Predict when cruising will start again post-Coronavirus

[Russell21]

29 minutes ago, Blackduck59 said:

Sorry to offend, I'll be quiet now.

You don't have to be, you were understandably upset at the second wrecking of your plans. But don't be like so many youngsters, and unfortunately some others who should know better, of today who always look for someone to blame. This covid situation falls under the "Shirt Happens" banner, and understandably all world leaders attempts to handle the situation will unfortunately have a certain percentage of mistakes and failures. The main reason being that our leaders are human beings, not gods.

[OzKiwiJJ]

3 minutes ago, Russell21 said:

The main reason being that our leaders are human beings, not gods.

But some of them think they have a direct hotline to God.😋

Edited May 10, 2021 by OzKiwiJJ

[ilikeanswers]

32 minutes ago, LittleFish1976 said:

 

I was responding to what he said which was the accusation that Australians will not 'welcome... anyone with a strange accent' into our country. I find that offensive. There are many ways he might have phrased what you take to be his meaning but the fact that he chose to phrase it as he did is an underhand accusation of racism and xenophobia, in my opinion (and our own opinion being all that any of us is qualified to speak about).

 

Previously, I've resisted the temptation to be drawn into answering this poster's criticisms of Australian policy and management of the covid pandemic on a number of occasions but am up to pussy's bow with it.

 

I guess if we are going to be pedantic about people's phrasing using "in my opinion" in your original criticism of his wording would have been apt😂. I certainly didn't interpret the words to be any sort racist accusation, perhaps it is the case of same but different English😉. People have their own way of describing things and I don't think one should jump to negative conclusions because of one phrase, I believe context is quite important. One of the beauties of language is how creative we can be with it🤗. 

[onlyslightlymad]

I don't believe our borders will snap open when have reached the required proportion of vaccination.  Instead it will be country by country, slowly, and with new restrictions.  I am so tired of people using the phrase 'back to normal" when they really mean "go back in time".  We can only move forward.  Things will not be as they were before because they never are.  There's always a new normal.

 

This is behind a paywall so I'll copy the relevant bits.  In the Herald.

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/dont-expect-border-to-reopen-like-a-switch-grant-robertson-warns/R2777JESLOZBXVPTOWYTM5PZMY/

 

Robertson was also asked about what would happen with the borders once New Zealanders had been fully vaccinated.

The Government is aiming to get all over-16-year-olds vaccinated by the end of the year.

Robertson said it was not standing still, pointing to the opening of the transtasman bubble and the soon-to-be-open border with Rarotonga.

"Where we can safely open the borders up for people and move people we will do that. We will continue to look for opportunities to do that."

He said the Government was looking at more travel into the Pacific but was also mindful of New Zealand not being a Covid exporter.

"Then once we get everyone vaccinated that opens up more opportunities."

But he warned people against thinking it would be a matter of flicking a switch and turning on travel again.

"It is going to take time, not necessarily so much because of us, but also because of how other countries are thinking, what are the individual decisions people are making, people are going to be cautious about that."

He said an important piece of work that was under way was the work by IATA [International Air Transport Association] on the vaccine passport which would be something people could use to travel more freely.

"That will be an important part of the developments into 2022. So I would see it more as an evolution rather than a flicking of a switch that we will see person-to-person travel."

 

 

[Russell21]

8 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I guess if we are going to be pedantic about people's phrasing using "in my opinion" in your original criticism of his wording would have been apt😂. I certainly didn't interpret the words to be any sort racist accusation, perhaps it is the case of same but different English😉. People have their own way of describing things and I don't think one should jump to negative conclusions because of one phrase, I believe context is quite important. One of the beauties of language is how creative we can be with it🤗. 😁

Should not the last sentence end...... is how creative with it we can be? 🙂

Edited May 10, 2021 by Russell21

[OzKiwiJJ]

2 minutes ago, onlyslightlymad said:

I don't believe our borders will snap open when have reached the required proportion of vaccination.  Instead it will be country by country, slowly, and with new restrictions.  I am so tired of people using the phrase 'back to normal" when they really mean "go back in time".  We can only move forward.  Things will not be as they were before because they never are.  There's always a new normal.

 

This is behind a paywall so I'll copy the relevant bits.  In the Herald.

 

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/dont-expect-border-to-reopen-like-a-switch-grant-robertson-warns/R2777JESLOZBXVPTOWYTM5PZMY/

 

Robertson was also asked about what would happen with the borders once New Zealanders had been fully vaccinated.

The Government is aiming to get all over-16-year-olds vaccinated by the end of the year.

Robertson said it was not standing still, pointing to the opening of the transtasman bubble and the soon-to-be-open border with Rarotonga.

"Where we can safely open the borders up for people and move people we will do that. We will continue to look for opportunities to do that."

He said the Government was looking at more travel into the Pacific but was also mindful of New Zealand not being a Covid exporter.

"Then once we get everyone vaccinated that opens up more opportunities."

But he warned people against thinking it would be a matter of flicking a switch and turning on travel again.

"It is going to take time, not necessarily so much because of us, but also because of how other countries are thinking, what are the individual decisions people are making, people are going to be cautious about that."

He said an important piece of work that was under way was the work by IATA [International Air Transport Association] on the vaccine passport which would be something people could use to travel more freely.

"That will be an important part of the developments into 2022. So I would see it more as an evolution rather than a flicking of a switch that we will see person-to-person travel."

 

 

Which is basically what I've been saying for several months now. Slowly, country by country initially, until the world has stabilized again ... which may take another couple of years according to some articles I've read.

[ilikeanswers]

19 minutes ago, onlyslightlymad said:

I am so tired of people using the phrase 'back to normal" when they really mean "go back in time".  We can only move forward.  Things will not be as they were before because they never are.  There's always a new normal.

 

I would agree with this sentiment. So many threads around CC and posters talks about how they are waiting for things to go back to normal before they start travelling. It seems to me they will be waiting till time travel is invented😂. 

[frantic36]

3 hours ago, possum52 said:

Just because you and others want to cruise, is not a reason the general population will decide to have the vaccination.

I am saddened that you think my main motivation for reopening the borders next year is because I want to cruise. I have already decided it is highly unlikely that my January cruise will go ahead. My main concerns is more for families locked away from each other and the mental health of the ongoing uncertainty of border closures even within Australia.

 

Just curious when do people think that Australians will feel safe enough to re-open borders and how much of the general population vaccinated will be acceptable to do so? 

 

From some of the comments here it sounds like 2, 3 or even 4 years because Covid will not just disappear like SARS did.

 

I posted this prior to reading the latest entries as I have been out for awhile. Only slightly mad thanks for the Herald piece. I do agree that there will be a new normal and people will need to accept that including something like a vaccine passport.

Edited May 10, 2021 by frantic36

[OzKiwiJJ]

6 minutes ago, frantic36 said:

I am saddened that you think my main motivation for reopening the borders next year is because I want to cruise. I have already decided it is highly unlikely that my January cruise will go ahead. My main concerns is more for families locked away from each other and the mental health of the ongoing uncertainty of border closures even within Australia.

 

Just curious when do people think that Australians will feel safe enough to re-open borders and how much of the general population vaccinated will be acceptable to do so? 

 

From some of the comments here it sounds like 2, 3 or even 4 years because Covid will not just disappear like SARS did.

I don't think there can be any clear answer yet as to what percentage of the population needs to be vaccinated to give us a safe and stable situation. And, as I said above, the borders aren't going to open to the whole world any time soon but rather on a country to country basis. 

 

As more people are vaccinated I imagine we'll see less state border closures but until them those who wish to travel interstate will need to be flexible in their arrangements. 

[possum52]

11 minutes ago, frantic36 said:

I am saddened that you think my main motivation for reopening the borders next year is because I want to cruise. I have already decided it is highly unlikely that my January cruise will go ahead. My main concerns is more for families locked away from each other and the mental health of the ongoing uncertainty of border closures even within Australia.

 

Just curious when do people think that Australians will feel safe enough to re-open borders and how much of the general population vaccinated will be acceptable to do so? 

 

 

My answer was in response to you saying that if we are awash with vaccines by October, we can start opening up to other countries. As this is a cruise forum, and we have all been discussing whether our cruises will go ahead or not, I assumed you were talking about cruising at the end of the year. My point was that if we don't have mandatory vaccination, some, or even many may choose not to have it for whatever reason and we cruisers going cruising is not likely to be a reason they would decide to have the vaccination. 

 

I also have relatives interstate - a sister in Tasmania and a brother in QLD whom I haven't seen in nearly two years. We were meant to be together for my father's 90th birthday April 2020 but couldn't be. We are hoping to be all together towards the end of June for my mother's 90th. Fingers crossed we will be able to do so.

 

Leigh

[getting older slowly]

Predicting future......    how long is a piece of string.......

I feel that....it is a case of moving goal posts..... where will they end up....

 

Nobody could know what was in store ( well maybe what is in Dan's )  

everybody has an opinion,  some are glass half full,  others half empty...

 

Yes one would like to go back a couple years....

but we are here now, and not really in our control....

 

Hoping to go to Tassie one day..... when... honestly not sure....

 

But we can dream cann't we......   at the moment  is it..... IF   &/or  WHEN..

 

Don......  better start dinner

[OzKiwiJJ]

Part of the problem is that we don't know what variants of the virus are going to pop up next. Will the vaccines still give protection or will there be another race against the clock to develop new variants of the vaccines.

 

Yes, many of us want to travel but would it be worth the risk if we ended up with a major outbreak because the border opened too soon? Or if, despite being vaccinated, we ended up catching a new and nastier variant of the virus during our travels?

Edited May 10, 2021 by OzKiwiJJ

[pully8]

Thank goodness for the forum where people can communicate and vent if needed, albeit with respect and kindness.

Possibly with the last year major changes, personal losses and disappointments many are experiencing grief and being able to share and discuss with hope for the future is valuable.  

[Chiliburn]

13 minutes ago, pully8 said:

Thank goodness for the forum where people can communicate and vent if needed, albeit with respect and kindness.

Possibly with the last year major changes, personal losses and disappointments many are experiencing grief and being able to share and discuss with hope for the future is valuable.  

We are all having our emotions.
For me it’s some of the strongest in my life.

[RickCanada]

5 hours ago, Blackduck59 said:

 

I really don't want to get in a fight with you Julie or a back and forth for that matter. I have said many times I understand why the border is closed now and support it. Just as our border is closed to the US but it's a little harder to make that stick. I am talking about the thought process that says we'll lock our people up perhaps another year or 2 rather than make the virus less of a threat by using whatever we can to get our people vaccinated in a timely fashion.

So far there have been 2.6 million doses of vaccine administered in all of Australia and we passed 2 million doses in our province (population 4.7 million) on Thursday. Have we made mistakes? Absolutely. Were we able to keep the virus out? No, we share the longest undefended border in the world with a country which until recently had little interest in addressing covid 19. Has the Canadian population embraced the restrictions and protocols like you have in Oz? unfortunately not even close. Have we researched and approved several different Vaccines? Yes 4. Have some of our "pop up" vaccination clinics been a cluster F**k most definitely. They were set up in high incidence area and people came from miles away in numbers that far exceeded the available supply. That was a simple case of "me first" mentality. In BC there is a system, register by age group so as to not crash the system and they get back to you so you can make an appointment. It works until the same people who have flaunted the rules and helped the spread decide they are "entitled" to a shot out of turn.

Have we had screw ups? The list is endless. Has our Prime Minister failed at times? Yes. Has he been absent? no.

In Canada over 50 per cent has had their first dose.

[LC1950]

Personally, I doubt if we will ever get back to the "old normal".  Nor will we have a "new normal".  I think it will be just one foot in front of the other and a day by day sort of thing. 

 

Yep, I'm peeved and I'm personally feeling oppressed and - dare I say it?  Yep, why not, everyone else sprouts - I'm feeling depressed.  Have been for 12 months. 

 

Lyle, my heart goes out to you and your beloved with your crushed plans.  I feel so bad for you.  But, life does goes on so just try and accept and go on and on and on.  I send all my very best wishes to you and hope in the future things turn around for you. 

 

LOL, I was a dancer way back in the day (LOL you wouldn't think it to see me now) but I was always taught "the show must go on".  And it does, so please, do not despair.  There is always a light at the end of every dark tunnel.  Best to you and yours.

[OzKiwiJJ]

1 hour ago, RickCanada said:

In Canada over 50 per cent has had their first dose.

Which is great but it's still going to take time to see results from that especially as it appears people aren't fully protected until at least two weeks after their second dose. 

[Porky55]

Article on research into the variants, the vaccine and immunity :-

 

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-01-coronavirus-variants-deadly.html

 

[Chiliburn]

There’s suspicion about the this virus.

This virus has a thing called a furin cleavage which isn’t normal.

 Apparently the coronavirus family doesn’t have it and scientists are wondering where it come from.
The furin cleavage makes ideal for a human host.

 It could be a natural mutation but very very unlikely.

 

 I like cleavage but not where it shouldn’t be.
 

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-020-0184-0

[1980dory]

13 minutes ago, Chiliburn said:

There’s suspicion about the this virus.

This virus has a thing called a furin cleavage which isn’t normal.

 Apparently the coronavirus family doesn’t have it and scientists are wondering where it come from.
The furin cleavage makes ideal for a human host.

 It could be a natural mutation but very very unlikely.

 

 I like cleavage but not where it shouldn’t be.
 

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-020-0184-0

Absolutely!  I once dated a gal who had this and it certainly wasn't normal!

[Chiliburn]

9 minutes ago, 1980dory said:

Absolutely!  I once dated a gal who had this and it certainly wasn't normal!

In the upper area,Yes.

 

Here’s another.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210217/The-origin-of-SARS-CoV-2-furin-cleavage-site-remains-a-mystery.aspx

[MicCanberra]

Fur in cleavage sounds like a totally different thing to plumbers' crack.

[By The Bay]

18 hours ago, Blackduck59 said:

Thanks Leigh, I'm really not sure I care anymore. Your government and many of your people have posted "closed for visitors" loud and clear as well as making it clear that it will be years perhaps never before anyone with a strange accent will be welcome there.

This is the latest statement about the borders from a Federal minister. Not looking good.☹️

 

"The budget assumes the border will open in 2022, but Finance Minister Simon Birmingham has conceded that probably doesn’t mean it will do so on January 1: “We certainly don’t expect to see major movements in international borders until into next year and probably some distance into next year.”"

[Chiliburn]

2 minutes ago, By The Bay said:

This is the latest statement about the borders from a Federal minister. Not looking good.☹️

 

"The budget assumes the border will open in 2022, but Finance Minister Simon Birmingham has conceded that probably doesn’t mean it will do so on January 1: “We certainly don’t expect to see major movements in international borders until into next year and probably some distance into next year.”"

We will probably hear something in the budget tonight.

 

[Chiliburn]

9 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

Fur in cleavage sounds like a totally different thing to plumbers' crack.

I don’t like hairy chests.