Would you get on a ship today?

[LGW59]

17 minutes ago, C-Dragons said:

Oh please don’t. 🙄

Maybe you 4 guys should get your own thread. 😁

I'm sure it would be a lot easier for you all to communicate without the rest of us who are trying to discuss the OP's topic. 😎

Yea, what C-Dragons said! 🤐😷

[Quo Vadis?]

2 hours ago, verizon said:

When you look at countries like Germany,France, Spain,Italy and USA its much safer to stay at sea than land.

 

I guess that the ship would be safe as long a passengers and crew do not come from Germany, France, Spain, Italy and the USA... and every other country that has spiking infection numbers.

 

We are very content staying home away from the sea of troubles out there.

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, nocl said:

on airplane the flow goes from inlets at the top to vents along the floor all along the cabin. the air flow is mostly vertical vent directly above exhaust.

 

With cruise ships have mostly see vent up high, but exhaust vents, when I have seen them along walls with substantial horizontal flow. So if someone emits particles in the center of the room they would go sideways along with the air flow. Changes in fresh air mix and improved filter means more and better air coming in, but by itself does not answer the particle clearance question, which for a large air plane tests have show to be about 6 minutes.

 

Do not know how the new systems compare to the old because as far as I can find no published data on either. Maybe the Chief might know from his NCL days if any studies were ever done.

 

For me my trust comes after cruise lined demonstrate transparency in their procedures, decision making and health reporting. Something they have not exactly demonstrated in the past.

Ring, ring, ring..☎️ hurry up and answer, it's Scientific American, they need you

 

 

[Fouremco]

1 hour ago, davekathy said:

Would you? 

See post #58. The answer was "no".

[Threedrones]

4 hours ago, nocl said:

here is one from July that uses date from earlier periods (takes time to collect data, analyze and publish) that puts the number at 10X.

 

https://www.statnews.com/2020/07/21/cdc-study-actual-covid-19-cases/

 

will post others when I get the chance.

You should read what your source says before using it. The article claims 10x what Covid reports and is a guess, with you have already criticized. That number would still be about half of the Swine flu. Thanks for proving my point.

[julia]

No, no, no, I say...

I would NOT sail today,

I would not sail next May,

I would not sail next fall,

I would NOT sail at all!!

[phoenix_dream]

5 hours ago, garyl62 said:

 

Certainly not inferring this, thanks for the opportunity to correct that thought if that's the way it came across.

 

Someone can become infected many ways, sometimes it may never be known how they become infected and some are infected even if they take many precautions.  Everyone needs to make their own decisions about precautions, cruise experience expected under restricted conditions, and all those many other detailed questions you've asked.  The OP asked "Would you get on a ship today?" and my answer was that I would, but I know many would not.  Since the question asked was about our own personal opinion and our own personal action, there is no correct or incorrect answer. 

 

While I respect everyone else who needs more guarantees like safety, being able to take part in many of the things on the ship, or having the shore experiences we all enjoy, quite frankly I don't need all those guarantees.  I do want to know what rules will be in place, but beyond that I'm ok for now.  We have a suite with a very large balcony booked for an upcoming trip I hope we can take and we've said even if we sit on the balcony with room service the entire time we'll feel it was money well spent and it will give us a great break from being at home.  So given that opportunity, I'd get on a ship today.

 

 

The idea of sitting on a large balcony in a suite looking out at the ocean sounds really good about now!

[nocl]

59 minutes ago, Threedrones said:

You should read what your source says before using it. The article claims 10x what Covid reports and is a guess, with you have already criticized. That number would still be about half of the Swine flu. Thanks for proving my point.

too funny. 

[Stumptowngal]

8 hours ago, phoenix_dream said:

When I read your comments, it makes me wonder if you are inferring that your staff members have not been taking care of themselves and making good choices.  Otherwise, based on your logic, they would not have caught the virus.  

 

You are certainly correct that taking appropriate measures can significantly reduce your chances of catching the virus.  But I know people who are very careful and yet caught the virus anyway - it is extremely contagious.  Assuming ships are as careful as they need to be, it is still almost a guarantee that there will be some instances of virus onboard some ships.  Testing is not 100% accurate, and likely won't catch people who picked up the virus on their travels to the ship.  To expect otherwise is naïve in the extreme. 

 

My biggest concern then is, what happens?  Maybe you have been very, very careful and you are well.  But they might contact trace an exposure to you (perhaps your waiter/bartender).  Are you then quarantined for the rest of the cruise?  Are you disembarked at the next port just because you've been exposed?  Are you allowed to fly home after having been exposed or are you expected to continue a 14 day quarantine?  And what if you do catch the virus despite all your precautions?  It is certainly possible.  Assuming you don't stay locked in your cabin all cruise, you will be around people in the dining rooms without masks while they are eating, and at the bars while they are drinking as two primary examples.  There are too many questions around that situation to list them here.  

+1. I absolutely agree.

 

Also, it just doesn’t seem a very care-free or relaxing vacation to wear masks and try to dodge people and maintain distance in public spaces.  I’ve observed way too many people disregard the recommendations and requirements in public to have any comfort level at this time. 

[MK_Cruiser1955]

Going back to the OP ....... I would not cruise at the moment but not through fear of catching Covid, that doesn't worry me.

I've already had Covid and survived although, unlike Trump, I'm not going to strut around saying I'm immune.

If I catch it again, I catch it again. If it kills me, so be it - we all die sometime.

My objection to cruising at the moment is the cruise lines insisting you can only go ashore on an organised excursion.

Before anyone begins patronising me I fully understand their "reasoning" for this approach, it's just that personally I hate organised tours with a vengeance, notwithstanding the fact they are grossly overpriced.

I have no desire to be herded around like a schoolchild. I hate listening to tour guides who like the sounds of their own voices, who only show you what they want to show you. I recall one excursion from hell where the tour guide didn't stop talking the entire 4½ hours - even when returning back to the ship - which is usually a time of quiet reflection.  

Plus don't forget the obligatory stop at their partners / siblings / cousins / friends (and in one case own) shop / restaurant. Hanging around waiting for fellow travellers who cannot be arsed to return to the coach on time.    

Nope, not for me.

I cruise to visit and explore new places but I'm more than capable of exploring these places on my own, seeing what I want to see. Sometimes even wandering aimlessly round a town and finding hidden gems the organised tours wouldn't go near. I want to meet the locals, eat where they eat etc. etc. 

As I said I see the reasoning behind the decision but it's not for me . 

[GlobalMethod]

1 hour ago, MK_Cruiser1955 said:

Going back to the OP ....... I would not cruise at the moment but not through fear of catching Covid, that doesn't worry me.

I've already had Covid and survived although, unlike Trump, I'm not going to strut around saying I'm immune.

If I catch it again, I catch it again. If it kills me, so be it - we all die sometime.

My objection to cruising at the moment is the cruise lines insisting you can only go ashore on an organised excursion.

Before anyone begins patronising me I fully understand their "reasoning" for this approach, it's just that personally I hate organised tours with a vengeance, notwithstanding the fact they are grossly overpriced.

I have no desire to be herded around like a schoolchild. I hate listening to tour guides who like the sounds of their own voices, who only show you what they want to show you. I recall one excursion from hell where the tour guide didn't stop talking the entire 4½ hours - even when returning back to the ship - which is usually a time of quiet reflection.  

Plus don't forget the obligatory stop at their partners / siblings / cousins / friends (and in one case own) shop / restaurant. Hanging around waiting for fellow travellers who cannot be arsed to return to the coach on time.    

Nope, not for me.

I cruise to visit and explore new places but I'm more than capable of exploring these places on my own, seeing what I want to see. Sometimes even wandering aimlessly round a town and finding hidden gems the organised tours wouldn't go near. I want to meet the locals, eat where they eat etc. etc. 

As I said I see the reasoning behind the decision but it's not for me . 

Our exact opinion on escorted cruise tours ... we've had excellent luck in finding those hidden gems also, but enjoy doing our own research for touring a new port ... that was part of our cruising job ... that said we will give the 'new cruising a try probably in the 1st quarter of 2021.

[Pinboy]

2 hours ago, MK_Cruiser1955 said:

My objection to cruising at the moment is the cruise lines insisting you can only go ashore on an organised excursion.

( I posted this previously, but, in case anyone missed this --- enjoy a laugh on me ).

 

LOL--- That reminds me of a tour we took in Costa Rica -- I never saw so many bananas in my life.

Our tour guide took us to a little shop which was " probably " owned by a relative and told us we would never find prices like that anywhere else .

Not only that, he told us we were the nicest tour group he ever had and showed us pictures of his 6 kids !!

Not only that, at the end of the tour he had the back door of the tour bus locked so we had to get off at the front where he stood directly in front of the door until you gave him a tip. 

Not only that---- I believed ever word he said--- ya can't fool me when I'm stuck on a tour for seven hours going to see friggin bananas !!!

 

[alwaysonaship]

Absolutely not

[Happy Cruiser 6143]

4 hours ago, MK_Cruiser1955 said:

My objection to cruising at the moment is the cruise lines insisting you can only go ashore on an organised excursion.
   
Nope, not for me.

I cruise to visit and explore new places but I'm more than capable of exploring these places on my own, seeing what I want to see. Sometimes even wandering aimlessly round a town and finding hidden gems the organised tours wouldn't go near. I want to meet the locals, eat where they eat etc. etc. 
 

 

Exactly.  Why I will probably not take the 3 cruises I have booked for 2021 (which were re-booked from 2020).  The first one involves 3 days in Bermuda.  I've been to Bermuda twice and I want to do what I want to do, not be jammed on a bus to see things I've already seen.  The next 2 are a B2B to Iceland and Greenland.  I've already spent years planning this one.  No way I'm spending that kind of money to be forced to take ship excursions.

 

Now give me a cruise in the Caribbean that I can drive to the port and where I hardly ever get off the ship anyway, that's a whole different story.  Those I can book at the last minute.

 

As far as catching the virus, Florida is wide open.  I go out to eat all the time.  I attend book club every month.  I've flown several times to other states since all this started.  So far, no issues, so I'm not too worried about it.

 

I think everyone should do what works for their own comfort level.

[phoenix_dream]

18 minutes ago, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

 

Exactly.  Why I will probably not take the 3 cruises I have booked for 2021 (which were re-booked from 2020).  The first one involves 3 days in Bermuda.  I've been to Bermuda twice and I want to do what I want to do, not be jammed on a bus to see things I've already seen.  The next 2 are a B2B to Iceland and Greenland.  I've already spent years planning this one.  No way I'm spending that kind of money to be forced to take ship excursions.

 

Now give me a cruise in the Caribbean that I can drive to the port and where I hardly ever get off the ship anyway, that's a whole different story.  Those I can book at the last minute.

 

As far as catching the virus, Florida is wide open.  I go out to eat all the time.  I attend book club every month.  I've flown several times to other states since all this started.  So far, no issues, so I'm not too worried about it.

 

I think everyone should do what works for their own comfort level.

As this relates to cruising out of Florida which may happen soon, hopefully this isn't considered thread high-jacking.  So how is Florida handling the virus for real, in areas near FLL and MIA?  Are there mask requirements in stores, hotels, etc.?  Are there capacity limits in restaurants?  Do servers wear masks?  Do people walk around like the virus doesn't exist or do they generally try to social distance and wear masks when around others and so on?  I know there are not state mandates but I am wondering how cities like Lauderdale and Miami are handling things.

[PTC DAWG]

22 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

As this relates to cruising out of Florida which may happen soon, hopefully this isn't considered thread high-jacking.  So how is Florida handling the virus for real, in areas near FLL and MIA?  Are there mask requirements in stores, hotels, etc.?  Are there capacity limits in restaurants?  Do servers wear masks?  Do people walk around like the virus doesn't exist or do they generally try to social distance and wear masks when around others and so on?  I know there are not state mandates but I am wondering how cities like Lauderdale and Miami are handling things.

I would guess servers are wearing masks...that's how it is here in Georgia..I personally don't care for it, can't see peoples faces....I only wear a mask where required...never outside...never alone in my car....I just don't see the point.

Edited October 29, 2020 by PTC DAWG

[Life Buoy]

Richard Fain said in the Conference Call and on CNBC that they would start with some free test cruises. Would you take a 2-3 cruise if was free?

[phoenix_dream]

50 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

I would guess servers are wearing masks...that's how it is here in Georgia..I personally don't care for it, can't see peoples faces....I only wear a mask where required...never outside...never alone in my car....I just don't see the point.

They also wear them here, but Florida is a whole different attitude.  None of us care for it - I would doubt the sanity of anyone who actually likes wearing a mask where it is not needed.  But I don't care to get Covid either.  I don't wear them outside or alone in a car either, but inside it has been scientifically proven that there is significant lessening of spread while wearing a mask, as well as some protection to the wearer, varying by type of mask.  I would very much hesitate to dine someplace where the waiter/waitress is breathing all over my food given that so many people are asymptomatic.  (and I'm not implying they deliberately or forcefully breath on the food - but the particles have been proven to spread a minimum of six feet and some say further so just carrying the food, as well as speaking to me while carrying it can contaminate it)

[C-Dragons]

27 minutes ago, Life Buoy said:

Richard Fain said in the Conference Call and on CNBC that they would start with some free test cruises. Would you take a 2-3 cruise if was free?

Heck yeah! Where do we apply?

[ECCruise]

1 hour ago, Life Buoy said:

Richard Fain said in the Conference Call and on CNBC that they would start with some free test cruises. Would you take a 2-3 cruise if was free?

Nope.

Not going to travel anywhere for a 2 or 3 day cruise.  Still going to likely have other charges.

But hey, if you are dying (no pun intended) to be on a cruise ship, then could be a decent test.

[phoenix_dream]

1 minute ago, ECCruise said:

Nope.

Not going to travel anywhere for a 2 or 3 day cruise.  Still going to likely have other charges.

But hey, if you are dying (no pun intended) to be on a cruise ship, then could be a decent test.

Many people who cruise live with an hour or two of the ports.  I would guess they may look towards them first - how they actually would do this who knows.

[Pinboy]

1 hour ago, Life Buoy said:

Richard Fain said in the Conference Call and on CNBC that they would start with some free test cruises. Would you take a 2-3 cruise if was free?

Trust me--- Nothing is Free -- Don't forget your Visa and your Emergency Contacts list.

[ECCruise]

11 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

Many people who cruise live with an hour or two of the ports.  I would guess they may look towards them first - how they actually would do this who knows.

I included that in my "wouldn't travel," honestly.  I wouldn't travel at all to do a 2 or 3 day cruise, ever. 

Let alone on the MV Guinea Pig.

[cangelmd]

4 hours ago, phoenix_dream said:

As this relates to cruising out of Florida which may happen soon, hopefully this isn't considered thread high-jacking.  So how is Florida handling the virus for real, in areas near FLL and MIA?  Are there mask requirements in stores, hotels, etc.?  Are there capacity limits in restaurants?  Do servers wear masks?  Do people walk around like the virus doesn't exist or do they generally try to social distance and wear masks when around others and so on?  I know there are not state mandates but I am wondering how cities like Lauderdale and Miami are handling things.

Just came back from a 2 week vacay in Florida Panhandle. Stayed at Seaside where masks are mandated for entering businesses. Most restaurant dining has converted to outside. Inside dining was distanced and servers uniformly wore masks (much as it is here in Alabama). People were about 50/50 wearing masks outside whe social distancing was difficult (farmers market, for example). People standing in line for ice cream were socially distanced in family groups and mask wearing increased to a majority. Lots of teens on tight groups, uniformly no masks. Most people at a Publix, away from the local mask ordinance were masked. Went antiquing one afternoon in Destin, we wrote masks and were in the minority, but no crowds, well beyond 6 ft, much less than 15 minutes.

Have no idea how this translates to South Florida. I will say this, here in Alabama my area was the hardest hit early on because of Mardi Gras and large outbreak in New Orleans. Masks are worn much more uniformly by people over 30 here than in north AL, especially in the more rural counties (we have a second home in a rural area and have been up there 2-3 times in the months since this started) - those more rural areas are surging now. Under 30 only masked when forced and immediately take masks off when not forced, even in large groups.

[LGW59]

22 minutes ago, cangelmd said:

Just came back from a 2 week vacay in Florida Panhandle. Stayed at Seaside where masks are mandated for entering businesses. Most restaurant dining has converted to outside. Inside dining was distanced and servers uniformly wore masks (much as it is here in Alabama). People were about 50/50 wearing masks outside whe social distancing was difficult (farmers market, for example). People standing in line for ice cream were socially distanced in family groups and mask wearing increased to a majority. Lots of teens on tight groups, uniformly no masks. Most people at a Publix, away from the local mask ordinance were masked. Went antiquing one afternoon in Destin, we wrote masks and were in the minority, but no crowds, well beyond 6 ft, much less than 15 minutes.

Have no idea how this translates to South Florida. I will say this, here in Alabama my area was the hardest hit early on because of Mardi Gras and large outbreak in New Orleans. Masks are worn much more uniformly by people over 30 here than in north AL, especially in the more rural counties (we have a second home in a rural area and have been up there 2-3 times in the months since this started) - those more rural areas are surging now. Under 30 only masked when forced and immediately take masks off when not forced, even in large groups.

So, would you get on a ship today?