Celebrity used to be a step above the rest....Not anymore

[tfred]

2 hours ago, marieps said:

I was about to explain the reasons I just booked 61 days in Asia with Regent.   I believe my fellow posters leave nothing for me to add.  

61 days on Regent is a very big number. That is not the customer that X is looking for.  
 

 

[Duanerice1]

I'm just a normal cruiser.  No Regent or Oceania for me.  Out of my budget for a cruise but a cruise is just a small part of our vacation portfolio.  Fancy, huh, vacation portfolio... lol  But we do take a lot of non cruise vacations. 

 

Been sailing almost exclusively Celebrity since 2007.  Family situations and Covid broke that streak but went back last April.  One of the best cruises we have been on.  We only sail in a balcony so don't expect any special treatment but everyone we had contact with was pleasant, especially if we smiled and said hello.  Food was good but then we are nor foodies so take it for what it's worth.  The only issue I have is the entertainment isn't that good. 

 

Is it less than it was years ago?  Sure but not as far off as most people post.  It's still a bit above many cruise lines and it's still our preferred when the prices are right.  We have no interest in spending the money for the luxury lines.  We go just to have fun, we don't need to be pampered or catered to.  Just be nice and give us good food and we'll be happy... lol

 

 

[deliver42]

Not thinking luxury lines because i can't afford them, but the lines supposedly above Carnival, Royal, MSC, and NCL. Celebrity was my 1st choice after sailing on the Equinox and Beyond. Now, they've priced themselves close to the luxury, with the perks close to the lower tier. I'm now looking at princess and HAL for our next cruise, with both at a much better price point with All In including gratuities.

[PTC DAWG]

5 hours ago, QuestionEverything said:

I am on Oceania Insignia right now.

It is the same experience I had on Century in 1994 - premium. Gracious, one class, magnificent high tea, over the top service, high end food with multiple restaurants with large menus.

It is like a blast from the past.

To be clear, Celebrity is not a premium line, it is a mass line.

There is a big jump from Celebrity to an Oceania, Azamara etc.

Very different product offering. I cancelled Celebrity in 2018.

Celebrity used to be the Oceania of the day, it is quite the collapse of a company.

Consumers, there is significant choice in the market, no need to purchase Celebrity, you can move on if you wish.

I think I would be bored stiff after 10 PM or so…am I wrong? 

[QuestionEverything]

Just now, PTC DAWG said:

I think I would be bored stiff after 10 PM or so…am I wrong? 

Depends.

What entertainment do you want at 10pm?

Oceania has a happy hr, rock and roll music at 10, casino, trivia after 10.

It is all about analysis of the product offering.

O is patronized by older, classy, intellectual, economically successful patrons.

I am on the young side. Not interested in noise, vegas at sea, incense in Eden etc.

 

[poeticlicensed]

30 minutes ago, Duanerice1 said:

I'm just a normal cruiser.  No Regent or Oceania for me.  Out of my budget for a cruise but a cruise is just a small part of our vacation portfolio.  Fancy, huh, vacation portfolio... lol  But we do take a lot of non cruise vacations. 

 

Been sailing almost exclusively Celebrity since 2007.  Family situations and Covid broke that streak but went back last April.  One of the best cruises we have been on.  We only sail in a balcony so don't expect any special treatment but everyone we had contact with was pleasant, especially if we smiled and said hello.  Food was good but then we are nor foodies so take it for what it's worth.  The only issue I have is the entertainment isn't that good. 

 

Is it less than it was years ago?  Sure but not as far off as most people post.  It's still a bit above many cruise lines and it's still our preferred when the prices are right.  We have no interest in spending the money for the luxury lines.  We go just to have fun, we don't need to be pampered or catered to.  Just be nice and give us good food and we'll be happy... lol

 

 

I feel the same, but I'm having issues finding decent prices. We aren't interested in the Caribbean, as we've BTDT too many times. And that seems to be the direction Celebrity is heading. 

 

[Dolebludger]

A poster above asked what would be the equivalent in a Sky Suite on Regent or Oceania. Don’t know about Oceania — never cruised on that line. But have cruised Regent more times than I can count. My recommendation would be any suite except a few. Go to the web site and look at the suites on all ships. All are suites, but one ship has a few window suites (an oldie). And the three newest ships have base level suites that are too small IMHO, so an upgrade is needed. An adequate suite on Regent has 300 sq. ft. Inside area plus balcony. A bit smaller than a Sky Suite, but as the ships are uncrowded, you needn’t spend as much time in the suite. Inclusions you’ll miss in a SS are use of mini fridge beverages, room service without limits, basic shore excursions, nearly equal guest to staff ratio, gratuities,  an uncrowded “main ship” environment, no up charge items on the MDR menu, and a generally upscale (but not stuffy) environment. Dress code will always allow casual. There are no lines or crowds onboard, s]and no chair hogs at the pool. 
 

Our last two cruises pre-pandemic were in Celebrity suites. They were at less cost then than Regent, and great. Our sole post pandemic cruise was on Regent. No deterioration in perks and service. In face it seems to have improved. 
 

 

[marieps]

1 hour ago, tfred said:

61 days on Regent is a very big number. That is not the customer that X is looking for.  
 

 

You've made my point for me.  =X= and DW and I are no longer a fit.  If you expand my signature, you'll see I've been a loyalist for 13 years.  Sillie's October TA will be our 19th =X= cruise.  Things change.

Edited August 30, 2023 by marieps

[jaywoods678]

Depending on itinerary and time of year, we've been able to book Oceania for only slightly more, and in one case even less, than Celebrity on a per diem basis. And Oceania is a true premium line. I can no longer justify the cost of Celebrity especially considering all the cuts. I've even heard some people say they've been able to book the true luxury lines like Silver Sea, Seabourn, and Regent for only slightly more.

[jaywoods678]

22 hours ago, mnocket said:

That's been my choice.  X no longer offers the experience I desire.  My next 3 cruises are on Windstar, Regent, and stepping down a bit - MSC Yacht Club.  I used to be happy with the Celebrity and Princess products, but not so much anymore. So my decision was to cruise a little less frequently, but pay up for a luxury, small ship experience.  

 

Do I think Celebrity cares?  Not necessarily.  I'm sure they would prefer that I trade up to their luxury line Silversea and I'm sure many do.  On the whole, it's my opinion that the major cruise corporations are finding that their Premium lines don't generate the same profit per customer as their luxury or mainstream lines do. Hence all these changes to the Premium lines are intended to essentially make them mimic their mainstream product.  Their bet is that their loyal Premium customers will either accept the changes or move to a luxury line - most of which are part of the very same corporations.  It's a win-win for the corporations as the less profitable Premium lines are essentially phased out in favor of the more profitable mainstream and luxury lines. 

I completely agree with this. You basically wrote down my thoughts exactly. And I believe this is a good theory. I'll elaborate. The large mainstream lines have economies of scale. They may have lower fares but have lots of first timers and families. These customers spend onboard. They spend on alcohol, excursions, photos, souvenirs, art auctions, spa services, etc. They also have a lot more cabins filled with four people. All of this obviously makes them more money. On the other end, the true luxury lines make more money simply because of the high fares. Then you have the lonely premium lines in the middle - HAL, Celebrity, and Princess. From my own personal experience and from others, these are the lines making the most cuts. Yes, all lines are making some cuts, even the upper premium lines like Oceania but NOTHING like the others. In fact, even on mainstream line Carnival, on their newest ships, they've actually eliminated extra charge fees for many of their specialty restaurants, so not only are they not cutting as much, they are actually giving more. They are still providing free lobster on formal night whereas their premium brand Holland America is not. Go figure. For all of us experienced cruisers who prefer the aforementioned premium lines, we've sailed a lot. We are most likely not purchasing photos, we are probably booking our own private excursions, I can't remember when I've last been to a spa onboard, and we don't spend money in the shops. So the lines don't know what to do with us or ways to squeeze more money out of us. They know we are not going to fall for all the gimmicks, so they are simply just going to cut cut cut until they can't cut anymore. At this point, these lines have already cut so much that they are pretty much indistinguishable from their mainstream counterparts. I think they would love to get rid of this category and just roll these lines in with the mainstream ones and just consider these lines the more "adult focused" versions. For me, there is really no reason to pay more to sail with the premium lines. I will just start sailing the mainstream lines and, if I want a better experience, will from time to time sail on a line like Oceania.

[PTC DAWG]

S Class or Edge is about as small of a ship as I want to sail on…the Ultra Luxury lines are probably a no go me.  Y’all enjoy. Horses for courses. 

[poeticlicensed]

1 hour ago, jaywoods678 said:

I completely agree with this. You basically wrote down my thoughts exactly. And I believe this is a good theory. I'll elaborate. The large mainstream lines have economies of scale. They may have lower fares but have lots of first timers and families. These customers spend onboard. They spend on alcohol, excursions, photos, souvenirs, art auctions, spa services, etc. They also have a lot more cabins filled with four people. All of this obviously makes them more money. On the other end, the true luxury lines make more money simply because of the high fares. Then you have the lonely premium lines in the middle - HAL, Celebrity, and Princess. From my own personal experience and from others, these are the lines making the most cuts. Yes, all lines are making some cuts, even the upper premium lines like Oceania but NOTHING like the others. In fact, even on mainstream line Carnival, on their newest ships, they've actually eliminated extra charge fees for many of their specialty restaurants, so not only are they not cutting as much, they are actually giving more. They are still providing free lobster on formal night whereas their premium brand Holland America is not. Go figure. For all of us experienced cruisers who prefer the aforementioned premium lines, we've sailed a lot. We are most likely not purchasing photos, we are probably booking our own private excursions, I can't remember when I've last been to a spa onboard, and we don't spend money in the shops. So the lines don't know what to do with us or ways to squeeze more money out of us. They know we are not going to fall for all the gimmicks, so they are simply just going to cut cut cut until they can't cut anymore. At this point, these lines have already cut so much that they are pretty much indistinguishable from their mainstream counterparts. I think they would love to get rid of this category and just roll these lines in with the mainstream ones and just consider these lines the more "adult focused" versions. For me, there is really no reason to pay more to sail with the premium lines. I will just start sailing the mainstream lines and, if I want a better experience, will from time to time sail on a line like Oceania.

That would be unfortunate. If they make X like RCCL I'm out completely. My last Royal cruise cinched it. We hadn't been on Royal for nearly 15 years and were given a free cruise.  It wasn't the food or the price. It was the noise. I feel like the Grinch when I say that, but the noise noise noise. They played music so loud in public areas I was literally covering my ears. By comparison, X is peaceful. 

 

I booked our first HAL cruise. Seriously looking at Oceania. I'd rather cruise less with better itineraries  than move to Royal. Didnt like Carnival or NCL either.  

[doghog]

57 minutes ago, poeticlicensed said:

That would be unfortunate. If they make X like RCCL I'm out completely. My last Royal cruise cinched it. We hadn't been on Royal for nearly 15 years and were given a free cruise.  It wasn't the food or the price. It was the noise. I feel like the Grinch when I say that, but the noise noise noise. They played music so loud in public areas I was literally covering my ears.

 

By comparison, X is peaceful. 

 

I booked our first HAL cruise. Seriously looking at Oceania. I'd rather cruise less with better itineraries  than move to Royal. Didnt like Carnival or NCL either.  

Bummer for you. We haven't experienced any of that on the RC ships we've cruised on. We don't do the three mega ships (Oasis class ships) so maybe they crank the music up higher on those three ships. Also depends on the venue. 

 

Funny, there has been posts on the Celebrity forum about the loud music being played on Celebrity's E class ships. We didn't think the music being played, wherever we were was loud. We could talk with out yelling.

 

I guess noise (music) is another subjective subject. 

Edited August 30, 2023 by doghog

[MamaFej]

Disclaimer: I am not a business person. My only experience with worrying about profit was in the context of organizing and working at fundraising events for the non-profit school and community organizaions I've volunteered for over the decades. Small potatoes. 

 

That said, it seems short-sighted, to me, to squeeze out/diminsh the Premium lines. I see them as potential bridges from the mass market lines to the Premium Plus or Luxury lines. 

 

Certainly, some cruisers start out crusing the Luxury lines. Most don't. Most never will. 

 

I would imagine that most cruisiers start at the Carnival or RCCL, etc.  level. If they enjoy that level, they might continue cruising, eventually moving to the HAL or Celebrity level. If they continue to enjoy cruising as their incomes and financial security rise, they may come to move to Premium Plus and then perhaps to the true Luxury lines, some of which are owned by parent companies of Mass Market and Premium lines. 

 

If, for example RCCL cruisers feel they'd enjoy a more premium experience like Celebrity has traditionally been, but aren't yet ready to go to SilverSea, what might they do? Taking away that bridge won't necessarily keep them on the side of the stream they started on, it may cause them to  eschew cruising altogether in favor of Premium travel experiences elsewhere. Why not keep the bridge, and keep collecting the tolls, even (and especially) if they never cross the bridge entirely?

 

It also seems to me, that with so many Celebrity cruisers here and on other platforms, talking about jumping ship to lines such as Oceania, Viking, Azamara, and even Regent, Seabourn, Crystal, etc., that RCI would do well to offer a one-time loyalty bump relative to current Captains Club level on Celebrity for SilverSea in order to try to keep cruisers "in the family" so to speak.

 

 🤷🏻‍♀️🤷🏻‍♀️🤷🏻‍♀️

[odyssyus]

19 hours ago, tfred said:

61 days on Regent is a very big number. That is not the customer that X is looking for.  
 

 

They know this.  Their comment was an opportunity to flex, nothing more.  

[wineoclock]

@MamaFej Celebrity need hire you. Your posts are always measured & talk sense. Something X seems to have forgotten about. 

[ChucktownSteve]

On 8/29/2023 at 3:38 PM, QuestionEverything said:

I am on Oceania Insignia right now.

It is the same experience I had on Century in 1994 - premium. Gracious, one class, magnificent high tea, over the top service, high end food with multiple restaurants with large menus.

It is like a blast from the past.

To be clear, Celebrity is not a premium line, it is a mass line.

There is a big jump from Celebrity to an Oceania, Azamara etc.

Very different product offering. I cancelled Celebrity in 2018.

Celebrity used to be the Oceania of the day, it is quite the collapse of a company.

Consumers, there is significant choice in the market, no need to purchase Celebrity, you can move on if you wish.

TY. IMO Celebrity has always been a mass market line. Granted, elevated above their peers but still mass.  Just because they called themselves Luxury, didn't make it true.  They never were a premium line either. I've sailed mostly on Celebrity pre-pandemic but have included both premium and luxury cruise lines since.  It's easy to tell the difference when you've experienced it.

 

Over a year ago, I realized Celebrity was moving closer to the bottom of the mass market lines; not elevating themselves except for the prices.  Only recently have I observed a huge change in many CC poster's opinions...many of whom used to be cheerleaders. That's the true tell.

[ChucktownSteve]

On 8/29/2023 at 5:50 PM, fsdorado said:

What is the equivalent to an Edge-class SkySuite on Oceania and Regent?

 

 

Frederick

One of the three bottom categories on Regent's newer ships but with more inclusions.

Edited August 31, 2023 by ChucktownSteve

[adolfo2]

On 8/29/2023 at 12:31 PM, tiggypooo said:

With all of the cutbacks and exclusions, they are on par or below the other options now.

Cruisers expect great food and service. These just don't exist anymore.

Is it now worthwhile to go to the next step and book luxury?????

 

Celebrity Suite/Retreat pricing is on a par w/Seabourn, etc. 

[adolfo2]

16 hours ago, MamaFej said:

I would imagine that most cruisiers start at the Carnival or RCCL, etc.  level. If they enjoy that level, they might continue cruising, eventually moving to the HAL or Celebrity level. If they continue to enjoy cruising as their incomes and financial security rise, they may come to move to Premium Plus and then perhaps to the true Luxury lines, some of which are owned by parent companies of Mass Market and Premium lines. 

Just like it was w/cars... Chevrolet->Oldsmobile->Buick->Cadillac

[ECCruise]

On 8/29/2023 at 8:25 PM, Ex-Airbalancer said:

 

A and O are $ hundred more per night than X when I compare cruises 

 

Sometimes yes.  Quite often, no.

Since =X=, Azamara and Oceania are the 3 lines we've sailed most frequently, we often compare.

 

Here is an example of Azamara vs. Celebrity.  10 day, Eastern Med, summer 2024.  Balcony cabin, Deck 7 both. All inclusive. Azamara including grats, no grats for =X= after October. Both refundable.

$200 OBC, =X=. $300 OBC Azamara.

 

Celebrity: $9233.18

Azamara: $8291.24

[TeeRick]

On 8/29/2023 at 12:31 PM, tiggypooo said:

With all of the cutbacks and exclusions, they are on par or below the other options now.

Cruisers expect great food and service. These just don't exist anymore.

Is it now worthwhile to go to the next step and book luxury?????

 

short answer yes.

[AF-1]

what is the daily dining dress code for Oceania, Regent, Silversea's etc?  Thank you

[RichYak]

25 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

short answer yes.

Longer answer. I recently disembarked after 12 nights on Summit. The post-cruise survey had the question "How likely are you to choose Celebrity for your next Cruise?" I gave them a 2 out of 10.

[bac513]

On 8/29/2023 at 12:56 PM, mnocket said:

That's been my choice.  X no longer offers the experience I desire.  My next 3 cruises are on Windstar, Regent, and stepping down a bit - MSC Yacht Club.  I used to be happy with the Celebrity and Princess products, but not so much anymore. So my decision was to cruise a little less frequently, but pay up for a luxury, small ship experience.  

 

 

In my experience, MSC Yacht Club is not stepping down from Retreat at this time. Better amenities include:

 

• Price for a seven day cruise $2-3,000 less for a suite compared with Sky Suite
• All YC suites in one area of ship with key controlled access
• Excellent Butler Service - they strive to please
• Minibar included
• Buffet for breakfast and lunch on pool deck
• Good food and Service in YC Restaurant
• Reserved theatre seating area for all shows
• Complimentary bottle of alcohol (Got 1 liter bottle of Grey Goose)
• Really good pizza that can be delivered to cabin or even pool deck
• Special are for luggage drop off and embarkation

 

The main negatives compared with X are limited itineraries, small or no OBC, gratuities extra.