Is RCL heading in the Wrong Direction... ?

[Sunny AZ Girl]

I wonder how much value RCI is giving to the fact that many of their coveted new cruisers are actually brought to them by the RCI loyals?

[Tutankhamen]

If I go by the contents of the Cruise Critic boards, you would think the entire cruise industry is about to dry up and blow away. At the end of the day, my wife and I go on cruises on different cruise lines, we always have a good time and then we look forward to our next cruise. On each cruise I could find something I don't like, but I normally find a lot more that I really enjoyed. I do believe there is not a lot of financial benefit to being a loyal customer to any particular cruise line. Look for a good destination on a good ship with a good price and don't worry about being loyal. This is business. The cruise lines will do what they have to, to keep the ships full.

 

Perfecto!

 

This is how we do it. Loyalty programs are designed to benefit the provider, not the consumer.

 

As with all things in life, we decide based on what we feel like and what we can comfortably afford. Any loyalty points gained have no affect on our future decisions.

 

Its a big world, with many options and we enjoy experiencing new experiences and new products. Our next vacation is a condo for 10 days in Playa Del Carmen. We use to cruise about 80% of the time we were on vacation. This has now dropped to less then 50%. Nothing to do with loyalty, but rather the decline in our experiences on ships. Those who have cruised for 25+ years probably understand what I am saying.

Edited October 29, 2014 by Tutankhamen

[time4u2go]

What's wrong with these folks taking cruises at the last minute ? Are you jealous that you can't do it. I just don't understand your comment !:confused:

I believe their comment was addressing the fact that if RCI doesn't lower prices close to the date of the cruise, then RCI will lose a lot of cruisers that live close to cruise ports. I really don't understand how you think they were jealous of anything. :confused:

[Toddcan]

I also have to think that this announcement of no more lower prices to fill ships is just an empty "threat". The very last line in that article sums it up: Not many analysis/insiders believe it will actually pan out this way. If they keep prices in the higher range - they simply won't fill the ships.

 

If this statement by Royal gets a few people booking earlier, then the strategy has worked.

 

I am a little intrigued by his comment that the lower prices are bothersome to those who booked early. The way I look at things is that I book a cruise at a price I am willing to pay. If the price drops before final payment - I see that as a bonus! I do not count on it. Now, if the price drops after final payment, I see if I can grab an upgrade. If not.. I am still excited to be going on vacation, paying a price I was comfortable with back when I booked it.

 

In my opinion, if we worry too much about someone else getting a better deal, or having more, or being better off than then we are - will have an unfufilled life. The only time I should be worried about what's on my neighbour's plate is when he doesn't have enough, and I can help him out.

[dorisis]

I call it Walmartizing. So many other products are going the same way.

[Beach710]

I also have to think that this announcement of no more lower prices to fill ships is just an empty "threat". The very last line in that article sums it up: Not many analysis/insiders believe it will actually pan out this way. If they keep prices in the higher range - they simply won't fill the ships.

 

If this statement by Royal gets a few people booking earlier, then the strategy has worked.

 

I am a little intrigued by his comment that the lower prices are bothersome to those who booked early. The way I look at things is that I book a cruise at a price I am willing to pay. If the price drops before final payment - I see that as a bonus! I do not count on it. Now, if the price drops after final payment, I see if I can grab an upgrade. If not.. I am still excited to be going on vacation, paying a price I was comfortable with back when I booked it.

 

In my opinion, if we worry too much about someone else getting a better deal, or having more, or being better off than then we are - will have an unfufilled life. The only time I should be worried about what's on my neighbour's plate is when he doesn't have enough, and I can help him out.

 

This is an awesome quote, is it original or did you borrow it? I may want to use it in the future.

 

Thanks

[nbsjcruiser]

There seems to have been a lot of negativity in the past several months about a vast array of different things and different ships in the RC fleet - most recently the changes performed to the Oasis from it's recent dry dock. Royal Caribbean has also just announced that it will be holding firm on it's cruise prices and not to expect last minute discounts anymore. It seems they are putting it's shareholders ahead of it's customers and looking at the "bottom line." Will this come back to bite them down the road... ?

 

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-10-27/royal-caribbean-to-cruisers-stop-expecting-last-minute-discounts?campaign_id=yhoo

 

Just looking for some different opinions and perspectives about this. I love this cruise line and it's sister company Celebrity and have remained loyal for over 12 years now. I have to admit that my cruise experience on RCL has diminished in quality over the years, but still found good value in the vacations. If the "value" is taken away, and service and quality is diminished - at what point do people start jumping ship?

 

- Doc

 

In all fairness, that's what a for-profit company should do.

 

Actually no. A successful company will pay very close attention to its customers first. Without them, they are nothing. Successfully courting and pleasing your customer will have the side affect of returning value to shareholders. Appealing to shareholders first will only lead to improper decisions - see IBM as an example.

[jewopaho]

We get this all the time here ... the sky is falling on this-or-that cruise line; if they keep it up, they'll be out of business; you won't catch me cruising with them again; they've forgotten who brought them to where they are ... please!! They all seem to be doing pretty well these days.

 

Cruise lines are for-profit entities, and as such answer to their shareholders. The fact that their product is a vacation (as opposed to a tangible item such as an automobile or a toaster) is of little consequence. No, they're not going anywhere ... if Carnival has survived and flourished in the wake of the Costa tragedy (as well as all the negativity over ships losing power in open waters, half a passenger load becoming ill, etc.) Royal Caribbean needn't be overly concerned about the relatively few complaints over cutbacks in onboard credit when booking aboard ship.

 

With the advent of mega-ships, the industry has changed dramatically ... some believe for the worse, but the majority feel otherwise (as in 5500-passenger behemoths consistently sailing full). If we didn't like what's being offered, we wouldn't be on this forum. Add the competitive (more like cutthroat) nature among the major players, the battle to grow larger (remember the war between Carnival and RCI to acquire Princess?), the increasing cost of doing business, and the launching of new ships on a regular basis (Oasis, Allure, Quantum and Anthem over a six-year period ... that's over 20,000 more staterooms to fill each week) ... there simply needs to be a continual flow of new cruisers in the pipeline. Going after them is a prudent business decision ... Carnival has been doing it for decades.

 

The thought in the boardroom seems to be that those "loyal to Royal" passengers will continue to sail with RCI as long as the product is attractive (all components, not simply the perks) ... sure, there will be casualties along the way, but the Diamond, D+ and those Pinnacle members who spend half their lives aboard cruise ships, will, for the most part, remain onboard (pun intended). Don't look for anything resembling a mass exodus ... it's not going to happen. A cutback here and there is part of doing business these days ... but so is the development and launching of new, innovative and very attractive floating resorts. Something's gotta give somewhere. Is there any cruise line out there that regularly adds to the experience, while lowering prices and building newer, bigger and better ships? I can guarantee that there is (or has been) a thread similar to this one on the Carnival, Celebrity and NCL forums (probably all of the majors).

 

Overall, we love the Royal Caribbean product (five cruises currently booked) ... I've sailed with Princess, Celebrity, HAL, NCL, and even a few lines that are no longer in business. It's always disappointing when an amenity is reduced or eliminated ... but where else can you get this kind of experience for that kind of money? Unless you're booking the top-of-the-line accommodations, nothing comes close. So RCI is holding firm on price ... if you didn't feel comfortable paying it in the first place, why book it at all? Spending half a day at a computer looking for a price drop is at best unproductive ... sure, you'll hit one every now and then, but even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.

 

For some, RCI is indeed heading in the wrong direction ... but when it continues to thrive, attract new passengers while maintaining most of its repeat cruisers, and offer a product attractive to families, singles, couples, seniors (a pretty neat trick, since preferences vary so considerably amongst demographics), while satisfying its shareholders, it can only be concluded that they're doing something right.

 

Al

[ryano]

I also have to think that this announcement of no more lower prices to fill ships is just an empty "threat". The very last line in that article sums it up: Not many analysis/insiders believe it will actually pan out this way. If they keep prices in the higher range - they simply won't fill the ships.

 

If this statement by Royal gets a few people booking earlier, then the strategy has worked.

 

I am a little intrigued by his comment that the lower prices are bothersome to those who booked early. The way I look at things is that I book a cruise at a price I am willing to pay. If the price drops before final payment - I see that as a bonus! I do not count on it. Now, if the price drops after final payment, I see if I can grab an upgrade. If not.. I am still excited to be going on vacation, paying a price I was comfortable with back when I booked it.

 

In my opinion, if we worry too much about someone else getting a better deal, or having more, or being better off than then we are - will have an unfufilled life. The only time I should be worried about what's on my neighbour's plate is when he doesn't have enough, and I can help him out.

 

[insidecabin]

I also have to think that this announcement of no more lower prices to fill ships is just an empty "threat". The very last line in that article sums it up: Not many analysis/insiders believe it will actually pan out this way. If they keep prices in the higher range - they simply won't fill the ships.

 

If this statement by Royal gets a few people booking earlier, then the strategy has worked.

 

I am a little intrigued by his comment that the lower prices are bothersome to those who booked early. The way I look at things is that I book a cruise at a price I am willing to pay. If the price drops before final payment - I see that as a bonus! I do not count on it. Now, if the price drops after final payment, I see if I can grab an upgrade. If not.. I am still excited to be going on vacation, paying a price I was comfortable with back when I booked it.

 

In my opinion, if we worry too much about someone else getting a better deal, or having more, or being better off than then we are - will have an unfufilled life. The only time I should be worried about what's on my neighbour's plate is when he doesn't have enough, and I can help him out.

 

The price I think acceptable is based on history. Some itinerary ships get higher rates and sell out others always have space.

This gets adjusted for various things like friends already booked convenient dates etc.

 

My target price is the lowest I have ever seen that(similar) cruise.

Often a GTY senior or loyalty special gets us close.

 

This is the issue for cruise lines, discounting sets expectations lower.

All cruise lines have been trying to reverse this with higher prices and packaging eg X 123.

 

An example of a deal this year was Princess round Britain they ask for around $2k they come down to $1500 ,UK special past pax rate $500.

[knittinggirl]

We just returned from the Grandeur, and the food wasn't very good. We ate both formal nights in our GS because DH had broken his elbow and couldn't wear anything other than t-shirts. The tenderloin was tough and had gristle. Seemed more like a sirloin than a tenderloin. DH is planning on returning to the dining room for formal nights, because if it's that bad, we can send it back.

 

Chops still wasn't very good. I ordered the crab cake, and it was no where near as good as what I had on Legend. It looked the same, but the taste just wasn't there. It was renamed a Dungeonus and Shrimp crab cake.

 

We did like the Diamond Drink coupons loaded onto our seapass card. That's a nice change.

Edited October 29, 2014 by knittinggirl

[cruzeluvr]

Perfecto!

 

This is how we do it. Loyalty programs are designed to benefit the provider, not the consumer.

 

As with all things in life, we decide based on what we feel like and what we can comfortably afford. Any loyalty points gained have no affect on our future decisions.

 

Its a big world, with many options and we enjoy experiencing new experiences and new products. Our next vacation is a condo for 10 days in Playa Del Carmen. We use to cruise about 80% of the time we were on vacation. This has now dropped to less then 50%. Nothing to do with loyalty, but rather the decline in our experiences on ships. Those who have cruised for 25+ years probably understand what I am saying.

I understand exactly what you are saying! We have been taking 2-3 vacations each year for quite some time, with at least one cruise each year. In the planning stage, cruising used to be our first thought. Now we are looking more and more at land based vacations. While we still enjoy cruising, over the years our expectations and tastes have not really changed much, but the cruise experience has definitely declined somewhat. DW and I were actually just talking this past weekend about maybe cancelling our May 2015 Liberty of the Seas cruise and doing something else instead.

Edited October 29, 2014 by cruzeluvr

[cinnamon]

 

In my opinion, if we worry too much about someone else getting a better deal, or having more, or being better off than then we are - will have an unfufilled life. The only time I should be worried about what's on my neighbour's plate is when he doesn't have enough, and I can help him out.

 

 

Beautifully said. Thank you.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums

[Toddcan]

This is an awesome quote, is it original or did you borrow it? I may want to use it in the future.

 

Thanks

 

Louis C.K. - comedian. His stuff is VERY funny-- and very deep at the same time. Check out some of his Youtube videos.

[BamaGuy44]

If I go by the contents of the Cruise Critic boards, you would think the entire cruise industry is about to dry up and blow away.

 

Exactly, and it's never been stronger. But every week or so some announcement is made that CC declares will be the death of cruising. I get it, people here tend to be long time veteran cruisers and don't want the experience they love to change, which is understandable.

 

But the reality is RCL isn't counting on the D+ crowd to fill all these giant billion dollar ships they're building, the math just doesn't work out. 75% of Americans have never been on a cruise. Also the growing middle class in China and other Asian countries is about to make cruising explode over there. That's the market they have to tap into in order to keep growing.In business you're growing or you're dying.

 

Obviously that doesn't mean they shouldn't try to keep loyal customers happy. They will do that too, but it's a balancing act.

Edited October 29, 2014 by BamaGuy44

[postmeome]

I agree 100%. Royal has a problem with repeat cruisers - they take up too many resources. D,D+, & Pin cruisers earn less per cruise for the cruise line. The strategy back in the day was to entice us to cruise more. But, we all see the eroding benefits. But, I really think Royal is perfectly fine with this.. in fact they want to rely less upon repeat cruisers, which is why they build the newer ships geared towards the families, and the experience - likely to attract the one-off cruiser.

 

They would rather fill your berth with a one-time cruiser who likely (on averages) spends more every cruise. The trick is how to do that without the D, D+ and Pins noticing. :cool:

 

I believe we will see even more eroding of repeat cruiser perks. They will keep enough of them to make us JUST interested enough to keep coming back. Of course, statistically, that means many will leave because their acceptable/not acceptable threshold has been passed.

 

You said it all,well done

[The Viking]

As a long time shareholder for the investment purpose, I like the way they seem to be going.

As a cruiser I look forward to more interesting itiniaries,- especially overseas.

[bigque]

We get this all the time here ... the sky is falling on this-or-that cruise line; if they keep it up, they'll be out of business; you won't catch me cruising with them again; they've forgotten who brought them to where they are ... please!! They all seem to be doing pretty well these days.

 

Cruise lines are for-profit entities, and as such answer to their shareholders. The fact that their product is a vacation (as opposed to a tangible item such as an automobile or a toaster) is of little consequence. No, they're not going anywhere ... if Carnival has survived and flourished in the wake of the Costa tragedy (as well as all the negativity over ships losing power in open waters, half a passenger load becoming ill, etc.) Royal Caribbean needn't be overly concerned about the relatively few complaints over cutbacks in onboard credit when booking aboard ship.

 

With the advent of mega-ships, the industry has changed dramatically ... some believe for the worse, but the majority feel otherwise (as in 5500-passenger behemoths consistently sailing full). If we didn't like what's being offered, we wouldn't be on this forum. Add the competitive (more like cutthroat) nature among the major players, the battle to grow larger (remember the war between Carnival and RCI to acquire Princess?), the increasing cost of doing business, and the launching of new ships on a regular basis (Oasis, Allure, Quantum and Anthem over a six-year period ... that's over 20,000 more staterooms to fill each week) ... there simply needs to be a continual flow of new cruisers in the pipeline. Going after them is a prudent business decision ... Carnival has been doing it for decades.

 

The thought in the boardroom seems to be that those "loyal to Royal" passengers will continue to sail with RCI as long as the product is attractive (all components, not simply the perks) ... sure, there will be casualties along the way, but the Diamond, D+ and those Pinnacle members who spend half their lives aboard cruise ships, will, for the most part, remain onboard (pun intended). Don't look for anything resembling a mass exodus ... it's not going to happen. A cutback here and there is part of doing business these days ... but so is the development and launching of new, innovative and very attractive floating resorts. Something's gotta give somewhere. Is there any cruise line out there that regularly adds to the experience, while lowering prices and building newer, bigger and better ships? I can guarantee that there is (or has been) a thread similar to this one on the Carnival, Celebrity and NCL forums (probably all of the majors).

 

Overall, we love the Royal Caribbean product (five cruises currently booked) ... I've sailed with Princess, Celebrity, HAL, NCL, and even a few lines that are no longer in business. It's always disappointing when an amenity is reduced or eliminated ... but where else can you get this kind of experience for that kind of money? Unless you're booking the top-of-the-line accommodations, nothing comes close. So RCI is holding firm on price ... if you didn't feel comfortable paying it in the first place, why book it at all? Spending half a day at a computer looking for a price drop is at best unproductive ... sure, you'll hit one every now and then, but even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while.

 

For some, RCI is indeed heading in the wrong direction ... but when it continues to thrive, attract new passengers while maintaining most of its repeat cruisers, and offer a product attractive to families, singles, couples, seniors (a pretty neat trick, since preferences vary so considerably amongst demographics), while satisfying its shareholders, it can only be concluded that they're doing something right.

 

Al

 

[bigque]

I have not been cruising since the 70's, only since 2008. I really don't care how about how it was in the good old days because I wasn't there. I have not cruised on another line yet and not because I am "Loyal To Royal" (And there may be something better), but I simply don't want to yet as I am happy cruising on Royal. There has been nothing over the past six years that they have done that has gotten me irate enough to want to cruise with someone else. Just like the departure of the VCL....It was nice and if the don't have them anymore...then oh well, it was nice while they had it! Have I always been happy with evertything on every cruise like food (I have not left a cruise hungry yet), etc....No, but as I said their has been nothing yet for me to say...."I'm Leaving" :cool:

[jewopaho]

But the reality is RCL isn't counting on the D+ crowd to fill all these giant billion dollar ships they're building, the math just doesn't work out. 75% of Americans have never been on a cruise. Also the growing middle class in China and other Asian countries is about to make cruising explode over there. That's the market they have to tap into in order to keep growing. In business you're growing or you're dying.

Exactly ... this is my major contention, but you expressed it much better. Many veteran cruisers shy away from those Monsters of the Seas anyway ... and the newer ships are built with families and an overall younger demographic in mind.

 

Excellent point about the Asian market ... much the same as Europe a few years back. RCI has already positioned ships in the area (as well as the Australia/South Pacific region) year-round. The competition (particularly Princess) is already there, as well.

 

I've owned several businesses over the years, and the models always emphasized continual growth, even though they were profitable as they stood. I did what I did to both attract additional customers and maintain the established clientele ... much like RCI, but on an infinitesimal scale. The principles are the same ... size doesn't matter here.

 

Great comments ... thanks for posting.

 

Al

[pcur]

Exactly ... this is my major contention, but you expressed it much better. Many veteran cruisers shy away from those Monsters of the Seas anyway ... and the newer ships are built with families and an overall younger demographic in mind.

 

Excellent point about the Asian market ... much the same as Europe a few years back. RCI has already positioned ships in the area (as well as the Australia/South Pacific region) year-round. The competition (particularly Princess) is already there, as well.

 

I've owned several businesses over the years, and the models always emphasized continual growth, even though they were profitable as they stood. I did what I did to both attract additional customers and maintain the established clientele ... much like RCI, but on an infinitesimal scale. The principles are the same ... size doesn't matter here.

 

Great comments ... thanks for posting.

 

Al

 

I think you and BamaGuy44 need to look at the statistics before you decide. While I agree about the Asian markets, which is what RCCL did in Australia, I think you two are wrong about C&A members. Since there are now 9 - 10 million members, I think they make up a large customer base of repeat cruisers. Also, the 20,000+ D, D+, and Pinnacle members are the ones who cruise more often, and we DO cruise on the Oasis, Allure, and the new Quantum class ships. That's why they invite the Pinnacle members to the inaugural sailings.

 

Older cruisers actually go on the larger ships because there is more room to spread people around, and if we don't want to be around a lot of young children, there are plenty of places to go.

 

I mean, seriously, the people that have the time to cruise and enjoy doing so, are indeed the ones who fill up the ships. We bring future cruisers with us, too. We are about to sail our third family cruise in December.

 

I can tell you from personal experience that the repostitioning and transatlantics are mostly retired people, and we are going on our 4th next year. Those cruises end up with 400 - 500 D, D+, and P's.

 

Maybe the bread-and-butter cruises (my phrase) sailing from Florida are full of younger families, but the Australian, South Seas, Transatlantics, repositioning, and South America cruises are full of retired people who have the time to go on these longer cruises. Actually, I'll guess that Princess and HAL get more business from this demographic because they offer longer itineraries.

Edited October 29, 2014 by pcur

[Tutankhamen]

I understand exactly what you are saying! We have been taking 2-3 vacations each year for quite some time, with at least one cruise each year. In the planning stage, cruising used to be our first thought. Now we are looking more and more at land based vacations. While we still enjoy cruising, over the years our expectations and tastes have not really changed much, but the cruise experience has definitely declined somewhat. DW and I were actually just talking this past weekend about maybe cancelling our May 2015 Liberty of the Seas cruise and doing something else instead.

 

 

2 peas in a pod. We also do between 2-3 vacations a year, dependent on length. I am glad many enjoy the cruises as they are today. I am not to much into the all inclusive gated compounds that are frequented. I never thought I would enjoy renting villas and condos, but we have been really enjoying this type of vacation. The condo we have reserved comes with daily maid service, a chef that comes and cooks once a day (lunch or dinner based on our needs) plenty of space and beachfront. For a family of 6, it is about the same price of a cruise. Still miss the cruises of the years passed.

 

As far as the departure of the VCL, I am sad to see it not included on the new ships. I remember venturing out onto the deck of the Nordic Prince in a storm off the coast of Cape Hatteras heading towards Bermuda. Winds were blowing, sea spray was in the air, ship was rocking as we navigated our way up the exterior stairs to the Crown lounge. I can still feel the shutters, the rocking, hearing the creeks of the lounge and winds howling as the door opened to other guests brave enough to venture up top as the ship steamed towards Bermuda. Beautiful place to be at that moment. We also always met there as the ship departed from ports. Great memories.

Edited October 29, 2014 by Tutankhamen

[grandmarnnurse]

Same here. The only thing that has me skeptical right now is Dynamic Dining. I certainly will try it and at that time I'll judge it. However, if it kills service on RCI like Freestyle killed service on NCL, my preference will certainly be focused elsewhere...most likely Celebrity.

 

At least that'll still keep the shareholders happy. ;)

 

I am sailing the Oasis in Feb 2015, and was very nervous about what was happening in dry dock--mostly with Dynamic Dining--but was relieved to hear it wasn't starting until March 2015. I have always loved the service of the Main Dining Room, and I had fears that the personal service that comes with having the same waiter and assistant waiter every evening would disappear. Not to mention, I am traveling with other family members on this cruise that includes teenagers. I was not sure they would all want to eat where I wanted to eat (more formal restaurant), and I would be stuck eating in the same venue (American Grill) every night--without the chance to sample some great items that I don't usually get at home. If it was just my husband and myself, I wouldn't mind it as much. So I am much relieved.

I had been following the posts from those on the TA of the Oasis, and certaintly hope all the issues they encountered will be resolved by February.

Last year was our first on a RCCL ship (Independence of the Seas) and loved it! All our previous experiences have been mostly on Carnival, so we were pleased with everything on the Independence and suggested it to other family members. I hope this coming sailing will be as pleasant as the last.

[akcruz]

 

I can tell you from personal experience that the repostitioning and transatlantics are mostly retired people, and we are going on our 4th next year. Those cruises end up with 400 - 500 D, D+, and P's.

 

Maybe the bread-and-butter cruises (my phrase) sailing from Florida are full of younger families, but the Australian, South Seas, Transatlantics, repositioning, and South America cruises are full of retired people who have the time to go on these longer cruises. Actually, I'll guess that Princess and HAL get more business from this demographic because they offer longer itineraries.

 

I have not priced them out myself, but have heard that most of the TAs are very reasonably priced.

 

Those bread and butter cruises on the big ships are the ones commanding the higher prices consistently.

 

If you had a choice of taking new cruisers on pricey cruise or loyalty members on a discount cruise which do you think the company is going to go for.

 

Unfortunately I think most here are correct, yes they do want some loyal cruisers, but the big bucks, and where they are catering to, come from the newbies.

 

What will be interesting to see is all the young Diamond and up members (which there are a lot more of due to inherited benefits as well as starting to cruise younger) that start to bring their families on cruises. Which way will they go??

Edited October 29, 2014 by akcruz

[BamaGuy44]

I think you and BamaGuy44 need to look at the statistics before you decide. While I agree about the Asian markets, which is what RCCL did in Australia, I think you two are wrong about C&A members. Since there are now 9 - 10 million members, I think they make up a large customer base of repeat cruisers. Also, the 20,000+ D, D+, and Pinnacle members are the ones who cruise more often, and we DO cruise on the Oasis, Allure, and the new Quantum class ships. That's why they invite the Pinnacle members to the inaugural sailings.

 

Like I said it's a balance. Nobody is saying the loyal customers aren't important. But they're not the key to growth, new and younger cruisers are. That's not me saying it, it's easy to see which markets they are going after, and how there is less and less emphasis on loyalty perks.

 

20,000 is a lot of people but it's not a big percentage of their passenger base. They will have 20 million+ passengers this year and that's without the Quantums or Oasis 3 sailing yet. So that's 0.01%.

 

Percentage is not exact due to people taking multiple cruises, etc but you get the idea. Even if all 20,000 take 5 cruises a year you're not even up to one half of one percent.