Discounting is going too far!

[retailoil]

I just got back from a cruise on the Summit yesterday from San Juan. For some background, I took the same cruise a year ago so I have a historical comparison.

 

Here are my observations:

 

1. Cabins the same as last year (I stayed in a Suite this cruise and a CC last year). Rooms in moderately good shape. In the suite, the door fell off of a cabinet when opened, there was sea-salt leaking in around seals in one of the windows, room was not properly dusted on the first day.

 

2. Dining room staff excellent both cruises

 

3. Ports: Tobago a disappointment, Bonaire much better for shopping and general experience.

 

4. Food quality: reasonable, seemed better a year ago

 

5. Grand midnight buffet: gone this year and replaced with a chocolate and fruit buffet which was disappointing.

 

6. Temperature of ship: warmer this year, seemed they turned up the thermostats.

 

7. Passengers: This is the point I want to stress the most. Fellow passengers have changed significantly from 2008 to 2009. I believe Celebrity is currently doing itself and it's high-value customers a disservice by discounting the cruises to a level where they are bringing on a low class passenger to fill the empty cabins. These passengers are rude, pushy, demanding, etc and are creating a very poor atmosphere for the rest of us. My cruise cost (between the room and the excursions, wine, normandie, bar, casino) approx $9000 for my family of 4 not including airfare, etc. For that kind of money I do not expect to be pushed from elevators, struggle for the last pad of butter at the buffet, have to look at slobs in shorts in the dining rooms (one of the reasons many of us escape to the Normandie), deal with loud abnoxious passengers, etc. If this discounting coutinues, I will not again book a cruise on any line other than Crystal and Radisson as it is not worth spending the $$ only to have to deal with that group. I spoke to other passengers on the ship who have also taken other Celebrity Cruises and they agree.

 

I believe it's better to sail the ship with fewer high-value customers who will return again and again rather than fill up some low end cabins with anyone looking for a buffet dinner and some time at the pool.

 

Celebrity-please consider the long term ramifications of customer goodwill erosion due to your discounting. I understand the recession is deep, but please look at other ways of margin recovery. I will gladly pay more if I can be assured of a quality experience!!

 

Thanks!

[Ma Bell]

I have two observations. Spring Break and San Juan. For some reason the worst reports always seem to come from these cruises.

[jerseygirl3]

I just got back from a cruise on the Summit yesterday from San Juan. For some background, I took the same cruise a year ago so I have a historical comparison.

 

Here are my observations:

 

1. Cabins the same as last year (I stayed in a Suite this cruise and a CC last year). Rooms in moderately good shape. In the suite, the door fell off of a cabinet when opened, there was sea-salt leaking in around seals in one of the windows, room was not properly dusted on the first day.

 

2. Dining room staff excellent both cruises

 

3. Ports: Tobago a disappointment, Bonaire much better for shopping and general experience.

 

4. Food quality: reasonable, seemed better a year ago

 

5. Grand midnight buffet: gone this year and replaced with a chocolate and fruit buffet which was disappointing.

 

6. Temperature of ship: warmer this year, seemed they turned up the thermostats.

 

7. Passengers: This is the point I want to stress the most. Fellow passengers have changed significantly from 2008 to 2009. I believe Celebrity is currently doing itself and it's high-value customers a disservice by discounting the cruises to a level where they are bringing on a low class passenger to fill the empty cabins. These passengers are rude, pushy, demanding, etc and are creating a very poor atmosphere for the rest of us. My cruise cost (between the room and the excursions, wine, normandie, bar, casino) approx $9000 for my family of 4 not including airfare, etc. For that kind of money I do not expect to be pushed from elevators, struggle for the last pad of butter at the buffet, have to look at slobs in shorts in the dining rooms (one of the reasons many of us escape to the Normandie), deal with loud abnoxious passengers, etc. If this discounting coutinues, I will not again book a cruise on any line other than Crystal and Radisson as it is not worth spending the $$ only to have to deal with that group. I spoke to other passengers on the ship who have also taken other Celebrity Cruises and they agree.

 

I believe it's better to sail the ship with fewer high-value customers who will return again and again rather than fill up some low end cabins with anyone looking for a buffet dinner and some time at the pool.

 

Celebrity-please consider the long term ramifications of customer goodwill erosion due to your discounting. I understand the recession is deep, but please look at other ways of margin recovery. I will gladly pay more if I can be assured of a quality experience!!

 

Thanks!

 

I'm so sorry for what you experienced on your cruise. I was on one cruise like that, and it really is awful.

 

I do have a question, though. You say Celebrity is discounting, yet the price you paid for this cruise doesn't sound like a bargain. Can you explain...did they offer last minute pricing for new bookings or something like that?

[kennetro]

I couldn't agree with you more! While I do realize that some cruises, depending on times & destinations do lend themselves to the "more casual cruisers", the cruise lines these days are only exacerbating the problem through heavy discounting. (Yes, partly out of necessity, due to the economy). But I'm with you. I'd rather pay a decent (fair) price and not feel as if I'm on a floating "Wal-Mart". ...and I won't even start on "dress codes" here. Suffice it to say, if one is not willing to dress appropriately, or is intent on "seeing what they can get away with" then do the rest of us a favor & just stay at HOME in your "Grrrr-Animals"!! :-)

[Texed]

I have two observations. Spring Break and San Juan. For some reason the worst reports always seem to come from these cruises.

 

I agree Joanie, but we went on Summit March 14th, and had no really bad issues. :)

[Fblack]

I agree with Ma Bell about demographics, discounts, and San Juan. And I don't know where most of the passengers on your ship were from. Without meaning to offend anyone, in the past, big discounts out of San Juan have created many problems when lots of Central and South American passengers filled the cabins to maximum capacity. Some ships suffered a lot of "vandalism" and had to implement special rules for all the kids during the cruise.

[Ma Bell]

We were on Constellation beginning March 16th and had no issues either.

[wvufan]

Retailoil, it seems that your references to "low class passengers"..."loud, obnoxious passengers"..."that group" etc. are aimed at the Puertoricans on board.

 

While I don't condone obnoxious behavior from anyone-including Puertoricans, teenagers, Floridians, drunks, etc etc., I am offended by branding a whole group of people with the derogatory statements made in the OP.

 

Want to have fun on a cruise? Make friends with the Puertoricans on board. You will laugh more, dance more, and love more. I have never experienced any other culture with a stronger love of life and joy.

 

Ma Bell said it right-it is spring break time. That alone tends to bring out a more informal and boisterous crowd. The fact that the ship was sailing from PR and they offered lower prices to locals to fill the ship is simply good business. Why do you think they offer resident rates for Floridians?

 

I agree with your point about the negative effects of deep discounting, but certainly not your prejudice against one group.

 

I lived in PR from the age of 10 through college and also served for a year there as an advisor to La Guardia Nacional. My kind of people.

 

Happy Sails to You

 

OOOEEE :D:D Bob and Phyl

[Duck Duck Cruise]

~X~ is not a luxury cruise line....it is a mass market line...period.

 

I can understand your frustration with the behavior of some passengers and if you want to avoid those problems in the future ... you said it best yourself .... cruise on Crystal or Radisson.

 

It's a shame you view other passengers as "low class" and "slobs".:(

 

Also, choosing your destinations and time of year better might help you avoid the low class slobs.

[AtlantaCruiser72]

No where did the OP state that the bothersome passengers were of a particular nationality or ethnic background. Rather he was stating that rampant discounting has led to a overall deterioration in passenger quality - both in terms of behavior and dress. Obviously a more Carnival than Celebrity crowd!

 

Also - many times suites book up early and/or are not heavily discounted, even though many other cabins might be. Unfortunately w/ 4 more ships on the way I think the dilution of the Celebrity brand will continue ....:mad:

 

For $9K on RSSC you could most likely have had 2 minimum balcony suites, free flowing alcohol, included gartuities, included soft drinks, included specialty coffes, no fees for specialty dining, and a more refined atmosphere.

[retailoil]

First of all, I am not specifically referring to any single nationality (American, European, or other). I am referring in general to a set of passengers that thinks they are the only ones on the ship.

 

- They consume excessive food at the buffets (wasting a lot of it...like the guy who asked for 4 pieces of pizza when there were others in line behind him and not enough pizza ready to serve all of them)

 

- are rude to their fellow passengers and crew alike (I saw several people consistently asking "gimme" this or "gimme" that with no thank you)

 

- push themselves into elevators and lines without saying excuse me or moving out of the way when someone is getting off an elevator

 

- spend no additional money on the excursions, retail, normandie etc which helps the cruise line with profitability (I'm also a stockholder of RCL)

 

- show up to dining room in shorts, t-shirts

 

- speak loudly in the halls and dining areas (one person basically stood over my family's table while we were eating shouting to his family and friends across the room in the waterfall as if we didn't exist)

 

- reserve 5-6 chairs by the pool with their clothes and never use them

 

Lastly to answer the question from jerseygirl, here is where I spent my money on this cruise:

 

Suite: $5700 for 4 passengers

Insurance: $350

Excursions and Ship board Expenses: $2600

Tips, other: $350

[Kristi Williamson]

First of all, I am not specifically referring to any single nationality (American, European, or other). I am referring in general to a set of passengers that thinks they are the only ones on the ship.

 

- They consume excessive food at the buffets (wasting a lot of it...like the guy who asked for 4 pieces of pizza when there were others in line behind him and not enough pizza ready to serve all of them) LOL So, if you don't eat four pieces, then that automatically constitues that THEY are wastful? How incredibly judgmental of you. And what's more, if X didn't have enough to feed their passengers, that's not anyone's fault but Celebrity's.

 

- are rude to their fellow passengers and crew alike (I saw several people consistently asking "gimme" this or "gimme" that with no thank you) And I'm sure you utter a thank you every single time someone on a cruise line accomodates you? Again, quite judgmental, as you don't know these people in any way and no one is perfect.

 

- push themselves into elevators and lines without saying excuse me or moving out of the way when someone is getting off an elevator

 

- spend no additional money on the excursions, retail, normandie etc which helps the cruise line with profitability (I'm also a stockholder of RCL) And you know this for a fact, HOW? You monitored every persons on board spending habits? Perhaps you should relax and enjoy yourself instead of worrying about what other passengers are spending! And I'm a stockholder in both RCI and Carnival...your point?

 

- show up to dining room in shorts, t-shirts This point is relevant.

 

- speak loudly in the halls and dining areas (one person basically stood over my family's table while we were eating shouting to his family and friends across the room in the waterfall as if we didn't exist)

 

- reserve 5-6 chairs by the pool with their clothes and never use them

So do what you should have done and hand them over to an attendant to be placed in the lost and found!

 

Lastly to answer the question from jerseygirl, here is where I spent my money on this cruise:

 

Suite: $5700 for 4 passengers

Insurance: $350

Excursions and Ship board Expenses: $2600

Tips, other: $350

 

You also seem abnormally concerned with your fare. You agreed to this fare when you booked, correct? If you can't afford it, then perhaps you should attempt to book for less money. Celebrity is a mass marketed line, and is in NO WAY exclusive. What in the world makes you believe it is? We've cruised with them twice and they in NO WAY compare to the Oceania's and Silversea experience. If you want that, then you are the ones who'll need to pay for that, not passengers who paid very similar rates to what you paid.

 

Wow! The level of pompousness in this thread is amazing! X is NOT an exclusive brand. It never has been, nor will it ever be. An extra 500/1000 dollars isn't going to keep RCI, Princess or Carnival cruisers from booking with X, so why are you pretending as though it does and then acting upset when it doesn't? Simply amazing!!

 

I'd place this thread in the....bovine scatology category.

[cvaty]

I just got back from a cruise on the Summit yesterday from San Juan. For some background, I took the same cruise a year ago so I have a historical comparison.

 

Here are my observations:

 

1. Cabins the same as last year (I stayed in a Suite this cruise and a CC last year). Rooms in moderately good shape. In the suite, the door fell off of a cabinet when opened, there was sea-salt leaking in around seals in one of the windows, room was not properly dusted on the first day.

 

2. Dining room staff excellent both cruises

 

3. Ports: Tobago a disappointment, Bonaire much better for shopping and general experience.

 

4. Food quality: reasonable, seemed better a year ago

 

5. Grand midnight buffet: gone this year and replaced with a chocolate and fruit buffet which was disappointing.

 

6. Temperature of ship: warmer this year, seemed they turned up the thermostats.

 

7. Passengers: This is the point I want to stress the most. Fellow passengers have changed significantly from 2008 to 2009. I believe Celebrity is currently doing itself and it's high-value customers a disservice by discounting the cruises to a level where they are bringing on a low class passenger to fill the empty cabins. These passengers are rude, pushy, demanding, etc and are creating a very poor atmosphere for the rest of us. My cruise cost (between the room and the excursions, wine, normandie, bar, casino) approx $9000 for my family of 4 not including airfare, etc. For that kind of money I do not expect to be pushed from elevators, struggle for the last pad of butter at the buffet, have to look at slobs in shorts in the dining rooms (one of the reasons many of us escape to the Normandie), deal with loud abnoxious passengers, etc. If this discounting coutinues, I will not again book a cruise on any line other than Crystal and Radisson as it is not worth spending the $$ only to have to deal with that group. I spoke to other passengers on the ship who have also taken other Celebrity Cruises and they agree.

 

I believe it's better to sail the ship with fewer high-value customers who will return again and again rather than fill up some low end cabins with anyone looking for a buffet dinner and some time at the pool.

 

Celebrity-please consider the long term ramifications of customer goodwill erosion due to your discounting. I understand the recession is deep, but please look at other ways of margin recovery. I will gladly pay more if I can be assured of a quality experience!!

 

Thanks!

Some low class can have manners too, as some snobs can´t have manners as well.

[welly world]

I have to agree with Kristi. We booked on Celebrity for a February sailing. From what I have heard in the past, there have been 'wonderful people' on board. I hope I run into THOSE people and not the pompous ones who think they are better than the rest of the world!

[hcat]

I have two observations. Spring Break and San Juan. For some reason the worst reports always seem to come from these cruises.

 

We had a similar experience a few yrs ago on an Easter cruise (Royal C) from Miami-- many families with unsupervised children--rude pushing & shoving (by children & adults)..chocolate poured onto the art auction, damage to decorative items in the adult Solarium by children, room service cards stolen , children took over the elevators and hot tubs--& the cruise line (Royal ) could not really control it all-- Will never cruise over school holidays or school break times again-- Just not right for us! The irony is that we paid a premium price to book ahead due to the dates.

 

Those who are critical of OP may not have expeprienced a cruise like this-- so just a caution to know what you are booking!

[Kristi Williamson]

I actually HAVE had an experience like the OP. It was, in fact, on RCI. However, the difference is that I don't label every passenger on the ship as "low class". These types are on all ships from every line at one point or another. At least the mass marketed lines like X, RCI, Carnival, and Princess.

 

I suppose that's one reason I always laugh when snobs who regally exclaim Carnival or RCI to be "wal-mart". My dear, any mass marketed line is similar to Wal-Mart and unless you are willing to pay 20,000 dollars for a cruise, you're a Wal-Mart cruiser just like the rest of us.

 

One other thing to note...manners are free. We should ALL have some, including those who would call someone "low class" simply because they can't afford, or because they chose not to afford, a suite. Wealth, or lack thereof, does not, nor has it EVER, equaled class. The original post is proof positive of this statement.

[MisterBill99]

- spend no additional money on the excursions, retail, normandie etc which helps the cruise line with profitability (I'm also a stockholder of RCL)

How do you know this? Did you follow them around the entire cruise? Do you know that they weren't spending money in the bars and casino?

 

And nowhere in this post do I see any evidence that these people were actually traveling on heavily discounted fares, which is the basis of your entire argument. Did you ever find out and just forget to post it? Many people who have money have no class.

 

Would it make you feel better if you found out that these unruly people paid regular price?

[maggieq]

From someone that has cruised out of San Juan 5 times, I believe I can agree with the OP. Up until our last cruise 5/08, we had always enjoyed San Juan as a cruising port. Our other cruises were a good mix of passengers and never really thought twice about booking another one.

 

May 08, however, was the the last one for a while for us. I will say that the passenger mix does have an impact on my vacation. I work very hard and treasure my cruises.

 

I remember my first carnival cruise....it was probably the most dressy out of all cruises I had been on. My ta took the time to go over the dress code, etc. It was a great experience.

 

I'm all for a bargain myself and live in a very diverse state but poor manners just doesn't fly with me.

[glenneagle]

We cruised on x out of San Juan last year.Will never do it again.The passengers were as the Op described. One put her baby in a diaper in the pool. the pool butler told her it was not allowed, He pointed out the sign stating this.Her comment I am not a USA citizen that rule does not apply to me,I paid for my child he will stay in the pool.It caused a problem. Security was called. Her husband and his cronies got involved.This ugly out burst ruined our relaxing day at the pool,The next day they showed up at the pool again drunk and one of the group threw up in the pool, Pool was closed the rest of the day.The noise in the corridors after 11pm was awful, The children ran wild all over the ship.The waiters in the dining room were overwhelmed by the number of entrees ordered. They came to late seating at 9.30pm.Cruise from hell. Never will we do a cruise from SJ again.We have done 30 cruises and never had this on a ship ever.

[Cruisenouvelle]

Retailoil makes a few good points, but bottom line is key. The cruise lines have bills to pay NOW, just like most of us. If they can bring in revenue by slashing fares to attract as many passengers as possible, they will do so.

A suite on a mass-market line is just that. You have to jostle with the riff-raff. And if someone pushes you (in an elevator,etc.) a healthy push back, with a loud "Excuse me", often works wonders.

Keep in mind, too, that different cultures have different customs and manners. The Puerto Rico I have seen is a bit loud, colorful, passionate, proud, and spiritual. I'm sorry the good qualities were were overshadowed by the not-so-good in the passengers you encountered.

That said, I am sorry that you had a poor cruise experience, and hopefully you'll give Celebrity another try at a different time of year and/ or port.

[bob278]

I get somewhat irritated when I see the words 'low class" applied to any group of people, regardless of their economic situation. In reading these posts, I get the feel that there is at least a certain level of agreement on what "class" means. To summarize, it means that someone exhibits courtesy to others and does not intentionally disrupt or interfere with someone else's fun.

 

But it is my opinion that money has very little to do with class. There are some fine people that have very little money and some true jerks that have a lot.

 

Some people get out of hand when they are on vacation and their behavior should have consequences. Unfortunately, the cruise lines are very leery of that as they try hard not to alienate their passengers and the loudest (and usually the most disruptive) will frequently get their way. But that speaks to their manners/standards/custom, not their economic situation. Some of the people that you found to be low class may well have more money than you do.

 

Once you start using terms like "that kind of people" you risk being considered like that yourself by others.

[Can'tstopcruising]

We just booked a back to back from San Juan next winter and I have absolutely no qualms about it.

 

Glenneagle, those pax sound horrendous, but they could have been anyone from anywhere. Furthermore, they could be very wealthy.

 

In my experience, people are people. There are all kinds in every part of the world, of every ethnic group and at every economic level.

 

Cruising on a luxury line (or going to a luxury resort) does not guarantee the character of fellow travellers. There are pushy, loud people in all walks of life.

 

Don't be too influenced by the results of reduced fares. Everyone loves a "deal". Especially ME!!

[chuly]

I really wish people didn't generalize about other nationalities. As a matter of fact Puerto Ricans and Latin Americans in general love to "overdress" specially at night for dinner. It's funny that most Latin Americans think that the "Americans" are the ones always dressing casually at cruises, and caribbean destinations. Go figure.....:confused:

[SusaninCali]

I think the OP is being unjustly labeled as a snob.

 

Just because he didn't specifically cite data that the cruise was heavily discounted to fill the ship doesn't mean it wasn't. The description of the cruisers, if accurate, implies that it was.

 

I can draw some comparisions to the Easter brunch I attended this morning. Not my first choice of restaurants, but was a good value. My MIL wanted to go there, and then ended up cancelling at the last minute. Anyway, the patrons, well...nearly half were not what I'd call appropriately attired (baseball caps, sloppy T-shirts/shorts, etc.). Too many staff with limited English skills which translated to so-so service. Afterwards, we visited my MIL and then went to scope out a place near her home that recently started doing brunch again. ENTIRELY different clientele and staff. I didn't see anyone dressed inappropriate and the atmosphere and menu was much more refined. The price was almost 3X. Worth it I think for when Mother's Day comes around. My point: today's brunch atmosphere was OK for 90 minutes but a week would be challenge.

 

I think the OP was lamenting that the discounting on that cruise went too far. And as far as poster gleneagle noted with the diaper in pool account, believe me as a native Californian who has seen her state inundated with people who do not share Western culture, I've seen much worse. And I, like the OP, would be disappointed to be on a cruise that had enough of such people to deterimentally influence the cruise experience. If this makes me a snob too, then I'm proud to be one.

[hubofhockey]

The last time I checked, this is 2009. If cruiselines want to stay in business, they had better be price competitive. Welcome to the new economy. It must be nice for OP to only have to worry about price only to the extent that it prevents others from cruising Celebrity. That's one heckuva problem to have. I am deciding between Med cruises on the Princess Ruby and the Solstice for next July. For now, prices seem too high on the Ruby. A decent baclony cabin on the Solstice will run my wife and I $5,200. After you add in air, excursions, specialty restaurants and hotels, this is a $9 to $10K vacation. If you are looking to exclude people who can afford $10K on a vacation but not $12K, then maybe you really are a snob. But to the extent I can save some cash, the snobs are stuck with me. :D