HAL just lost my business because of cigarette smoke

[Lady Arwen]

We spent two weeks on Kdam in May. The smoke in the casino was awful! And, it drifted to other areas, as well. We love to use the casino in the evenings, but the smoke some nights just drove us out. I don't understand why HAL continues with this very outdated smoking policy. On Celebrity ships the casinos are full and hopping all evening into the wee hours and their casinos are all smoke-free.

 

Get with the program, HAL, and restrict smoking to outdoor areas only and away from where the majority of people will be enjoying the fresh sea air. I think you'll find the casinos will be busier than ever!

[zitsky]

Electronic cigarettes smell. Would I walk into a cabin and smell it if someone had been using it? At work, I sometimes have to walk through clouds of vapor outside, and I can definitely smell it.

 

Edit: Can someone talk about their experience with smoke on the Zaandam?

[Lady Arwen]

There are no non-smoking ships anywhere on any line. I've never heard of any, at least. If the OP cancels this cruise, I can't imagine which line the OP expects to cruise where there won't be smoke.

Well, Celebrity and Azamara do not allow any smoking indoors at any time, not even the casinos. Very limited outdoor smoking areas that can easily be avoided.

[navybankerteacher]

Thank you all for posting. We are scheduled on the Koningsdam in Dec. I am an oxygen user and am very sensitive to smoke. This is very disturbing. What is the matter with HAL don't they understand that smoking kills people..

 

On recent HAL cruises (February - Westerdam and September - Zuiderdam) smoke was barely noticeable, and very few smokers were seen on the limited approved open deck areas. Perhaps the die-hard smokers are finally getting the message - and HAL no longer needs to cater to those too addicted to do without.

[Lady Arwen]

On recent HAL cruises (February - Westerdam and September - Zuiderdam) smoke was barely noticeable, and very few smokers were seen on the limited approved open deck areas. Perhaps the die-hard smokers are finally getting the message - and HAL no longer needs to cater to those too addicted to do without.

Unfortunately, on Koningsdam, the smoke in the casino drifts out to the other areas, so even if you are not in the casino you can still smell smoke. A design flaw that perhaps will be addressed on Nieuw Statendam. Hopefully, HAL will ban casino smoking on all their ships.

[iancal]

HAL came back on our list when they eliminated smoking on cabin verandahs. HAL still has a way to go, especially with the silly day on day off smoking in the casino on some ships but they are moving in the right direction. We will avoid those until the change is implemented fully.

 

HAL has come to understand that from a financial perspective and a marketing perspective it is far better to cater to, and target the majority than it is to pander to a minority of smokers. Not to mention having a basic concern for their employees and contractors over the dangers of second hand smoke.

 

So I complement HAL for moving forward. It took some time however the penny finally dropped.

 

I read multiple times on this forum the thread that HAL ships would be sailing half full when HAL changed theirs. Obviously this did not come to fruition. The threat/prediction was a load of nonsense from a small self interested group. The sky did not fall after all.

Edited October 7, 2017 by iancal

[Mustsea]

These newer ships (like the 3 newest NCL ships) have an open design plan and the cigarette smoke cannot be contained to the casino. On the older ships the casinos are compartmentalized with one doorway in and one doorway out. Not too much of an issue with me as I would try to avoid passing through the casino on my way to the theater and instead use the forward stairs or elevator.

[taxmantoo]

What happened to the old "single" thread on smoking? :confused:

[CruisinHarvey]

Seems to me that HAL is between a rock and hard place. I read so many complaints when they stopped smoking on the verandas. Although.they weren't taking too much of a risk with on that decision, since one other lines allow it either, that I'm aware of. They're walking a fine line on the smoking policy. Having some ships with no smoking, and others with it is an interesting experiment. I can see where it's hard to eliminate smoking in their casinos. The casino is the number one profit center of the ship. It's also been proven that if you open a non smoking casino it will fail in a very short period of time. There have been multiple attempts on land. All have failed. I think HAL is doing there best to accommodate all their passengers. If you want non smoking, they ships for that. If want smoking, they have ships for that. I don't know of another cruise line that offers that option.

[navybankerteacher]

I am not a smoker and never have been.

It is a filthy addiction that is hard to kick.

 

Do cruise lines really care about your health?

Not really.

Do cruise lines care about profits.

Absolutely.

HAL has found good financial reasons to continue to allow smoking on their ships, even when they know that this could have a negative effect on your health.

 

Many of the experts who claim that cigarette smoke is hazardous to our health, also claim that diesel exhaust (like the kind you frequently inhale on cruise ships) is far more dangerous to your health than cigarette smoke.

 

So now you know. But I suggest that you investigate it further, to ensure that it is not fake news.

If, indeed, breathing diesel exhaust is far more damaging than breathing cigarette smoke, why are you still cruising on ships that burn diesel fuel? Do you have some good financial reason for doing so?

 

Don't you feel embarrassed posting something like this? I have never detected the smell of diesel exhaust -- which is far heavier and more pungent than tobacco smoke -- and which is effectively kept clear of passenger areas by the stacks.

 

There is much greater contact with diesel exhaust in any city where internal combustion engines are operated than on any cruise ship.

 

Congratulations on providing this bit of fake news.

[taxmantoo]

It's also been proven that if you open a non smoking casino it will fail in a very short period of time. There have been multiple attempts on land. All have failed.

 

All casinos in Ontario and Quebec (Canada), as well as most other casinos in other Canadian provinces, are non-smoking. I can assure you they are all doing quite well ;)

[CruisinHarvey]

All casinos in Ontario and Quebec (Canada), as well as most other casinos in other Canadian provinces, are non-smoking. I can assure you they are all doing quite well ;)

If there's little or no competition that allows smoking, it's an easy decision. The gamblers have little option. Since most cruise lines still allow smoking, they can choose other lines, just as easily as HAL. The paradigm is different.

[mcrcruiser]

First as a long time ago ex smoker who had a terrible habit ,I now hate the smell of cigarette smoke :mad:

 

We are sailing on Oosterdam in February & we are so so happy that there is NO SMOKING in the casino :D

 

As the cruise industry evolves it is coming to realize that smokers are dwindling rapidly & lines like Celebrity & Azamara are NOT allowing any smoking in any indoor area of their ships & they are NOT hurting financially :)

 

We recently was on Royal Caribbean Anthem of the Seas ,168000 gross tons with a normao passenger load of 4400 & we di not smell any smoke ,even in the Casino:D

 

IMO . Any cruise line who does NOT recognize that 2nd hand smoke is very unhealthy will ultimately pay the price in their pocket book(bottom line ) :)

[Lady Arwen]

If there's little or no competition that allows smoking, it's an easy decision. The gamblers have little option. Since most cruise lines still allow smoking, they can choose other lines, just as easily as HAL. The paradigm is different.

This is exactly why ALL cruiselines need to eliminate smoking in the casinos. Smokers will have to go outside and non-smokers can enjoy the indoor space without having to breathe in second hand smoke and it levels the playing field. Everyone will be happy!

[navybankerteacher]

First as a long time ago ex smoker who had a terrible habit ,I now hate the smell of cigarette smoke :mad:

 

We are sailing on Oosterdam in February & we are so so happy that there is NO SMOKING in the casino :D

 

As the cruise industry evolves it is coming to realize that smokers are dwindling rapidly & lines like Celebrity & Azamara are NOT allowing any smoking in any indoor area of their ships & they are NOT hurting financially :)

 

We recently was on Royal Caribbean Anthem of the Seas ,168000 gross tons with a normao passenger load of 4400 & we di not smell any smoke ,even in the Casino:D

 

IMO . Any cruise line who does NOT recognize that 2nd hand smoke is very unhealthy will ultimately pay the price in their pocket book(bottom line ) :)

 

A lot of smokers are (literally) dieing off. HAL does not seem to have suffered because they banned balcony smoking - and it is possible that other lines may see that as a signal that banning smoking altogether might be a good idea.

 

It would also be a kindness to smokers who might need some "tough love" to help them decide to quit.

[SetAnOpenCourse]

Compromise by allowing only e-cigarettes in the casino.

[Lady Arwen]

Compromise by allowing only e-cigarettes in the casino.

Okay, I could live with that.

[sail7seas]

Okay, I could live with that.

Please......... no.

[Lizzie68]

Compromise by allowing only e-cigarettes in the casino.

 

I don't think so. You wouldn't be able to see for all that vapour.

 

Edited to add.... all casinos in BC are smoke free. They sure aren't suffering, it's crowded at all times.

[kazu]

What happened to the old "single" thread on smoking? :confused:

 

I was actually wondering the same thing.;):confused:

 

Seems to me that HAL is between a rock and hard place. I read so many complaints when they stopped smoking on the verandas. Although.they weren't taking too much of a risk with on that decision, since one other lines allow it either, that I'm aware of. They're walking a fine line on the smoking policy. Having some ships with no smoking, and others with it is an interesting experiment. I can see where it's hard to eliminate smoking in their casinos. The casino is the number one profit center of the ship. It's also been proven that if you open a non smoking casino it will fail in a very short period of time. There have been multiple attempts on land. All have failed. I think HAL is doing there best to accommodate all their passengers. If you want non smoking, they ships for that. If want smoking, they have ships for that. I don't know of another cruise line that offers that option.

 

I can only comment on the non smoking nights I have seen in the casino. The place is dead compared to the other nights.

 

The smoking area is not that large in the casinos and, I am actually surprised that a new ship like the Koningsdam does not have a better ventilation system. I didn't see a major issue on the Rotterdam (smell throughout) on our last cruise.

 

It is what it is and all about choices. There are ships with absolutely no smoking in the casino so there are choices.

 

Like it or not, the casino needs to make money and if smokers make them money.......

[wearesiamese]

I’m on the Volendam and definitely smell smoke on deck 5 near the casino and it does enter other areas

 

 

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[zitsky]

And when you go out on the open deck, can you smell the clouds of diesel fumes and smoke coming from the stack?

Those fumes and smoke are carcinogenic. They are killing you. YOU have the choice not to breathe those fumes.

 

That is just like saying, you can't complain about cigarette smoke, because you don't complain about cars. Some people do hate both, but you have to pick your battles. You can avoid cigs easier than cars.

 

You can make a big choice to not go on cruise ships, or you can learn about investing in carbon credits. Everything is a trade off.

[idiebabe]

We were considering a relaxing 11-night cruise next month on the Koningsdam. However, after reading so many negative reviews (even one from a smoker) about smoking permitted in the casino and it wafting into the musical venues making for an unpleasant experience, HAL, we'll take our business elsewhere until you start to value clean air and your customers' wellbeing.

 

People tend to exaggerate! Sailed Kdam twice and never smelled smoke in Musical Venues and didn't find it a problem in the Casino! We also didn't find it a problem at all in the Casino and only smelled smoke if standing by the Smoking Machines.

 

There are some HAL Ships where there is No Smoking in the Casino. In addition, HAL's Smoking Policy is very restricted compared to other Lines with only the area by Seaview Bar and on some Ships a few machines in Casino!

[wearesiamese]

And when you go out on the open deck, can you smell the clouds of diesel fumes and smoke coming from the stack?

Those fumes and smoke are carcinogenic. They are killing you. YOU have the choice not to breathe those fumes.

 

What’s your point?

[zitsky]

People tend to exaggerate! Sailed Kdam twice and never smelled smoke in Musical Venues and didn't find it a problem in the Casino! We also didn't find it a problem at all in the Casino and only smelled smoke if standing by the Smoking Machines.

 

There are some HAL Ships where there is No Smoking in the Casino. In addition, HAL's Smoking Policy is very restricted compared to other Lines with only the area by Seaview Bar and on some Ships a few machines in Casino!

 

Thanks for your post, but what is a smoking machine???