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Next announcement of cancellations


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5 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

Kind of...for me that means:

 

-- Difficulty getting through on the phone generally.

-- All sorts of barriers made if you do have a problem on board which continues to require a solution when you get back (even before the pandemic).

-- Questions before you go on holiday difficult to get a straight, consistent answer.

-- All the daft emails they send in general.

 

 

 

 

Getting through on the phones is a difficult but try contacting Marella near impossible.

no idea about second point but heard stories which back your statement.

we never had a problem but that doesn’t mean there isn’t one.

you can opt out of emails my beloved loves to look at them than compare prices.

Edited by Bazrat
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5 minutes ago, Bazrat said:

I agree but what happens if they have to change them they would have to inform you about the changes, so the information you would receive would most likely change if there becomes another problem, than the accusations of them not knowing what there doing would be justified.

Exactly this. Whatever they do, there'll be someone who doesn't agree with the way they've done it. If they lay out a plan now and then it changes every week, it could possibly cause more confusion and annoyance than if they say nothing at all until it's 100%. 

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13 minutes ago, Bazrat said:

Costa are only cruising to Italian ports from Italy so I am taking a guess that there trying out the systems, so yet again taking a guess it will take P&O longer because of going to European ports.

I see your point but are P&O trying to learn from the experience of Costa.  Your guess/es could be correct or could be incorrect.

 

Only P&O knows if they are looking across the Carnival umbrella or not.  Perhaps they could say?

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6 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

Exactly this. Whatever they do, there'll be someone who doesn't agree with the way they've done it. If they lay out a plan now and then it changes every week, it could possibly cause more confusion and annoyance than if they say nothing at all until it's 100%. 

Again, I see your point, there is no way to satisfy everyone, but if their internal view is that it is hard to communicate decisively with customers until say, four weeks before the phased relaunch, why can P&O not work with Carnival to change balance due dates to reflect this?  A holding statement to this effect would be possible?

 

This would give them a certain amount of space for greater certainty to emerge against the backdrop of the current ambiguity.

 

This would likely satisfy quite a broad spectrum of the prospective customers and I can't see who, customer wise, would be particularly upset by this?

Edited by No pager thank you
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3 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

 

Only P&O knows if they are looking across the Carnival umbrella or not.  Perhaps they could say?

True but it’s a bit different sailing around the med with the windows open to let fresh air in than sailing around the UK, which my husky would appreciate a darn site more than me.

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1 minute ago, Bazrat said:

True but it’s a bit different sailing around the med with the windows open to let fresh air in than sailing around the UK, which my husky would appreciate a darn site more than me.

I agree with you there, it's not like for like. But as far as I know, there are no confirmed plans at all for test cruises round Blighty in November.  It's all (mainly) supposed to be North and Mediterranean European cruises

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5 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

Again, I see your point, there is no way to satisfy everyone, but if their internal view is that it is hard to communicate decisively with customers until say, four weeks before the phased relaunch, why can P&O not work with Carnival to change balance due dates to reflect this?  A holding statement to this effect would be possible?

 

This would give them a certain amount of space for greater certainty to emerge against the backdrop of the current ambiguity.

 

This would likely satisfy quite a broad spectrum of the prospective customers and I can't see who, customer wise, would be particularly upset by this?

Totally agree re balance due dates. That's a very simple change that they could make that would make a huge difference to their customers. 

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Just now, No pager thank you said:

I agree with you there, it's not like for like. But as far as I know, there are no confirmed plans at all for test cruises round Blighty in November.  It's all (mainly) supposed to be North and Mediterranean European cruises

I know we’re booked on Iona in November but like I have posted repeatedly we will not cruise until they tell us what are the systems to keep us as safe as possible, but most of the stops are in countries that are on the banned list so I very much hope we cruise this year but I doubt it.

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1 minute ago, Bazrat said:

I know we’re booked on Iona in November but like I have posted repeatedly we will not cruise until they tell us what are the systems to keep us as safe as possible, but most of the stops are in countries that are on the banned list so I very much hope we cruise this year but I doubt it.

Personally, (as a guess only) I'm beginning to think that the UK banned list will be replaced by this idea of double testing following the EU colour coding model.  I think that there is about a 30% chance of our Christmas cruise sailing.

 

As a second guess, I would say that when P&O decide that it is safe to cruise, then the flexibility not to cruise will be withdrawn, except for medical exemptions ... social distancing measures and all that follows will be considered a reasonable adjustment which does not cause P&O to be required to offer cancellation of the holiday (which would be mean).

 

I hope that I am closer with my first guess than second by the way 😉

 

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2 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

Personally, (as a guess only) I'm beginning to think that the UK banned list will be replaced by this idea of double testing following the EU colour coding model.  I think that there is about a 30% chance of our Christmas cruise sailing.

 

As a second guess, I would say that when P&O decide that it is safe to cruise, then the flexibility not to cruise will be withdrawn, except for medical exemptions ... social distancing measures and all that follows will be considered a reasonable adjustment which does not cause P&O to be required to offer cancellation of the holiday (which would be mean).

 

I hope that I am closer with my first guess than second by the way 😉

 

I also sincerely hope your second guess is wrong - many cruise for the social aspect, which will go out of the window, particularly awful for those travelling solo - this would not be a holiday for them; as an esteemed poster once said (Denarius, I think) it would be an ordeal to be endured.

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45 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

Unless they take a leaf out of Cunard’s book and ditch a larger chunk of their planned programme and do some shorter cruises closer to home. Again, they need to be informing passengers of their plans 

I suspect that when they do re-start, for a while cruises will be much closer to home than normal.

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12 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

I also sincerely hope your second guess is wrong - many cruise for the social aspect, which will go out of the window, particularly awful for those travelling solo - this would not be a holiday for them; as an esteemed poster once said (Denarius, I think) it would be an ordeal to be endured.

Fingers crossed that I am wrong as I see what you are saying.  At the end of the day, a holiday, howsoever taken, is meant to be relaxing and enjoyable for the traveller🤞

 

To be honest, as a couple of my recent posts probably show, my level of faith in P&O isn't high at the moment.

Edited by No pager thank you
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29 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

Personally, (as a guess only) I'm beginning to think that the UK banned list will be replaced by this idea of double testing following the EU colour coding model.  I think that there is about a 30% chance of our Christmas cruise sailing.

 

As a second guess, I would say that when P&O decide that it is safe to cruise, then the flexibility not to cruise will be withdrawn, except for medical exemptions ... social distancing measures and all that follows will be considered a reasonable adjustment which does not cause P&O to be required to offer cancellation of the holiday (which would be mean).

 

I hope that I am closer with my first guess than second by the way 😉

 

If your option 2 is correct that would be grossly unfair and I think it would be difficult for P&O to defend. What is likely to be the rules on the first few cruises will be a long way away from what we all booked up to 2 years ago. I think that there are many that want to cruise regardless and they are not wrong, everyone has to do what they are comfortable with, but if you don't want the new regime than there has to be a get out. Either that or they should move payment dates to much nearer departure time.

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I was under the impression the world was under a pandemic, so it goes without saying cruising is going to change in the short term, those who chose not to cruise should not be penalised by cancelling there holidays

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1 hour ago, Bazrat said:

I agree but what happens if they have to change them they would have to inform you about the changes, so the information you would receive would most likely change if there becomes another problem, than the accusations of them not knowing what there doing would be justified.

Whatever happens, they have to take decisions, and communicate them to passengers in a transparent way. 

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1 hour ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

Exactly this. Whatever they do, there'll be someone who doesn't agree with the way they've done it. If they lay out a plan now and then it changes every week, it could possibly cause more confusion and annoyance than if they say nothing at all until it's 100%. 

In that case, they’d have to wait months and months, even a couple of years, before they could announce anything. They will have to make some sort of decision before then 

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3 minutes ago, Bazrat said:

I was under the impression the world was under a pandemic, so it goes without saying cruising is going to change in the short term, those who chose not to cruise should not be penalised by cancelling there holidays

I agree with those who say that it is unfair to expect passengers to travel.

 

That said, many customers on land based package holidays, who booked whilst their country was listed as "green" are now finding as follows:

 

-- Flight prices, and occasionally accommodation costs are non refundable after balances are paid, irrespective of when that was.

-- Even with a FCO travel advisory, non travel is counted as "disinclination to travel."  This means no refund entitlement.

-- Travelling against FCO advice results in some travel insurances being invalid (depending on when the trip was booked).  14 day quarantine follows.

 

Ultimately, travellers are left with a difficult choice.  The choice to travel comes with accepting all of the modifications which follow.

 

I do see a worry that, eventually, cruise ship travel will be treated similarly (when, in principle, travel is safe).  The rider is of course when the travel was booked may come as the saviour, assuming that the cruise has not been transferred/rebooked with a FCC since.

 

Again I reiterate that I want to be wrong, but that's the evidence for my current guess if that makes sense.☹️

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8 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

In that case, they’d have to wait months and months, even a couple of years, before they could announce anything. They will have to make some sort of decision before then 

100% was probably the wrong thing to say. I should have said until they're more certain. I gather from Mole that they've been close to announcing a restart but then the cases started rising in Europe and back came the quarantine from certain countries. I would guess that the current increase here will unsettle them too. 

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6 minutes ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

100% was probably the wrong thing to say. I should have said until they're more certain. I gather from Mole that they've been close to announcing a restart but then the cases started rising in Europe and back came the quarantine from certain countries. I would guess that the current increase here will unsettle them too. 

I feel really sorry for them, as it’s incredibly difficult for them to know what to do.

 

all I’m really saying is that they do need to make decisions, and communicate them to us - even if it’s a long term cancellation 

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What should be done and what will be done are completely different scenarios. We saw this with the refunds and communication throughout. 

Bear in mind the staff losses and a complete restructuring of the business and trying to survive. 

Sadly, we are not that high on their 'to do' list at the moment, they are potentially fully booked, depending on capacity, for a year or more, but that will have to change. 

Andy 

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1 minute ago, AndyMichelle said:

What should be done and what will be done are completely different scenarios. We saw this with the refunds and communication throughout. 

Bear in mind the staff losses and a complete restructuring of the business and trying to survive. 

Sadly, we are not that high on their 'to do' list at the moment, they are potentially fully booked, depending on capacity, for a year or more, but that will have to change. 

Andy 

The difficulties that some of the staff with whom customers come in to contact with are enormous I agree.  That does not justify the well reported poor behaviour experienced by some customers and the choices not to tell the truth when it came to refunds, but it is mitigation.

 

For a few years to come, it will be hard for the cruise ship industry to continue to attract the "new to cruising" market and bring in basically a younger clientele to fill the larger ships.  In these circumstances, for the short term, it will be loyalty and the experienced cruise ship travellers who will help to save the industry - when they can. 

 

This is why it feels the constant attempt to take loyalty, forbearance and unspoken understanding for granted is a risky one.  This will be particularly problematic if the likes of Saga, Fred, Viking and TUI are seen to be doing better than P&O.  At the moment, the jury is out on that one, but once sentiment has formed, it can be hard to break.  Just feel that P&O are playing a dangerous game in choosing to say not a lot, even if they have to rehash plans.

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3 hours ago, No pager thank you said:

I see your point but are P&O trying to learn from the experience of Costa.  Your guess/es could be correct or could be incorrect.

 

Only P&O knows if they are looking across the Carnival umbrella or not.  Perhaps they could say?

Costa delicioza was only due to start sailing today so it's a bit early for any worthwhile feedback that P&O could use to determine if it would be worth them using it in any P&O restart, never mind sharing it with their customers.

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