Pulling out of Falmouth

[ColoradoGurl]

I'm not trying to insinuate anything about you (I don't even know you), and I am sorry if you took it that way because that was not my intent.

 

 

 

You responded to my comment to try not to conflate fear of culture with fear of crime in a way that seems very personal to you, and if that is the case then I can appreciate that. My point is that these two fears can coexist and even overlap. A number of people on this thread have openly questioned why people fear other cultures without seeming to consider that the fear of crime may also be a separate factor. Your response took it one step further to say that it clearly has nothing to do with crime but only with skin color, at least in the one case you cited. Your assumption may be reasonable to you, but that doesn't mean it is the only possible conclusion here.

 

 

 

To me, Jamaica is one of the more interesting islands in the Caribbean to visit but there is no denying that it has a crime problem, the severity of which we could debate elsewhere. But as I mentioned in an earlier post, my traveling companions were held up at gun point by the hired help at the guest house in Mo Bay, people who were supposed to be taking care of us. So my reluctance to visit Jamaica is based on a fear of crime. I can say it is not a fear of culture until I am blue in the face, but whether or not you believe that is something only you can reconcile. Does this seem reasonable to you?

 

 

Perhaps the defensiveness in my reply to your crime/culture post came off as jumping to conclusions about race myself; given you didn't have the context of my own race and where I was coming from. I apologize for the misunderstanding.

 

I can also see now why you mentioned the crime/culture issue, since I didn't put your earlier post regarding the hold up, together with that reply, and therefore also didn't have proper context.

 

So in answer to your question, yes that seems reasonable to me, and I can see how you would have that point of view now, given that experience. For you, or anyone that has actual experience with crime in that area, I can understand being inclined to not trust the area or the people there (as can be said for anywhere that a person has a scary experience like that).

 

I'm skeptical that the person who said they were afraid of the people outside of the fence had that same experience to work from, but maybe they did. I would assume that if there was an actual reason other than racism for them to have had that reaction, they would have mentioned it.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

Edited July 10, 2017 by ColoradoGurl

[nealstuber]

Article is completely unclear. It says "three cruiselines". It also says Allure of the Seas, Celebrity and one from Royal Caribbean, so where do you get three ships?

 

 

 

From the paragraph further down: "He notes that the three vessels bring a combined 10 thousand guests per visit to the port."

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[whitecap]

From the paragraph further down: "He notes that the three vessels bring a combined 10 thousand guests per visit to the port."

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

I agree with everyone about the "confusing" comments reported in the newspaper. I think the only thing that is clear is that Royal Caribbean and Celebrity are making some type of change. I'm not sure why either cruise line would only stop certain ships from making port calls and not other ships in their fleet. The other question I have is other cruise lines. I know that Princess has been making and has scheduled several ships to stop in Falmouth. I assume that if Royal Caribbean/Celebrity feel that their passengers are in danger so should other cruise lines. I have searched all the cruise line web sites and see no information being provided by any of them so, so far all we have is the Mayor's comments.

[nealstuber]

Falmouth cruiseport was sold to the locals as providing all kinds of outlets for local crafts and so on whereas in reality it's a favoured few who get to sell within its walls, the rest going short as cruisers either whizz past on excursions or don't leave the restricted area.

 

We've been there a few times, one excursion stopped in town at a church being renovated, it was fine, locals friendly and some telling about the history. Also stopped by a cameo maker place, very nice. We then were dropped in Montego Bay for a while. Again, no harassment that a simple 'no thanks' didn't stop. Went in some stores etc. We ended up at the downtown Margaritaville for a very loud (mostly) liquid lunch:D

 

 

 

Compared to Mo Bay, the port facility and the number of vendors in it is quite impressive. And the cabbies and tour drivers and chaperones may also be local. So RCCL held up its end bringing revenue and jobs to this area, it's up to the locals to invest a part of that money outside the port if they expect people to spend time there.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[nelblu]

Compared to Mo Bay, the port facility and the number of vendors in it is quite impressive. And the cabbies and tour drivers and chaperones may also be local. So RCCL held up its end bringing revenue and jobs to this area, it's up to the locals to invest a part of that money outside the port if they expect people to spend time there.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

There's got to be some concerns on RCL/Celeb. part as they pulled out of Martinique (some of the most unfriendly locals that I've come across) and still not sailing the Mexican coast due to crime.

[TeeRick]

There's got to be some concerns on RCL/Celeb. part as they pulled out of Martinique (some of the most unfriendly locals that I've come across) and still not sailing the Mexican coast due to crime.

 

We were in Martinique a year ago and loved it. People were polite and friendly. It seems that RCCL and Celebrity both have a lot of ships stopping in Mexican ports.

[TeeRick]

Try not to conflate a fear of other cultures with a fear of crime.

 

I understand that fear of crime, or terrorism, or anything else is based on an individual's experience and perceptions. Why travel at all if fear is a driving factor? Is staying near your home any safer? As I stated previously, my own direct experience in Falmouth based on 4 actual visits (not perceptions or speculations) is that walking around the town was safe and enjoyable. Others might disagree but that's what I have experienced.

[Biker19]

It seems that RCI and Celebrity both have a lot of ships stopping in Mexican ports.

They do?

[TeeRick]

On the Caribbean side both Costa Maya and Cozumel are stops for both lines on multiple ships. Vision calls on Yucatan. On the Pacific side we have recently stopped in Cabo and Puerto Vallarta on our Panama Canal Cruise.

[bouhunter]

They do?

 

Costa Maya and Cozumel are on LOTS of cruises.

[cruiserdudebobby8]

Following

 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Forums mobile app

[Biker19]

Costa Maya and Cozumel are on LOTS of cruises.

Right, but I think the poster you quoted was talking about West Coast Mexican ports - not Caribbean side.

[HicksRA]

Just from my point of view, upon leaving the confines of the port area on a bus, the slum area outside the gates was stunning. No way would I step outside those gates unarmed. The island is mountainous and beautiful, but I have no desire to return based on the poverty level and appalling living conditions.

And for the record, skin color or race never even entered my mind.

[mcatmcat]

I always try to avoid ships that docks in

Nassau

Jamaica

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[Pratique]

I'm skeptical that the person who said they were afraid of the people outside of the fence had that same experience to work from, but maybe they did. I would assume that if there was an actual reason other than racism for them to have had that reaction, they would have mentioned it.

 

Thanks for your reply. All I will say is that in my experience, some people who have firsthand experience with crime are very reluctant to talk about it, even anonymously in this forum. I have a friend who was assaulted on the subway several years ago and it was very, very difficult for her to talk about it, even to the point where she didn't want to get the police involved. This is part of the reason why I am sensitive to the culture/crime distinction and why I (personally) wouldn't assume that someone would have mentioned crime as a factor in their decision to avoid leaving the port area in Falmouth. Sometimes we don't know why people react the way that they do, or why their reaction, while rational to them, does not seem rational to us.

[cruiselvr04]

We have been to Falmouth many, many times. Sometimes we only go to Margaritaville but have done private and ship excursions and they were very good. Two reasons I don't care for it as much as other ports of call is haressment by a few ( some just don't take no for an answer, no issues inside port fence) and it's far for excursions which means expensive.

It's hard to have an excursion there under $75, part of which may be the distance from port. Which also means long drives on two lane roads where accidents are common. ( wear a seatbelt if available.)

 

We have learned to have a plan in Falmouth. If I would venture into the little city I would only go with a guard and tour. My husband says he is not intimidated by their aggressiveness but I am and I don't like to be uncomfortable in a foreign country. I don't want to be offered MJ three times in a day or threatened to be robbed if we didn't give them money. ( Both of these happened. The threat was near the gate so the DH walked fast and I ran ahead. Of course they then disappeared.)

 

Roatan has its issues too as a crew member (NCL)? was murdered near the port a couple of years ago. However we like it too just don't wander far and book a private or ship excursion.

 

Both ports offer a lot of great excursions and we have another cruise booked for each.

[serialcruiser48]

It would be fantastic if the Liberty included Labadee in it's itinerary to replace Falmouth.

[FLACRUISER99]

I an one of the folks that enjoy Falmouth, and love outside the gates. Felt very safe and though the local's in the shops & bars were very friendly.

[tazdeb]

I just booked a western caribbean cruise for next June on Allure and we dont stop in Falmouth. The ports are Nassau ,Cozumel ,Roatan Honduras, and Puerto Costa Maya.

[srdancer]

On Celebrity 2 years ago and did city/walking tour in Cartagena, Columbia. Street vendors incredibly aggressive. One selling "Panama" hats followed people (not us) all the way back to our bus and almost tried to board trying to push their merchandise. It was quite unnerving.

 

Held up at gunpoint on NYC subway some years ago, on train approaching Grand Central stop. Safe area. In evening but not in the wee hours.

 

So where is really safe?

[Pratique]

So where is really safe?

 

Well I for one am not planning to visit Syria anytime in the foreseeable future. But Hawaii is nice! :)

[hcat]

I suspect that the crafts being sold in Falmouth are about as local to Jamaica as the stuff that is sold in Labadee is to Haiti.

 

Some of the local crafts in Labadee are truly local esp the paintings, netal artwork, etc.

 

Falmouth has a shop that sold beautuful locally made Jamaican clothing...high end, soft white cotton..lovely.

 

both have junk like all ports but always nice to find worthwhile locally made items

 

We loved Martinique...one of our best recent port visits. .We no longer get off in Mexico...been there done that,

[iWillSailAway]

Is Royal pulling out of Jamaica all together or just Falmouth? Doesn't Jamaica have quite a few other ports?

[mommamd]

We are booked on Christmas Cruise on Harmony and I am not sure what my plan is on the Falmouth day, I am considering spending it on the ship. We did a beach day on the last Christmas holiday cruise that landed at Falmouth was just OK, not as great as Nachi Cocum. The seating ran out and we had to sit on the sand. No loungers, etc. after paying excursion prices. I think if we have a great time at Mr Sanchos or Nachi Cocum and then Labadee, we will be ok on the ship. We have done Dunns River Falls and Mo Bay before (and experienced the hard sell from the vendors ;). I don't see a private beach day that really appeals at the right price at Falmouth.

[Ocean Boy]

Just from my point of view, upon leaving the confines of the port area on a bus, the slum area outside the gates was stunning. No way would I step outside those gates unarmed. The island is mountainous and beautiful, but I have no desire to return based on the poverty level and appalling living conditions.

And for the record, skin color or race never even entered my mind.

The island is beautiful but you will not return based in the poverty level and living conditions? Poverty is not contagious and you don't have to live in those conditions. I don't get it. The way I see it while I visit, and enjoy, this beautiful place maybe my tourist dollars will help someone living in poverty and appalling living conditions have just a little bit better life.