannia twice, am going on MSC Seaview in June & Ventura next year. So have only sailed on 'larger' ships.

As a young couple in our mid 20's we prefer the slightly lower initial cost. we can then save up for the extras if/when we want them.

Although these new mega-ships won’t suit many ‘traditional’ cruisers (new ships rarely do), I do feel that P&O is doing the right thing for the future success of their brand.

 

We have cruised on all the P&O ships over the past 22 years, other than Arcadia (a situation which will be rectified this year) and the clientele has changed enormously. We were in our early 30’s when we first cruised with P&O on the then 12 month old Oriana. We were younger than 99% of the passengers, most of whom were wealthy retirees. Throughout the cruise, we heard regular moans from people complaining about how they didn’t like this ‘massive’ new ship and how they much preferred Canberra.

 

As most people know, the glory days of gold plated pensions is mostly over, now that it is known that they were never affordable in the first place! Final salary / defined benefit pensions are now almost extinct in the private sector and even the comparatively far better public sector pension schemes are contributory and a little less generous than they used to be. So pensioners of the future will not enjoy the pension incomes of their parents generation and P&O will not be able to rely on this segment of the population to anywhere near the same extent.

 

Add to this the vast increase in the number of cabins that they have to fill. I was looking at the 1996 brochure for our first cruise. It bragged that there were around 45 cruises to choose from that year and the biggest ship was Oriana. Now they have as many cruises as that every few months and Oriana is the smallest ship!

 

Then, finally factor in that cruising is now starting to appeal to all generations and that younger people want bigger resort style ships with all the variety and choice that they offer.

 

Once you consider all the above, the rapidly changing passenger demographic and the fact that bigger ships are more cost efficient to run per passenger (hence why cruises are comparatively cheaper now than when we first cruised), it makes absolute sense for P&O to go in that direction.

 

Do I like it? Not really. We prefer the smaller ships as the overall cruise experience suits us better. But the new ships, particularly Britannia, offer far better facilities and appeal far more to the likes of our adult children. For what it’s worth, we also find that the bigger ships don’t feel as congested as the smaller ships inside on a dull sea day, so there are some other advantages.

 

So, although we would be gutted if the likes of Aurora and Oriana eventually leave the P&O fleet as more and more of the mega-ships are introduced, my business head tells me that if I was the CEO of P&O, I would be doing exactly as they are.

I couldn’t have put any of this better myself, it exactly reflects my thoughts.

There is so much change on the horizon as we enter an era where 5 generations will be in the workforce and the whole structure of jobs will change with the introduction of artificial intelligence and robotics.

Most people can’t even imagine what this will look like and what it will mean. Companies have to plan ahead and evolve or they will die.

If you’ve got time to make yourself a drink and spend 10 mins watching this it’s worth it - all of this technology was available 5 years ago, will probably be in our cabins soon and is just the tip of change to come.

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Personally, once all the small ships go, so will I.

I by far prefer the small ship experience.

I understand the business model and having to think for the future.

I suspect we will end up cruising less and paying more for the privilege.

Personally, once all the small ships go, so will I.

I by far prefer the small ship experience.

I understand the business model and having to think for the future.

I suspect we will end up cruising less and paying more for the privilege.

I think it will be many many years before all of today's " small" ships will have disappeared completely. The existing ones at the moment will be sold on to other cruise lines so yes we may have to change to another cruise company to still experience & enjoy but at least we will still be able to cruise on cruise ships of a size that we prefer.

The 2020 design looks very similar to AIDAprima.

Regards John

Oh dear, another giant. I have a nasty feeling that, the way things are going, in six to eight years time Azura and Ventura will be the smallest ships in P&O's fleet. I know some people like big ships, but Aurora and Arcadia are plenty big enough for me, and I loved Adonia. (I've yet to try Oriana and Oceana.)

I agree absolutely.

When I first started cruising 20+ years ago the QE2, measuring 70000 tonnes and carrying 1900 passengers, was considered huge. Almost as big as the legendary 80000 tonne 2000 passenger Queen Mary. Nowadays both would be classed as mid size ships.

It is not a change for the better. Big ships are impersonal, with none of the camaraderie found on smaller ship. You very rarely meet the same person twice, there are queues everywhere, and tender ports are a nightmare.

Of the present P&O fleet, I feel more comfortable in ships the size of Oceana (my favourite) Oriana, Arcadia and Aurora. Ventura I found a bit too large for my personal tastes. I gave Brittania a go but did not warm to her at all. Too big and impersonal, felt more like a hotel with a rooftop swimming pool than a ship, little sight of the sea. I cannot see myself warming to the new ships in any way whatsoever.

So where does that leave me? In recent years, as mass market ships have got bigger and bigger I have found myself sailing with the like of P&O less and with niche lines like Star Clippers (my favourites) more. I see this trend continuing. But I accept that I am probably in a minority and that newer cruisers probably want a floating resort hotel rather than a traditional ship.

Rant over!

We first sailed on Oriana then Arcadia (twice). Recently we have been on Azura and Britannia. As a disabled person I found the new ships perfect for us, modern and spacious. We are on Aurora in June so it will be interesting to compare facilities again. If things don't work as well, we will probably give the new arrivals a go, but I admit it would be a shame if the choice of ships was restricted to the 'giants' only.

What a pleasure to read a thread like this one, it makes a nice change! We have only cruised with P&O, since 2012. We have sailed on Aurora, Arcadia, Azura and Britannia with Oceana and Ventura lined up. We already fall into the bracket of buy in at a reasonable price and add on, as we find that by paying extra for facilities like The Retreat and all the speciality restaurants, or opting for a suite, we can find a niche for ourselves away from some of the other cruisers....with thousands of passengers on board there is bound to be a cross section of the public, some of whom you would prefer to avoid! As we spend twelve weeks of the year abroad on other holidays we are more than happy to be amongst fellow Brits, and love having our floating hotel take us to beautiful ports, as one poster said! We are looking forward to trying the new ships.

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I love Britannia and have no objection to big ships in principle. I certainly love the wide range of options they offer as floating resorts. The problem for me is that they limit the type of cruises which can be offered. Currently Britannia's cruises revolve round the Fjords, the Canaries and the larger ports in the Med. Yes there's an occasional visit to The Baltics etc but if there are only these large ships people could would tire of the same old destinations. It's one of the major complaints every year when the new brochure is released and it may be that the new type of cruisers whose money is so avidly sought will feel the same.