Zaandam and Rotterdam Situation (merged topics starting March 22, 2020)

[LMaxwell]

1 minute ago, AmBear said:

Yes, but understand this area is a hot zone, hit hard by the virus, there simply isn't the beds, equipment waiting for over 100 sick, which has been reported!

These cruisers deserve a location they can be taken care of, not thrown into the middle of an already chaotic situation in this area!

 

There are far fewer cases more north and central in Florida.  The Villages have field hospitals and rapid testing sites setup already.  Many area hotels are empty. Why are they not being welcomed to an area far better suited to accept them?  A half day additional sailing has them at Port Canaveral and major highways that charter busses can get them to these field hospitals and rapid testing sites

[capriccio]

8 minutes ago, conwakr said:

These people aren't in a hospital right now...we simply don't know how many people need hospitalization immediately.  I know in my state there is "hospital" sharing plan in place with areas of the state that have extremely low cases of coronavirus and empty intensive care beds because the south east side of the state is a severe hotspot but the spread is not uniform throughout the state.   I'm sure the state of Florida has smart people who can figure it out. Again, the key will be just how many people on these ships coming into Florida have people who are sick enough to need medical attention. 

 

Determination on whether cruise ships can dock at Port Everglades at this time is based on stringent Unified Command conditions. Holland America continues to work on a detailed plan to be submitted to the Port Everglades Unified Command for review. (https://www.porteverglades.net/zaandam-update/)

 

One of the Unified Command components making the dock/no dock decision for Port Everglades is the Florida Department of Health, Broward County. 

[Himself]

2 hours ago, cat shepard said:

 

Father, you are a better person than I.  If the leader of my state was this cautious from Day 1, I could understand his position - though I would still cringe at his choice of words.

 

But he has dragged his feet and he continues to waffle back & forth.   Luckily I live in a County whose Sheriff made us sit up & take notice early on. And though we have a decent sized airport, it is not a major hub.

 

But I am the eternal optimist. I have to believe that the dilemma of the Zaandam & Rotterdam will soon be resolved. And resolved in a way that is best for all involved.

I hope and pray it will be resolved.

[Mosaic]

10 minutes ago, mamaofami said:

This is a terrible situation for those onboard the Zandam and their worried families. The governor of Florida has done a terrible job, allowing those spring break kids on the beaches and now denying these people the ability to dock in Ft.Lauderdale. Ciities in Florida , until recently, had some restrictions while others had none. We recently returned from Florida and know first hand how restrictions differed from

one city to the next.

 

About a month ago , we met an ER doctor from Miami hospital before anything had happened there and they were busy preparing for this.

 

My own opinion is Florida should extend a hand to these stranded passengers and do whatever is necessary to protect them and Floridians from this virus.

Correct.  Keep in mind that Florida/Broward have made a huge amount of money from Holland and Carnival and therefore has responsiblity.

[Hlitner]

We think many are overthinking the issue and also exaggerating the problem.   A majority of the passengers are not symptomatic and likely not even carrying the virus.  Since a majority of those folks are from outside the USA, they will need access to a major airport and possibly a rescue flight to their country.  South FL offers both MIA and FLL.  Some  of the passengers and crew are symptomatic and will need a place to self-isolate until they recover.  This can easily be done in a hotel and there are plenty of empty rooms in South FL.  It would also be possible to care for those folks on their ship, but the Diamond Princess fiasco proved the wisdom of getting folks off ships.

 

  There are certainly a few passengers/crew that will need hospital care and South FL.has numerous excellent facilities.  We are not talking about the need for hundreds of rooms, as only a few of the sick will require a hospital.  At this point, what seems to be lacking is a plan!  We might assume that this is quietly being discussed by the cruise line, CDC and local authorities, but the NIMBY attitude works against a solution.  We continue to think that South Florida owes it to the cruise ships, passengers, and crew to work towards a good solution.  This is the part of the country that benefits the most, from the cruise industry and passengers.  Now, it is time for FL to open their arms and help those who routinely help FL.

 

Hank

 

 

[capriccio]

6 minutes ago, capriccio said:

 

Determination on whether cruise ships can dock at Port Everglades at this time is based on stringent Unified Command conditions. Holland America continues to work on a detailed plan to be submitted to the Port Everglades Unified Command for review. (https://www.porteverglades.net/zaandam-update/)

 

 

We hear from politicians because that is what politicians do.  Luckily there are other entities with pertinent information (facts) too that make up the Unified Command and hopefully they are working with HAL to find a safe harbor.

 

Unified Command Members

• U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
• Florida Department of Health in Broward County
• U.S. Coast Guard
• U.S. Customs & Border Protection
• Broward Sheriff’s Office Departments of Law Enforcement and Fire Rescue
• Broward County Emergency Management
• Port Everglades Pilots Association
• Broward County Port Everglades Department

[LMaxwell]

They are asking Carnival to address the crew situation; Carnival is stating no crew will come off but the Vice Mayor is asking about the plan for urgent care for crew members.  

[Nymich]

1 minute ago, Hlitner said:

We think many are overthinking the issue and also exaggerating the problem.   A majority of the passengers are not symptomatic and likely not even carrying the virus. 

Hank

 

 

With all due respect we do not know the status of the passengers.  Even the Broward Commissioners are saying they are getting mixed and different reports.  A Carnival Rep will be speaking soon to hopefully clarify that which is what the commissioners are looking for.

[capriccio]

1 minute ago, Nymich said:

With all due respect we do not know the status of the passengers.  Even the Broward Commissioners are saying they are getting mixed and different reports.  A Carnival Rep will be speaking soon to hopefully clarify that which is what the commissioners are looking for.

 

3 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

They are asking Carnival to address the crew situation; Carnival is stating no crew will come off but the Vice Mayor is asking about the plan for urgent care for crew members.  

 

Thank you for providing updates!

[conwakr]

8 minutes ago, Wehwalt said:

Panama has made huge sums from cruise ships and probably made more the other night. By that logic, they should have laid on the red carpet to the airport.

And it appears they did!

[capriccio]

10 minutes ago, Mosaic said:

Correct.  Keep in mind that Florida/Broward have made a huge amount of money from Holland and Carnival and therefore has responsiblity.

 

Broward is well aware.   That fact is right on the Port Everglades update:

 

How long has Holland America Line been a customer of Port Everglades?

Holland America Line has been a primary customer for Port Everglades since the mid-1930s. Further the Zaandam was christened at Port Everglades by Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen in May 2000. This cruise season, October 2019 through May 2020, Holland America had 11 cruise ships scheduled to sail from Port Everglades, including Zaandam.

How much do we receive in income from Holland America?

In Fiscal Year 2019 (October 1, 2018 through September 30, 2019), Holland America generated more than $8 million in revenue for Port Everglades from its 129 cruise sailings with 459,194 passengers.

[3rdGenCunarder]

Just now, conwakr said:

And it appears they did!

 

Do you mean the red carpet through Lake Gatun? It must have taken some serious planning to make sure other ships were well out of the way for that dash through the lake.

[LMaxwell]

1 minute ago, conwakr said:

And it appears they did!

No, Panama did not.  They refused porting the vessel and allowing passengers to head direct to airports

[LMaxwell]

The Carnival Representative is being called up at the Broward Commissioners meeting now 

[Nymich]

Carnival speaking Burke and Matzaka (sp)  4 deceased and as of last night 14 "experiencing influenza like illness"  on Zaandam.  

Edited March 31, 2020 by Nymich

[LMaxwell]

"We are trying to bring two ships up here that have some COVID onboard" - Carnival Rep 

[LMaxwell]

"14 passengers ill, 7 in onboard hospital, 2 we have requested Medevac" 

[cat shepard]

https://www.mynews13.com/fl/orlando/ap-online/2020/03/31/stranded-cruise-ship-hit-by-virus-begs-florida-to-dock

 

Central Florida news reporting.

[Aquahound]

2 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

No, Panama did not.  They refused porting the vessel and allowing passengers to head direct to airports

 

And let's not forget, Panama initially denied them access to the canal.  It was only after several nations got involved with lengthy discussions over several days that Panama finally conceded.  Now, they're being lauded as such great humanitarians?  

 

I appreciate that Panama came around and finally made the decision they did, but let's not forget they were once in the predicament that South Florida is now in.

[Nymich]

They want to charter flight for UK people.  Canadians 250 up to Toronto and 120 charter to West coast of the US that will include Australians and Kiwi citizens

Edited March 31, 2020 by Nymich

[M5M]

17 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

We think many are overthinking the issue and also exaggerating the problem.   A majority of the passengers are not symptomatic and likely not even carrying the virus.  Since a majority of those folks are from outside the USA, they will need access to a major airport and possibly a rescue flight to their country.  South FL offers both MIA and FLL.  Some  of the passengers and crew are symptomatic and will need a place to self-isolate until they recover.  This can easily be done in a hotel and there are plenty of empty rooms in South FL.  It would also be possible to care for those folks on their ship, but the Diamond Princess fiasco proved the wisdom of getting folks off ships.

 

  There are certainly a few passengers/crew that will need hospital care and South FL.has numerous excellent facilities.  We are not talking about the need for hundreds of rooms, as only a few of the sick will require a hospital.  At this point, what seems to be lacking is a plan!  We might assume that this is quietly being discussed by the cruise line, CDC and local authorities, but the NIMBY attitude works against a solution.  We continue to think that South Florida owes it to the cruise ships, passengers, and crew to work towards a good solution.  This is the part of the country that benefits the most, from the cruise industry and passengers.  Now, it is time for FL to open their arms and help those who routinely help FL.

 

Hank

 

 

Well said, Hank! I am so insulted by the attitude of Florida's governor and Fll mayor.....neither seems to have any ability to formulate a plan of action.  South Florida profits heavily from tourism overall, it is very disappointing to see such a lack of care, whether that starts from a financial point or from  a base of compassion for others.

[Nymich]

1 minute ago, Magar said:

Well said, Hank! I am so insulted by the attitude of Florida's governor and Fll mayor.....neither seems to have any ability to formulate a plan of action.  South Florida profits heavily from tourism overall, it is very disappointing to see such a lack of care, whether that starts from a financial point or from  a base of compassion for others.

Easy to say and hard to do.  Stay tuned CCL laying out their plan.

[capriccio]

1 minute ago, Magar said:

Well said, Hank! I am so insulted by the attitude of Florida's governor and Fll mayor.....neither seems to have any ability to formulate a plan of action.  South Florida profits heavily from tourism overall, it is very disappointing to see such a lack of care, whether that starts from a financial point or from  a base of compassion for others.

The plan of action is not being made by politicians (thankfully).  It is being made by HAL and the Unified Command; the experts on the situation on the ship and shore. 

[sailingdutchy]

7 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

We think many are overthinking the issue and also exaggerating the problem.   A majority of the passengers are not symptomatic and likely not even carrying the virus.  Since a majority of those folks are from outside the USA, they will need access to a major airport and possibly a rescue flight to their country.  South FL offers both MIA and FLL.  Some  of the passengers and crew are symptomatic and will need a place to self-isolate until they recover.  This can easily be done in a hotel and there are plenty of empty rooms in South FL.  It would also be possible to care for those folks on their ship, but the Diamond Princess fiasco proved the wisdom of getting folks off ships.

 

  There are certainly a few passengers/crew that will need hospital care and South FL.has numerous excellent facilities.  We are not talking about the need for hundreds of rooms, as only a few of the sick will require a hospital.  At this point, what seems to be lacking is a plan!  We might assume that this is quietly being discussed by the cruise line, CDC and local authorities, but the NIMBY attitude works against a solution.  We continue to think that South Florida owes it to the cruise ships, passengers, and crew to work towards a good solution.  This is the part of the country that benefits the most, from the cruise industry and passengers.  Now, it is time for FL to open their arms and help those who routinely help FL.

 

Hank

 

 

 

Thank you Hank for this .  For instance for the 240 odd Canadians on board the Zaandam and Rotterdam after first being tested for signs they could be bussed to the airport right away where a couple of charter flichts set up by HAL could be at the ready and they can be taken to Toronto and Calgary and we can and will take care of them to get home and looked after from there .  

The same could be done for other nationals and also for Americans. 

From the numbers we have received over 90 % of the people on board these ships they have been in their cabins for 14 days or even longer. Don't leave all of these people on board ship isolated in there cabins any longer than necessary .

 

Hope I did not overly simplefy this ?! 

 

Where there is a will there is a way ! 

 

Tony 

[Nymich]

They do not have a plan yet for people outside South Florida which they will drive home.  Also no plan for others outside Florida which he mentioned "like New York".   CCL Rep wants to incorporate a plan that fits the questions the commissioners are now asking.