Restrictions that reduces the FUN

[mredandchis]

24 minutes ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

I disagree wearing a mask currently is logical; however, I agree with you that herd immunity is around the corner.  An article in the WSJ just came out and a researcher claims by the end of April, it should be gone basically in the US.

I do think some researchers are a bit optimistic but I do hope they are correct.  On the flip side some thing it will be 2022, and these folks are pessimists.  

As far as the logic of wearing a mask now I would point out not everyone in serious danger of covid19 have been afforded an opportunity to get the vaccine.  Here in NC they will start on St Patties day for the last of the high risk people.  Once they have had the opportunity and either got it or refused it then the logic will be more in favor of a return to normalcy. 

 

We are closing in to 40 percent herd immunity.  End of April should be at current rates about 60 percent.  Israel is at 60 right now and they haven't shook it but are rapidly getting there even with the variants that have hit them. 

[Buckeyefrank100]

11 minutes ago, mredandchis said:

I do think some researchers are a bit optimistic but I do hope they are correct.  On the flip side some thing it will be 2022, and these folks are pessimists.  

As far as the logic of wearing a mask now I would point out not everyone in serious danger of covid19 have been afforded an opportunity to get the vaccine.  Here in NC they will start on St Patties day for the last of the high risk people.  Once they have had the opportunity and either got it or refused it then the logic will be more in favor of a return to normalcy. 

 

We are closing in to 40 percent herd immunity.  End of April should be at current rates about 60 percent.  Israel is at 60 right now and they haven't shook it but are rapidly getting there even with the variants that have hit them. 

According to the researcher / doctor at John's Hopkins who has access to all the data, he claims more than 2/3 people have had it and we are much closer to herd immunity than 40%.  Anecdotal sure, but I hardly know anyone that hasn't had the virus at this point.  That's not even counting those that had it without being tested and diagnosed.  This doctor claims the numbers are going down because we have hit or are very close to herd immunity now.

 

[BlerkOne]

43 minutes ago, Buckeyefrank100 said:

According to the researcher / doctor at John's Hopkins who has access to all the data, he claims more than 2/3 people have had it and we are much closer to herd immunity than 40%.  Anecdotal sure, but I hardly know anyone that hasn't had the virus at this point.  That's not even counting those that had it without being tested and diagnosed.  This doctor claims the numbers are going down because we have hit or are very close to herd immunity now.

 

You're right. Anecdotal. Wake me up when there is consensus.

 

Meanwhile Spring Break is starting. Brazil apparently has a case of a person infected with 2 strains of the virus. It just keeps on keeping on.

 

Until the whole world is at herd immunity, it really isn't. There will continue to be mutations and international travel and outbreaks.

[Stick93]

3 hours ago, iria64 said:

Not to sound mean and this is not directed at the poster but... it does not matter what people think when they are on the ship.  The ship has rules and you follow the rules.  If you do not like the rules don't go.  If the rules say wear a mask then wear a mask.  Don't go off on your own at a port... don't do it.

 

As for mass fighting... having to deal with restriction all over the place, tensions will be high.  There will be some friction from both sides... the entitled morons who feel the rules do not apply and those that feel they need to call out everybody for not following the rules.  A cruise will not be the relaxing experience it has been especially at the beginning while they get the kinks worked out.

You actually don't sound mean - You are proving my point!

 

Having a rational conversation about covid and what will happen when cruises start again is not possible. People are emotionally charged and the rules will be too relaxed for some and too strict for others. Vaccines, no Vaccines, Masks - where to wear and were not to wear, kids or no kids.  The two sides will be forever mad and the only people enjoying will be the ones who ignore the others and do what THEY FEEL comfortable doing - so long as its in the new rule book. 

[Stick93]

1 hour ago, bgrmini said:

One day, like a miracle, it will disappear. 😄

Even a broken clock is right twice a day - one day this will be gone. 

[SNJCruisers]

4 hours ago, robertlanajean said:

 We have a cruise booked for this October that I know we won't be going on whether the ship sails or not. 

 My wife and I don't love the crowds on the ship, .... To all of you willing to take the lead, I applaud you and thank you for doing your part to keep the industry afloat until the rest of us are ready to return.  

Since you don't love the crowds,  cruising at reduced capacity should be a good thing for you.  Since you're not going on your October cruise, why haven't you cancelled it yet?  It can't be for the anticipation of the 600 in OBC since you said that it'll be years till you cruise again and the OBC has an expiration date. 

[Joebucks]

4 hours ago, ledges1 said:

I would rather go to Florida any day before going to New York or a few other very restrictive states.

 

New York has a death rate of 250 per 100,000 while Florida is at 149 per 100,000. Imagine thinking Florida is more dangerous.

 

As that was being read, people were chomping at the bit to "explain" why Florida is doing a worse job. Of course the 33k dead figure in Florida came up. You know why people think these things? Because they are influenced in doing so.

[BlerkOne]

15 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

 

New York has a death rate of 250 per 100,000 while Florida is at 149 per 100,000. Imagine thinking Florida is more dangerous.

 

As that was being read, people were chomping at the bit to "explain" why Florida is doing a worse job. Of course the 33k dead figure in Florida came up. You know why people think these things? Because they are influenced in doing so.

 

An example of how to lie with statistics. NY was hit very hard early in the pandemic as it was where the virus landed from Europe first. Current 7 day average deaths are virtually the same - 92 for NY vs 93 for FL. Currently Florida is number one in cases of the more contagious UK variant.

 

At best, any correlation between lockdowns and covid cases or deaths is anecdotal.

[Joebucks]

1 hour ago, BlerkOne said:

 

An example of how to lie with statistics. NY was hit very hard early in the pandemic as it was where the virus landed from Europe first. Current 7 day average deaths are virtually the same - 92 for NY vs 93 for FL. Currently Florida is number one in cases of the more contagious UK variant.

 

At best, any correlation between lockdowns and covid cases or deaths is anecdotal.

 

And there's the explanation. Even cherry-picking this, specific, point in time, they are still neck and neck. One is locked down, with a ton of restrictions. One is wide open. We can nitpick, all we want. For example, Florida has an older population, but who's counting? NY being hit hard by having frequent international travel really doesn't help its case either. 

[BlerkOne]

6 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

 

And there's the explanation. Even cherry-picking this, specific, point in time, they are still neck and neck. One is locked down, with a ton of restrictions. One is wide open. We can nitpick, all we want. For example, Florida has an older population, but who's counting? NY being hit hard by having frequent international travel really doesn't help its case either. 

 

Considering the snowbird traffic between NY and Florida, which lockdowns don't impact, I would expect a lot of similarities and carriers. But still, it is a stretch to say lockdowns don't have an positive impact at reducing the spread of the virus. It can't spread if there is no contact. Warmer temps in Florida lead to people being outdoors more, and more spread out, where the virus doesn't spread as easily.

[jfunk138]

14 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

I doubt some figment gets the credit. It couldn't possibly have anything to do with Florida has the most cruise ships, or that the Mardi Gras will be home ported in Port Canaveral, the availability of LNG, Carnival's headquarters are in Miami, the first cruises will be 7 days or less, not all destination ports will be open, etc.? Or could it?

The cruiseships don't belong to Florida, they could be floated anywhere in the world, including homeport #2, which is also colored similarly.  It's almost as if Carnival is looking for "states that are open"

[Tippyton]

3 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

 

Considering the snowbird traffic between NY and Florida, which lockdowns don't impact, I would expect a lot of similarities and carriers. But still, it is a stretch to say lockdowns don't have an positive impact at reducing the spread of the virus. It can't spread if there is no contact. Warmer temps in Florida lead to people being outdoors more, and more spread out, where the virus doesn't spread as easily.

California would like to enter the chat...

[BlerkOne]

52 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

The cruiseships don't belong to Florida, they could be floated anywhere in the world, including homeport #2, which is also colored similarly.  It's almost as if Carnival is looking for "states that are open"

Contracts and tax breaks don't mean anything either, I suppose.The CDC guidelines apply the same to all states, regardless of color. I doubt the Caribbean islands moved themselves to be located closer to Southern states because of politics.

 

What color are the Bahamas, because cruising might well begin there before the US? Supposed to start in July.

[bitemyfly]

We had vaccines developed and in people arms in a year, they are working today !more are coming online , it’s gets better weekly. I understand people will cherry pick data and point to this spot or that to suggest it’s not working .  They will eventually give it up. As deaths continue to drop.

We are blessed in the states as other parts of the world not so fast with vaccinations . 

Cruising will  return , and the restrictions of today( double masks)  most likely will be different when it does ultimately does return..

cruising is always going to be market driven , I will also say that some prominent voices within a cruise forum  really does not reflect the market .. 

most nearly all friends and neighbors here in Florida are vaccinated , though lowered the age bracket starting Monday  , there is many alternatives site to get vaccinated. even my neighbors in nyc are starting to get vaccinated after very slow start ...

Giant light at the end of the tunnel and it’s not a train .. 

[jfunk138]

10 hours ago, Tippyton said:

California would like to enter the chat...

California:  "Despite our longest and hardest lockdowns and our younger population, we're barely doing better than Florida!"  "Port of Long Beach?  Disneyland isn't even open yet!"

[BlerkOne]

2 hours ago, jfunk138 said:

California:  "Despite our longest and hardest lockdowns and our younger population, we're barely doing better than Florida!"  "Port of Long Beach?  Disneyland isn't even open yet!"

Average age in California is virtually the same as New York.

 

Where can cruises from California go in 7 days or less? If Mexico closes, nowhere. Inspiration and Imagination were scrapped and Radiance isn't ready yet.

 

Disney Cruises from anywhere, aren't cruising.

[jfunk138]

3 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

Average age in California is virtually the same as New York.

 

Where can cruises from California go in 7 days or less? If Mexico closes, nowhere. Inspiration and Imagination were scrapped and Radiance isn't ready yet.

 

Disney Cruises from anywhere, aren't cruising.

I don't think New York is on the shortlist of homeports to reopen either.

 

Got any facts to support Mexico closing?  Mexico has been among the most travel friendly countries in the western hemisphere during the pandemic and doesn't have any entry restrictions at all.

Edited March 13, 2021 by jfunk138

[BlerkOne]

3 hours ago, jfunk138 said:

I don't think New York is on the shortlist of homeports to reopen either.

 

Not much of a stretch.

 

3 hours ago, jfunk138 said:

 

Got any facts to support Mexico closing?  Mexico has been among the most travel friendly countries in the western hemisphere during the pandemic and doesn't have any entry restrictions at all.

Nope. And no facts that cruising will begin from Florida before Mobile. One fact is the CDC says you should avoid all travel to Mexico.

"Travelers should avoid all travel to Mexico."

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/travel/notices/covid-4/coronavirus-mexico

 

and I'm pretty sure cruise lines haven't forgotten how quickly Mexico was off limits when Swine Flu hit, and Canada isn't an option now.

 

Looks like there are about 26 options aka countries in the Caribbean.

 

 

Edited March 14, 2021 by BlerkOne

[elcuchio24]

We'll see what the restrictions actually look like when sailing begins. That being said, we have been doing AIs, which have basically no restrictions. So we'll keep doing those until we're comfortable with what cruise lines are doing...

[bdever]

On 3/6/2021 at 7:44 AM, 19cruiser59 said:

I don't think i will mind some of the restrictions. But i would like to see the cruise line ( Carnival, NCL, whoever ) also bear some responsibility and limit the number of guests onboard that will make it more palatable to abide some of these restrictions.

 

If like the airlines they just go full speed ahead and pack them in then i am not sure how much 'Fun' it would be.

THIS! Control capacity and restrictions are a lot easier to deal with to the point of being pleasant. 

[simplelife]

On 3/6/2021 at 7:51 AM, ledges1 said:

With the anticipated return of cruising, excitement is high as are bookings. Many of us remember cruising as it once was. With new restrictions, will this limit the FUN on Carnival and possibly sour the experience until restrictions are lifted. This could take a year or two. Will these possible restrictions limit the FUN.

1. Mask required

2. Limited seating in nightclubs

3. Limited seating in shows

4. Limited seating/games in casino

5. Slow turnover of players in casino resulting in waiting to get a slot machine

6. Carnival only excursions

7. Fewer ports of call due to slow reopening by other countries.                  8. Key West no longer available as a destination and Grand Cayman may limit cruise ship visits.                              

9. Hairy chest contest eliminated.          

10. Lido deck games removed due covid restrictions; putt putt, cornhole, chess, ping pong, ice carving, mixology contest, hot tubs, etc...                               I have no real insight to what the restrictions may be, but in reallity, these could all occur.  Will this effect your experience?

1. I've gotten so used to wearing a mask, it honestly does not bother me much.

2. I don't go to the clubs.

3, This one is of concern since limited seating likely may that fewer people could attend; however, if there are fewer people on board, this will be mitigated.

4. Don't use casino much

5. Don't use casino much

6. Don't do many excursions

7. Love seadays

8. last time we stopped in Key West it was for a few hours in the morning , nothing open except tourist trap souvenir shops . Much prefer a land trip there.

9. Contestants can wear a mask and distance

10. Some of the deck games could be adapted. 

 

I personally very little that would affect my experience. I'd sacrifice these things if it meant I could cruise again.

 

 

[elcuchio24]

On 3/12/2021 at 2:05 PM, BlerkOne said:

You're right. Anecdotal. Wake me up when there is consensus.

 

Meanwhile Spring Break is starting. Brazil apparently has a case of a person infected with 2 strains of the virus. It just keeps on keeping on.

 

Until the whole world is at herd immunity, it really isn't. There will continue to be mutations and international travel and outbreaks.

 

Same with other diseases. Doesnt mean you have to shut your life down. Over the years I had H1N1, Malaria, Dengue, and 'Rona. Just part of life. I'm happy to get the vaccine. But certainly wont, and havent. shut my life down in the meantime. 

[Surfwench]

I do hope one important detail is changed forever. No more communal serving spoons and tongs in the buffet, touched by 4000 of my closest friends, lol. 

[debnrick]

What would help would be cruise lines offering some sort of compensation for some of the things we may not be able to do in the future. That and lowering the capacity. What would it look like, staying 6 feet apart in the buffet line or at a bar with a ship at full capacity? Deck chairs 6 feet apart .. it’s sometimes hard as it was to get one. I understand things may be different on cruise ships now, but with that, cruise ships need to accommodate/adapt any changes for their guests to make it as fun as it always has been. We pay a lot of money to do a lot of things.  We should pay less to do less things. To me, sailing at half capacity is better than zero capacity. 

Edited March 20, 2021 by debnrick

[jfunk138]

1 hour ago, debnrick said:

What would help would be cruise lines offering some sort of compensation for some of the things we may not be able to do in the future. That and lowering the capacity. What would it look like, staying 6 feet apart in the buffet line or at a bar with a ship at full capacity? Deck chairs 6 feet apart .. it’s sometimes hard as it was to get one. I understand things may be different on cruise ships now, but with that, cruise ships need to accommodate/adapt any changes for their guests to make it as fun as it always has been. We pay a lot of money to do a lot of things.  We should pay less to do less things. To me, sailing at half capacity is better than zero capacity. 

Half capacity may work for Disney who can fall back on its content empire when parks aren't profitable.  There is no such luck for the cruiselines.  If cruiselines are forced to sail at half capacity, you can certainly expect to be paying double.  

If you wanted to pay double, there were already cruiselines that would give you twice the space for the double the price.  The mass market cruiselines (like Carnival) offer the prices they do because they pack so many people in.