Please, just require passengers to be vaccinated so we can get back to sea.

[Shorewalk Holmes]

4 hours ago, kearney said:

So if you know everyone is vaccinated... masks shouldn't be needed... The reason you do is that you can't trust unvaccinated not to wear masks..or at least that is the assumption.

 

Good point (assuming you meant 'can't trust unvaccinated to wear masks').

 

Unfortunately, there are some on these boards who have actually stated that they will use fake vaccine cards. 

 

And there's a much bigger group who brag about breaking other covid rules. I'm sure most are honest people who just disagree with the rules. But would some of them fake a vaccine card?  No way to know.  Would they lie about symptoms to board?  No way to know.

 

I'm vaxxed, so I don't worry about my health. But there could be cases among the vaccine cheats that would scuttle the cruise.

 

Royal may conclude for now that the best way to prevent this is to require masks in high risk areas, because that precaution can be observed by the crew. 

   

Edited April 28, 2021 by Shorewalk Holmes

[harkinmr]

23 minutes ago, BeachyBrowns said:

Probably because of this: https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/04/18/scams-coronavirus-vaccination-cards/

Royal doesn't want to do what would have to be done to ensure, with legal liability at stake, that everyone is in fact vaccinated and not just claiming to be vaccinated.  And I don't blame them.  I have no idea how they would catch the liars, but it would be expensive and probably intrusive, with the potential for some bad publicity, however they might do it.  I wish there were an easy way to make absolutely sure that people are vaccinated.  That would make the situation much simpler.

Then they should in no way be promoting their cruise line as being dedicated to safe cruising.  They should not be making claims that their vaccine policy and other health protocols will ensure a safe and healthy cruise for their guests.  I understand that they are concerned about liability, and certainly guests will be signing away whatever rights they have if in fact their cruise goes south or they become infected or ill.  But if you cannot assure people that you have a plan in place to prevent those who are not in compliance with the rules from boarding, then just fess up and admit that it will be a crap shoot and best of luck to everyone.  For sailing out of the US, those lines that are going to mandate vaccines will certainly be hard pressed by the CDC to prevent fraud and to enforce the rules.  

Edited April 28, 2021 by harkinmr

[kirtihk]

1 hour ago, easy1234 said:

All guests over the age of 10 are required to wear masks at all times except when actively eating and swimming, regardless of vaccination status. Guests 10 and under do not need to wear masks. This is based off guidance from the UK's NHS. The question is, which experts do we listen to? The CDC who says kids need to wear masks regardless of age, or the NHS which says they dont and putting masks on 3-year-olds can literally cause them to suffocate?

 

https://www.doncasterccg.nhs.uk/babies-and-children-under-11-years-do-not-require-face-masks/?doing_wp_cron=1619634869.6805739402770996093750

I have a friend who religiously chews 36 times each bite (good for a proper digestion).  Will it be considered passive eating?  Seriously, what a foolish world we live in these days?! 

[coffeebean]

6 hours ago, kearney said:

I don't mind some masking...but the problem I have is my glasses fogging up... 

Here is a quick and easy way to prevent eye glasses from fogging up when wearing a mask.

No more eyeglasses fogging up when wearing a mask

[harkinmr]

2 minutes ago, easy1234 said:

Interesting, because the experts at the NHS are saying something completely different (emphasis theirs, not mine). Here is their exact quote:

 

"Babies and young children under 3 years must not wear face coverings or masks as they can lead to suffocation."

 

https://www.doncasterccg.nhs.uk/babies-and-children-under-11-years-do-not-require-face-masks/?doing_wp_cron=1619634869.6805739402770996093750

 

It sounds like you are saying the experts are wrong, may I ask what your credentials are which makes you a more authoritative source on this topic than the doctors and scientists at the NHS? Also, not sure where 3 masks came from?

I live in the US, so I don't abide by NIH guidance.  Our rule is 2 years and older.  The issue with children less than 2 has to do with being able to properly wear the mask or being unsupervised while wearing it and perhaps chocking on it.  Again, no one here in the US suggests putting a mask on an infant.

 

My mistake on the 3 mask reference.

 

[kearney]

8 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

Here is a quick and easy way to prevent eye glasses from fogging up when wearing a mask.

No more eyeglasses fogging up when wearing a mask

What a great hack.. I will try that... that has been my one issue that drives me nuts about constant mask wearing... almost fell over a curb once when I had put it on walking towards a store

[harkinmr]

1 minute ago, easy1234 said:

You are right you live in the US, but you explicitly stated that masks do not cause children under 3 to suffocate, and the experts (doctors and scientists) explicitly state masks on children under 3 puts them at risk for serious injury. You are flat out saying the experts are wrong, so what are your credentials to say these experts are wrong?

 

I DID say that the rule for 2 and younger IS because of the risk of serious injury, such as chocking or not being able to wear the mask properly.  That is the CDC guidance.  

[Keksie]

1 hour ago, BeachyBrowns said:

The corollary to the idea of free speech that no one seems to remember is that everyone else is just as free to call out stupidity when they see it.  "Free speech" does not mean that anyone can say anything without fear of paying a social price for it in the form of criticism.

Why would anyone fear criticism from random strangers on social media?  

[kearney]

1 hour ago, Shorewalk Holmes said:

 

Good point (assuming you meant 'can't trust unvaccinated to wear masks').

 

Unfortunately, there are some on these boards who have actually stated that they will use fake vaccine cards. 

 

And there's a much bigger group who brag about breaking other covid rules. I'm sure most are honest people who just disagree with the rules. But would some of them fake a vaccine card?  No way to know.  Would they lie about symptoms to board?  No way to know.

 

I'm vaxxed, so I don't worry about my health. But there could be cases among the vaccine cheats that would scuttle the cruise.

 

Royal may conclude for now that the best way to prevent this is to require masks in high risk areas, because that precaution can be observed by the crew. 

   

That is why I think they should also require the negative covid test before the cruise...so that at least the people who aren't telling the truth are not carrying the virus... at least another layer.... ps thanks for correcting my post... type too quickly

[coffeebean]

2 hours ago, kearney said:

What a great hack.. I will try that... that has been my one issue that drives me nuts about constant mask wearing... almost fell over a curb once when I had put it on walking towards a store

Good luck. Hope this works for you.

[harkinmr]

2 hours ago, easy1234 said:

 

Actually thats not the guidance, the guidance is under 2, not 2 and younger.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/daily-life-coping/children/protect-children.html

 

"Children 2 years of age and older should wear a mask."

 

But that is not the point because you explicitly stated:

 

Ok, enough with the drama.  Masks do not make anyone suffocate and no one suggested putting 3 masks on anyone.

 

Which is not what the experts at the NHS state (as demonstrated), so you are saying the experts are wrong but appear that you wont admit to saying the experts are wrong?

Enough!  I said that I made a mistake with the 3 mask reference.  You are playing with semantics here.  I said that the US does NOT go by NIH guidance.  Children are susceptible  to injury because masks can be worn improperly or without supervision.  That is what causes the injury.

 

I forget, what was the focus of your original post?  Are you complaining because cruise lines might make children wear a mask?  Or that they might require anyone, including adults and children, to wear a mask? The UK sailing masking protocols are, apparently, driven by the NIH.  US cruises will be driven by CDC guidance, which is 2 years and up requiring a mask.  My suggestion is that if you are at all concerned about the mask requirements for a sailing, that you take those concerns up with the individual cruise line.

[lenquixote66]

10 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

We should all contribute to a fund to buy you a special cruise on that day, as a treat. ☺️

Thanks ,VA resident.One of my son in laws grew up in the great state of VA.

[lenquixote66]

9 hours ago, molly361 said:

There is a fellow CC member (who is also a friend)  that shares the same birthday as me

That is great

[broberts]

4 hours ago, easy1234 said:

Ok, I stand corrected, but which experts do we listen to? the experts which say children 2 years old and above should wear masks, or the experts which say those 10 and under should not wear masks, and children 3 and under *must* not wear masks as they very well could suffocate and die?

 

It's quite simple. In the US follow the CDC guidance. In the UK follow the NHS guidance. And, in Canada follow the Health Canada guidance. Which, by the way makes the most sense 🙂 "Children under the age of 2 should not wear masks. Between the ages of 2 and 5, children may be able to wear a mask if supervised. This will depend on their ability to tolerate it as well as put it on and take it off. Children older than 5 should wear one in situations or settings where they're recommended."

[lenquixote66]

On 4/27/2021 at 4:55 PM, DirtyDawg said:

West Virginia is giving a $100 saving bond to young people when they get vaccinated. 💲

I think tickets to a full capacity NFL game would work better because they couldn't get a full capacity game until they get their buddies, and their buddies', buddies vaccinated too. Maybe include a keg for the tailgate party too. 

Which team would that be for ?

[lenquixote66]

On 4/27/2021 at 6:48 PM, TheMastodon said:

Brilliant.  I would do anything back in the day for ice cold Slugweiser

When I was in college the norm was not not to drink beer but rather to smoke............

[John&LaLa]

12 hours ago, BecciBoo said:

100??  You said you were in your 9th decade!

 

75 if I was a betting man.

 

9 decades is his 'funny' way of saying he's lived in 9 decades😉

[Seville2Cabo]

1 hour ago, John&LaLa said:

 

75 if I was a betting man.

 

9 decades is his 'funny' way of saying he's lived in 9 decades😉

About right. I’ve lived in 8 decades and am not 65 yet

[Fabulous97]

In the US you have the CDC

In the UK we have the NHS

 

They both have different guidance. The cruises from the UK will be advised by the NHS and the British government. All over 18s must have both vaccinations, under 18s a clear PCR test not lateral flow. We have an NHS app to show our vaccinations including date, batch and type. A piece of paper or vaccination card will not be accepted. Only UK residents are allowed on board as well.

 

We are restarting cruising.

 

Every country Cyprus, Greece, Spain etc will have its own rules.

 

Good luck to the US however you will have your government/boards to decide what is acceptable. 

[Bobal]

1 hour ago, Fabulous97 said:

 

We have an NHS app to show our vaccinations including date, batch and type. A piece of paper or vaccination card will not be accepted. Only UK residents are allowed on board as well.

 

 

Is this shown on your NHS app? Mine only shows the date of my first vaccination - it doesn't even mention which type it was, let alone batch 🤔

[BeachyBrowns]

14 hours ago, Keksie said:

Why would anyone fear criticism from random strangers on social media?  

Are you asking why social media is the way it is?  People care—way too much—about what is said to and about them on social media.  Given what we have seen about the deleterious effects of social media on society, you could just insist that people ignore others’ statements or not take them seriously, which is also an option IRL, but people don’t do that.  They do take it seriously, and they do feel social pressure.  That’s another of those corollaries of free speech: that speech will affect people’s thoughts and behaviors.  If it didn’t, there would be no need to protect it, because speech itself would be powerless.

[BeachyBrowns]

16 hours ago, harkinmr said:

Then they should in no way be promoting their cruise line as being dedicated to safe cruising.  They should not be making claims that their vaccine policy and other health protocols will ensure a safe and healthy cruise for their guests.  I understand that they are concerned about liability, and certainly guests will be signing away whatever rights they have if in fact their cruise goes south or they become infected or ill.  But if you cannot assure people that you have a plan in place to prevent those who are not in compliance with the rules from boarding, then just fess up and admit that it will be a crap shoot and best of luck to everyone.  For sailing out of the US, those lines that are going to mandate vaccines will certainly be hard pressed by the CDC to prevent fraud and to enforce the rules.  

That’s not exactly realistic for a corporation desperate to get back to its billion-dollar money-making enterprise, is it?  Brutal honesty is not going to entice many people.

[Keksie]

1 minute ago, BeachyBrowns said:

Are you asking why social media is the way it is?  People care—way too much—about what is said to and about them on social media.  Given what we have seen about the deleterious effects of social media on society, you could just insist that people ignore others’ statements or not take them seriously, which is also an option IRL, but people don’t do that.  They do take it seriously, and they do feel social pressure.  That’s another of those corollaries of free speech: that speech will affect people’s thoughts and behaviors.  If it didn’t, there would be no need to protect it, because speech itself would be powerless.

I guess it looks like a question and I agree that people take what random strangers say way too seriously.  I just don't understand why people don't realize it doesn't matter what someone says and why they feel everyone should agree and have the same opinions.  Maybe a generational thing.  When we got bullied (no social media) at school your parents taught you to fight or gave you the  "sticks and stones"  speech.  Then they gave you more chores to do to keep you busy.  

[kearney]

Two interesting developments 1) CDC seems to be more flexible to cruising starting by July 2) Florida, not trusting CDC is continuing to push for an injunction against CDC.  So perhaps we will have cruising out of US ports. Attaching a link to one of several stories on the CDC CDC responds to cruise line request . To me one of the most important quotes  "It said, 'Cruising will never be a zero-risk activity,' adding that the goal of the CSO phased approach was to resume operations in a way that cuts the risk of COVID-19 transmission onboard ships and across port communities." It has seemed over the past year that we moved from flattening the curve... to keep health care facilities from being overwhelmed to zero covid..an impossible goal... I am glad to see that they recognize that zero-risk is an impossible goal.  Fingers crossed that this isn't some kind of head fake.... but perhaps we will see ships sailing this summer out of Florida and other US ports.

[harkinmr]

11 minutes ago, BeachyBrowns said:

That’s not exactly realistic for a corporation desperate to get back to its billion-dollar money-making enterprise, is it?  Brutal honesty is not going to entice many people.

I know that.  But it is dishonest.  With the news out today from the CDC, certification of vaccine status will be required from the cruise lines, so they will be on the hook legally whether they like it or not.