NCL lost our trust forever

[SeaShark]

49 minutes ago, buckeyefrank said:

Uhm.... no.  That's business.  How else are they going to pay for the ship, payroll, port fees, food, fuel?  They need those things to offer the cruise.  They don't have a fiduciary duty in a legal sense with the cash given.  It's not like a security deposit on a rental, which does carry fiduciary responsibility.

 

Except, of course, that the Federal Maritime Commission does impose financial responsibility requirements on cruise lines operating from US ports. Deposits are unearned income and are not revenue to the cruise line until such time as the cruise completes.

[julig22]

5 hours ago, Waquoit said:

 

Just received my refund in full from Amex. You owe it to the rest of the board here to stop spreading misinformation.

Instead of bashing people who are actually giving factual information... And YOU DID NOT get a full refund from AMEX - I read the letter on your other post.  You got a temporary credit that will be resolved at a future date.  Sorry you don't understand that.

 

Capital One credit card that told someone to come back in 90 days; AMEX denied the claim outright.

 

Now, here is a link to the original posts - I suggest you go there and tell those people that you believe they are lying and spreading misinformation.

 

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2744348-share-real-repsonses-from-your-credit-card-company-re-dispute-chargesrefunds/?tab=comments#comment-59762689

 

[julig22]

7 hours ago, njhorseman said:

I don't know what you mean by "aren't landing where they belong" and the last place I would be looking for accurate information about anything is Facebook...not that I totally discount the possibility of some screw ups in the roll out.

Meaning that the money isn't in the correct bank account.  And this isn't about looking for accurate information on Facebook - it's about noting that people are commenting to the local community that their payment is missing.  No different than reading comments on CC and asking about refund status and so forth.

[ellasmomanddad]

15 minutes ago, julig22 said:

Capital One credit card that told someone to come back in 90 days; AMEX denied the claim outright

 Shenanigans, there are 30 post that said Amex returned/credited within 24 hours. You managed to find the 1 person who got denied. That tells me they did or said something not true or maybe that 1 poster didn’t wait for there cruise to cancel. Capital one is a bad company to start with so not surprised. There company motto is get the 18 year olds at a high rate and watch them crumble.

[Zippeedee]

Do people really think that NCL is holding all refunds for 90 days and then will release the money all in one big wave? It is a 90 day WINDOW. Some credits could be issued every day between now and July. They originally said 7-10 days, which was correct until they had to close offices and move to working at home. 

[julig22]

3 minutes ago, ellasmomanddad said:

 Shenanigans, there are 30 post that said Amex returned/credited within 24 hours. You managed to find the 1 person who got denied. That tells me they did or said something not true or maybe that 1 poster didn’t wait for there cruise to cancel. Capital one is a bad company to start with so not surprised. There company motto is get the 18 year olds at a high rate and watch them crumble.

Huh??? on the post I linked to, 2 people who mentioned AMEX were given TEMPORARY credits, 1 was flat out denied.  The prevalent poster on this thread who keeps insisting they got a refund has posted the letter on another thread - a letter that clearly states that it is a TEMPORARY credit. So I call shenanigans on your 30 posts.

[Waquoit]

19 minutes ago, julig22 said:

Instead of bashing people who are actually giving factual information... And YOU DID NOT get a full refund from AMEX - I read the letter on your other post.  You got a temporary credit that will be resolved at a future date.  Sorry you don't understand that.

 

And I'm sorry you don't understand the difference between facts (what I posted from actual experience) and the hearsay (the report of another person's words) you posted. And LOL at the idea you have a clue of what I got! My Amex message says: " In these situations, we may rebill your account."   Rebill my account, not take back my temp credit. 

But say you are right and they do "rebill my account". What do you think they will say if I tell them to "wait 90 days, interest free"?

[sprint180]

I'm not waiting for a refund but I have been reading the boards on several of the lines.   The cruises on NCL were probably my favorite but hearing about what some have had to do in this situation has soured me on them also.  We will have to see won't we.

[Murph269]

7 minutes ago, Zippeedee said:

Do people really think that NCL is holding all refunds for 90 days and then will release the money all in one big wave? It is a 90 day WINDOW. Some credits could be issued every day between now and July. They originally said 7-10 days, which was correct until they had to close offices and move to working at home. 

It depends on if you choose to take NCL’s wording literally or not. They said we’d “receive a refund 90 days after” they receive our refund request form. It did not say “within” 90 days. I agree, it would be odd to issue them all at once, but if you go by their own wording, that is what would happen. 

[NLH Arizona]

6 minutes ago, Waquoit said:

 

And I'm sorry you don't understand the difference between facts (what I posted from actual experience) and the hearsay (the report of another person's words) you posted. And LOL at the idea you have a clue of what I got! My Amex message says: " In these situations, we may rebill your account."   Rebill my account, not take back my temp credit. 

But say you are right and they do "rebill my account". What do you think they will say if I tell them to "wait 90 days, interest free"?

When I disputed a charge, not mine, with my Visa.  They removed the charge off the account and said I wouldn't have to pay it or any interest until it has been investigated, they said that they will investigate the charge and if it is found that I did make the purchase, they will "rebill" my account, because that is how they get the charge back on the Visa.  Of course, it was not my charge, so they didn't "rebill" my account.  

[Waquoit]

2 minutes ago, julig22 said:

The prevalent poster on this thread who keeps insisting they got a refund has posted the letter on another thread - a letter that clearly states that it is a TEMPORARY credit. 

More disinformation. The letter does not use the word TEMPORARY at all. The part you are calling the claw back is more like CYA boilerplate than anything else in this context.  I'l post it again:

 

It's important to know that we may accept the response from Usd Reservation at a later date and review the information they provide. In these situations, we may rebill your account. If that happens, we'll be sure to let you know immediately. If you don't hear from us by 06/24/2020, then you may consider this matter closed.

 

They MAY accept the response from NCL but they won't because NCL doesn't have a case. That's why Amex is processing these things so quickly.

 

Trust me, I'll gladly eat crow if my credit disappears. And I will come back and say so. In the meantime, I'm just trying push back against all the disinformation here. Like saying a letter clearly says something when it clearly doesn't.

 

[ellasmomanddad]

8 minutes ago, julig22 said:

The prevalent poster on this thread who keeps insisting they got a refund has posted the letter on another thread - a letter that clearly states that it is a TEMPORARY credit. So I call shenanigans on your 30 posts.

Your joking right? I saw his op, I liked his op. The post in the other thread did not deny they could recharge him in fact in his second sentence he addressed it. The one Amex denial to me means the poster you referred to either lied about his reason or didn’t wait for the cruise to get canceled.Everybody else said I got mine back. 

[julig22]

8 minutes ago, ellasmomanddad said:

Your joking right? I saw his op, I liked his op. The post in the other thread did not deny they could recharge him in fact in his second sentence he addressed it. The one Amex denial to me means the poster you referred to either lied about his reason or didn’t wait for the cruise to get canceled.Everybody else said I got mine back. 

I don't know what your are reading:

"Disputed mine with AMEX and CHASE VISA Reserve. Got temporary credits for both within 24 hours""

"Amex gave 6-8 week estimate for investigation to complete, and provisional credits until then. "

 

Post on the other thread says they could recharge. 

 

So that makes 3 who have provisional credits.  Not sure what you are implying is wrong with what I have posted.  Terminology may be different but the result, whether the credits are temporary, provisional, subject to a recharge at a later date, "clawed back" (not my term) - is always the same.  They will investigate.  They will side with you because you didn't get the services or they will deny the chargeback because the original charge was legit and NCL is working on refunds.  It will take time.

 

Bottom line is nobody knows at this point.

[ellasmomanddad]

1 minute ago, julig22 said:

Bottom line is nobody knows at this point.

You personally have accused everyone filing a chargeback as committing fraud. If the money is back on his card it’s by definition a refund. He never denied that he could be charged back. You have been consistent in telling people they are wrong but your only source is 1 person saying they got denied.

[Waquoit]

12 minutes ago, julig22 said:

It will take time.

Bottom line is nobody knows at this point.

Maybe not, but the picture getting clearer to me. I predict that my balance in full will be safely back in my checking account by the end of the month, probably by the end of next week. If it isn't, I will contribute $100 to the food bank of your choice.

[graphicguy]

On 4/14/2020 at 6:43 AM, ray98 said:

Well....I guess you should be 'done' with the entire industry.  They ALL have similar delays as they deal with this unprecedented situation.

You're correct.  But, we're talking a few key strokes here.  They already have all the account information set up.  That's how they can take payment immediately....like less than a minute.

 

Yes, they're probably overwhelmed.  But, 90-days?  Maybe 14 days, perhaps even 30 days.  Make no mistake, this can be done easily and quickly (just like when you cancel a hotel reservation).  It's a loan that NCL is forcing you to make to them.  Plus, if they go belly up, you're out all of it.

[julig22]

33 minutes ago, ellasmomanddad said:

You personally have accused everyone filing a chargeback as committing fraud. If the money is back on his card it’s by definition a refund. He never denied that he could be charged back. You have been consistent in telling people they are wrong but your only source is 1 person saying they got denied.

Remember the game telephone....where somebody whispers a statement to the next person and by the end, that statement is totally garbled.  I have NEVER accused everyone of filing a chargeback as committiing fraud. There is a term "friendly fraud" and I have posted references to articles that clearly define what that entails.  I didn't make it up, I don't make the rules.  If you choose to act on emotion rather than logic, more power to you.

 

If there is a possibility that a credit to my account might be taken away, then I don't consider it a refund - it is a temporary credit.  Call it what you want. 

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, sprint180 said:

I'm not waiting for a refund but I have been reading the boards on several of the lines.   The cruises on NCL were probably my favorite but hearing about what some have had to do in this situation has soured me on them also.  We will have to see won't we.

This has been standard operating procedure since Del Rio took over.  NCL was very customer centric before him.

 

I was on a cruise that they refused to cancel until the a.m. hours before the cruise.  They wanted to cruise out of Miami  with Hurricane Dorian bearing down on Caribbean/Nassau predicted to be a CAT 5.  They had days before to cancel.  NCL did not care what sort of problems the passengers had to endure, or the costs they had to bare.  They were bound and determined to keep sailing so they could keep all the fares, regardless of safety.

 

I had insurance and still lost money.  I had to change flights 3 times because I could not get a straight answer out of NCL.  Insurance covered one of the changes, but not the others.  Same for pre-sailing hotels.

 

NCL has gone from one of the best run cruise companies to one of the worst in a matter of a few years.

[KateQ22003]

4 hours ago, buckeyefrank said:

Uhm.... no.  That's business.  How else are they going to pay for the ship, payroll, port fees, food, fuel?  They need those things to offer the cruise.  They don't have a fiduciary duty in a legal sense with the cash given.  It's not like a security deposit on a rental, which does carry fiduciary responsibility.

They aren't paying those things 120 days in advance.

[Diver2014]

On 4/14/2020 at 12:55 AM, cruiser4801 said:

   I for one will never cruise on NCL again if they survive, which I truly doubt they will. 

 

I was Platinum level at NCL and am done with them.  

Goodbye NCL-- you lost our trust..  

 

 

Since you will never cruise on NCL again, they have no incentive to expedite your refund, which is what you wanted since you were Platinum level, right?

[Double Jack]

On 4/14/2020 at 7:32 AM, sparks1093 said:

This isn't bill paying, it is initiating a refund. (And even bill paying needs human intervention at some point in the process, even if it is only inputting the invoice into the system.) 

 

Not 90 days worth of human intervention.  Don't make excuses for poor behavior.

[MoCruiseFan]

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2020 at 12:55 AM, cruiser4801 said:

NCL's 90 day delay to issue refunds is ridiculous.  The payments are all stored electronically and can be refunded swiftly with 10 days at most.  They are doing this for cash flow purposes and that makes us angry.  I for one will never cruise on NCL again if they survive, which I truly doubt they will.  The way NCL has handled the Covid-19 crises and processing of refunds for cruises they had to cancel and did as a result of the pandemic shows what little regard they have for their customers.  

 

I was Platinum level at NCL and am done with them.  Why would anyone ever subject themselves to having NCL hold your money for 3 months after a cruise they canceled.

Goodbye NCL-- you lost our trust..  

 

 

So many assumptions and so little knowledge of billing and payment processing process along with the associated internal controls and internal audit procedures of any large company .  By the way, it is up to 90 days not at least 90 days.  Some refunds have been processed and have been received by the customers.  I really do hope that all these people saying that they will never cruise NCL again actually do so.  That just means fewer people to compete with for the best cabins! 

[jaapie]

12 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

By the way, it is up to 90 days not at least 90 days.

Wrong. This is what it says on NCL's website:

Guests who prefer to not take advantage of a future cruise credit can elect to receive a lesser refund to the original form of payment 90 days after submitting the Refund Form below.

 

So AFTER, not UP TO.

[CaribbeanJen]

19 minutes ago, jaapie said:

Wrong. This is what it says on NCL's website:

Guests who prefer to not take advantage of a future cruise credit can elect to receive a lesser refund to the original form of payment 90 days after submitting the Refund Form below.

 

So AFTER, not UP TO.

 

AND?

 

Are you that strapped for cash that you can't just be patient about this?  It's not like you can take ANY kind of vacation right now.   YOU SPENT THAT MONEY.  

[cruiser4801]

NCL has no right to keep thousands of our dollars that belong to us.  They have no right to an interest free 3 month loan on my money.  NCL will never get my dollars or business again.  For that matter, I am done with cruising for a long time since they have all behaved the same way.  

 

These cruise companies have shown themselves to be gangsters with our monies.  They will never get mine again.