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SS Future Re-Open Plan: Timing, Testing Needs??!!


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Being restricted to arranged excursions as the only way off the ship together with Gym and Pool closed would be a non starter for us who enjoy early morning gym and pool followed by doing our own thing in the Port we are in.

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11 hours ago, alexandria said:

Why else refer to the denied boarding provisions of the passage of contract (which provides for no refund or compensation if denied boarding)?  Why shouldn't older ships be required to provide the same high quality indoor air as newly built ships?  If these are recommendations for HEALTHY sailing, the air quality should be absolutely clean and safe regardless of the age or condition of the ship. If you look at the CDC Request for Information Related to Cruise Ship Planning and Infrastructure, Resumption of Passenger Operations, and Summary Questions (https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2020/07/21/2020-15812/request-for-information-related-to-cruise-ship-planning-and-infrastructure-resumption-of-passenger#open-comment), and in particular the twenty-six summary questions posed, many with multiple subparts, you will notice that RCCL ignored the vast majority of the concerns for which the CDC sought input.  It seemed that each of the panel's recommendations involved minimal cost or burden to the cruise line.

While the CDC will have the final word, the manner in which RCCL (Silversea) has addressed (or failed to address) the concerns raised by the CDC simply does not inspire my confidence in RCCL (Silversea).

 

Super excellent and very helpful that alexandria from Georgia has dug very deep into the details and specifics with the CDC requirements and the actual filings per the Federal Register.  Impressive research!!   As cited, certain of the efforts by RCCL to carve out an exception about "recommendations provide that it 'should' be optimized 'given the constraints of ship age and ventilation type.' "  Clearly the cruise ship attorneys were earning their fees with such wordings that are not designed to help customers, nor inspire any type of long-term confidence.  

 

Key point raised about "no refund or compensation if denied boarding".  Given the new limits as to what insurance would or would not pay, nobody wants to risk costly sailing payments if it is not clear what would happen if you get the Covid virus after passing previous, pre-boarding tests and are later re-boarding the ship.  

 

For us in cruising, so much is about the ports and being able to explore various, interesting parts of the world.  If we are "locked out" and/or limited to only cruise ship excursions, that makes future sailings very doubtful for us.  

 

Back to the CDC, my strong feelings and hopes are that their experts will not be fooled and/or tricked by such "games" by the cruise line lawyers and PR spinners.  They will see these efforts for what they are.  Weak and lame!!  Fortunately during recent months, CDC has been well aware of the risks in cruising with so many people from all over the world in very close quarters.  Ventilation standards and high-quality air performance will be very important in order to resume safe and health sailing.  

 

Keep it coming with all of the great comments, sharing, questions, research, etc.  

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Venice: Loving It & Why??!!  Is one of your future desires or past favorites? See these many visual samples for its great history and architecture.  This posting is now at 88,694 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1278226

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1 hour ago, TLCOhio said:

 

For us in cruising, so much is about the ports and being able to explore various, interesting parts of the world.  If we are "locked out" and/or limited to only cruise ship excursions, that makes future sailings very doubtful for us.  


For sure very doubtful for us.  I can’t imagine our 100 +/- days over the past eight years on Silversea in the Med without being to book private tours, self-guide ourselves, or just getting off in port and just wandering around.   It would not have been the same and nowhere as good.   

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I am not reading the 65 pages from the "Healthy Sail Panel" since all of you have given the re-cap🙂.  I will just have

to decide if the new protocols will be too much for me as well or if they will lax up as time goes by.......looks like I will

be looking for a land trip first........

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3 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

Weak and lame!!


Terry, you’re smart.  You’ve run in DC circles.  Did you, or anyone here, really think they would suggest anything different than what they did?  I would argue this is nothing more than an opening salvo to a protracted negotiation by the industry at large.  


These companies know what they are up against and understand the game, yes game, that one has to play with governmental agencies.  The agency would never accept what the industry proposes on first blush.  They have to show changes to the proposals, put into place policies with teeth, and create penalties for failure to abide by, etc., so that the public sees the agency as doing their job.  
 

This proposal is something that should have been issued 3-months ago.  By sitting on their collective hands and not forcing the CDC to engage with them, the industry has put itself behind the 8-ball now.  I don’t see how it gets resolved before the U.S. presidential election.

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1 hour ago, Randyk47 said:

For sure very doubtful for us.  I can’t imagine our 100 +/- days over the past eight years on Silversea in the Med without being to book private tours, self-guide ourselves, or just getting off in port and just wandering around.   It would not have been the same and nowhere as good.   

 

Very good comments and follow-up from Randy above regarding many of us value being able to do in-depth and customized shore adventures.   Don't like boring and/or average tours.  

 

Like from the wise Stumblefoot when he shared: "Terry, you’re smart.  You’ve run in DC circles.  Did you, or anyone here, really think they would suggest anything different than what they did?  I would argue this is nothing more than an opening salvo to a protracted negotiation.  These companies know what they are up against and understand the game, yes game, that one has to play with governmental agencies.  The agency would never accept what the industry proposes on first blush."  AGREE!!  It will take serious time and negotiations between this industry and the CDC before there can be agreement and a slow, staged re-opening for cruising to resume. The CDC does not have "full faith and confidence" in this industry with its many challenges, checkered history and unique conditions.  

 

From a columnist at a Wall Street financial website today, they had this headline: “Will Taking a Cruise Ever Be Fun Again?” with this sub-head:"Carnival, Royal Caribbean, and Norwegian Cruise Line are starting to formulate a plan of what cruising will be like in the new normal. It won't be pretty."

 

Here are some the author's highlights and comments: “There's been a lot of talk about when cruise ships will start sailing again, but not a lot of chatter about what the experience will be like. With the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) continuing to kick the 'no-sail' order can down the calendar, it's easy to set aside the conversation. However, with the Healthy Sail Panel,  putting out their health and safety recommendations this week, reality is starting to sink in. Cruising isn't going to be as fun and carefree as it used to be for passengers, and it's definitely not going to be as lucrative for the actual cruise line operators."  

 

Here is more to consider: "Crew members will have even more hoops to jump through. They also will be required to submit a fresh negative test before boarding the ship, but then they'll have to quarantine on the vessel for seven days and pass another COVID-19 test before beginning their duties. Life on the ship will also be a little more inconvenient. Passengers and crew will have to submit to daily temperature checks and be required to wear face coverings for most of the time that they're outside of their cabins. Naturally, there'll be exceptions when eating, drinking, or swimming, but the mask requirement is going to be a deal-breaker for some potential passengers. If this doesn't sound like the magical cruises that you may have taken in the past, you're right. If some of these measures seem like a regulatory overreaction, keep in mind that it's the cruise lines themselves proposing these changes as a way to get approval to start sailing again.

 

Full story at:

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/09/22/will-taking-a-cruise-ever-be-fun-again/

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Amazon River-Caribbean 2015 adventure live/blog starting in Barbados. Many visuals from this amazing river and Caribbean Islands (Dutch ABC's, St. Barts, Dominica, Grenada, San Juan, etc.).  Now at 67,426 views:

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2157696

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1 hour ago, Stumblefoot said:

 Did you, or anyone here, really think they would suggest anything different than what they did?  I would argue this is nothing more than an opening salvo to a protracted negotiation by the industry at large.  

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

I don't care what the cruise line propose, only what the CDC mandates including the penalties. Thanks.

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Not just the CDC but global Health Authorities agreeing to measures allowing cruise ships into their ports. 

 

Not much point in the CDC giving the green light if the rest of the world says go away. 

Edited by Tothesunset
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2 minutes ago, Tothesunset said:

Not just the CDC but global Health Authorities agreeing to measures allowing cruise ships into their ports. 

 

Not much point in the CDC giving the green light if the rest of the world says go away. 

Correct. Even if CDC let their no sail order expire I don't think cruising will resume anytime soon. Too, too many other issues to resolved. And I DON'T believe that the CDC is going to open the valve.

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On 9/21/2020 at 9:09 PM, alexandria said:

Note the complete absence of any discussion of repatriation of the passenger denied boarding.  It it is clear from the recommendations and accompanying discussion by the panel that a hard-line approach would be taken by RCCL (and Silversea) that the denied boarding provisions of the cruise contract would apply.  Those provisions clearly state as to denied boarding that the company "shall not be liable to any Passenger for any refund, payment, compensation or credit of any kind for such denial of boarding.

 

I'm wondering how people think these situations should be resolved. It's a tough one -- probably the toughest issue I see. Is it reasonable to expect cruise lines to assume responsibility for lodging and air travel for passengers who test positive for the virus? Absolve customers of any accountability for mask-wearing, social distancing, hand-washing and doing everything possible to arrive at embarkation virus-free? On the other hand, even someone who does "everything right" can still end up with the virus (especially after long airlines flights and multiple airports) -- should they face thousands of dollars of unexpected expenses in planning every trip? What about hotels and isolation/quarantine before return air travel?

 

I don't know how to handle this problem. Simply expecting the cruise line to pick up all the costs seems unrealistic; it would require cruise fares to go up, probably substantially. Expecting every passenger to leave home knowing there is a chance they'll test positive after traveling and need to suddenly pay to isolate somewhere for two or more weeks, and then fly home on a last-minute booking seems unrealistic. The only fair solution I can envision would be new insurance, mandatory for all passengers; the actuaries will calculate the odds of any passenger testing positive, calculate the costs (maybe set lower or higher depending whether the individual has had a vaccine), and apportion the costs (plus profits) across all the people who will buy the policies.  What other ways might this issue be addressed?

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In this case, all I can say is please stay safe. I mean first and foremost is to be safe aware that if you caught covid - you need to stay away from  such ways of entertainment. Next year we will have a vaccine and all these restrictions will not have any force. So just stick in there and wait for the vaccine. In this case, they wont any powers to deny you

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Sorry Roger88 but I believe that's magical thinking.

It is likely there will be one or several vaccines by next year but they are unlikely to be anywhere near 100% effective.

These restrictions in some form are likely to be with us for a long time.

'They' (whoever you mean) will probably always have the 'powers to deny us' (whatever it is you mean).

 

IMO we will eventually have to balance a reduced risk from Covid with our need to carry on with our lives, and choose what we are willing to do. This virus is unlikely to go away completely.

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3 hours ago, jollyjones said:

 

 

IMO we will eventually have to balance a reduced risk from Covid with our need to carry on with our lives, and choose what we are willing to do. This virus is unlikely to go away completely.

I agree totally that the virus is not only unlikely to go away completely, but that it will never go away completely.  I also agree that the best we can hope for in a single vaccine is 50 % effectiveness.  Perhaps a combination of one or more vaccines can increase the level of effectiveness.  What we can hope for, perhaps, is a combination of anti-virals, such as with HIV, that will limit the chance of dying from the virus to near zero.  But this is almost and art rather than science but it is proving to be possible.  Right now, nearly all medical resources are being devoted to vaccine research and little to drug 'cocktails' that might be effective in keeping at bay the most serious of complications from the virus.  That will come, only after they give up on virus quest.
 

What strikes me as the major barrier to reopening is living in a closed environment with inadequate HVAC systems.  Even though the CDC withdrew their advisory on the aerosol spread of the disease on Monday, I haven't seen such a respective institution lose their credibility and stature so fast, nearly every other health organization in the world agrees that COVID-19 is spread this way.  This means the the 6 foot social distancing does not work, and the virus can linger in a room for hours.  It is for this reason I will not dine out in an indoor restaurant, or attend any other indoor event until this is figured out.  Included in this obviously are the restaurants on cruise ships.  So in addition to all the restrictions contained in the CDC and cruise industry advisories add this to the list.  I do not see eating room service for an entire cruise.  Ms. Jones is spot on in saying there comes a point where we have to make an informed choice as to what we are willing to do, the risks we are willing to run, to go to sea again.  If I were 10 years younger, and without underlying conditions, I might contemplate doing so, even with a CDC (as I said above cannot be trusted any more) green light.  But I do have underlying conditions, as I think, given SS's demographics about 90% of have.  So choosing to cruise for me, right now is out of the question.

I think the only people going to sea will be college spring breakers who will take over a mega Carnival et.al ships and drink themselves silly with tequila shooters for a week and be to drunk to care.  

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4 hours ago, cruiseej said:

 

I'm wondering how people think these situations should be resolved. It's a tough one -- probably the toughest issue I see. Is it reasonable to expect cruise lines to assume responsibility for lodging and air travel for passengers who test positive for the virus? Absolve customers of any accountability for mask-wearing, social distancing, hand-washing and doing everything possible to arrive at embarkation virus-free? On the other hand, even someone who does "everything right" can still end up with the virus (especially after long airlines flights and multiple airports) -- should they face thousands of dollars of unexpected expenses in planning every trip? What about hotels and isolation/quarantine before return air travel?

 

I don't know how to handle this problem. Simply expecting the cruise line to pick up all the costs seems unrealistic; it would require cruise fares to go up, probably substantially. Expecting every passenger to leave home knowing there is a chance they'll test positive after traveling and need to suddenly pay to isolate somewhere for two or more weeks, and then fly home on a last-minute booking seems unrealistic. The only fair solution I can envision would be new insurance, mandatory for all passengers; the actuaries will calculate the odds of any passenger testing positive, calculate the costs (maybe set lower or higher depending whether the individual has had a vaccine), and apportion the costs (plus profits) across all the people who will buy the policies.  What other ways might this issue be addressed?

 

What is particularly troubling, at least from my perspective, is that boarding can be denied for reasons other than a positive COVID test.  From the report:  "Under the current circumstances, it would not be appropriate for cruise operators to have anything less than strict adherence to a no tolerance policy toward allowing individuals to board if they are confirmed or suspected of being  infected with SARS-CoV-2." 

 

Another specific recommendation the panel included was "As noted earlier in the recommendations, if a group is traveling together to a cruise, if any one of them has tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 in the previous two weeks, all members of that party who are close contacts of the infected individual should not travel to the pier and all will be denied boarding."   How does that recommendation apply when read together with the recommendation cited above?  What if a member of the party is only suspected of having COVID?  Wouldn't that mandate denial of boarding for all members of the party?  Does this provision apply to persons on cruise line excursions?  If you are in the group that takes that excursion and one of those participating tests positive for, or is suspected of having, COVID, would the entire group be denied re--boarding or disembarked?  After all, wouldn't you now be continued to be a "close contact?"

 

Reading two well-regarding trip insurance policies that I have on hand led me to conclude that denial of boarding under those criteria (suspected of having COVID or being a member of a party where one person has tested positive for, or is suspected of having COVID) is likely not a covered event that would allow a passenger to recover any costs of the insured trip.  For example, one such policy provides coverage as follows:  "You are prevented from taking Your Trip for any of the following reasons that are Unforeseen and takes place after the Effective Date:  Your Sickness, Accidental Injury or death or that of a Family Member or Traveling Companion, booked to travel with You, that results in medically imposed restrictions as certified by a Physician at the time of Loss preventing Your participation in the Trip."  Sickness is defined as "an illness or disease of the body that requires a physical examination and medical treatment by a Physician."  Quarantine is also an event which provides coverage. 

 

So in many cases where boarding is denied (note the requirement that the reason be unforseen), trip insurance will not provide any coverage.  On top of that, Silversea (RCCL) would retain your full cruise fare without refund, credit or any other compensation. So all of the risk falls upon the passenger and none upon the cruise line.  And based upon language commonly found in trip insurance policies, those are risks that you may not be able to insure for. This is the position that is being taken by Silversea (RCCL).  All while they continue to market cruises departing as early as December 1, proclaiming "CRUISE WITH CONFIDENCE!"  🤔

 

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The cruise lines and associated  peripheral orgs,  must find a way to be sailing soon.. or perish.

One option is to create 'in house'  travel insurance that covers all the  possibilities.

They can sell the insurance at a discount to get things started and then ramp up the charge until it covers the costs.

This option gets them sailing and  creates a monopoly insurance spin off that , in time ,  might be very profitable.

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An interesting comment on the process the panel engaged in is found on page 7 of the report:  "While the Panel included leading experts with depth of experience in a variety of relevant areas of science, hospitality, and public health, the experts relied on the cruise operators on the Panel to contribute the necessary expertise around the operational constraints and unique     considerations of cruise travel."

 

It will be interesting to see how Recommendation 8 (Cruise operators should not allow an individual to sail if they do not affirmatively state their willingness to comply with current safety and public health protocols) is implemented if it becomes part of the approved plan for resumption of cruising.  That provision in the report reads as follows:  "It is essential that cruise operators require guests to affirmatively state their willingness to comply with protocols to prevent the spread of SARS-CoV-2, as well as other health and safety requirements. Cruise operators may choose to incorporate the acknowledgment of compliance into existing attestations at the time of booking and/or boarding. Guests should be made aware far in advance of their cruise about mask wearing requirements, social distancing requirements, and changes in other cruise operations so they are prepared to comply with these policies on board." 

 

Will Silversea publish those in advance of embarkation dates and permit any guest who is unwilling to agree to these new requirements of cruising to cancel without penalty and receive a full cash refund?  Or will Silversea deny any refund to those guests based upon paragraph 25 of the passage contract which provides "CARRIER MAY CHANGE OR MODIFY THESE TERMS AND CONDITIONS UPON WRITTEN NOTICE TO PASSENGER" (bold and all caps theirs, not mine)??  That will be an interesting issue to watch for those who have booked or are planning future cruise travel on Silversea.

 

 

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29 minutes ago, alexandria said:

Will Silversea publish those in advance of embarkation dates and permit any guest who is unwilling to agree to these new requirements of cruising to cancel without penalty and receive a full cash refund?  Or will Silversea deny any refund to those guests based upon paragraph 25 of the passage contract which provides "CARRIER MAY CHANGE OR MODIFY THESE TERMS AND CONDITIONS UPON WRITTEN NOTICE TO PASSENGER" (bold and all caps theirs, not mine)??  That will be an interesting issue to watch for those who have booked or are planning future cruise travel on Silversea.

 

Excellent "detective work" by alexandria and follow-ups for the vital legal details as to how the cruise lines would "PLAY THE GAME" once they would resume sailing.  BUT, do not forget about the key warning of "consumer beware" and for reading those vital details, first, before signing up and sending them tens of thousands of dollars in payments.  

 

Interesting post and thoughts by the experienced tgh from Australia as to "They can sell the insurance at a discount to get things started and then ramp up the charge until it covers the costs."  YES, the cruise lines (with their uncertain, long-term finances) could take money from us for an insurance policy that looks good on paper.  BUT, which "REAL" insurance company with solid assets and a real reputation will back it up fully and guarantee 100% such a supposed protection policy??  Travel insurance, including what is excluded, why and how, will be another important detail for us to check (AND RE-CHECK) before we can be confident in sailing again.  Much more as to good questions and serious uncertainty??

 

From the CNBC business news channel yesterday, they did interviews with the top executives of both Royal Caribbean and NCL and had this headline: “Norwegian CEO sees lower 2021 bookings, hopes for an ‘OK’ year, as cruises try to resume despite coronavirus” with these key points: "Del Rio said future bookings are 'truly remarkable,' considering what’s happened to the industry this year, but he added that the company doesn’t expect 2021 bookings to be in line with past years. 'We’re behind last year. There’s no question, but not as far behind as you would think given what’s been going on,' he told CNBC’s Seema Mody on 'Power Lunch.' "

 

Here are some of their added highlights: “ 'A key part of it is to create a bubble, where we test every single person going on board, the guests and the crew and protect them so that their likelihood of entering with coronavirus is very low. And then we have processes on boards, so that if somehow somebody slips through, there’s still protection so it doesn’t spread,' Royal CEO Richard Fain told CNBC of the panel’s recommendations. 'We look forward to working with the CDC.'  Fain echoed Del Rio’s sentiment that 2021 bookings are higher than expected, but he did not compare them to a typical year’s bookings at this point in the ticket cycle. He added that cruising has already resumed in some parts of Europe, including Germany, Italy and Greece. 'Bookings in general have been much better than I think anybody expected, particularly as we get into the year, and people feel more and more confident that we’ll be able to be putting the coronavirus more and more into the rear-view mirror,' Fain said. 'The key thing to remember is how much more we know about the disease and how much better our technology is for dealing with it.'  The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention issued a no-sail order for cruise ships in U.S. waters on March 14, saying “that cruise ship travel exacerbates the global spread of Covid-19.” The order is currently due to expire on Sept. 30. ”

 

This link has a video clip from parts of this interview session with these two top and long-experienced cruising executives.  

 

Full story at:

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/09/22/norwegian-ceo-sees-lower-2021-bookings-hopes-for-an-ok-year-as-cruises-try-to-resume-despite-coronavirus.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

AFRICA?!!?: Fun, interesting visuals, plus travel details from this early 2016 live/blog. At 50,135 views. Featuring Cape Town, South Africa’s coast, Mozambique, Victoria Falls/Zambia and Botswana's famed Okavango Delta.

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2310337

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From Yahoo News and a writer with the South Florida Sun Sentinel this morning, they had this headline: “No more exploring cruise ports. If you want to get off the ship, you'll have to pay for their excursions” with these highlights: “Forget the tequila shots, straw markets and jewelry stores. If cruise lines are allowed to resume operations anytime soon, passengers won’t be permitted to roam freely around port cities.  Proposals to limit the spread of COVID-19 call for allowing passengers to disembark only if they are signed up for an excursion sponsored by the cruise line, one of a series of health protocols developed by an industry eager to resume operations.  The proposals, which cruise lines would implement voluntarily, include requiring all passengers and crew members to take COVID-19 tests before being allowed to board. Fewer passengers will be allowed on ships. Temperatures will be checked frequently. Face masks will be required at terminals and on board ships whenever social distancing is not possible. Cabins will be allocated for isolating patients who get sick. And cruise lines will develop ways to improve flow of fresh air through interior portions of their ships. The recommendation to prohibit passengers from freely roaming away from cruise lines’ watchful eyes in port cities would be enforced 'until further notice,' according to protocols developed by a panel of experts, called the Healthy Sails Panel.”

 

Part of this proposed restriction has some basis in order to protect from Covid-19.  Understand right now part of that motivation.  BUT, how much is also a "REVENUE-ENHANCEMENT" tool to feed the cruise line cash flow?  How long would this limited be enforced?  How much would excursion prices be inflated?   Clearly in our circumstance and for many other experienced cruise veterans, such a requirement could be a serious "deal-breaker" as to if and when we would resume sailing.  These types of "details" will be important to consider before some form of "normal" can resume.   

 

Also in many of these Caribbean islands, if the cruise ship passengers cannot freely roam and visit the various shops and jewelry stores, the economic impacts could be serious for many of these port locations.  Many impacts and questions!!

 

Full story at:

https://news.yahoo.com/no-more-exploring-cruise-ports-035900111.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Kotor/Montenegro:  Exciting visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this scenic, historic location. Over 47,869 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439193

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5 minutes ago, TLCOhio said:

From Yahoo News and a writer with the South Florida Sun Sentinel this morning, they had this headline: “No more exploring cruise ports. If you want to get off the ship, you'll have to pay for their excursions” with these highlights: “Forget the tequila shots, straw markets and jewelry stores. If cruise lines are allowed to resume operations anytime soon, passengers won’t be permitted to roam freely around port cities.  Proposals to limit the spread of COVID-19 call for allowing passengers to disembark only if they are signed up for an excursion sponsored by the cruise line, one of a series of health protocols developed by an industry eager to resume operations.  The proposals, which cruise lines would implement voluntarily, include requiring all passengers and crew members to take COVID-19 tests before being allowed to board. Fewer passengers will be allowed on ships. Temperatures will be checked frequently. Face masks will be required at terminals and on board ships whenever social distancing is not possible. Cabins will be allocated for isolating patients who get sick. And cruise lines will develop ways to improve flow of fresh air through interior portions of their ships. The recommendation to prohibit passengers from freely roaming away from cruise lines’ watchful eyes in port cities would be enforced 'until further notice,' according to protocols developed by a panel of experts, called the Healthy Sails Panel.”

 

Part of this proposed restriction has some basis in order to protect from Covid-19.  Understand right now part of that motivation.  BUT, how much is also a "REVENUE-ENHANCEMENT" tool to feed the cruise line cash flow?  How long would this limited be enforced?  How much would excursion prices be inflated?   Clearly in our circumstance and for many other experienced cruise veterans, such a requirement could be a serious "deal-breaker" as to if and when we would resume sailing.  These types of "details" will be important to consider before some form of "normal" can resume.   

 

Also in many of these Caribbean islands, if the cruise ship passengers cannot freely roam and visit the various shops and jewelry stores, the economic impacts could be serious for many of these port locations.  Many impacts and questions!!

 

Full story at:

https://news.yahoo.com/no-more-exploring-cruise-ports-035900111.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Kotor/Montenegro:  Exciting visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this scenic, historic location. Over 47,869 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439193

Thanks Terry for always coming up with the news from around the media.

This description of a cruise is a total non starter for Mrs Banjo and Myself.  If that is what we can expect, I expect our cruising days are over.  

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4 minutes ago, TLCOhio said:

...Also in many of these Caribbean islands, if the cruise ship passengers cannot freely roam and visit the various shops and jewelry stores, the economic impacts could be serious for many of these port locations.  Many impacts and questions!!

 

Full story at:

https://news.yahoo.com/no-more-exploring-cruise-ports-035900111.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Kotor/Montenegro:  Exciting visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this scenic, historic location. Over 47,869 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439193

 

A question then arises about how many of these destinations would no longer permit cruise ships to make port calls if the potential benefits of such don't outweigh the risks.  Or would these destinations increase their "head tax" in order to offset the loss in revenue resulting in increased costs to passengers just to arrive there and even greater costs if one wants to leave the ship in that port.  And if the Caribbean island nations respond by attempting to raise their head taxes, would the cruise lines respond as they have in the past by threatening to drop that island from their itinerary? 

 

Considering that the first recommendations from the cruise industry were just released on Monday, I can certainly forsee a scenario where it is at least another four to six months before US cruises resume while all of this is hashed out.

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8 minutes ago, crusinbanjo said:

Thanks Terry for always coming up with the news from around the media.

This description of a cruise is a total non starter for Mrs Banjo and Myself.  If that is what we can expect, I expect our cruising days are over.  


It makes me exceedingly sad to agree.  It brings to mind a song by Reba Mcentire several years ago entitled “If I Had Only Known” when I think back about our January cruise on the Wind.   I can’t help but wonder if that might have been our last cruise.  I hope not but......

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I do want to add a note of optimism. I am not sure who suggested that research into anti-virals could make COVID end up not a death sentence - eg as I believe HIV is not necessarily now - but I think this complete coming in and out of lockdown cannot last for ever. People enjoy cruising, and indeed flying,  and these things will come back - and hopefully for us!

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4 minutes ago, worldtraveller99 said:

I do want to add a note of optimism. I am not sure who suggested that research into anti-virals could make COVID end up not a death sentence - eg as I believe HIV is not necessarily now - but I think this complete coming in and out of lockdown cannot last for ever. People enjoy cruising, and indeed flying,  and these things will come back - and hopefully for us!

 

Appreciate these great comments and follow-ups from Mr. Banjo, alexandria and Randy.

 

As to this above "note of optimism", I want to share my view for the future positive potentials ahead.  Clearly this whole "process" is going to take longer, but I do believe there will be a "future" ahead for cruising and travel. It will be different!!  Maybe with a different structure for certain of the cruise lines that are able to survive. Vaccines will be a part of it.  Improved testing and treatments will be an aspect of the future.  

 

My rusty and imperfect "Crystal Ball" says there will be a "COMBINATION" needed and used.  No one shot or pill will do it "ALL"!!??  As an example on AIDS, there is no vaccine now, but it has been mostly controlled and managed by multiple medical and changes of practices, etc.

  

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Dubrovnik!  Nice visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this super scenic location. Over 47,476 views.    

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439227

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5 hours ago, tgh said:

One option is to create 'in house'  travel insurance that covers all the  possibilities.


Agree.  Or, work with Allianz, et al, to create a similar policy.

 

Vail Resorts created something similar this year and buried the cost in the season pass for skiing this upcoming season.  This way, people don’t have to worry whether they will be reimbursed should the mountains be forced to close again like last March.

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