Those "service" animals

[beachbum53]

So the dog appears to be optional. Why go to the trouble? Leave the dog at home and push the wheelchair

 

There are several comments that I could make to this statement, but they would most likely get deleted and would bring about a severe reprimand from the moderators. So I'll just say this. Be happy that you (and hopefully all in your family) have no disabilities (physical or mental) that prohibit you from having a normal life. Please be understanding and kind to those that do have needs, whether it be with the assistance of another human or a service animal.

[beachbum53]

As denas says, the only thing the cruise line can ask, under the law, is what task the animal is trained to perform. Further, there is no national or state registry for service animals, nor is there any standards for their training. This is why you can go online and get a certificate for your dog for $40, just for applying.

 

 

Perhaps someone can go on line and get some sort of certificate for $40.00. However, according to what denas has shared, it takes far more than that to not only be able to take a service dog on a cruise ship, but also to be able to take that dog into different ports.

[cruisejunkie76]

the sad thing is, that it needs to be proofed because of People just wanting to take their pets.

 

I worked for an Airline and we sometimes had People that needed to fly out the next day due to a death in the Family. They would get those rules banded that for cheaper tickets you need to book early (eg 21 days prior or so)

Unfortunately we had to ask them for proof of the death or a medical note saying the sick Person is in Hospital and is dying.

It's very hard to "demand" such a thing, but you have those people that just use every line to get something cheaper etc and the Persons that really has a reason has to "suffer"

 

that get me really mad sometimes :mad:

[chengkp75]

Perhaps someone can go on line and get some sort of certificate for $40.00. However, according to what denas has shared, it takes far more than that to not only be able to take a service dog on a cruise ship, but also to be able to take that dog into different ports.

 

Absolutely correct, but those who "can't be without Poopsie" will go to the trouble of getting the clearances. My point was that asking people to "prove" their animal is a service animal is basically illegal, but difficult to disprove since anyone can come up with documentation. I have no problems at all with true service animals (I've even had to put up with a service capuchin monkey), even those for "non-visible" disabilities. ESA's and pets are what bother me, and there are a lot of them. Any animal you see being fed from the table is not a service animal.

 

I know how hard it is to get one onboard, and I know how difficult it is to get the shoreside staff to actually prepare the ship for the animal. We were told the morning of embarkation that a service dog would be on for the next cruise, but they did not pass along the information that the dog had been trained only to use kitty litter. We normally provided shredded newspaper, and so the poor animal had a hard night until we could get to WalMart the next day to get litter.

[denas]

How about a service kangaroo? Not kidding, this really happened. http://www.wisn.com/news/woman-brings-kangaroo-into-beaver-dam-mcdonalds/31070566

 

Beaver Dam has now had to make a law that states kangaroos are not service animals.

 

The US Federal Law already states that the only service animals allowed access under the ADA are dogs and miniature horses. And before you wonder about miniature horses, it is because these are very trainable and the size of a large dog and live about 25 years. They are generally only used as guide-animals for the blind. Training a guide dog takes 3 years and they usually retire at about 9-10 so you only get about 6-7 years of service for about $40,000 investment. An animal that can live provide 20 years of service is a much more cost-effective investment.

[denas]

So the dog appears to be optional. Why go to the trouble? Leave the dog at home and push the wheelchair

 

1. Walking is considered a pretty basic access right. Kind of like talking and replying to comments on the internet. How would you like it if someone said, "fine you can go on a cruise, but we are taking away your shoes because you can hobble barefoot or be pushed in a wheelchair and I don't like your shoes." By stating that you think it is OK to not have the tools my son uses to safely walk because he could just be pushed around in a wheel chair is incredibly offensive.

 

2. Wheelchairs don't go well on the beach and they don't make pediatric beach wheel chairs. We end up carrying the chair which weighs 50 pounds and the child who also ways 50 pounds.

 

3. Wheelchairs require special access. I am sure you are one of those first in line complaining about the 15-minute hold up when they need to provide special lifts to get my son and his wheelchair on the tender boats or people have to stand up and move and push chairs to get the wheelchair to the table in the MDR.

 

4. Seizure alert dogs sleep with the child. She barks when there is a seizure to wake us up. Without the dog, we sleep right next to him with a hand on him at all times hoping to wake up with the seizure. We also set alarms every couple of hours throughout the night to wake up and check for seizures periodically. An undetected seizure can be life-threatening.

 

We can do all of these things. This is what we did before we got the service dog. But it is a pretty basic right of an individual to walk places, enjoy the ports on a vacation, and sleep uninterrupted in their own beds. This is what the dog allows. If we choose not to bring her, it puts us back in the situation where we were before we had the dog which is an "option" as you stated, but is certainly not an easy option to take. I really wouldn't dismiss it so lightly. Your worry about having to walk around a litter box or see a dog under a chair by the pool are pretty minuscule disruptions to your vacation compared to the disruptions to my vacation by not bringing the dog.

[denas]

Absolutely correct, but those who "can't be without Poopsie" will go to the trouble of getting the clearances. My point was that asking people to "prove" their animal is a service animal is basically illegal, but difficult to disprove since anyone can come up with documentation. I have no problems at all with true service animals (I've even had to put up with a service capuchin monkey), even those for "non-visible" disabilities. ESA's and pets are what bother me, and there are a lot of them. Any animal you see being fed from the table is not a service animal.

 

I know how hard it is to get one onboard, and I know how difficult it is to get the shoreside staff to actually prepare the ship for the animal. We were told the morning of embarkation that a service dog would be on for the next cruise, but they did not pass along the information that the dog had been trained only to use kitty litter. We normally provided shredded newspaper, and so the poor animal had a hard night until we could get to WalMart the next day to get litter.

 

I know a lot of people with service animals wish there actually was some type of registration process! I also wouldn't mind if the cruiselines required a doctor's signature to reserve an HC accessible room. They can't ask the nature of the disability, but all a doctor would be stating is that this person requires a HC accessible room because of a disability. This is required to get a DMV handicap placard. Too many people just check that block as well so they can have a "bigger" room. Those rooms are really hard to get for an actual need.

[NLH Arizona]

Why is this such a concern? Is someone jealous because they can't bring their own fur baby on a cruise?

Well one concern was on a Celebrity tread where they said they were on a cruise and a couple had their two poser service dogs who pooped in public areas and the couple wouldn't even clean up after them. True service animals are highly trained, they don't get fed at a table, don't sit on chairs, don't growl or bark at other dogs or people and help their owners do everyday tasks and live an independent life because of them. Poser service animals, give these true heroes a bad name, because of some of their behavior. Not to mention it is against the law in some states to lie and say little fluffy is a service dog.

[NLH Arizona]

So the dog appears to be optional. Why go to the trouble? Leave the dog at home and push the wheelchair

So the person can be as independent as you are on your cruises.

[slidergirl]

I can only imagine the issues surrounding dogs (true service and "ESAs") on a ship. It is difficult enough to manage in a hotel. It always seems that the ESAs that I see at the hotel are the little "rat dogs" and yip all the time. We allow all dogs at our hotel, but we charge a $150 charge for a non-service animal. People will trot up their little baby, all dolled up in "service animal" harnesses and vests and demand we can't charge them. The ones with true service animals are notably low-key and have already pre-arranged accommodation for their animals. We've even hosted a couple groups with service dogs-in-training so that they could get their animals acquainted with hotel life.

To me, people with the ESAs and demanding accommodation on a ship are no different than those people who are morbidly obese by their own hand, not disabled and clog up the hallways and run us all down with their scooters...

[spookwife]

I am sure that they validate to the fullest extent that the law allows, which isn't much when all is said and done. As long as the animal is well behaved and unobtrusive I don't care.

 

 

a True SA would be. most ESAs and pets are NOT but still get treated as SA due to ignorance and deception.

 

that is what most people have issue with. most vocal are those who HAVE SA and have had to deal with negative repercussions because of abuse

[spookwife]

The US Federal Law already states that the only service animals allowed access under the ADA are dogs and miniature horses. And before you wonder about miniature horses, it is because these are very trainable and the size of a large dog and live about 25 years. They are generally only used as guide-animals for the blind. Training a guide dog takes 3 years and they usually retire at about 9-10 so you only get about 6-7 years of service for about $40,000 investment. An animal that can live provide 20 years of service is a much more cost-effective investment.

 

 

Capuchin must be on the list too, or were they removed for some reason? I have a friend who is a Quadraplegic who has one, and she does pretty much EVERYTHING, to include feeding him simple things like a peeled banana. far more versatile than a dog or mini horse would be.

[Morisnfan]

I don't mind seeing service animals on board, but on a previous cruise, we saw an older woman with her large service dog (with a vest) in the loud, smokey casino. This broke my heart, as an animal lover, I feel it's just cruel to put a dog in such a situation. A little off topic, but I feel the same about dogs in the fragrance area of Nordstrom, Macy's, etc.[emoji17]

[realtrip]

Because the goal of every person with a disability is to live as independent and normal a life as possible. Yes, a wheelchair could be used full time. However it is never the goal to take a step backwards.

 

Also, if this is a seizure detection dog and that seizure happened at night, the ability of that dog to alert for the seizure could prevent the patient dying.

 

This!

[sail7seas]

In this politically correct, litigious society which exists today, if a guest can produce documents that certify their animal is a service animal, how many cruise ship crew are going to argue the point? They are not going to research if they got those documents from one of those on line sites people use or their real 'need' for the animal. We have only been aware maybe four times of a service dog being aboard. I wouldn't begin to guess the necessary aid they provided,,,,, or not.

 

[realtrip]

There are several comments that I could make to this statement, but they would most likely get deleted and would bring about a severe reprimand from the moderators. So I'll just say this. Be happy that you (and hopefully all in your family) have no disabilities (physical or mental) that prohibit you from having a normal life. Please be understanding and kind to those that do have needs, whether it be with the assistance of another human or a service animal.

Thank you for putting so politely as quite unable to formulate such a nice response:mad:

[denas]

Capuchin must be on the list too, or were they removed for some reason? I have a friend who is a Quadraplegic who has one, and she does pretty much EVERYTHING, to include feeding him simple things like a peeled banana. far more versatile than a dog or mini horse would be.

 

Actually, they are NOT covered under the revised ADA (2011). Only dogs and miniature horses. This doesn't mean that there aren't service monkeys, because there are. However, there are restrictions on importing primates. What the ADA does is provide access. It basically means that any place open to the public is required to provide access to service animals that are either dogs or miniature horses and are task-trained to provide a service to a person with a disability. Businesses can turn away other types of animals, even if they are service animals, and all emotional support animals. Businesses can also kick-out service dogs who are aggressive, bark for no reason (not medical alert barking, just other barking) or who defecate in public.

[sparks1093]

Actually, they are NOT covered under the revised ADA (2011). Only dogs and miniature horses. This doesn't mean that there aren't service monkeys, because there are. However, there are restrictions on importing primates. What the ADA does is provide access. It basically means that any place open to the public is required to provide access to service animals that are either dogs or miniature horses and are task-trained to provide a service to a person with a disability. Businesses can turn away other types of animals, even if they are service animals, and all emotional support animals. Businesses can also kick-out service dogs who are aggressive, bark for no reason (not medical alert barking, just other barking) or who defecate in public.

 

Far easier for the business to ignore it rather than risk the expensive law suit. I don't think there is an easy answer (well, the easy answer is for people not to take advantage of laws but I mean an easy answer that means enforcement). I know the issue ticks a lot of people off but I'd rather see some people get away with it than for one bona fide user of a service animal to be hassled. In any event I am not in a position to address this when I am onboard so what choice do I have?

[galensgrl]

1. Walking is considered a pretty basic access right. Kind of like talking and replying to comments on the internet. How would you like it if someone said, "fine you can go on a cruise, but we are taking away your shoes because you can hobble barefoot or be pushed in a wheelchair and I don't like your shoes." By stating that you think it is OK to not have the tools my son uses to safely walk because he could just be pushed around in a wheel chair is incredibly offensive.

 

2. Wheelchairs don't go well on the beach and they don't make pediatric beach wheel chairs. We end up carrying the chair which weighs 50 pounds and the child who also ways 50 pounds.

 

3. Wheelchairs require special access. I am sure you are one of those first in line complaining about the 15-minute hold up when they need to provide special lifts to get my son and his wheelchair on the tender boats or people have to stand up and move and push chairs to get the wheelchair to the table in the MDR.

 

4. Seizure alert dogs sleep with the child. She barks when there is a seizure to wake us up. Without the dog, we sleep right next to him with a hand on him at all times hoping to wake up with the seizure. We also set alarms every couple of hours throughout the night to wake up and check for seizures periodically. An undetected seizure can be life-threatening.

 

We can do all of these things. This is what we did before we got the service dog. But it is a pretty basic right of an individual to walk places, enjoy the ports on a vacation, and sleep uninterrupted in their own beds. This is what the dog allows. If we choose not to bring her, it puts us back in the situation where we were before we had the dog which is an "option" as you stated, but is certainly not an easy option to take. I really wouldn't dismiss it so lightly. Your worry about having to walk around a litter box or see a dog under a chair by the pool are pretty minuscule disruptions to your vacation compared to the disruptions to my vacation by not bringing the dog.

 

Sounds like your son NEEDS his dog to keep him safe and alive as well as having a guide to help him get around. I would say having her is not an option for your family, she is a need. It's a good thing your son, and you as parents, have her to rely on. It's unfortunate anyone would put you in the position of having to defend your son's disability. I hope your cruise goes smoothly and that everyone stays safe and happy. Cheers.

Edited March 16, 2016 by galensgrl

[cbr663]

It's not a huge concern. Just a topic for discussion. I have my doubts if CCL really checks to see due to the sensitive nature of the issues. God forbid someone might get offended

 

So the dog appears to be optional. Why go to the trouble? Leave the dog at home and push the wheelchair

 

Seems to me that the intent here is to flame.

[GUT2407]

There are several comments that I could make to this statement, but they would most likely get deleted and would bring about a severe reprimand from the moderators. So I'll just say this. Be happy that you (and hopefully all in your family) have no disabilities (physical or mental) that prohibit you from having a normal life. Please be understanding and kind to those that do have needs, whether it be with the assistance of another human or a service animal.

 

Thank you.

 

Because until I read this response I was going to say what I suspect you were thinking.

[Ashland]

My son has a service animal. Carnival asks us to state the tasks the animal is trained to provide. This is what the law states. My son's dog provides seizure alert and mobility assistance. That is what we tell them. This is where people who don't have a true service animal usually get caught as "she provides emotional support" or "he just keeps me from being anxious" are not trained tasks.

 

Emotional support animals are not covered under the ADA as they are not task-trained for a disability. However, there are service dogs who are task trained for PTSD and autism so the commenter who lumped emotional support animals with those task-trained to assist with anxiety or behavior disruption caused by PTSD is not correct. The organization we worked with that provided my son's dog also provides both autism-assistance dogs to children and PTSD dogs to Veterans. These dogs can assist with ensuring adults take medication on time, sense an anxiety attack and use several trained techniques to help the child/adult cope with the anxiety, and provide other task-trained services depending upon the scope and nature of the disability.

 

Travelling with a trained service dog is still difficult. My son's dog has been trained since birth to deal with being in public. She goes to school with him everyday so she rides the school bus and is in an elementary school so used to dealing with LOTS of kids. She also does restaurants and malls just fine. She is trained to go potty on command and is trained to use small litter boxes. But the crowd on a ship is a challenge for even an experienced, well-trained service dog. Someone's pet is going to have a really tough time.

 

Those of us with trained service dogs would love for people to not try and pass your pet off as a service dog. It is a huge problem as an untrained dog can be a danger to my son's service dog in public (service dogs have been bitten by untrained dogs) and leave a bad impressions. Unless someone sees us walk in or out, they seldom know our dog is present (she lays under a table in a restaurant or under a seat in a theater/plane completely out of the way and doesn't eat food off the ground or sniff people or do anything else that calls attention to her. She only barks if she is alerting to a seizure or my son is eloping. We had to have a doctor's prescription certifying a disability and need, references and interviews to verify that we were capable of handling a dog, fund raised over $13,000 dollars to cover part of the cost of dog training (it costs anywhere from $25-40,000 to train a service dog), and had to cover travel expenses and hotel costs to spend 14 days to be trained as a service dog handler to bring our dog home. We are re-certified annually. It is a very long, expensive process but worth it if a service dog can provide a person with a disability the opportunity to have a more "normal" life. However, it is frustrating to go through all of that and see someone pass off a pet as a service dog simply because they don't want to leave Fluffy home.

Do you need to supply any documentation to the cruiseline when you make a booking ?

[MicCanberra]

I am sure that they validate to the fullest extent that the law allows, which isn't much when all is said and done. As long as the animal is well behaved and unobtrusive I don't care.

 

Agreed. None of my concern unless it affects my cruise.

[MCC retired]

You can buy a "Emotional Support Dog Kit" from $79 on the internet .

No proof of need required .

Usdogregistry.org

Seems easy to bring Fido with you anywhere now ?

[Ashland]

You can buy a "Emotional Support Dog Kit" from $79 on the internet .

No proof of need required .

Usdogregistry.org

Seems easy to bring Fido with you anywhere now ?

 

Sad abuse :(