What's your take on the alcohol based anti-viral spray/liquid

Do you think the liquid dispensers at the food vendors is enough? I've heard that these ans the soaps can actually add to the problem :( Sadly, I have seen small children and SOME adults leave the restrooms without washing. I bouth spray and liquid several years ago but wondered if I'm overreacting. If, indeed the cruise line furnished hand spray is enough. What's your thoughts ?

Mac

The liquid dispensers at food venues are merely a stopgap to try to prevent those who as you describe do not wash their hands from making themselves sick.

If you take responsibility for your own hygiene--by washing your hands regularly, and not touching your hands to your face after touching a surface in a public room--you will not need any additional liquid or spray sanitizer. The GI outbreaks on cruise ships are caused by a few passengers boarding when sick and other passengers spreading it to themselves due to failure to practice even simple hygiene. Even if you are in the midst of such an outbreak, the additional use of hand sanitizer demanded by the ship will not make you less likely to get sick: you are already exercising adequate due care as long as you have already been adequately washing your hands. That is all that separates the healthy from the slobs.

Vigorous and thorough handwashing is the best way to help prevent illness, but even that is not always foolproof. Over the years, there have been threads here on these boards about passengers who, despite their best efforts, got sick. I mean, you can wash your hands and use the sanitizer after going through the buffet, but what about pulling out your chair when you sit down? How about that drink glass, or that cutlery you are eating with? Do you know how many people have touched it from the time it exits the dishwasher until you use it?

You can make yourself sick with worry. Just be vigilant and try not to overthink it. By the way, Noro and other intestinal illnesses are prevalent all year round and they are everywhere - mall, church, grocery store, hospital, school, work, airplane, cruise ship.... it's just a fact of life.

.

If you have a strong immune system that protects against viruses, you don't need to use the sanitizer. You only need use the sanitizer to give the impression that you're doing your share.

But as fishywood points out, not touching your face helps. Don't scratch your nose, don't wipe your eye, and if you want a biscuit (cookie), make sure you eat it with a knife and fork. And above all, don't ever ever ever use a walking aid, eg. a stick (cane) or a zimmer frame. So many elderly and infirm people use the "restroom" for non-resting purposes, and then fail to sterilize their walking stick afterwards. It makes the whole thing about washing hands become irrelevant. They are, I would assume, among the "slobs" fishywood is so concerned about.

We carry a small hand sanitizer and try to always do it again after looking at menus in the dining room and also after using the utensils in the self serve cafes. We also wipe everything in our room down with Clorox wipes.

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

Every notice the CDC almost never recommends using the anti-everything solutions? The CDC almost always only recommends soap and water...

Wash your hands.

Then the other may reduce another tiny fraction of risk.

Every notice the CDC almost never recommends using the anti-everything solutions? The CDC almost always only recommends soap and water...

That's because soap, water and common sense are the best ways to avoid acquiring unwanted bugs. The ships sanitizer primary purpose is to make people believe they are doing something.

I do NOT buy "anti bacterial" anything. Soap and water is more than sufficient, if you use it properly!

Germs can be washed off....that's what soap does...loosens the germs...the rubbing and rinsing washes them away.

Those alcohol based things might kill some bugs...but most folks don't use enough, or wipe their hands BEFORE the alcohol has dried.....that does nothing to help you. And, anti-bacterials make you MORE prone to infection, in the long run. They should be out-lawed.

Washing your hands and not bringing infectious materials (other people's mucuous, feces, urine, etc. --- sorry about being graphic, but those are the common transmitters of Noro) picked up from doorknobs, faucet handles, serving utensils, etc. to your mouth, nose and eyes - is the surest - but not absolutely certain - way of staying healthy.

Your careless and/or slovenly shipmates leave little land mines all over - you should take care not to pick them up.

So, how many of all y'all excuse yourselves from the table and head off to wash your hands after handing the menu back to the waiter? :rolleyes:

I never pick up careless and/or slovenly shipmates. I am in the Fire Dept and they train EMTs and FD personel to wash their hands for 15 seconds under the spigot with soap. It is as good an infection preventative as any although EMTs wear rubber gloves and some wear a surgical mask. When you are on a ship with 2500 other people chances are 50/50 you'll get sick. I think they are useless as relatives.

I never pick up careless and/or slovenly shipmates. I am in the Fire Dept and they train EMTs and FD personel to wash their hands for 15 seconds under the spigot with soap. It is as good an infection preventative as any although EMTs wear rubber gloves and some wear a surgical mask. When you are on a ship with 2500 other people chances are 50/50 you'll get sick. I think they are useless as relatives.

Every time you touch any surface on the ship which has been touched by anyone else - you are effectively touching everything they have touched over. the preceding several hours.

I think that no matter how often you wash or use sanitizer you can become contaminated immediately after. Wash, and then as soon as you touch the door handle you can have dirty hands again. And norovirus is not so easily removed. Just as one has to drive defensively, one must defend against those unsanitary shipmates.

When I see someone being unsanitary I call them out. I may not have any friends anymore, but I have not been sick very often either.

Great marketing and sales ploy. That's it.

They are a feel good product with little value according to the Heath professionals that I know. Soap, water, and vigorous hand washing is far more effective.

I never use chemicals... I wash my hands constantly... I actually even go back to my own cabin to use the bathroom also, figure less public contact the better.

The alcohol wipe at the entrance to the buffet is actually great for colds and flu. Unfortunately due to the physical make up of that particular virus it does nothing for Noro except maybe make you feel better.

Sent from my iPad using Forums

I agree with others that the hand sanitizes simply give the appearance of the cruise lines doing something.

Same with the notion that cruise ships don't get sick - it is sick passengers that bring it on board. Baloney. While some passengers may certainly bring it on board, it is also true that the majority of cases are caused by improper food handling.

1. Wash your hands well and often,

2. Avoid touching as many things as you can, (especially your face, which is a challenge for many people),

3. Avoid eating certain foods commonly involved in noro outbreaks - leafy greens, poorly washed fruit and shell fish. So yes, pass on the steamed lobster and crab legs,

4. Never use public laundry on the ship,

5. Avoid areas of potential contamination - pool lounge chairs, hot tubs, saunas...

Keep in mind that some people will be infected with noro and will never show any symptoms. That's why passengers can bring it on the ship without knowing and crew can spread it without the ship without knowing.

. We also wipe everything in our room down with Clorox wipes.

Unless you block the room steward from your room you are really wasting your time. They are using the same cleaning rags from the room next door when they clean your room

I know and I try to do it a couple of times during the week. When I do it the first time the wipes are so dirty so it makes me feel better to know it's been cleaned at least to start the trip :)

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

Hospitals, who have lawyers that keep them VERY concerned about minimizing liability for hospital-caused problems, have switched from soap-and-water washing to hand sanitizer use for their personnel. And "evidence-based medicine" has been the rule for at least 3 decades that I know of. (I passed boards as an RN in 1986.) So either there is evidence that the hand sanitizers do as good or a better job of preventing person-to-person germ transmission, or they are ignoring their lawyers and court case precedents.

I believe in hand washing, but that isn't always feasible. I have a hand sanitizer in my purse and will be taking it on our cruise. YMMV.

Do you think the liquid dispensers at the food vendors is enough? I've heard that these ans the soaps can actually add to the problem :( Sadly, I have seen small children and SOME adults leave the restrooms without washing. I bouth spray and liquid several years ago but wondered if I'm overreacting. If, indeed the cruise line furnished hand spray is enough. What's your thoughts ?

 

Mac

Those sprays and liquids have little to no effect on viruses, which is what your title asks about. If the alcohol concentration is high enough they are quiet effective against bacteria. The best preventative is to simply wash your hands well with soap and water for at least 30 seconds (that is actual seconds nto what most people think of as 30 seconds). None of these alcohol based sprays or liquids are effective against the noro family of viruses.

Hospitals, who have lawyers that keep them VERY concerned about minimizing liability for hospital-caused problems, have switched from soap-and-water washing to hand sanitizer use for their personnel. And "evidence-based medicine" has been the rule for at least 3 decades that I know of. (I passed boards as an RN in 1986.) So either there is evidence that the hand sanitizers do as good or a better job of preventing person-to-person germ transmission, or they are ignoring their lawyers and court case precedents.

 

I believe in hand washing, but that isn't always feasible. I have a hand sanitizer in my purse and will be taking it on our cruise. YMMV.

Hand sanitizer may be quite effective in the killing of bacteria but that does not translate to viruses. Also ORs still require full scrub and have not moved to hand sanitizer as a replacement. If you are trying to decrease risk of noro, flu, or even the rhinovirus of the common cold then good old soap and water is still the way to go. As I stated earlier the ships hand sanitizer provides more benefit to the psyche of cruisers than to there health.

Hospitals, who have lawyers that keep them VERY concerned about minimizing liability for hospital-caused problems, have switched from soap-and-water washing to hand sanitizer use for their personnel. And "evidence-based medicine" has been the rule for at least 3 decades that I know of. (I passed boards as an RN in 1986.) So either there is evidence that the hand sanitizers do as good or a better job of preventing person-to-person germ transmission, or they are ignoring their lawyers and court case precedents.

 

I believe in hand washing, but that isn't always feasible. I have a hand sanitizer in my purse and will be taking it on our cruise. YMMV.

There is no question that it works on bacteria (big problems in hospitals) and several viruses. Unfortunately, it is ineffective against Noro :-(

Hospitals, who have lawyers that keep them VERY concerned about minimizing liability for hospital-caused problems, have switched from soap-and-water washing to hand sanitizer use for their personnel. And "evidence-based medicine" has been the rule for at least 3 decades that I know of. (I passed boards as an RN in 1986.) So either there is evidence that the hand sanitizers do as good or a better job of preventing person-to-person germ transmission, or they are ignoring their lawyers and court case precedents.

 

I believe in hand washing, but that isn't always feasible. I have a hand sanitizer in my purse and will be taking it on our cruise. YMMV.

This is simply not true. Granted hospitals are using sanitizers, but they have not switched from soap and water at all,, in fact they routinely recommend both soap and water followed by the sanitizers. The sanitizers that hospitals use are nothing like the ones you buy at the store.

The only good thing about the sanitizers that people can buy is that they help the bottom line of the companies that make them.