Thoughts on getting around the vaccination req’t

[firefly333]

20 minutes ago, stellarose said:

if the RCCL AOTS from Nassau goes well - then we know that vaccinated is the way to go.  

Had 6% unvaccinated kids. Need to pare down kids even more to cruise vaccinated from usa.

 

Went out at 94%

[Elaine5715]

1 hour ago, bgrmini said:

Please explain that reasoning. You are comparing well understood, well controlled diseases that have been around for centuries. They are not, nor have they ever been a worldwide pandemic within our lifetimes. You are comparing apples to moon rocks.

I am comparing vaccinated preventable diseases and no longer well controlled due to the rise in unvaccinated.   

[harkinmr]

3 hours ago, Elaine5715 said:

Then those innocent lives need to stay home.  There is no requirement that one is vaccinated against any other the common and deadly diseases like whooping cough, measles, mumps. meningitis. 

Well, in actuality, children are required to have each of the vaccines you mentioned to attend school.  Children are not, at this time, required to get a COVID-19 vaccine for school, but will be required to for many cruise lines if 12 and over.  My personal opinion is that no children under eligible vaccine age should be allowed to sail, but I don't make those decisions. 😉  

[bdever]

1 hour ago, firefly333 said:

Had 6% unvaccinated kids. Need to pare down kids even more to cruise vaccinated from usa.

 

Went out at 94%

Good 👍 to know!

[harkinmr]

20 hours ago, TNcruising02 said:

That's a slippery slope since the law states they can't deny services based on vaccination status.  However, since they are stating that they are sailing with only vaccinated people that's what they will get.  Nobody is going to want to risk being turned away when they can just cruise on RCL.

You may think it's a slippery slope, but there have been crickets from Tallahassee since Celebrity announced its plan.  The law is that you cannot deny services based on failure to comply with a vaccine requirement.  In addition, the only teeth the Florida law has is a fine.  They can't otherwise restrict the cruise lines or deny their right to sail.

 

Celebrity isn't requiring vaccines.  It's voluntary.  If you don't provide the proof, you are considered unvaccinated and they have made a decision and been approved by the CDC to sail with no more than 5% unvaccinated passengers.  Once they are past that 5% you can't sail.  Folks get turned away all the time for not complying with health standards to sail.  This is just one more time.  

[cruisingguy007]

14 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

You may think it's a slippery slope, but there have been crickets from Tallahassee since Celebrity announced its plan.  The law is that you cannot deny services based on failure to comply with a vaccine requirement.  In addition, the only teeth the Florida law has is a fine.  They can't otherwise restrict the cruise lines or deny their right to sail.

 

Celebrity isn't requiring vaccines.  It's voluntary.  If you don't provide the proof, you are considered unvaccinated and they have made a decision and been approved by the CDC to sail with no more than 5% unvaccinated passengers.  Once they are past that 5% you can't sail.  Folks get turned away all the time for not complying with health standards to sail.  This is just one more time.  

 

The slippery slope started long ago with smoking bans. Businesses were allowed to control workers even off duty (folks were warned it would snowball but didn't believe it). Nurses in TX just had their cases tossed recently as well. They sued due to vaccine requirements for employment. They were told they could work elsewhere and had a choice. Employers can now force you to get a vaccine as a condition of employment. I just don't see these anti vaccine laws holding up in court based on all other evidence and previous rulings and established precedent. The laws/rulings seems consistent: choices have consequences. Cruising is no different.     

Edited June 14, 2021 by cruisingguy007

[harkinmr]

5 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

The slippery slope started long ago with smoking bans. Businesses were allowed to control workers even off duty (folks were warned it would snowball but didn't believe it). Nurses in TX just had their cases tossed recently as well. They sued due to vaccine requirements for employment. They were told they could work elsewhere and had a choice. Employers can now force you to get a vaccine as a condition of employment. I just don't see these anti vaccine laws holding up in court based on all other evidence and previous rulings and established precedent. The laws/rulings seems consistent: choices have consequences. Cruising is no different.     

A lot of the vaccine challenges will not be successful.  Some might be, but under very narrow exceptions.  Vaccine mandates have been upheld previously across the country, including for employment.  School vaccines are required in all 50 states.  I think the focus of some of these "vaccine passport" ban laws has been mostly political in nature.  There may be some valid arguments, for example, against requiring vaccines to secure necessities like grocery stores, pharmacies, medical services, etc.  But other businesses should be able to call their own shots (pun intended). The biggest argument against the application of vaccine passport bans to the cruise lines is the Commerce Clause, so we will see how that plays out.  In the meantime, the lines seemed to have found a way around it.

[ontheweb]

13 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

The slippery slope started long ago with smoking bans. Businesses were allowed to control workers even off duty (folks were warned it would snowball but didn't believe it). Nurses in TX just had their cases tossed recently as well. They sued due to vaccine requirements for employment. They were told they could work elsewhere and had a choice. Employers can now force you to get a vaccine as a condition of employment. I just don't see these anti vaccine laws holding up in court based on all other evidence and previous rulings and established precedent. The laws/rulings seems consistent: choices have consequences. Cruising is no different.     

And the judge in the suit by the hospital personnel in Texas displayed extreme displeasure at the comparison made by those saying we should have the choice whether to be vaccinated that they compared getting the vaccine to medical experimenting done by N a z i s on people in concentration camps. 

[ScottsSweetie]

9 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

A lot of the vaccine challenges will not be successful.  Some might be, but under very narrow exceptions.  Vaccine mandates have been upheld previously across the country, including for employment.  School vaccines are required in all 50 states.  

Until they aren't. One can opt out of vaccines in a lot of places with a religious exemption. Also, undocumented immigrants can enroll their children with no medical info. I can remember several tb outbreaks when I lived in Georgia at the middle or high school level. My child got the chicken pox, despite having the vaccine, when an outbreak occurred among non-vaxxed students. So no, not all vaccines are required at all schools in all 50 states.

[harkinmr]

8 minutes ago, ScottsSweetie said:

Until they aren't. One can opt out of vaccines in a lot of places with a religious exemption. Also, undocumented immigrants can enroll their children with no medical info. I can remember several tb outbreaks when I lived in Georgia at the middle or high school level. My child got the chicken pox, despite having the vaccine, when an outbreak occurred among non-vaxxed students. So no, not all vaccines are required at all schools in all 50 states.

They are still legally required in all 50 dates.  There are medical and religious exemptions afforded in 44 states, but those exemptions must be documented and accommodations made.  All other objections result in the option to home school.  Certain types of vaccines may not be required from one jurisdiction to another, like the chicken pox vaccine which is only required in 43 states.  But the point is, vaccines can and have been mandated in schools across the country and those mandates have been upheld by the courts.

[amcankid]

30 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

And the judge in the suit by the hospital personnel in Texas displayed extreme displeasure at the comparison made by those saying we should have the choice whether to be vaccinated that they compared getting the vaccine to medical experimenting done by N a z i s on people in concentration camps. 

lol. I see by the way you spelled N a z i s that you had the same algorithm problem that I did when I was blasting someone here on CC for comparing vaccinations to internment camps.

But in all seriousness, I just don’t get how anyone in their right mind can think getting vaccinated to save your own life as well as saving others by helping to reach herd immunity is even one tenth of one percent comparable to the horrific conditions and abuse so many American heroes endured during WWll ( or any other war). 

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, amcankid said:

lol. I see by the way you spelled N a z i s that you had the same algorithm problem that I did when I was blasting someone here on CC for comparing vaccinations to internment camps.

But in all seriousness, I just don’t get how anyone in their right mind can think getting vaccinated to save your own life as well as saving others by helping to reach herd immunity is even one tenth of one percent comparable to the horrific conditions and abuse so many American heroes endured during WWll ( or any other war). 

Yes, you have that right. And another word that I discovered runs into the same problem is v i a g a r a .

 

Oh, and I agree with the other part of your post as well.

[cruisingguy007]

35 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

Yes, you have that right. And another word that I discovered runs into the same problem is v i a g a r a .

 

Oh, and I agree with the other part of your post as well.

 

Sildenafil is more specific anyway. Most folks use generics.  

[SNJCruisers]

8 hours ago, d12j28 said:

You can try and spin it however you want. The fact is only %43.4 of the total population has been fully vaccinated. Didn't realize you needed to be of voting age to count.

Does the total population cruise?  The only percentages that matter are those of cruisers and I believe that Cruise Critic ran a poll that the majority of readers were on the vaccinated side of the line in the sand. 

[SNJCruisers]

8 hours ago, stellarose said:

family is ready for any protocol .  again, prefer not to wear a mask, but what needs to be done. I want on the Mardi Gras

A heck of a lot of things are going to change over the next 6+ months before you cruise on the MG for Christmas. 

[SNJCruisers]

8 hours ago, firefly333 said:

Had 6% unvaccinated kids. Need to pare down kids even more to cruise vaccinated from usa.

 

Went out at 94%

So it went out with zero unvaccinated adults?

[amcankid]

6 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Yes, you have that right. And another word that I discovered runs into the same problem is v i a g a r a .

 

Oh, and I agree with the other part of your post as well.

Hahaha. The little blue pill used by 85% of the male passengers on Holland America is a no no to say on a Carnival Board?

Guess Carnival really is shooting ( pun intended) for a younger demographic!!

Edited June 15, 2021 by amcankid
Wrong word

[BlerkOne]

8 hours ago, ScottsSweetie said:

Until they aren't. One can opt out of vaccines in a lot of places with a religious exemption. Also, undocumented immigrants can enroll their children with no medical info. I can remember several tb outbreaks when I lived in Georgia at the middle or high school level. My child got the chicken pox, despite having the vaccine, when an outbreak occurred among non-vaxxed students. So no, not all vaccines are required at all schools in all 50 states.

Florida is one of the states with required vaccines for s hooks  How odd.

[MrMarc]

2 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Florida is one of the states with required vaccines for s hooks  How odd.

Didn't you know, COVID is the first virus that discriminates based on polotical leanings.  

[Joe817]

1 minute ago, MrMarc said:

Didn't you know, COVID is the first virus that discriminates based on polotical leanings.  

HAhahahah! Oh! I caught that one! You can't put anything over on me. 

[BlerkOne]

5 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Florida is one of the states with required vaccines for s hooks  How odd.

How the hell did schools become "s hooks"?

[amcankid]

6 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

How the hell did schools become "s hooks"?

Wait. I just spent 10 minutes trying to figure out the acronym for s hooks and now you tell me word check changed it on you?

[firefly333]

2 hours ago, SNJCruisers said:

So it went out with zero unvaccinated adults?

Everyone over age 16 had to be vaccinated.  Some blogger said some didnt board, but didnt say more.

[Joe817]

13 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

How the hell did schools become "s hooks"?

To many trips to the Alchemy bar? 🍹 

 

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.  

Edited June 15, 2021 by Joe817

[BlerkOne]

17 minutes ago, Joe817 said:

To many trips to the Alchemy bar? 🍹 

 

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.  

I wish!