AZ Upgrade Program - NEW - effective 3/12/19!!

[uktog]

11 minutes ago, hiccups said:

I would be very surprised if they release any information on the algorithm/multiplier.  That would just open up another can of worms.

I agree the specifics would never be released but it would help to know answers to the general parameters eg is a weighting applied to a bid or are offers tailored by loyalty or what 

Edited March 13, 2019 by uktog

[manc]

We have just been asked to bid for an upgrade on 10th April sailing - cheaprsr suggested is £1000 each. We are on the previous cruise and had submitted a request for a LCV upgrade when we booked and weren't successful as Discoverer Plus. How will there be any greater transparency with the new system as to how LCV membership is taken unto account? 

[BBMacLaird]

11 minutes ago, uktog said:

Thanks 

Disappointed issues like that hadn't been thought about before launch - kind of smacks of big corporate brother who did not understand azamara ships and their peculiarities.

I am still uncomfortable about this blind bidding and need to understand a little more about this multiplier.

 

Hi Ann, I don't have any specifics on the multiplier, aka the specific weight given to the various tiers. No one has shared this with me. And as Hiccups mentions, I too would be surprised if they ever shared it with me. This is because nothing is static in the world of pricing. I'm sure the formulas will be fine-tuned as more data comes in over time.

To complicate matters, I'd be surprised if LCV tier is the only variable being built into the algorithm. If it were me (as an ex-revenue manager in my youth) I'd build in other variables, such as how many upgrades received in the past, how regularly a guest has cruised in recent years, and a few more variables I'll just dream about. 

[BBMacLaird]

15 minutes ago, hiccups said:

The other unknown is something I mentioned earlier, which is when the upgrades are awarded, and whether the earlier bids get priority.  Will the bids just "pile up" and all be considered on the same day?  Perhaps bid date is also assigned a multiplier.

The old system might have been labor intensive, but was easier for me to understand.  Fill out your upgrade form as soon as you book, and hope your date of application, coupled with your LCV status, will get you the offer of an upgrade.

 

Upgrades will begin being awarded at 60-days prior to sailing. 

As I just mentioned, I am sure there are other variables besides LCV tier in the mix, and date of request certainly ought to be one of them. 

 

PS. It's now 1:30p in CA. I will catch up with you all after lunch. 

Edited March 13, 2019 by BBMacLaird
OOO - lunch

[uktog]

21 minutes ago, BBMacLaird said:

Hi Ann, I don't have any specifics on the multiplier, aka the specific weight given to the various tiers. No one has shared this with me. And as Hiccups mentions, I too would be surprised if they ever shared it with me. This is because nothing is static in the world of pricing. I'm sure the formulas will be fine-tuned as more data comes in over time.

To complicate matters, I'd be surprised if LCV tier is the only variable being built into the algorithm. If it were me (as an ex-revenue manager in my youth) I'd build in other variables, such as how many upgrades received in the past, how regularly a guest has cruised in recent years, and a few more variables I'll just dream about. 

Thanks, fully understand.

Trouble with all these variables is there are unknowns not factored in that can make it feel even less fair.  Anyway I still remain uncomfortable with the whole process and will not be bidding at present for our upcoming cruises.  

[excitedofharpenden]

30 minutes ago, manc said:

We have just been asked to bid for an upgrade on 10th April sailing - cheapest suggested is £1000 each. We are on the previous cruise and had submitted a request for a LCV upgrade when we booked and weren't successful as Discoverer Plus. How will there be any greater transparency with the new system as to how LCV membership is taken unto account? 

 

I’d be interested to know between which two categories?

 

Phil

[AllisonJames]

Bonnie -- if you can please clarify (and apologies if this has already been answered but I just don't have time to read through the entire six pages of postings right now) --I submitted an upgrade request 20 months ago for my July 17, 2019 cruise.  Final payment is due in a few days (I think -- already made the payment so not exactly sure).  So after that final payment date I have to resubmit my upgrade request if I want to be eligible to receive an upgrade for this upcoming cruise?

[marinaro44]

28 minutes ago, excitedofharpenden said:

 

I’d be interested to know between which two categories?

 

Phil

In our one opportunity 🙄, $370 per person was minimum bid to upgrade from Club Ocean to Club World.  That, of course, was a "Weak" bid.  To get to "Fair" I would have to go to $640; to "Strong" needed $800, or $1600 total. On the website it's $2400 more for two in a Club World. 

Edited March 13, 2019 by marinaro44

[excitedofharpenden]

57 minutes ago, marinaro44 said:

In our one opportunity 🙄, $370 per person was minimum bid to upgrade from Club Ocean to Club World.  That, of course, was a "Weak" bid.  To get to "Fair" I would have to go to $640; to "Strong" needed $800, or $1600 total. On the website it's $2400 more for two in a Club World. 

Yikes.  I upgraded from a CC to a CW for $1900 total.  Secured with a particular cabin number.  It’s as I thought.  I’m guessing those big suites will be in the Bingo prize draw more often.  Unless they can successfully sell them off to consiladotors.  And that kind of discounts the other cabin category, which I don’t want to do.  Just a bellwether.  

 

Phil

[BBMacLaird]

1 hour ago, AllisonJames said:

Bonnie -- if you can please clarify (and apologies if this has already been answered but I just don't have time to read through the entire six pages of postings right now) --I submitted an upgrade request 20 months ago for my July 17, 2019 cruise.  Final payment is due in a few days (I think -- already made the payment so not exactly sure).  So after that final payment date I have to resubmit my upgrade request if I want to be eligible to receive an upgrade for this upcoming cruise?

Yes, that is correct. Once Final Payment has been made, typically 90-85 days out, you will be most likely eligible to bid on an upgrade. 

[aussie travel bird]

2 hours ago, excitedofharpenden said:

Yikes.  I upgraded from a CC to a CW for $1900 total.  Secured with a particular cabin number.  It’s as I thought.  I’m guessing those big suites will be in the Bingo prize draw more often.  Unless they can successfully sell them off to consiladotors.  And that kind of discounts the other cabin category, which I don’t want to do.  Just a bellwether.  

 

Phil

Phil is that for next week? I thought bidding was for cruises after April 1? With limited internet and being on the ship I can’t cope with this rapidly progressing thread and no answers onboard. I’m stressed and this is ruining my cruise worrying about my upcoming ones where I clearly booked early and registered for the upgrade using the old system. This isn’t how my Azamara holiday should be.....

Edited March 14, 2019 by aussie travel bird

[excitedofharpenden]

5 hours ago, aussie travel bird said:

Phil is that for next week? I thought bidding was for cruises after April 1? With limited internet and being on the ship I can’t cope with this rapidly progressing thread and no answers onboard. I’m stressed and this is ruining my cruise worrying about my upcoming ones where I clearly booked early and registered for the upgrade using the old system. This isn’t how my Azamara holiday should be.....

No, that was another cruise under the old terms. There hasn't been an opportunity on next week's cruise as all the categories sold out very suddenly. The cabins were most probably dumped on certain travel agencies. One of which I know packages flights with the cabin. 

 

Phil 

Edited March 14, 2019 by excitedofharpenden

[Grandma Cruising]

A couple of thoughts.

Firstly I wonder what proportion of cruisers apply for upgrades, and whether the new process will increase or decrease the numbers. I guess time will tell.

Secondly we book the stateroom that we are happy to be in. If we apply/bid for a higher level and get it, it’s a bonus (we’ve had one upgrade from 6 applications) - though possibly less of a bonus now you don’t get the chance to say no if you don’t like the location of the upgraded stateroom. Certainly the option to specify tub/shower etc would improve the appeal.

[Bloodaxe]

32 minutes ago, Host Grandma Cruising said:

A couple of thoughts.

Firstly I wonder what proportion of cruisers apply for upgrades, and whether the new process will increase or decrease the numbers. I guess time will tell.

Secondly we book the stateroom that we are happy to be in. If we apply/bid for a higher level and get it, it’s a bonus (we’ve had one upgrade from 6 applications) - though possibly less of a bonus now you don’t get the chance to say no if you don’t like the location of the upgraded stateroom. Certainly the option to specify tub/shower etc would improve the appeal.

 

I agree, we have always booked the cabin we are happy with and value being able to choose the location.

No interest in this new upgrade system at all, in fact sorry to say that Azamara rapidly falling out of our favour altogether.

After sailing with them almost from the beginning we have only one more booking and that could be the last.

Edited March 14, 2019 by Bloodaxe

[uktog]

I would never book anything I wouldn’t be happy staying in so whilst the change wouldn’t spoil a cruise for me just now it might influence (adversely) a future booking. 

The reason for that is the new scheme doesn’t fit with how I like to work with businesses at all  (my choice I accept) therefore the value to me today in staying loyal has been further reduced. 

However as I’m not about to make any more booking decisions I can revisit my thinking on whether I still want to be loyal down the line. 

[gymfreak]

I think I am beginning to get the gist of this new system in terms of process but do have a question 

Some people have reported on their experience of bidding and the use of ‘sliders’ which indicate if their bid is from weak to strong. 

My question is on any particular cruise is the slider gerneric for all bidders or does it provide specific information according to your loyalty level as to the strength of your bid? 

For example

person A on Explorer bids $500

person B on Discoverer plus Bids $500

As we are unaware of the multipliers will the slider indicate that person B’s bid is for sake of argument strong whereas personA’s is weak?

This would seem a much fairer system to those loyal guests and you would know more clearly where to pitch your bid 

 

 

[excitedofharpenden]

8 hours ago, aussie travel bird said:

Phil is that for next week? I thought bidding was for cruises after April 1? With limited internet and being on the ship I can’t cope with this rapidly progressing thread and no answers onboard. I’m stressed and this is ruining my cruise worrying about my upcoming ones where I clearly booked early and registered for the upgrade using the old system. This isn’t how my Azamara holiday should be.....

Honestly Jenny, it is NOT worth stressing over on your cruise. Whilst the changes appear to be bad news, I have always considered the upgrade as a bonus.  As uktog, I wouldn’t book a cabin that ultimately I wouldn’t be happy with.  My concern now is the price of the upgrades if they are available and particularly the lack of control over where I might be moved to if successful.  

 

I’ve two future bookings made in January, registered for upgrades under the old scheme at the time I booked.  I will just see what happens, but at the end of the day I am happy with the cabin and location I’ve picked.  

 

I guess it’s the spin about it here and the total lack of information on HOW the system assesses upgrades that I find most frustrating.  I’m still none the wiser.  The system throws up more questions than it answers.

 

Phil

Edited March 14, 2019 by excitedofharpenden

[excitedofharpenden]

28 minutes ago, gymfreak said:

I think I am beginning to get the gist of this new system in terms of process but do have a question 

Some people have reported on their experience of bidding and the use of ‘sliders’ which indicate if their bid is from weak to strong. 

My question is on any particular cruise is the slider gerneric for all bidders or does it provide specific information according to your loyalty level as to the strength of your bid? 

For example

person A on Explorer bids $500

person B on Discoverer plus Bids $500

As we are unaware of the multipliers will the slider indicate that person B’s bid is for sake of argument strong whereas personA’s is weak?

This would seem a much fairer system to those loyal guests and you would know more clearly where to pitch your bid 

 

 

Vicki, although it’s hard to tell with so many questions on this new program, I’d say that yes.  If you are at a higher loyalty level then your bid for strong will at a lower point on the monetary scale.  What I’m still not sure of is if you are say Explorer and upped your bid to $600 would you then stand a better chance of an upgrade than the Discoverer Plus who leaves theirs at $500?

 

Phil

[combine]

We have a lot to learn.......! I have just glanced at the Royal Caribbean boards regarding their ‘Royal Up’ bids for upgrades and there are over 1600 posts since November 2018 on this same subject and  people are still unsure of how it works!

[Lottie A]

18 minutes ago, uktog said:

I would never book anything I wouldn’t be happy staying in so whilst the change wouldn’t spoil a cruise for me just now it might influence (adversely) a future booking. 

The reason for that is the new scheme doesn’t fit with how I like to work with businesses at all  (my choice I accept) therefore the value to me today in staying loyal has been further reduced. 

However as I’m not about to make any more booking decisions I can revisit my thinking on whether I still want to be loyal down the line. 

I agree Ann. I always book the cabin grade I am happy with. However, I have been very lucky in the past with the $398 upgrades and have appreciated them. We had the opportunity to know the cabin position and whether we had a bath tub or a shower and this played a big part in whether we should accept the upgrade. 

 

 This business model to profit by bidding against others for a cabin upgrade is very distasteful to me. I won't be taking part in it ....maybe it's a British thing? My past loyalty to Azamara and money spent with them since 2010 versus an extra $10 bid from a newbie?  I think I know which bid will win in the new Azamara business plan. It certainly affects my loyalty to Azamara.

 

I have just booked a May cruise on Pursuit with friends but I would normally have at least three Azamara cruises booked. I have future cruises booked with Saga on their new ship, Silversea and Viking. Looking at a cruise on Crystal to see the much missed Russ as well.

 I certainly won't be booking Azamara cruises a year out now, particularly as it seems that the cruises aren't selling out and there are late deals available. Probably due to the big increase in fares. I have had another two emails this morning with reductions in fares for cruises in the Summer and more cruises added to the Sail and Save deal. The onboard experience is still wonderful due to the stellar crew but they can't carry everything. 

[nordski]

1 hour ago, Host Grandma Cruising said:

A couple of thoughts.

Firstly I wonder what proportion of cruisers apply for upgrades, and whether the new process will increase or decrease the numbers. I guess time will tell.

Secondly we book the stateroom that we are happy to be in. If we apply/bid for a higher level and get it, it’s a bonus (we’ve had one upgrade from 6 applications) - though possibly less of a bonus now you don’t get the chance to say no if you don’t like the location of the upgraded stateroom. Certainly the option to specify tub/shower etc would improve the appeal.

 

Agree with your points.

 

In our experience the previous system was so opaque and random that we had absolutely no idea how it worked. It seemed to be highly subjective and one of Bonnie’s posts may have supported that view.

 

It appears that new programme is more automated. This probably explains why the option to choose particular staterooms, say concerning tubs/showers, was not included. 

 

You are correct that being able to specify this would be a real improvement. Although more labour intensive, perhaps this is how Azamara could distinguish itself from the other RCI products.

 

Since our upgrade experience was so rare and hard to understand anyway, we have never considered it a key part of the Azamara product. It was much like the futility of concerning ourselves as to what others had paid for the cruises we were on. 

 

According to the website response, apparently we do not have, an opportunity to upgrade for our upcoming May cruise. We are in a stateroom we deliver chose so it is really not a concern.

 

Others would clearly disagree with our view.

 

[hants52]

Having applied under this new scheme for upgrades for two upcoming cruises l received responses for both informing me I was not eligible. Despite this, shortly afterwards I received emails inviting me to submit bids for both cruises. I submitted modest offers and received acknowledgements that they had been received.

 

I have now received an email headed “ Booking Modification “ and informing me that due to a change in my reservation my offer has been cancelled. I have no idea what they are talking about as I have made no changes since making the booking.

 

The introduction of this scheme is a ridiculous shambles and not worth spending my time on it.

[gymfreak]

31 minutes ago, excitedofharpenden said:

Vicki, although it’s hard to tell with so many questions on this new program, I’d say that yes.  If you are at a higher loyalty level then your bid for strong will at a lower point on the monetary scale.  What I’m still not sure of is if you are say Explorer and upped your bid to $600 would you then stand a better chance of an upgrade than the Discoverer Plus who leaves theirs at $500?

 

Phil

Good point Phil

I assume their is nothing in the algorithm to alert someone when their bid enters a different position on the strenghometer (just made that word up!)

It seems a pain but does this then mean you keep rechecking and if so how often.

With so many other things going on in people’s lives I doubt this would happen 

[Riocca]

Upgrades and the workings of the upgrade fairy has been a contentious issue for as long as we’ve been cruising and across all brands. Fairest system is on one line that had a strict no upgrade policy, you got exactly what you paid for.

However going back in time on Azamara pre the LCV upgrade the system seemed to actually penalise loyalty, nearly every cruise we would meet first time Azamara passengers who received free upgrades, it was a marketing tool to impress first timers to encourage future business. Azamara were not alone in this it was prevalent across lots of lines, many years ago we took our daughter & son-in-law on their first cruise, on that line we were top level loyalty they were first timers , guess who got the upgrade!

We appreciate the views of others but over the years we have decided on a policy of only booking the cabin we want to travel in and upgrades are of no interest. Saying that we did accept an upgrade on Pursuit’s maiden from our usual CC to a CW, don’t get me wrong it’s a beautiful suite but to us it wasn’t  actually worth the extra we paid.

Bigger issue to us is the erosion of LCV benefits the more you pay for your cruise/accommodation, so we understand the feeling that this change is a further reduction in rewards for loyalty.

[Bloodaxe]

1 hour ago, Lottie A said:

I agree Ann. I always book the cabin grade I am happy with. However, I have been very lucky in the past with the $398 upgrades and have appreciated them. We had the opportunity to know the cabin position and whether we had a bath tub or a shower and this played a big part in whether we should accept the upgrade. 

 

 This business model to profit by bidding against others for a cabin upgrade is very distasteful to me. I won't be taking part in it ....maybe it's a British thing? My past loyalty to Azamara and money spent with them since 2010 versus an extra $10 bid from a newbie?  I think I know which bid will win in the new Azamara business plan. It certainly affects my loyalty to Azamara.

 

I have just booked a May cruise on Pursuit with friends but I would normally have at least three Azamara cruises booked. I have future cruises booked with Saga on their new ship, Silversea and Viking. Looking at a cruise on Crystal to see the much missed Russ as well.

 I certainly won't be booking Azamara cruises a year out now, particularly as it seems that the cruises aren't selling out and there are late deals available. Probably due to the big increase in fares. I have had another two emails this morning with reductions in fares for cruises in the Summer and more cruises added to the Sail and Save deal. The onboard experience is still wonderful due to the stellar crew but they can't carry everything. 

 

Lottie, did you change your mind about the cruise you were planning to book in June?.

If so that we will miss you, we have also been looking at the new Saga ships with interest.

Eric