Are vaccines the light at the end of the tunnel?

[LGW59]

1 minute ago, mimbecky said:

Good news: California just announced opening to over 50 on April 1st and to everyone over 16 on April 16th

Bad news: there are no basically appointments to be had of late.

Hope this means they think we are going to start getting a lot more soon!!

I am in MA, as of today we have had 1.3 million with both vaccines!  Opened to 60+ on Monday and was able to get appt for my first shot on April 5.

[wrk2cruise]

NC just announced an accelerated schedule.  We are currently doing group 4 Priority 1 Adults with underlying medical conditions.  They are moving the rest of Group 4 to March 31 (from April 7) and Group 5 Everyone else to April 7.

[nocl]

7 hours ago, TeeRick said:

I know this is a vaccine thread but we cannot lose sight of the good work going on with antiviral drugs too.  If we had a SARS-CoV-2 specific oral antiviral drug in addition to effective vaccines, our cruising problems would be solved.  Antiviral drugs would contribute to the vaccine light at the end of the tunnel.  I will highlight one here that just entered the clinic.  It is a viral protease inhibitor.  This class of drug has been effective with other tough viruses like HIV-1 and HepC.   

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/covid-pfizer-begins-early-stage-clinical-trial-testing-oral-antiviral-drug.html

It depends.  Does the oral take care of the secondary impacts - long  haulers and the damage COVID causes in many cases, even mild ones. We still do not know if the vaccines will prevent the same when mild cases occur in those vaccinated.

[nocl]

1 hour ago, mimbecky said:

Good news: California just announced opening to over 50 on April 1st and to everyone over 16 on April 16th

Bad news: there are no basically appointments to be had of late.

Hope this means they think we are going to start getting a lot more soon!!

When the time comes check the web sites for Albertson's, CVS, etc a couple of times each day.  SLO county went to age 50 on Monday.  On the 3rd time I checked Albertson's web site at 10:15 pm I got an appointment for the next day.  They also differentiate between the two dose vaccines and the single dose.

[D C]

10 hours ago, TeeRick said:

As your highlighted quote reveals, the CSO situation is currently under review internally and with other agencies (probably at least HHS).  They all have a new director and staff.  And a new White House to deal with too.  So saying -for now- that Nov 1 is still the date is the safe thing to do.  It might get revised to an earlier date.  The CDC cannot afford to be out of step and make decisions that would further erode public confidence.  I am just providing some insight.  I very much think that they need to be communicating more right now to us about cruising and travel.  We are all anxious since vaccines are rapidly changing the picture in the US and UK.

What the CDC could do is provide information to the public that they are allegedly serving.

They could have said something along the lines of "vaccines have changed the landscape.... we understand cruise lines are restarting elsewhere with vaccines being required... we think there may be merit to the proposal BUT.... we're waiting for additional research... additional data on transmission from vaccinated people.... etc etc etc... we expect/hope to have additional information by XXX date "   

 

Doing that costs them nothing, commits them to nothing, but gives a glimmer of hope of a reasonable decision in a timely manner.   Whoever leads their PR department needs to find a new job, imho. 

[LGW59]

11 minutes ago, D C said:

What the CDC could do is provide information to the public that they are allegedly serving.

They could have said something along the lines of "vaccines have changed the landscape.... we understand cruise lines are restarting elsewhere with vaccines being required... we think there may be merit to the proposal BUT.... we're waiting for additional research... additional data on transmission from vaccinated people.... etc etc etc... we expect/hope to have additional information by XXX date "   

 

Doing that costs them nothing, commits them to nothing, but gives a glimmer of hope of a reasonable decision in a timely manner.   Whoever leads their PR department needs to find a new job, imho. 

They are not focused on cruises resuming, nor should they be.  That is on the cruise lines, that have had months and months and months to present something, they did not, now they own it.  The glimmer of hope you want to cruise is not and should not be the focus of CDC

Edited March 26, 2021 by LGW59

[Charles4515]

4 minutes ago, D C said:

What the CDC could do is provide information to the public that they are allegedly serving.

They could have said something along the lines of "vaccines have changed the landscape.... we understand cruise lines are restarting elsewhere with vaccines being required... we think there may be merit to the proposal BUT.... we're waiting for additional research... additional data on transmission from vaccinated people.... etc etc etc... we expect/hope to have additional information by XXX date "   

 

Doing that costs them nothing, commits them to nothing, but gives a glimmer of hope of a reasonable decision in a timely manner.   Whoever leads their PR department needs to find a new job, imho. 

 

Your mistake is you confuse the public with people who want to cruise and the cruise industry. Most people I know would not consider taking a cruise. The CDC has said cruises should be avoided. You personally want a glimmer of hope. That is not their mission. Why should they care about PR? 

 

The cruise industry gave itself a huge black eye a year ago. The doubt the HBO Diamond Princess documentary premiering on March 30 is going to help the cruise industry.

[D C]

46 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

Your mistake is you confuse the public with people who want to cruise and the cruise industry. Most people I know would not consider taking a cruise. The CDC has said cruises should be avoided. You personally want a glimmer of hope. That is not their mission. Why should they care about PR? 

 

The cruise industry gave itself a huge black eye a year ago. The doubt the HBO Diamond Princess documentary premiering on March 30 is going to help the cruise industry.

 

53 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

They are not focused on cruises resuming, nor should they be.  That is on the cruise lines, that have had months and months and months to present something, they did not, now they own it.  The glimmer of hope you want to cruise is not and should not be the focus of CDC

Public relations IS the job of the CDC. It's absolutely essential for them to communicate to the public on every topic in which they're meddling. Thus far, their PR looks like it was done by the keystone cops. 

 

Cruising is one of the few areas where they have ACTUAL authority vs the mere ability to provide enforceless guidelines.  It's not too much to expect competence in communication in those areas where they have actual authority.  We're talking about a multi-billion dollar industry, not the local putt-putt. 

[Charles4515]

2 minutes ago, D C said:

 

Public relations IS the job of the CDC. It's absolutely essential for them to communicate to the public on every topic in which they're meddling. Thus far, their PR looks like it was done by the keystone cops. 

 

Cruising is one of the few areas where they have ACTUAL authority vs the mere ability to provide enforceless guidelines.  It's not too much to expect competence in communication in those areas where they have actual authority.  We're talking about a multi-billion dollar industry, not the local putt-putt. 

 

A non essential industry. The major cruise lines like Royal Caribbean are not a US industry. The Royal Caribbean ships are flagged in the Bahamas and the company is incorporated in Liberia. Thus they got no relief funds from the US government.

[lyndarra]

1 hour ago, Charles4515 said:

 

Your mistake is you confuse the public with people who want to cruise and the cruise industry. Most people I know would not consider taking a cruise. The CDC has said cruises should be avoided. You personally want a glimmer of hope. That is not their mission. Why should they care about PR? 

 

The cruise industry gave itself a huge black eye a year ago. The doubt the HBO Diamond Princess documentary premiering on March 30 is going to help the cruise industry.

They didn't learn from Diamond Princess and followed up with the Ruby Princess fiasco where the death toll was even greater. Diamond 14 dead, Ruby 28 dead.

[D C]

24 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

A non essential industry. The major cruise lines like Royal Caribbean are not a US industry. The Royal Caribbean ships are flagged in the Bahamas and the company is incorporated in Liberia. Thus they got no relief funds from the US government.

Doesn't matter. If the CDC sees fit to interject themselves into a "non-essential" industry, then they're obligated to follow through. 

 

"Here are today's rules.... screw you forever more" doesn't quite live up to their responsibility. 

[LGW59]

1 minute ago, D C said:

Doesn't matter. If the CDC sees fit to interject themselves into a "non-essential" industry, then they're obligated to follow through. 

 

"Here are today's rules.... screw you forever more" doesn't quite live up to their responsibility. 

all about you and being to go on a luxurious expense cruise.  CDC will take care of that for you

[zitsky]

Can I ask a practical question?  What are most people getting for vaccine documentation?  All I got was a paper card.  My area in North Carolina has a website but it's been difficult to get it working.

[cangelmd]

11 hours ago, TeeRick said:

I know this is a vaccine thread but we cannot lose sight of the good work going on with antiviral drugs too.  If we had a SARS-CoV-2 specific oral antiviral drug in addition to effective vaccines, our cruising problems would be solved.  Antiviral drugs would contribute to the vaccine light at the end of the tunnel.  I will highlight one here that just entered the clinic.  It is a viral protease inhibitor.  This class of drug has been effective with other tough viruses like HIV-1 and HepC.   

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/23/covid-pfizer-begins-early-stage-clinical-trial-testing-oral-antiviral-drug.html

The monoclonal antibodies have been highly effective as well. The problem is identifying and then notifying and actually treating the persons who will benefit the most. The cost-benefit ratio and side effect profile of both antiviral and antibodies has to hit a sweet spot - this is an infection that the majority will recover just fine on their own, but some are going to get deathly ill and some will have long term effects. On the positive side, I think I saw preliminary findings that looked like treating the virus might prevent the long term symptoms. If that holds up, it will shift the cost benefit toward treatment

[D C]

17 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

They didn't learn from Diamond Princess and followed up with the Ruby Princess fiasco where the death toll was even greater. Diamond 14 dead, Ruby 28 dead.

Are you seriously focusing on the actions taken before the pandemic was declared, before transmission was understood, and before there were widespread tests to even detect the virus? Saying "they didn't learn" in regards to the actions taken at that point in time is one of the most disingenuous comments possible. 

[Ken the cruiser]

5 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Can I ask a practical question?  What are most people getting for vaccine documentation?  All I got was a paper card.  My area in North Carolina has a website but it's been difficult to get it working.

When we got our 2 Pfizer shots, we received the CDC card and the associated tags that got placed on them after each shot. It also has spaces for possible future boosters later on. We're also going to take the CDC card to our local clinic where we'll have them recorded on our permanent shot record.

[D C]

8 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Can I ask a practical question?  What are most people getting for vaccine documentation?  All I got was a paper card.  My area in North Carolina has a website but it's been difficult to get it working.

Paper card with writing on it.  Doesn't even have my name on it, nor does it have the location where I received the jab or who administered it. 

[D C]

13 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

all about you and being to go on a luxurious expense cruise.  CDC will take care of that for you

I happen to expect competence from the CDC on every topic, yet they demonstrate otherwise with every opportunity.  The only thing 'about me' is that I apparently have higher expectations than others. 

[Charles4515]

11 minutes ago, D C said:

Doesn't matter. If the CDC sees fit to interject themselves into a "non-essential" industry, then they're obligated to follow through. 

 

"Here are today's rules.... screw you forever more" doesn't quite live up to their responsibility. 

They interjected to protect the American public from infections spread by infected cruise passengers. Before  the CDC Florida ports and other US ports were not allowing cruise ships with US citizens to dock. Our first cases in Maryland were brought in from cruise passengers. The governor closed the cruise port in Baltimore and has not given any timeframe for reopening it. Also do you recall that the cruise lines did not want to take responsibility for returning their crews home? The CDC has good reason not to trust the cruise industry. 

[Ken the cruiser]

3 minutes ago, D C said:

Paper card with writing on it.  Doesn't even have my name on it, nor does it have the location where I received the jab or who administered it. 

Maybe the organization that gave you the jabs have it documented in their database from which they can generate a more official document for you, or did you already ask them?

[LGW59]

3 minutes ago, D C said:

Are you seriously focusing on the actions taken before the pandemic was declared, before transmission was understood, and before there were widespread tests to even detect the virus? Saying "they didn't learn" in regards to the actions taken at that point in time is one of the most disingenuous comments possible. 

Oh dear, dear, D C, yes it has been a very challenging year, especially for the 540,000 dead from COVID and their families in just the US alone.   Fret not though, CDC is there for you and being able to board a ship for a luxurious cruise.  Darn those March 2020 cruise lines who messed it all up for us.  CDC = Cruise for D C.....go away

[D C]

5 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

When we got our 2 Pfizer shots, we received the CDC card and the associated tags that got placed on them after each shot. It also has spaces for possible future boosters later on. We're also going to take the CDC card to our local clinic where we'll have them recorded on our permanent shot record.

What constitutes a 'permanent record' and who maintains it Ken? County? State? I've received vaccinations and treatments in the past that don't even show up on the portal of the medical system that provided the service.  I don't expect that I could readily find the date of my last tetanus shot, let alone anything resembling a history of records. 

[Charles4515]

16 minutes ago, zitsky said:

Can I ask a practical question?  What are most people getting for vaccine documentation?  All I got was a paper card.  My area in North Carolina has a website but it's been difficult to get it working.

 In addition to the card I have a certificate of vaccination from the State of Maryland that I printed from he state health site vaccination database. I found the link to that from hated CDC website which has links to every state.  Of course just because Maryland has that does not mean North Carolina does. 

[Arizona Wildcat]

22 minutes ago, D C said:

Doesn't matter. If the CDC sees fit to interject themselves into a "non-essential" industry, then they're obligated to follow through. 

 

"Here are today's rules.... screw you forever more" doesn't quite live up to their responsibility. 

Disagree.  CLIA has not presented an updated protocols to the CDC.  The part most forget is CDC reports to HHS which in turn reports to the White House.  It is NOT just CDC.  Then throw in the USCG.

CLIA wants to avoid needing to follow CDC rules on cruises outside the US.

Being that the Caribbean cruise season is mostly over, Europe still fighting big COVID numbers, Canada closed - why can't RCG and others put together a plan?  They did for getting crew on board and vaccinated that was approved.

[D C]

4 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Maybe the organization that gave you the jabs have it documented in their database from which they can generate a more official document for you, or did you already ask them?

I asked about it. The card was the most official thing they offer.  I received an uncertain response as to whether or not the vaccination was registered with the state (maybe) or the CDC (definite no). Michigan doesn't require notification of vaccines given to those above 18 (or maybe 21).