Is RCL heading in the Wrong Direction... ?

[time4u2go]

No one can say if Royal is heading in the 'right direction' because it seems every cruiser has their own definition of what is right. Is Royal changing a little, sure...it has to adapt/change to what they perceive will continue to bring new cruisers and continue to bring something new to returning cruisers. As much as repeat cruisers (like myself) want a consistency of product provided, I for one, don't want it to become stale and old. Yet, I also don't want every ship to be the same as every other ship in the fleet, only to be differentiated by its name.

 

A little?:rolleyes:

[shipshape sam]

There seems to have been a lot of negativity in the past several months about a vast array of different things and different ships in the RC fleet - most recently the changes performed to the Oasis from it's recent dry dock. Royal Caribbean has also just announced that it will be holding firm on it's cruise prices and not to expect last minute discounts anymore. It seems they are putting it's shareholders ahead of it's customers and looking at the "bottom line." Will this come back to bite them down the road... ?

 

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-10-27/royal-caribbean-to-cruisers-stop-expecting-last-minute-discounts?campaign_id=yhoo

 

Just looking for some different opinions and perspectives about this. I love this cruise line and it's sister company Celebrity and have remained loyal for over 12 years now. I have to admit that my cruise experience on RCL has diminished in quality over the years, but still found good value in the vacations. If the "value" is taken away, and service and quality is diminished - at what point do people start jumping ship?

 

- Doc

 

I like Royal and Celebrity and have been a big cheerleader for them, but we are considering being a part of a group sailing on Costa in 2015, not what I would propose, but $$$$ has a part in decision process along with vanishing amenities. First sailed on Royal in 1998 and Celebrity in 2005.

[tcieyes]

HI We live in Florida and used to cruise 4-6 times a year with Royal exclusively. Since the WOW non-sales and all the new structure we have not cruised since May 2014. The prices on summer cruises were way higher than we wanted to pay for the Royal experience. Also to our great distress all the Transatlantics are leaving by on or about May 4, 2015, which we can't make, we could go from 8th on so we are looking at Seabourne and Windstar, and the QE2 as much as we really do love Royal. If everyone else starts to react the way we have, it will be very interesting. We just can't justify paying the prices for suites on itineraries we have been on 3 times already, when Seabourne sales are better deals. I do know that the top tier M-lifers can still get amazing deals, as I have a friend that gets those deals. It is to Royal's advantage to attract high rollers that will bring in a lot of gambling revenue. Finally got to almost Diamond and now everything is changing a bit too much. :(:confused:

[Spurschick]

HI We live in Florida and used to cruise 4-6 times a year with Royal exclusively. Since the WOW non-sales and all the new structure we have not cruised since May 2014. The prices on summer cruises were way higher than we wanted to pay for the Royal experience. Also to our great distress all the Transatlantics are leaving by on or about May 4, 2015, which we can't make, we could go from 8th on so we are looking at Seabourne and Windstar, and the QE2 as much as we really do love Royal. If everyone else starts to react the way we have, it will be very interesting. We just can't justify paying the prices for suites on itineraries we have been on 3 times already, when Seabourne sales are better deals. I do know that the top tier M-lifers can still get amazing deals, as I have a friend that gets those deals. It is to Royal's advantage to attract high rollers that will bring in a lot of gambling revenue. Finally got to almost Diamond and now everything is changing a bit too much. :(:confused:

 

:confused: the QE2 doesn't sail anymore:confused:

[tcieyes]

Sorry Oops mean the Queen Mary 2

[mcatmcat]

I have the royal caribbean card and I advised my mom to get stocks from the company. That's shows the level of appreciation that I have toward the company. But when you also look for an alternative vacation after emerald they might be doing something wrong or maybe it's me. What used to be "wow" in the past today it is like "nice"

 

 

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[grand isle joe]

.......maybe familiarity breeds contempt?...........;)

[Starry Eyes]

HI We live in Florida and used to cruise 4-6 times a year with Royal exclusively. Since the WOW non-sales and all the new structure we have not cruised since May 2014. The prices on summer cruises were way higher than we wanted to pay for the Royal experience. Also to our great distress all the Transatlantics are leaving by on or about May 4, 2015, which we can't make, we could go from 8th on so we are looking at Seabourne and Windstar, and the QE2 as much as we really do love Royal. If everyone else starts to react the way we have, it will be very interesting. We just can't justify paying the prices for suites on itineraries we have been on 3 times already, when Seabourne sales are better deals. I do know that the top tier M-lifers can still get amazing deals, as I have a friend that gets those deals. It is to Royal's advantage to attract high rollers that will bring in a lot of gambling revenue. Finally got to almost Diamond and now everything is changing a bit too much. :(:confused:

With so many families traveling, summer demand is high, ergo summer cruise prices are high. Price sensitive travelers try to avoid school vacation times, as prices run much higher. The high prices during school vacations are rough on budget travelers tied to a school calendar, but if one is not tied to a school calendar, be glad the companies are able to make their profits off somebody else. there have been some great prices this fall for the bargain hunters.

 

Obviously, as relocation cruises for Royal Caribbean, the transatlantic cruise timing are designed to get the ships to the other side of the pond at the right time for those lucrative (in the hopes of the cruise line) European cruises. Unfortunately, for you, that timing does not fit your upcoming schedule...c'est la vie. I do not think that is a "wrong direction” issue for the cruiseline. Enjoy the others lines that time better for your timing; changing things up is fun.

[Paulette3028]

HI We live in Florida and used to cruise 4-6 times a year with Royal exclusively. Since the WOW non-sales and all the new structure we have not cruised since May 2014. The prices on summer cruises were way higher than we wanted to pay for the Royal experience. Also to our great distress all the Transatlantics are leaving by on or about May 4, 2015, which we can't make, we could go from 8th on so we are looking at Seabourne and Windstar, and the QE2 as much as we really do love Royal. If everyone else starts to react the way we have, it will be very interesting. We just can't justify paying the prices for suites on itineraries we have been on 3 times already, when Seabourne sales are better deals. I do know that the top tier M-lifers can still get amazing deals, as I have a friend that gets those deals. It is to Royal's advantage to attract high rollers that will bring in a lot of gambling revenue. Finally got to almost Diamond and now everything is changing a bit too much. :(:confused:

 

Even though we live in Florida, very close to the FLL and Miami ports, we don't have the ability to cruise 4-6 times a year or even 3. Sometimes 2, we try hard to do it once....we love cruising. Do I look forward to the time, when we can cruise on a calendar whim....sure -- that will be a luxury for us because we are so close -- but booking that late has disadvantages. The most glaring is less choice of cabin options. We have attained Diamond status and the balcony discounts are nice, but I don't cruise with them simply for the discounts -- it is the fun onboard, which from what I read from others, I might not find on other lines. My BIL and SIL cruised on Caribbean Princess last summer, a week after we cruised on Allure. When we compared cruises, they seems to have a lot less to do. Since we EACH did not enjoy the others food, we did not compare dining room options. Glutony, isn't a priority to me -- having good food that I enjoy is. For us, we had that on Allure. My BIL was disappointed in some of his meals and they had cruised on Princess before.

[seaofwonder]

We have no upcoming cruises on Royal. First time in 5 years. We are just bored with their itineraries and have noticed all the little changes. I think some of our discontent is Royal and some of it is us. Our travel style is changing. We want to see more of the world and royal's itineraries don't match our goals. However, some of the things we've noticed in recent years:

 

- slower stateroom service as the attendants have to service more rooms

- very slow dining Service

- poor customer service response from guest services

 

The hard product is great....it's the management/customer service that has been lacking. The actual crew members are always amazing and pleasant, but management is making changes that leads them to suffer (I.e. Customers blame attendants for slow service when it is because they have to service 50% more cabins).

 

I'm also not happy with how they implemented announcement of casino program changes.

 

 

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[Alleycat1027]

bI posted a LONG post yesterday that doesn't seem to be here, so, will try to recap in a shorter fashion. I just got off "Explorer" in Cape Liberty, NJ yesterday (11/1) after her last cruise from NJ to NJ...she's off again on a 14 day cruise that will end in Port Canaveral, FL, where she'll cruise from for several months and then she's destined for dry dock, Europe, then ultimately Australia.

 

While I have no MAJOR complaints about the cruise, I hadn't cruised at all or on this ship in 4 years and was disappointed in the "Platinum" perks and the fact that I can't seem to get my "Crown and Anchor" straightened out (I should be "Emerald")...while the difference between those two aren't great, I should be closer to Diamond status.

 

It DOES bother me that along the way, RC changed C&A criteria dramatically so it's harder to get to Diamond, I didn't find the food that great on this cruise (it was OK-good, but not great), the Windjammer was a disaster to be frank (tables not cleaned at busy times...having to sit down with others dirty stuff or not sit down). The STAFF, however, was GREAT overall!!

 

My ULTIMATE POINT is that I used to work in MARKETING and still do to some extent. When ppl have a bad or so-so experience or are just unhappy with decreased perks, they will tend to tell 11 people; when happy? they tend to tell 3-4 people.

 

I know when I'm HAPPY, I tell WAY more than 3 or 4 people!! I "Sing the Praises" of the product, cruise, vacation, business, etc.!!

 

I have personally recommended RC @ Cape Liberty to many and know I'm responsible for many booking a cruise out of that port as it's very convenient for many in the Northeast (and people fly in to Newark, JFK, etc.) even from Europe! (Many from Europe, esp. the UK/Ireland, on this cruise I just finished!)

 

WHY NOT keep the perks the same or even better simply for the purposes of MARKETING?? So that former cruisers can honestly say: "Yeah! RC is great! Innovative and they like to hold on to their cruisers!"

 

This company has NO lack of income on these ships. Just think of all the ALCOHOL consumed!! (not by me but...!!) :D

Edited November 2, 2014 by Alleycat1027

[Alleycat1027]

I want to be enlightened about all of these cutbacks for Diamonds and other loyalty programs? I'm not being sarcastic, I just want to know. As a Diamond I can't remember any cutbacks outside of the great kick out of the CL. RCI responded by building Diamond Clubs on all of their new ships and converting areas into Diamond Clubs on other ships.

 

Many loyal cruisers book their next cruise at the loyalty desk or online, saving them a net of millions of dollars by not paying TA commissions, while paying loyalty discounts only for their most expensive cabins.

 

Why is that RCI's plan is to reduce loyalty perks? I see no concrete evidence. I always get a chuckle when someone posts RCI has too many Diamonds or D+. A newly minted D+ would certainly convince an executive that my product produces many customers that return over and over. I they didn't return, wouldn't you think there is a problem?

 

Dynamic dining aside, IMHO RCI is heading in exactly the right direction. They must watch the bottom line, satisfy their shareholders, and keep customers both new and loyalists happy. History is littered with bankrupt coporations that did not watch all three.

 

My two cents.

 

**Perhaps, RC hasn't reduced Diamond and Diamond Plus Perks and that's GREAT! But they have for lower levels! And offered hard earned Perks to people who have barely cruised. :eek:

 

I do think the revision to CROWN & ANCHOR was unnecessarily harsh and? even "unfair". I read on this very thread of folks who cruised numerous times per year as they live in FL and hey...good for them! But, easy to get the former criteria for DIAMOND of 10 cruises that way. NOW? it's 80 nights on the ship.

 

If you live where I do (Northeast) and use Cape Liberty, NJ (Bayonne), unless you were willing to add the cost of flying to FL, you were "stuck" with 5 or 9 days cruises. I wouldn't have flown to FL for a 3, 4 or 5 day cruise. And? I do other vacations besides cruising as well.

 

I have NO PROBLEM with the perks D and D+ have! I think it's great for them no matter how they earned them ("old" or "new" C&A system)! But? let some of us who started on the OLD program catch up in a more fair way is all.

[Hoopster95]

However, some of the things we've noticed in recent years:

 

- slower stateroom service as the attendants have to service more rooms

- very slow dining Service

- poor customer service response from guest services

 

I just commented in different words on another thread some of the above. I would mention in my personal experience I haven't seen poor room attendant service at all, it has been stable for years in my experience. Dining service definitely slower, however most recently Serenade it was perfect like the "old days"!! Guest services I have not experienced much so can't comment.

 

The hard product is great....it's the management/customer service that has been lacking. The actual crew members are always amazing and pleasant, but management is making changes that leads them to suffer (I.e. Customers blame attendants for slow service when it is because they have to service 50% more cabins).

 

Very well said. And as so many well-traveled experienced CC'ers have said on many threads, all in the name of the bottom line perhaps:(

 

So what's the solution? I guess increase prices to support more staff, decrease the passenger:staff ratio, higher food costs, build smaller ships with less revenue per customer, etc etc... pretty soon RCL will become another Oceana or Regent. In other words, I guess they have to do whatever's best for their business model in competing with the other "mass market" cruise lines. We have a choice... leave the mass market cruise lines and pay 3 times more to sail on much better serviced ships, or continue to pay lower priced more affordable cruise fares with RCL, CCL, NCL or Princess... whoever we feel is doing the best job.

[slk230red]

I want to be enlightened about all of these cutbacks for Diamonds and other loyalty programs? I'm not being sarcastic, I just want to know. As a Diamond I can't remember any cutbacks outside of the great kick out of the CL. RCI responded by building Diamond Clubs on all of their new ships and converting areas into Diamond Clubs on other ships.

 

Many loyal cruisers book their next cruise at the loyalty desk or online, saving them a net of millions of dollars by not paying TA commissions, while paying loyalty discounts only for their most expensive cabins.

 

Why is that RCI's plan is to reduce loyalty perks? I see no concrete evidence. I always get a chuckle when someone posts RCI has too many Diamonds or D+. A newly minted D+ would certainly convince an executive that my product produces many customers that return over and over. I they didn't return, wouldn't you think there is a problem?

 

Dynamic dining aside, IMHO RCI is heading in exactly the right direction. They must watch the bottom line, satisfy their shareholders, and keep customers both new and loyalists happy. History is littered with bankrupt corporations that did not watch all three.

 

My two cents.

 

Why do think that RCI pays no TA commissions when guests book at the loyalty desk? This certainly doesn't apply to all bookings.

[steveru621]

Why do think that RCI pays no TA commissions when guests book at the loyalty desk? This certainly doesn't apply to all bookings.

 

It applies to all bookings made at the loyalty desk that are not transferred to a Travel Agent. The same applies to the Internet.

[Trainman-2]

We are both in our 70's and may be RCI's ideal cruisers!

 

We normally don't know who the Cruise Director is and really don't care. We can entertain ourselves relaxing on the pool deck, reading, and watching everyone else.

 

The 3 free drinks a day for us as Diamond Plus are more than we use.

 

We eat in the Windjammer or Specialty Restaurants (paid for by our T/A) and are looking forward to experiencing Dynamic Dining. We might like it or we might not, but we will try it.

 

We just like being on the ship and visiting the nearby places in the ports.

 

We are easy to please...

[slk230red]

We are both in our 70's and may be RCI's ideal cruisers!

 

We normally don't know who the Cruise Director is and really don't care. We can entertain ourselves relaxing on the pool deck, reading, and watching everyone else.

 

The 3 free drinks a day for us as Diamond Plus are more than we use.

 

We eat in the Windjammer or Specialty Restaurants (paid for by our T/A) and are looking forward to experiencing Dynamic Dining. We might like it or we might not, but we will try it.

 

We just like being on the ship and visiting the nearby places in the ports.

 

We are easy to please...

 

Hi Jim, I've been reading your posts on CFOT but haven't seen you around CC in a while.

[seaofwonder]

I just commented in different words on another thread some of the above. I would mention in my personal experience I haven't seen poor room attendant service at all, it has been stable for years in my experience. Dining service definitely slower, however most recently Serenade it was perfect like the "old days"!! Guest services I have not experienced much so can't comment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Very well said. And as so many well-traveled experienced CC'ers have said on many threads, all in the name of the bottom line perhaps:(

 

 

 

So what's the solution? I guess increase prices to support more staff, decrease the passenger:staff ratio, higher food costs, build smaller ships with less revenue per customer, etc etc... pretty soon RCL will become another Oceana or Regent. In other words, I guess they have to do whatever's best for their business model in competing with the other "mass market" cruise lines. We have a choice... leave the mass market cruise lines and pay 3 times more to sail on much better serviced ships, or continue to pay lower priced more affordable cruise fares with RCL, CCL, NCL or Princess... whoever we feel is doing the best job.

 

 

I don't know if there is a solution. Were generally pretty laid back cruisers. We hang in our room/balcony reading and watching tv episodes we download before leaving. Evenings are usually in the casino.

 

This isn't a problem unique to cruise lines....airlines are doing the same. Keep the prices the same but decrease service.

 

We are hopping over to NCL because their price for a european cruise was much cheaper and the itinerary was worlds better.

 

We prefer the comfort/familiarity of Royal, but life is too short. If we want to visit new places then we have to try new lines.

 

We are not the clientele that the upscale lines want. We're too laid back in terms of dress and eating.

 

 

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[Paulette3028]

We have no upcoming cruises on Royal. First time in 5 years. We are just bored with their itineraries and have noticed all the little changes. I think some of our discontent is Royal and some of it is us. Our travel style is changing. We want to see more of the world and royal's itineraries don't match our goals. However, some of the things we've noticed in recent years:

 

- slower stateroom service as the attendants have to service more rooms

- very slow dining Service

- poor customer service response from guest services

 

The hard product is great....it's the management/customer service that has been lacking. The actual crew members are always amazing and pleasant, but management is making changes that leads them to suffer (I.e. Customers blame attendants for slow service when it is because they have to service 50% more cabins).

 

I'm also not happy with how they implemented announcement of casino program changes.

 

 

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I use the logic when reading posts that I have learned about ingredients in processed foods. The first item listed is the item that is in the product the most. From this analogy, I deduce that your biggest disappointment with Royal is that you are bored with their itineraries. Therefore very little can the onboard ships crew do to overcome that big issue. The crew as you point out have been harnessed with more rooms to service, more tables to service in the dining room, and probably a few less guest relations personnel to handle customer service issues. Although, when we have had a problem that needed to be brought to Guest Relations, we got it resolved, because we don't take some version of "No" for an answer.

 

I don't understand the issues that disturbed you in the casino, because we do very little in the casino. If a ship did not have one, this cruiser would not miss it. From my point of view, they could turn that space into something else. I realize, I am in a very small minority and know that won't happen. It doesn't stop me from cruising.

[slk230red]

Although, when we have had a problem that needed to be brought to Guest Relations, we got it resolved, because we don't take some version of "No" for an answer.

 

I don't understand the issues that disturbed you in the casino, because we do very little in the casino. If a ship did not have one, this cruiser would not miss it. From my point of view, they could turn that space into something else. I realize, I am in a very small minority and know that won't happen. It doesn't stop me from cruising.

 

The Casino is of no importance to me, but I know there are a lot of passengers that won't cruise without one.

 

Just curious, do you only sail on RCI ships?

[seaofwonder]

I use the logic when reading posts that I have learned about ingredients in processed foods. The first item listed is the item that is in the product the most. From this analogy, I deduce that your biggest disappointment with Royal is that you are bored with their itineraries. Therefore very little can the onboard ships crew do to overcome that big issue. The crew as you point out have been harnessed with more rooms to service, more tables to service in the dining room, and probably a few less guest relations personnel to handle customer service issues. Although, when we have had a problem that needed to be brought to Guest Relations, we got it resolved, because we don't take some version of "No" for an answer.

 

 

 

I don't understand the issues that disturbed you in the casino, because we do very little in the casino. If a ship did not have one, this cruiser would not miss it. From my point of view, they could turn that space into something else. I realize, I am in a very small minority and know that won't happen. It doesn't stop me from cruising.

 

 

Our issues were eventually resolved, but only after much back and forth arguing.

 

Yes, itineraries is a big problem for us.....but even a new itinerary can't overcome some of the onboard issues.

 

However, cost is a biggie. Their prices for non-caribbean cruises are quite high compared to other lines. Given that the onboard experience doesn't match those prices, we are taking our dollars elsewhere. To see if the grass really is greener somewhere else.

 

 

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[Paulette3028]

The Casino is of no importance to me, but I know there are a lot of passengers that won't cruise without one.

 

Just curious, do you only sail on RCI ships?

 

So far we have only cruised on Royal -- we have had no reason yet to look elsewhere. I am sure there will come a time, when an itinerary we want is not available on Royal. Eventually we do want to do an Azamara cruise (that is part of the same overall parent company with Royal). The itinerary we would like to take that is not available on Royal is on Celebrity (again within the same parent company universe) -- but we don't have the availability right now to do it.

[Paulette3028]

Our issues were eventually resolved, but only after much back and forth arguing.

 

Yes, itineraries is a big problem for us.....but even a new itinerary can't overcome some of the onboard issues.

 

However, cost is a biggie. Their prices for non-caribbean cruises are quite high compared to other lines. Given that the onboard experience doesn't match those prices, we are taking our dollars elsewhere. To see if the grass really is greener somewhere else.

 

 

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It is interesting that you bring up cost now, and not prior. Disposal vacation dollars do have to be spent wisely, which is why I would have to believe you would carefully choose an itinerary that would make the experience worth the dollars spent.

[Big_G]

**Perhaps, RC hasn't reduced Diamond and Diamond Plus Perks and that's GREAT! But they have for lower levels! And offered hard earned Perks to people who have barely cruised. :eek:

 

 

I'm curious as to what perks you lost and what perks are now being offered to people who have barely cruised.

[grand isle joe]

The Casino is of no importance to me, but I know there are a lot of passengers that won't cruise without one.

 

Just curious, do you only sail on RCI ships?

 

Disney has no casino and does not have any trouble filling their ships. But they have "mined" a specific passenger profile.