Please, just require passengers to be vaccinated so we can get back to sea.

[ReneeFLL]

15 hours ago, PhoenixCruiser said:

 

Really, I didn't think Florida regularly had days over 110, now humidity is another issue 😀

Yikes, no we aren’t up there. Yes, the humidity royally sucks.

[ReneeFLL]

7 hours ago, boscobeans said:

Private boat I imagine.

Yep, no problem.

[jules815]

1 hour ago, lenquixote66 said:

Best post on this thread.Congratulations If there was a Best Post Award on the internet you would get my nomination.😀

Agree 100%!

[ReneeFLL]

6 hours ago, Yorkvillain said:

People are very sensitive when it comes to the Bloomington, Illinois airport. 

If you are from there do you know the Rose family? ✈️

 

6 hours ago, Iamcruzin said:

Is Nassau closer to Florida than Cuba?

Cuba is 90 miles from Key West. Nassau is about 180.

[mugtech]

1 hour ago, BecciBoo said:

Yep, that's what I said originally, some die sooner than others but we are all on the same journey.  Now I'm done with this, we're upsetting the natives.

First heard it in 1965 Bob Dylan's It's Alright Ma (I'm Only Bleeding) as in:

 

Pointed threats, they bluff with scorn

Suicide remarks are torn

From the fool's gold mouthpiece

The hollow horn plays wasted words

Proves to warn that he who is not busy being born

Is busy dying.

[Shorewalk Holmes]

44 minutes ago, TheMastodon said:

Sure have!!

 

 

The graph seems to suggest that mask mandates may have had some beneficial effect until late March.  Of course there are other possible explanations.

 

But why the crossover? It's possible that Biden's statement caused states/counties/cities to either remove or add mandates.  Are the states/counties in the January data the same as the ones in the April data?

 

Or are the states/counties shifted to the other pot when they change their mandate?

 

Other possible explanations of the crossover are differences in the success of the vaccine program in different states, or the relative number of old people in each state.

 

 

Edited April 26, 2021 by Shorewalk Holmes

[broberts]

2 hours ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

... 

 

Edited:  wait I just saw that On April 22, Florida filed a motion in a district court in Tampa, asking for an immediate injunction that would rescind the CDC’s current orders. Florida’s argument is that the lawsuit is “likely to succeed on the merits of the case,” and it is therefore entitled to the injunction due to “irreparable harm and hardships” created by the CDC’s actions.

 

I suspect the counter arguments will mention the fact that granting the injunction has the potential to cause irreparable harm to the entire country. Such harm includes death and long term disabilities.

[livingonthebeach]

4 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

I suspect the counter arguments will mention the fact that granting the injunction has the potential to cause irreparable harm to the entire country. Such harm includes death and long term disabilities.

 

Florida could counter that counter argument by pointing out that every single business in the state is open.  How is a fully vaccinated cruise going to cause irreparable harm to the entire country?  What about airlines and other transportation and hospitality industries that are very much open at this moment? 

[cured]

14 hours ago, harkinmr said:

I would not concern yourself with the Governor's "ban" on proof of vaccine requests by private businesses.  Based on the fact that any private business can have reasonable restrictions for access to their premises and services, provided those restriction apply to all patrons and do not discriminate against persons in a protected class, then requiring vaccines will likely be legal.  Unvaccinated persons are not a protected class, although that may change at least with respect to those who are precluded from the vaccine by a documented medical condition, or perhaps documented religious exemptions.  Voluntary refusal to be vaccinated would probably not be protected.

 

I believe that DeSantis' purported ban on vaccine mandates by the cruise lines will fail.  He has no authority over businesses engaged in interstate or international travel.  What is particularly irksome is that he is being aggressive in his efforts to prompt the restart of cruises, but then turns around and shoots himself in the foot by attempting to take away the one vehicle that will allow cruise lines to do so.  Shortsighted to say the least.

Oh, I think he is knows exactly what he is doing. He is cunningly devious.

 

He screams at the wind that the CDC is evil and won't allow sailing from Florida. He sues the CDC to allow sailing. His base thinks he is a hero.

 

UH OH. The cruise lines are making moves to be able to sail by wooing the CDC with vaccinated ships.

 

He executes a no vaccine mandate that includes cruise ships. This presents a conundrum for the CDC. Vaccinated ships are safe yet Florida won't allow them.

 

Phew. now he can continue to scream that it is all the CDC's fault that ships are not sailing from Florida. His angry base believes him and thinks he is approaching god status for fighting the evil CDC. When is his next election? Oh yeah, 2022. 

 

 

[cured]

10 hours ago, BecciBoo said:

So  how does it make sense to stop oceanic cruises if this is happening in our own backyard?  CDC, please get competent help...oh that's just too easy.  Noticed the big wrestling  night this week where the guy broke his leg, not that I watch that junk, but even Tom (maskless) Brady was there.  Lots of sports fans not even masked or distanced.  And now Fauci is saying (SURPRISE) no mask is needed outdoors at all.  Brilliant!  It is totally obvious that for some unknown reason, CDC is singling out cruise industry to muck with.  WHAT is their problem?

Not sure how credible it is to use the old guy's BFF as the model of good sense when it comes to a world wide pandemic. 

[livingonthebeach]

2 minutes ago, cured said:

Oh, I think he is knows exactly what he is doing. He is cunningly devious.

 

He screams at the wind that the CDC is evil and won't allow sailing from Florida. He sues the CDC to allow sailing. His base thinks he is a hero.

 

UH OH. The cruise lines are making moves to be able to sail by wooing the CDC with vaccinated ships.

 

He executes a no vaccine mandate that includes cruise ships. This presents a conundrum for the CDC. Vaccinated ships are safe yet Florida won't allow them.

 

Phew. now he can continue to scream that it is all the CDC's fault that ships are not sailing from Florida. His angry base believes him and thinks he is approaching god status for fighting the evil CDC. When is his next election? Oh yeah, 2022. 

 

As many have pointed out, he does not have the legal authority nor jurisdiction to dictate what the cruise ships can and can not do.  

[harkinmr]

12 minutes ago, cured said:

Oh, I think he is knows exactly what he is doing. He is cunningly devious.

 

He screams at the wind that the CDC is evil and won't allow sailing from Florida. He sues the CDC to allow sailing. His base thinks he is a hero.

 

UH OH. The cruise lines are making moves to be able to sail by wooing the CDC with vaccinated ships.

 

He executes a no vaccine mandate that includes cruise ships. This presents a conundrum for the CDC. Vaccinated ships are safe yet Florida won't allow them.

 

Phew. now he can continue to scream that it is all the CDC's fault that ships are not sailing from Florida. His angry base believes him and thinks he is approaching god status for fighting the evil CDC. When is his next election? Oh yeah, 2022. 

 

 

Well said!  And extraordinarily on point...you get the door prize! 😉  Yes, he is up for reelection as Governor in 2022, and is making predictable overtures for president in 2024.  He is 'Mini-Me' on steroids. Lol!

[BecciBoo]

52 minutes ago, cured said:

Not sure how credible it is to use the old guy's BFF as the model of good sense when it comes to a world wide pandemic. 

Not...just saying if they allow all that why not cruise ships....and whose BFF do you refer.  I'm not making a judgement call on good sense

Edited April 27, 2021 by BecciBoo

[TheMastodon]

2 hours ago, Shorewalk Holmes said:

 

The graph seems to suggest that mask mandates may have had some beneficial effect until late March.  Of course there are other possible explanations.

 

But why the crossover? It's possible that Biden's statement caused states/counties/cities to either remove or add mandates.  Are the states/counties in the January data the same as the ones in the April data?

 

Or are the states/counties shifted to the other pot when they change their mandate?

 

Other possible explanations of the crossover are differences in the success of the vaccine program in different states, or the relative number of old people in each state.

 

 

No words

[broberts]

1 hour ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

Florida could counter that counter argument by pointing out that every single business in the state is open.  How is a fully vaccinated cruise going to cause irreparable harm to the entire country?  What about airlines and other transportation and hospitality industries that are very much open at this moment? 

 

Last I heard, the complainant banned busineses from asking for proof of vaccination. So your fully vacinated cruise is a chimera.

[time4u2go]

2 hours ago, Shorewalk Holmes said:

 

The graph seems to suggest that mask mandates may have had some beneficial effect until late March.  Of course there are other possible explanations.

 

But why the crossover? It's possible that Biden's statement caused states/counties/cities to either remove or add mandates.  Are the states/counties in the January data the same as the ones in the April data?

 

Or are the states/counties shifted to the other pot when they change their mandate?

 

Other possible explanations of the crossover are differences in the success of the vaccine program in different states, or the relative number of old people in each state.

 

 

Great questions. Definitely a lot of unknowns.

[livingonthebeach]

1 minute ago, broberts said:

 

Last I heard, the complainant banned busineses from asking for proof of vaccination. So your fully vacinated cruise is a chimera.

 

He can always make an exception in this case if he even has the authority to ban vaccine passports for the cruise industry which is not likely.  Also, cruises could leave from other US ports - Florida is not the only state affected by the CSO.

[broberts]

1 minute ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

He can always make an exception in this case if he even has the authority to ban vaccine passports for the cruise industry which is not likely.  Also, cruises could leave from other US ports - Florida is not the only state affected by the CSO.

 

😂😂 You want a judge to grant an injunction on the lawful actions of a federal agency based on the possible actions of the complainant and private business?

[livingonthebeach]

3 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

😂😂 You want a judge to grant an injunction on the lawful actions of a federal agency based on the possible actions of the complainant and private business?

 

Where do you get such a thought?  My stance is that if every industry is open then the cruise industry should be as well -- they should not be the only industry that is shut down -- that's all -- it's very simple really. 

[Shorewalk Holmes]

46 minutes ago, time4u2go said:

Great questions. Definitely a lot of unknowns.

 

Thanks! 

 

Yeah, graphs comparing aggregations of different sets of states or counties are often going to be tough to interpret visually because...well...they are different sets of states or counties! 

 

The states/counties may have relevant differences -- such as population density, age distribution, other covid restrictions, etc. -- that need to be statistically controlled.

 

Edited April 27, 2021 by Shorewalk Holmes

[broberts]

2 hours ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

Where do you get such a thought?  My stance is that if every industry is open then the cruise industry should be as well -- they should not be the only industry that is shut down -- that's all -- it's very simple really. 

 

Why change the subject? We had been discussing FL asking for an injunction.

 

Every industry is not open. For the most part those that are have to follow fairly strict mitigation procedures. The CDC laid out guidelines and the cruise industry said it was not willing to accept the procedures.

 

Arguing fairness or everybody else does it ignores the essential fact that we are dealing with a world wide health emergency. 

[Stick93]

29 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Why change the subject? We had been discussing FL asking for an injunction.

 

Every industry is not open. For the most part those that are have to follow fairly strict mitigation procedures. The CDC laid out guidelines and the cruise industry said it was not willing to accept the procedures.

 

Arguing fairness or everybody else does it ignores the essential fact that we are dealing with a world wide health emergency. 

The whole world doesn’t feel like you. It’s okay - you are paranoid of covid. If the cruises start we promise we won’t force you to come along. 
 

Open  up cruising with a plan and move forward. If those people who feel this global pandemic is one shot away from solved - we promise we will save a place for them in the ship when they see the rest of us moving on.  
 

Take the shot, wear a face mask if you have to and get in the damn ship already. Stop this mass hype that not everyone is doing. Cruise ship are sailing in the world already - just not in this backwards country. 

[Etta1213]

7 hours ago, lenquixote66 said:

People die at all ages. I had a nephew who died 3 years ago at age 42 from a brain tumor.

I hope you're doing ok, Len. 🌹from Texas.

[Shorewalk Holmes]

4 hours ago, TheMastodon said:

No words

 

Yeah, the issue is relevant for interpreting the data properly, but I guess there was no point in my phrasing it as a question.  How would you know the answer unless your source described the method in detail, or you were the data aggregator yourself.

[broberts]

7 hours ago, Stick93 said:

The whole world doesn’t feel like you. It’s okay - you are paranoid of covid. If the cruises start we promise we won’t force you to come along. 
 

Open  up cruising with a plan and move forward. If those people who feel this global pandemic is one shot away from solved - we promise we will save a place for them in the ship when they see the rest of us moving on.  
 

Take the shot, wear a face mask if you have to and get in the damn ship already. Stop this mass hype that not everyone is doing. Cruise ship are sailing in the world already - just not in this backwards country. 

 

Not sure why you feel the need to judge me. 

 

I reject your assesment. The COVID denier mantra that anyone concerned about infections must be paranoid is getting tiresome. It denies that 570,000 Americans have died with the disease and presumes no one is at risk.

 

Cruising will open when it is judged safe by those qualified and employed to make such judgements. Peanut gallery opinions of safety are meaningless.