Celebrity Business Practices Getting Annoying

[neverbeenhere]

Not to prolong this but, Yes, pre-paid gratuities are refunded if one cancels after final payment.

[CHEZMARYLOU]

That is why the initial posting said change in practice. A few years ago they did not require prepayment of excursions. Now you have to prepay and if you cancel before boarding it goes back to your CC, but if you cancel on ship it goes to OBC. Have not checked to see if that OBC is refundable or not.

 

The list can go on

 

We have been cruising on Celebrity since 1997. I cannot remember a time when I could book an excursion on line with out pre paying it at the time of booking. BTW, if you cancel on board and get an OBC that is not used, it is refundable. Also, they have eliminated the 24 hour cancellation policy on board. As long as you cancel before the excursion you will get a refund.

 

Mary Lou

[Orator]

Now that makes for an very interesting question. If gratuities must be prepaid and cannot be canceled then do they still qualify as gratuities as far as financial reporting (SEC) and tax requirements (IRS)? Are they covered by travel insurance in case of an issue since they are not part of the trip cost that the insurance is calculated against? or are the gratuities now included in the calculation of that insurance? If you have to cancel after last payment date and do not have insurance are they refunded?

 

That is why the initial posting said change in practice. A few years ago they did not require prepayment of excursions. Now you have to prepay and if you cancel before boarding it goes back to your CC, but if you cancel on ship it goes to OBC. Have not checked to see if that OBC is refundable or not.

 

Some lines include excursions in fare, some include some excursions in fare but not others. Most still do not require prepayment of optional excursions.

 

The list can go on

 

I would not claim any special knowledge of tax law. However, as I have said, the prepaid tips can be reduced by going to Guest Relations. If your TA provided the Gratuties they will become an OBC. Since I've never reduced tips I don't know for certain whether it would be refundable or non refundable. Even if non refundable they could be converted to cash at the Casino at a 5% charge. If refundable you'd get it all returned on your credit card. Since it comes from a TA it would most likely be refundable. Of course you could always use the OBC for onboard purchases.

I've been on a few cruises and have taken a few excursions and only once booked prior to boarding. Never had a problem getting an excursion unless I waited until the last day and then only rarely.

[Caribbean Chris]

Do not care for select. Like the same table and same staff for a cruise. .

 

We do too, but Select can deliver that. Our experience has been you can speak to the Select dining room manager at the beginning, explain what type of table and time you wish, and it will be arranged. If you are pleased after the first night, the manager will book you there at the same table for two with the same waiters for the entire cruise.

 

Our last Celebrity Cruise went that way ...our table was waiting each night and we had the best waiters and wine steward service we've seen in years. They were there every night.

[Orator]

We do too, but Select can deliver that. Our experience has been you can speak to the Select dining room manager at the beginning, explain what type of table and time you wish, and it will be arranged. If you are pleased after the first night, the manager will book you there at the same table for two with the same waiters for the entire cruise.

 

Our last Celebrity Cruise went that way ...our table was waiting each night and we had the best waiters and wine steward service we've seen in years. They were there every night.

 

The best waiters are asked to work in Select since they need experienced servers to turn the tables quickly. I do he same as you. They hold the table for a reasonable time. I tell the Hostess when win plan to dine and let them know if we don't need the table the following evening.the OP has a variety of options to get what he wants.

[Lois R]

We have been cruising on Celebrity since 1997. I cannot remember a time when I could book an excursion on line with out pre paying it at the time of booking. BTW, if you cancel on board and get an OBC that is not used, it is refundable. Also, they have eliminated the 24 hour cancellation policy on board. As long as you cancel before the excursion you will get a refund.

 

Mary Lou

 

Mary Lou, guess what, I tried to cancel an excursion that I had booked

and they said I could not do it......I ended up going and having a good

time but when I tried to cancel I was they would not do it. This was

on Reflection last month.

[Gracie115]

We do too, but Select can deliver that. Our experience has been you can speak to the Select dining room manager at the beginning, explain what type of table and time you wish, and it will be arranged. If you are pleased after the first night, the manager will book you there at the same table for two with the same waiters for the entire cruise.

 

Our last Celebrity Cruise went that way ...our table was waiting each night and we had the best waiters and wine steward service we've seen in years. They were there every night.

 

This has also been our experience........we always speak up the first night and from that point forward it is as though we were in traditional dining with the same wait staff BUT with the added flexibility of NOT having to arrive at an exact time....best of both worlds...

[Gracie115]

My thought is in line with this. Kind of takes one back to the discussion about the suite perks and people said why should one care about the extra perks for suites. My response at that time was that I did not care, unless it started to impact my cruise experience. Well if you are correct it has started to do so.

 

The other thought is that Celebrity will be following the parent company into the land of no traditional dining at some point and that you will see more space allocated to select and less to traditional over time.

 

Of course both could be true.

 

But I DO think once they get those new Suite dining rooms open and get used to the new spacing they will be able to release more space for the rest of the MDR...at least I would hope so...

[Caribbean Chris]

By the way, Holland America Line has required payment when booking shore excursions for years.

 

Makes sense because it may prevent people from booking up a slew of excursions on a whim for months in advance without putting their money down, only to cancel close to departure. That helps keep space open for others who seriously want the excursion. Also helps the staff do a better job in working with their tour suppliers with realistic counts.

 

And it is refundable if you cancel.

 

But there are plenty of competitive lines, so pick what's important to you. I may be wrong, but I think Princess will let you book excursions without payment (or at least they used to.)

[Orator]

But I DO think once they get those new Suite dining rooms open and get used to the new spacing they will be able to release more space for the rest of the MDR...at least I would hope so...

 

Unless they carve the new restaurant from space that's now in the MDR as has been reported.

[RDC1]

By the way, Holland America Line has required payment when booking shore excursions for years.

 

Makes sense because it may prevent people from booking up a slew of excursions on a whim for months in advance without putting their money down, only to cancel close to departure. That helps keep space open for others who seriously want the excursion. Also helps the staff do a better job in working with their tour suppliers with realistic counts.

 

And it is refundable if you cancel.

 

But there are plenty of competitive lines, so pick what's important to you. I may be wrong, but I think Princess will let you book excursions without payment (or at least they used to.)

 

yep. Princess is one of the lines I have use, along with Cunard, Oceania, Crystal, HAL, (and prior to this Celebrity and Royal Caribbean). Have pretty much dropped NCL after trying them once a couple of years back.

[Gracie115]

Unless they carve the new restaurant from space that's now in the MDR as has been reported.

 

I know that, as I said in my previous post on this thread I suspect since they have not yet actually carved that space out they may be limiting the number of early dining reservations until they know for sure how many tables they will be losing to this new space....better to hold those spaces out until they've actually converted one of these dining rooms, especially on the "M" class which already had a portion of the MDR taken for Blu. Once they've completed one they will know for sure what the remaining space will look like.....and perhaps then they will be able to open for more traditional seating...just a theory....plans always look one way on paper and then another once implemented........who knows though....just a guess on why early dining is showing full this far out....and the only real variable I know is the creation of this new dining room.....

Edited December 3, 2014 by Gracie115

[RDC1]

The best waiters are asked to work in Select since they need experienced servers to turn the tables quickly. I do he same as you. They hold the table for a reasonable time. I tell the Hostess when win plan to dine and let them know if we don't need the table the following evening.the OP has a variety of options to get what he wants.

 

If we just wanted to sit at a table for two we could probably do that. However, or past norm on Celebrity has been TD at a table for eight. We have enjoyed that. We keep in touch and have gone on cruises with several couples we have met that way. We have found that while you meet people when sitting at a larger table in Select the dynamic is much different and not nearly as enjoyable.

[Orator]

I know that, as I said in my previous post on this thread I suspect since they have not yet actually carved that space out they may be limiting the number of early dining reservations until they know for sure how many tables they will be losing to this new space....better to hold those spaces out until they've actually converted one of these dining rooms, especially on the "M" class which already had a portion of the MDR taken for Blu. Once they've completed one they will know for sure what the remaining space will look like.....and perhaps then they will be able to open for more traditional seating...just a theory....plans always look one way on paper and then another once implemented........who knows though....just a guess on why early dining is showing full this far out....and the only real variable I know is the creation of this new dining room.....

 

One Senior Officer told a small group of cruisers, including me, that plans call for 56 seats in the new restaurant on the M Class ships. He claimed that this would not be adequate. You are spot on when you say that they need to see how it's working before they carve out the final space

Edited December 3, 2014 by Orator

[hulamoon]

It's odd to me that select diners are more willing to pull their auto tips. First, what a hassle and no matter how mediocre the service, What an embarrassing interaction.

[DaisyRose]

I am one who does not like Traditional Dining. My reason for this is that DH and I don't like a very long dinner. We usually only order one appetizer and one entree, sometimes dessert. We want to have our dinner and be able to leave without sitting there waiting through all the courses the servers bring to all the other tables. We find that in traditional we can not get out quickly. We like to get out and about on the ship to enjoy shows and entertainment. When we have MTD, we have found that they usually ask for our room number, and try to seat us in the same waitstaff area. We like that, because we do enjoy getting to know a waiter. But here might be a reason why MTD is filled up a year in advance: I have a travel agent that often prepays the gratuities for us as a booking gift. But if she does that, Celebrity does not allow us to select MTD. So, we have to sign up for traditional and then try to switch to MTD once onboard. We select early, because there is no way we could eat as late as the late dining. I really don't understand this. The TA is prepaying the gratuities, but Celebrity won't allow us to select MTD when she does. I'm guessing they want MTD gratuities at final payment, and the TA probably does not prepay it until shortly before the cruise. It is annoying to me, as I don't like having to stand on a line to see the maitre'd upon embarking. But if we are able to switch to MTD once onboard, that will open up some early traditional slots for you. Perhaps if there are a lot of folks whose TA's prepay gratuities, there might be a lot of passengers who will try to switch to MTD once onboard.

 

I also agree with the OP that I really dislike the practice of having to prepay for excursions booked online before the cruise. I like to book online because sometimes prices are higher onboard, and sometimes excursions sell out before you even embark. But I just don't always have the money to lay out. I just prebooked excursions for my Nov 2015 TA, and had to lay out $1,000 for them a year before the cruise. I really don't have the extra money for it right now, between Christmas and I just had a large payment due for my January 2015 cruise. Maybe I could understand them wanting payment for excursions at final payment date to get accurate counts of who is really taking the excursions, but really, a year in advance? So, yes to the OP, I agree that these are annoying business practices, and it does push me toward other cruise lines. But, I choose cruises based on itinerary and price, and sometimes Celebrity has a better itinerary or a better price for what I'm looking for. So I just have to go along with it. I don't consider it a deal breaker.

[Du vent dans les voiles]

book Select and dine at the time you want.

 

I don't agree with that, we were on the Equinox last February with select dining and on the first night we were told that we would not be able to have a table between 7 and 8:30 for the whole duration of the cruise.

For us select dining only meant we could decide at what time we would get in line for a table.

Problem solve for our upcoming cruise we're going to cruise Aqua Class and try Blue.

 

Josée

[TeaBag]

By chance, on Silhouette this past month we discovered a fantastic waiter one day at breakfast in the Oceanview cafe. We knew right away he would be fantastic at dinner. We asked for him the first few nights, as did a few others, and we were able to have him every night of the cruise that we dined in Select and so did the others. It was like traditional dining only better. Unfortunately this fantastic waiter has been chosen to train for the new Suite dining room so we cannot hope to have him again unless we book a suite.

 

You can have the same waiter in Select. This is the third time we have done this.

 

Don't give up on Celebrity yet.

 

PS Aren't the shares doing great?:)

[OCruisers]

Celebrity is a very good cruise line BUT some others are as well. It's fun to "Sleep Around" every so often! :D

LuLu

[Oville]

I agree athe debate, if civil, can be useful. Why do you think they require pre paid gratuities for Select dining? According to at least 3 Restaurant Managers, it's because diners in Select go from table to table and waiter to waiter and did not tip, or gave small tips to servers. The pre paid tips are now divided among the servers.

 

I'm quite sure, actuality know, prepaid gratuities have been required since the inception of Select Dining, hence 3 restaurant managers were blowing smoke.

Edited December 3, 2014 by Oville

[hulamoon]

I'm quite sure, actuality know, prepaid gratuities have been required since the inception of Select Dining, hence 3 restaurant managers were blowing smoke.

 

Thanks for confirming this. I am thinking it may have been an urban myth or cruise ship fear virus, or it was hard to get waiters to go to select and they used it to assist their concerns.

[Caribbean Chris]

I'm quite sure, actuality know, prepaid gratuities have been required since the inception of Select Dining, hence 3 restaurant managers were blowing smoke.

 

Agree, we were on Century the first week of Select Dining for that ship and we had to pre-pay (no big deal, it was a last-minute thing anyway.)

 

Unfortunately it was chaotic, the worst dining experience I've ever seen in 30+ cruises, so we ate in Murano a couple of nights (fabulous food & service, huge contrast.) Happily they got their act together, and a couple of years later, Select was outstanding in every way on Century.

[Iamcruzin]

I don't think traditional early dining sold out more than 11 months prior to sailing because the cruise is so popular. I'm pretty sure it sold out because Celebrity is only making a very reduced portion of traditional dining seats available to book this early. I'm willing to bet that more places in traditional dining will become available later. In the meantime, this particular business practice is pretty irritating to those who want to know where they stand from the day they book, and not take a chance. If I'm wrong, and demand for traditional dining really is that high, they need to make more seats available. Giving people what they want is always a better business practice than annoying them, surely.

 

I agree. A cruise booked 12 months out should still have availability for early traditional seating. Early traditional is so Popular that Princess created a second early seating. I call it the Early Early traditional. They use one of the the Anytime dining rooms for this extra time slot.

[terrierjohn]

I would not claim any special knowledge of tax law. However, as I have said, the prepaid tips can be reduced by going to Guest Relations. If your TA provided the Gratuties they will become an OBC. Since I've never reduced tips I don't know for certain whether it would be refundable or non refundable. Even if non refundable they could be converted to cash at the Casino at a 5% charge. If refundable you'd get it all returned on your credit card. Since it comes from a TA it would most likely be refundable. Of course you could always use the OBC for onboard purchases.

I've been on a few cruises and have taken a few excursions and only once booked prior to boarding. Never had a problem getting an excursion unless I waited until the last day and then only rarely.

My concern, as a select diner, about pre-paying grats is purely that these cannot then be offset against any OBC, especially if you have a free drinks package and pre purchased excursions and therefore no significant expenditure to use the OBC against.

Furthermore, when fixed time diners also now pay auto gratuities,I cannot see why select diners are the only ones asked to pre-pay. I would add that I do not wish to have the opportunity to reduce or delete any gratuities, but I would like the opportunity to use any excess OBC to pay them.

[dalgirl]

We also enjoy eating when, where, and with whom we like, and were thrilled when more cruiselines got on the bandwagon. Pre-paying the service charge (and let's face it, when you pre-pay it is not a gratuity, call it what it is) is silly. They can bill it daily like they do on other lines, and charge with the rest of the bill on the last day. We were given pre-paid "gratuities" by our TA and scheduled MTD. We have to pay the SC at final payment ourselves and the TA will give us an OBC to compensate, which is fine since we plan to spend at least that much onboard. So the TA that selects early seating to avoid the customer pre-paying the SC and the customer who hopes to then change to MTD is not doing a real service to the customer or those trying to get their dining choice. If MTD fills up, then you won't get it. And again if it is hurting those trying to secure early dining, then it is causing more confusion and hard feelings than is warranted. There is a better business model out there - look to your competitors.

 

As for the complaints by OP, though valid, it is the way of the future on all cruiselines - prepaying for everything, cutting back on services, etc. I really feel sorry for the crew as they have to keep everything running smoothly and try to unruffled all those feathers. Just remember the mantra "any day on a cruise is better than a day not cruising":D