CDC: Negative COVID-19 test required for air passengers to enter and leave the US

[cbr663]

8 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

 

While these examples certainly help clarify peoples' thinking, I have to wonder why people are not taking the CDC warnings more seriously to avoid ANY NON-ESSENTIAL travel to almost all countries, globally (this includes the US). Yes, nearly all countries are under the highest level advisory (Level 4, see link), and yet people are looking at ways to vacation and "duck" the general rules.

...

 

 

Here in Canada we have the same travel advice to stay home and avoid all non-essential travel.  Travel was increasing though.  Our gov't recently brought in the requirement that all international air travellers returning to Canada must have a negative COVID-19 on the PCR test 72 hours prior to travel to be allowed on the plane.  Since that requirement was announced, two of our major airlines have announced major employee layoffs and cancelled routes dues to the sudden number of cancelled bookings since this requirement has been announced.  It's amazing what steps have to be taken to get people to not take an international vacation.

[Hlitner]

14 hours ago, cbr663 said:

 

I applaud your decision to cancel.  If there is one thing I have accepted with this pandemic is that the situation is fluid and changing daily.  Anyone who chooses to travel and leave their country does so with the risk that things may change while they away and they may very well have a difficult time returning.

No doubt!  On the other hand DW and I could be sitting at home (Pennsylvania) spending our days in our family room watching TV and eating bon bons.  But no, we decided to spend our normal winter in Puerto Vallarta where the sun is shining, the beach is relatively empty, the restaurants, bars and clubs are open, most folks are social distancing, mask wearing is hit or miss, etc.   We spend most of our time outdoors and feel safer here then we would at home where most folks are stuck inside for the winter.  The reality of COVID is that the overwhelming cases that have been contact traced involved indoor spread.  Here we can generally avoid being indoors with other folks while still enjoying all kinds of activities.

 

Are things changing.  Sure...we will now need to get a COVID test before we fly home (in the Spring) which is not a big deal.  While staying home is certainly the most intelligent option we have simply made a decision to keep living our life in a fun way while also doing our best to avoid COVID.   I think you are correct that travel (or even staying home) involves some risk.  On the other hand, most things we choose to do in our lives involve risk.   We do have lots of concerns about our future cruise bookings (all our cruises have been cancelled until next October) and would not even consider stepping back onto a cruise ship until after we have been vaccinated.  In fact, I think a 100% mandatory vaccination policy is the only reasonable way forward for cruises since even a single COVID case on a ship would generally end the cruise and cause lots of delays/inconvenience for all aboard.  

 

When this pandemic is over and we look back it will be interesting to hear the stories of folks.  Most will talk about having been pretty isolated in their homes for up to two years!  Others will talk about how they continued to live their lives while doing their best to mitigate COVID.   It is ironic that in our own family the only folks that have had COVID have been the one's who have been staying at home.  Go figure.   Since last March we have managed to take three nice vacations (always being very cautious to follow rules and not do anything crazy) in South Carolina, Florida and Mexico.  What those three places have in common is that everything was open and the warm weather made it easy to spend most of our time outside where there is little COVID risk.

 

Hank

[Toofarfromthesea]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

 

When this pandemic is over and we look back it will be interesting to hear the stories of folks.  Most will talk about having been pretty isolated in their homes for up to two years!  Others will talk about how they continued to live their lives while doing their best to mitigate COVID.

And my guess is that the overall well-being of the former group will be significantly worse than that of the latter group.

[MrsDRK]

On 1/13/2021 at 7:01 AM, Jeremiah1212 said:

Hopefully this will stymie the number of Americans vacationing to places like Mexico that have very loose restrictions. I looked at a few of the fan pages of some Mexican AI resorts and the response was predictable. Previously it was always ‘contracting COVID is a risk you take...don’t live in fear!’ Now they are panicking about not being able to get a test, or testing positive and being stuck in Mexico. Wouldn’t that be ‘a risk you take’? Odd train of thought. However I would agree that this will have negligible impact on cruises.

I actually visited Mexico in November.  They were exceptionally careful everywhere we went, from the airport, to the car to the hotel, to the all inclusive.  Masks were required, elevators were restricted to one party only, and everything was socially distanced.  I feel for the Mexican (ands other ) tourism industry.  New York has been shut down for months and they STILL have the highest Covid death rate of any of the 50 states.

[Hlitner]

15 minutes ago, MrsDRK said:

I actually visited Mexico in November.  They were exceptionally careful everywhere we went, from the airport, to the car to the hotel, to the all inclusive.  Masks were required, elevators were restricted to one party only, and everything was socially distanced.  I feel for the Mexican (ands other ) tourism industry.  New York has been shut down for months and they STILL have the highest Covid death rate of any of the 50 states.

In Puerto Vallarta it is a mixed bag.  I would estimate that mask wearing is about 50%  with many younger Mexicans and gringos going without masks when it is possible.  Masks are required when walking around restaurants, stores, on buses, etc.  Restaurants are all open (inside and out) and operate with 50% capacity.  Since most restaurants are partially outside and there is normally lots of natural ventilation (inside and out) we feel very safe when dining out (which we do every day).  DW and I take our own chairs to the beach and sit in an area where there is nobody within 20 feet.  Our Condo building requires masks in public areas, elevators are limited with no sharing, and since the condos can be opened at both ends there is lots of natural ventilation.   When we need to use Uber or taxis the drivers wear masks and we always keep the windows open.  

 

So the question is why are there a lot of COVID cases here?  One big problem seems to be the gay bars where there is still crowding and little mask wearing.  There are also many clubs (generally popular with younger Mexicans) where there is little social distancing.  We do not go to any of those places so feel quite safe.  We also felt very safe when we took a trip to Key West and Ft Myers Beach last month.  Florida also had its restaurants operating at about 50% and we stayed at places where social distancing was not an issue.

 

I think the biggest risk of traveling are the airports and we carefully negotiated the airports to minimize our risk.  It is actually pretty easy to keep your distance in airports but many folks seem to leave their brain at home when they travel.   We would see folks crowding to board flights which really made no sense in this COVID era.  Onboard flights everyone had to wear masks and we further minimized our risk by flying first class (more space).  

 

We were somewhat nervous about doing our food shopping (at COSTCO and a local surpermarket) but that turned out to not be a problem.  I felt safer in those two places then in our local supermarket at home.  

 

I mention all this to again draw a comparison to cruising (which is in our blood).  While I feel confident about minimizing our risk on land trips I cannot imagine anyway to do that on a mass market ship (it would even be tough on small luxury vessels).  Just dealing with elevators on ships will be a huge problem, even if the ship is operating at a lower capacity.  The dining facilities are also not designed for social distancing and the enclosed environment with low ceilings (found on many ships) would also be a concern.

 

Many folks seem to ignore the numbers and reality.   States and cities that do the most to lock down generally have the most deaths and high COVID rates.  States like Florida that have kept most things open don't do much worse then the States that are locked down...and they are able to have an economy.  New York State has some of the toughest restrictions in the nation (especially in NYC) and yet has the 2nd highest death rate in the nation.  Go figure.  Southern California closes most things which simply forces folks inside where their COVID risk is increased.   It makes absolutely no sense to close outdoor dining and yet some places have done it.  I think when the history is written about this pandemic there will widespread agreement that many of our politicians and leaders blew it....big time.

 

Hank

[ldubs]

On 1/14/2021 at 10:33 AM, cruisemom42 said:

 

 

While these examples certainly help clarify peoples' thinking, I have to wonder why people are not taking the CDC warnings more seriously to avoid ANY NON-ESSENTIAL travel to almost all countries, globally (this includes the US). Yes, nearly all countries are under the highest level advisory (Level 4, see link), and yet people are looking at ways to vacation and "duck" the general rules.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/travelers/map-and-travel-notices.html

 

Perhaps the fact that people are not taking these recommendations seriously is one reason why these added testing restrictions have been added....?

 

Really -- I have read post after post on these boards from travelers in the past who have canceled entire cruises due to a Level 2 warning regarding safety in some country such as Israel.  But Level 4 health warnings go unregarded. Strange times we live in.

 

 

And how often to your hear: "Oh, but we are very careful".  😄

 

 

[ldubs]

On 1/13/2021 at 8:19 AM, Roz said:

Would a cruise ship be able to have the facilities to test thousands of passenger and get results back prior to disembarkation?  Would the cruise lines have to hire additional medical personnel to administer tests and process them?  I don't see how this is doable or remotely cost effective.

 

 

Just open up testing at Starbuck's stores.   Problem solved!  😄

 

Seriously, I suspect the future will be a requirement for proof of vaccine OR current negative test result.  I can visualize covid test kiosks scattered around places of travel.   

[SelectSys]

8 hours ago, MrsDRK said:

New York has been shut down for months and they STILL have the highest Covid death rate of any of the 50 states.

 

Didn't you hear, Cuomo has had a change of heart?

 

I wonder if our Governor in CA will decide to follow Cuomo's lead?  Probably not as last year's stock market gains have made the state's budget for government look really good. 

Edited January 16, 2021 by SelectSys

[cruisemom42]

17 hours ago, MrsDRK said:

New York has been shut down for months and they STILL have the highest Covid death rate of any of the 50 states.

 

Actually New Jersey has the highest per capita mortality rate from COVID at 227 per 100k, while New York is second at 208 per 100k. Massachusetts, Rhode Island and Connecticut round out the top 5.

 

Not surprisingly (to me anyway), all five of these states are in the top 10 for population density. This suggests to me that the disease spreads rapidly where there is a large number of people living in closer proximity.  I'm not sure if it has much to do with shutdown status. Although wearing masks HAS been shown to reduce overall spread....

 

 

 

 

Edited January 16, 2021 by cruisemom42

[JRG]

36 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

Not surprisingly (to me anyway), all five of these states are in the top 10 for population density.

 

Yes,  I believe it is more about density.   We should be prioritizing our general population vaccinations based on density.   IMO

 

And it is also about the highly susceptible who live in those densely populated areas.

 

Edited January 16, 2021 by JRG
edited

[ldubs]

20 hours ago, MrsDRK said:

New York has been shut down for months and they STILL have the highest Covid death rate of any of the 50 states.

 

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Actually New Jersey has the highest per capita mortality rate from COVID at 227 per 100k, while New York is second at 208 per 100k. Massachusetts, Rhode Island and Connecticut round out the top 5.

 

Not surprisingly (to me anyway), all five of these states are in the top 10 for population density.

 

 

I think you guys are looking at cumulative data for the past 11 months.  If recent trends are considered, you see a different picture.   Looking at recent week data, the difference between highest and lowest is about 2 deaths/100K.  Sadly that still translates into about 23K deaths in the US over the last 7 days.   

 

I sure agree with the comment about population density.   It is a huge factor.   

[ldubs]

12 hours ago, SelectSys said:

 

Didn't you hear, Cuomo has had a change of heart?

 

I wonder if our Governor in CA will decide to follow Cuomo's lead?  Probably not as last year's stock market gains have made the state's budget for government look really good. 

 

There might be a reaction if that pesky recall petition continues to gain traction.  Holy cow, that rhymes!

 

 

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, ldubs said:

 

There might be a reaction if that pesky recall petition continues to gain traction.  Holy cow, that rhymes!

 

 

NY state is not California; we do not have recalls allowed.

[ldubs]

7 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

NY state is not California; . . . 

 

Hey, no need to rub it in!  Hahaha

[Cruzaholic41]

14 hours ago, SelectSys said:

 

Didn't you hear, Cuomo has had a change of heart?

He’s just ahead of the others. I have a feeling the rhetoric is about to suddenly change from several governors. 🙄

[SelectSys]

On 1/14/2021 at 5:07 AM, K32682 said:

Canada introduced a similar requirement a week before the U.S. causing me to give up any thought of my annual trip to Florida.  I can easily get the test within 72 hours before returning home but if the test were positive I'd be stranded in Florida at the mercy of the American health care system if I fell ill. No thanks. 

 

 

 

 

Looks like some of your fellow citizens are making a run to Florida in an attempt to get the vaccine.  This behavior seems similar to other forms of Canadian medical tourism abroad.  

 

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/canadas-slow-vaccine-delivery-sends-its-snowbirds-to-florida-to-get-their-doses

 

"Gagnon said she was amazed at how easy the process was in the U.S. She and her husband simply drove to a park in Fort Lauderdale, where the county has a drive-through vaccination center, and they didn’t need an appointment. All they had to do was sign a medical consent form and show proof they were over 65 years old. No one asked whether they were Florida residents."

 

 

Edited January 16, 2021 by SelectSys

[SelectSys]

6 minutes ago, Cruzaholic41 said:

He’s just ahead of the others. I have a feeling the rhetoric is about to suddenly change from several governors. 🙄

 

Why would that be?  I thought everyone was working from a perspective of good faith and science.

[evandbob]

Most of NY deaths came in the first few months of this COVID pandemic when doctors were struggling to understand the diseases' progression.

 

Florida is now #3 of all 50 states in # of cases, most of them occurring after its Gov "loosened" up the economy.  As Operation Molasses Drip gets the vax out to people, Florida is averaging between 14,000 and almost 20,000 new cases daily.

[K32682]

16 hours ago, SelectSys said:

Looks like some of your fellow citizens are making a run to Florida in an attempt to get the vaccine.  This behavior seems similar to other forms of Canadian medical tourism abroad.  

 

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/canadas-slow-vaccine-delivery-sends-its-snowbirds-to-florida-to-get-their-doses

 

"Gagnon said she was amazed at how easy the process was in the U.S. She and her husband simply drove to a park in Fort Lauderdale, where the county has a drive-through vaccination center, and they didn’t need an appointment. All they had to do was sign a medical consent form and show proof they were over 65 years old. No one asked whether they were Florida residents."

 

If Americans are willing to sell vaccine to Canadians ahead of providing it to their own countrymen then Canadians of means will be willing to buy it.  Were I of the required age I would be one of those Canadians. 

[cruisemom42]

1 hour ago, K32682 said:

 

If Americans are willing to sell vaccine to Canadians ahead of providing it to their own countrymen then Canadians of means will be willing to buy it.  Were I of the required age I would be one of those Canadians. 

 

They are not selling the vaccine to Canadians, it is free. The US government purchased the doses for US citizens. 

 

Would you be okay with Americans showing up en masse in Canada and getting vaccinated with doses intended for Canadians (and ahead of most nationals)?

 

To me it seems wrong that my sister has been trying for a month to find a place in the queue somewhere to get my 88- and 94-year old parents vaccinated in Florida, so far with no success, while people from other countries (and states) are going to Florida to avail themselves.

 

 

 

 

[K32682]

22 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

They are not selling the vaccine to Canadians, it is free. The US government purchased the doses for US citizens. 

 

Would you be okay with Americans showing up en masse in Canada and getting vaccinated with doses intended for Canadians (and ahead of most nationals)?

 

To me it seems wrong that my sister has been trying for a month to find a place in the queue somewhere to get my 88- and 94-year old parents vaccinated in Florida, so far with no success, while people from other countries (and states) are going to Florida to avail themselves.

 

There are three reasons Americans won't be flocking to Canada to be vaccinated. The first is our government's egregiously slow acquisition and delivery of the vaccine, secondly Americans are not permitted in the country for non-essential reasons and finally if they do sneak in proof of residency is required to access the public system even for Canadians.  

 

If Florida is willing to vaccinate out of state residents your issue is with the government of Florida not with the people who are going there to be vaccinated. 

[navybankerteacher]

On 1/13/2021 at 12:19 PM, Roz said:

No vaccine provides 100% immunity.

There is no point in pointing this out.

 

There is no such thing as a sure thing — except for the fact that each of us will die sometime. 

 

 

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, navybankerteacher said:

There is no point in pointing this out.

 

There is no such thing as a sure thing — except for the fact that each of us will die sometime. 

 

 

I find it interesting that the same people who claim the whole thing is a hoax seem to be the people who are quick to point out that the vaccine is not a 100% sure thing.

[clo]

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

To me it seems wrong that my sister has been trying for a month to find a place in the queue somewhere to get my 88- and 94-year old parents vaccinated in Florida, so far with no success, while people from other countries (and states) are going to Florida to avail themselves.

 

This brings up something I've been thinking about. What are the # of doses allocated per state based on? With Florida specifically, all those "snow birds" aren't in the general population.  When I get my shot next Saturday I have to bring ID.

[SelectSys]

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

Would you be okay with Americans showing up en masse in Canada and getting vaccinated with doses intended for Canadians (and ahead of most nationals)?

 

This is one of my favorite to ask in other countries on travel.  Guess what the answer tends to be?