Crew retuning

[BND]

18 minutes ago, FTLCruiseGal said:

Something is better than nothing.  It’s progress and a sign of somewhat normalcy.

Normal will not return until we have a vaccine and/or herd immunity.  We cancelled our Nov b2b and WDW trip  and rescheduled for next year because we want real normalcy, not something kind of like it.  Meanwhile, we're using money not spent on cruising to put on new gutters, plant some trees, put in a tile backsplash and remodel our master bathroom (large room about 12x12).  After that, we plan to redo our 15x8 foot master closet.

Edited September 10, 2020 by BND

[Vera/Lee]

5 hours ago, Vera/Lee said:

I wonder if Royal Caribbean is going to start with 2 or 3 ships. I wish they would tell us!

If you go to carnival.com and click on the link at the top that says "Update", it will take you to a page that says "Health & Sailing Update". On that page you will see a place to click on that says "Cancelled Cruises" updated on Sept. 3rd. --They tell you which cruises are cancelled and the dates.--

Edited September 10, 2020 by Vera/Lee

[chengkp75]

8 hours ago, Tapi said:

All of these things, in addition to the successful relaunch of MSC, TUI, Costa (and Aida) in Europe make me conclude that the cruise lines in North America have been able to sit down with the CDC and present a much more concrete plan of action, and also present procedures and protocols that are already in use and that so far (knock on wood) have proven successful. Maybe the CDC hasn’t given the cruise lines official word that the no sail order will be lifted yet, but maybe they have given the cruise lines enough information to conclude that they will let it expire and not extend it. 

While you may be correct, and there is much going on behind the scenes that could lead to November cruising, using the re-start of cruises in Europe as a measure of that confidence is not really valid.  While those cruise lines have shown some success with procedures and protocols that are required in both Europe and the US, the major difference between the government requirements for cruising remains:  the European model allows for "agreements" between the cruise line and the local/national governments of the ports to deal with treatment and quarantine patients, while the CDC still requires the cruise lines to have a plan that does not place any impact for treatment or quarantine on any local, state or federal health care system.

[ipeeinthepool]

12 hours ago, Tapi said:

I may be wrong, but I have the feeling that the talks between the cruise lines and the CDC may be farther along than they are revealing. 

 

I don't have the same feeling.

[Tapi]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

the European model allows for "agreements" between the cruise line and the local/national governments of the ports to deal with treatment and quarantine patients, while the CDC still requires the cruise lines to have a plan that does not place any impact for treatment or quarantine on any local, state or federal health care system.

Chengkp75:

 

As always, thanks for your expertise. That’s definitely a significant consideration and I do wonder how the cruise lines will handle any potential outbreak now vs 6 months ago. Will entire ships be required to quarantine ashore and repeat the nightmare that we witnessed when this started? Will advances in testing and treatment now allow for all passengers to be tested if there’s an outbreak, and only those who test positive remain in quarantine and/or under medical care at the cruise line’s expense, while everybody else is allowed to disembark without further requirements, thus minimizing the impact on the health system? 
 

Once again, I’m speculating as much as the next person with limited knowledge of how all these things truly work. I eagerly await the restart whenever that may be, and to find out what all the new protocols and procedures will look like. 

[livingonthebeach]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

......CDC still requires the cruise lines to have a plan that does not place any impact for treatment or quarantine on any local, state or federal health care system.

 

This seems to be the major bone of contention between the CDC and cruise lines.  Do you think that shorter sailings, say 3-4 days will make negotiations easier for a possible restart agreement?  

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, Tapi said:

Chengkp75:

 

As always, thanks for your expertise. That’s definitely a significant consideration and I do wonder how the cruise lines will handle any potential outbreak now vs 6 months ago. Will entire ships be required to quarantine ashore and repeat the nightmare that we witnessed when this started? Will advances in testing and treatment now allow for all passengers to be tested if there’s an outbreak, and only those who test positive remain in quarantine and/or under medical care at the cruise line’s expense, while everybody else is allowed to disembark without further requirements, thus minimizing the impact on the health system? 
 

Once again, I’m speculating as much as the next person with limited knowledge of how all these things truly work. I eagerly await the restart whenever that may be, and to find out what all the new protocols and procedures will look like. 

What I see as the CDC's requirement is that improved testing will not eliminate the need for quarantine, since there is time between contagion and positive test results, so that it will still be the way the CDC wants it, positive or suspected cases quarantined to a ship or private shore facility for medical care, and everyone else quarantined on a ship or private shore facility until repeated testing allows them to leave.  It isn't real pretty, and it will be costly, but I see that the CDC has a larger responsibility than just to the cruising public, they must consider the possible spread of the virus beyond the ship if people are let go too early.

45 minutes ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

This seems to be the major bone of contention between the CDC and cruise lines.  Do you think that shorter sailings, say 3-4 days will make negotiations easier for a possible restart agreement?  

Not really, because if people develop symptoms after being home from a short cruise, contact tracing will lead back to the ship, and things will start all over again, shutting down ships.

[livingonthebeach]

1 minute ago, chengkp75 said:

Not really, because if people develop symptoms after being home from a short cruise, contact tracing will lead back to the ship, and things will start all over again, shutting down ships.

 

I wonder if the cruise lines test for Covid-19 right before allowing boarding like they are with TUI, MSC and Costa in Europe, then how likely is it for a cruise with negative Covid-19 only passengers and crew to spread the virus?  It would have to be spread by false negative passengers?  I guess we will learn more as the European sailings progress.

[chengkp75]

14 minutes ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

I wonder if the cruise lines test for Covid-19 right before allowing boarding like they are with TUI, MSC and Costa in Europe, then how likely is it for a cruise with negative Covid-19 only passengers and crew to spread the virus?  It would have to be spread by false negative passengers?  I guess we will learn more as the European sailings progress.

Not just false negatives, but the fact that if I am infected today, and tested tomorrow, I may not show as positive, as the viral load has not increased to the detectable level.  Testing is very important, surely, but it does have it's limitations, as do viral vaccines, and all preventative measures.  Nothing in life is perfect.  Well, except my better half.  😉

[laumicmah]

1 hour ago, livingonthebeach said:

 

I wonder if the cruise lines test for Covid-19 right before allowing boarding like they are with TUI, MSC and Costa in Europe, then how likely is it for a cruise with negative Covid-19 only passengers and crew to spread the virus?  It would have to be spread by false negative passengers?  I guess we will learn more as the European sailings progress.

Could be spread by those who just contracted the virus right before sailing but too early to test positive. Like if in traveling to cruise port one contracts Covid within hours of being tested. I think they would test negative and then a few days later, while on the cruise, they are sick. Maybe if they did 3-4 day cruises folks wouldn't show symptoms until they are done the cruise. 

[time4u2go]

Nobody has asked the obvious question based on the title of this thread:  How long will it take to retune the crew? 😁

[John&LaLa]

20 minutes ago, time4u2go said:

Nobody has asked the obvious question based on the title of this thread:  How long will it take to retune the crew? 😁

 

There is another thread on that. No answer,  duh.  Nothing but opinions and speculation, which is fine, we just keep waiting.

[A&L_Ont]

31 minutes ago, time4u2go said:

Nobody has asked the obvious question based on the title of this thread:  How long will it take to retune the crew? 😁

 

It has been mention by the chief that it would take about 2 months to staff a ship.  I believe that was in relation to normal times as well.  

 

Without approval from the CDC it would seem rather foolish to start fully staffing even a couple ships.  Once staff are back on board their costs are rising.  I would not be doing that if I had not had approval, or a "guarantee" that things would be starting on November 1st.  As always, only time will tell, over and above vaccines etc, as the CDC says all.  Some seem to forget that simple fact.

 

I won't be making my final payment in December, for March, unless I see some ships sailing a few weeks or months with success.  My personal guidelines are no cruise cancellations due to infection on board, how they handle infected guests on board, and repatriation of said guests.

 

Yes, I know I have an option to cancel but I don't want my money sitting in their hands from December to March.  I want to see how they handle it, especially while at the expense of staying in the RLS.  Add to that flights, hotels etc. Just not worth it for me, when travelling 1,200 miles without even the discussion of what level of "normality" will the cruise be at.  

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by A&L_Ont

[sandebeach]

FYI, trying to get online now to hear this:

Cruise Restart | #PortMiami cruise partners to update the Miami-Dade Tourism and the Ports Committee Sept. 10 @ 9:30 A.M. EST LIVE: https://lnkd.in/gdgumvQ

Arnold Donald,President/CEO
Carnival Cruise Line Corporation

Rick Sasso, Chairman
MSC Cruises

Frank Del Río, President/CEO
Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings Ltd.

Michael Bayley, President/CEO
Royal Caribbean International

PortMiami Leadership
Juan Kuryla, CEO
Hydi Webb, Deputy Director

#portmiamistrong
#wearecruise
#cruiserestart

[sandebeach]

4 minutes ago, sandebeach said:

FYI, trying to get online now to hear this:

Cruise Restart | #PortMiami cruise partners to update the Miami-Dade Tourism and the Ports Committee Sept. 10 @ 9:30 A.M. EST LIVE: https://lnkd.in/gdgumvQ

Arnold Donald,President/CEO
Carnival Cruise Line Corporation

Rick Sasso, Chairman
MSC Cruises

Frank Del Río, President/CEO
Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings Ltd.

Michael Bayley, President/CEO
Royal Caribbean International

PortMiami Leadership
Juan Kuryla, CEO
Hydi Webb, Deputy Director

#portmiamistrong
#wearecruise
#cruiserestart

So far, comments coming in from travel agents and the hotel/travel industry urging the PortMiami Commission to urge the CDC to lift the ban on cruising. 

[Tapi]

13 minutes ago, A&L_Ont said:

Without approval from the CDC it would seem rather foolish to start fully staffing even a couple ships.  Once staff are back on board their costs are rising.  I would not be doing that if I had not had approval, or a "guarantee" that things would be starting on November 1st.  

That's one of the main reasons why I have a feeling that the talks between the cruise lines and the CDC are farther along than the public knows. If the cruise lines didn't have something from the CDC indicating that they will be allowed to resume cruising soon, they wouldn't be recalling crew members to report as soon as the end of September. It would be foolish to recall these crew members to then extend the no sail order further.

[Vera/Lee]

12 minutes ago, sandebeach said:

FYI, trying to get online now to hear this:

Cruise Restart | #PortMiami cruise partners to update the Miami-Dade Tourism and the Ports Committee Sept. 10 @ 9:30 A.M. EST LIVE: https://lnkd.in/gdgumvQ

Arnold Donald,President/CEO
Carnival Cruise Line Corporation

Rick Sasso, Chairman
MSC Cruises

Frank Del Río, President/CEO
Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings Ltd.

Michael Bayley, President/CEO
Royal Caribbean International

PortMiami Leadership
Juan Kuryla, CEO
Hydi Webb, Deputy Director

#portmiamistrong
#wearecruise
#cruiserestart

Listening now. Thank you for the link!

[John&LaLa]

6 minutes ago, Tapi said:

That's one of the main reasons why I have a feeling that the talks between the cruise lines and the CDC are farther along than the public knows. If the cruise lines didn't have something from the CDC indicating that they will be allowed to resume cruising soon, they wouldn't be recalling crew members to report as soon as the end of September. It would be foolish to recall these crew members to then extend the no sail order further.

 

It's not like we've seen a more than a handful of crew members being recalled 😉

[Tapi]

2 minutes ago, John&LaLa said:

 

It's not like we've seen a more than a handful of crew members being recalled 😉

True, we don't know how many are being recalled, but hopefully its enough to man at least one ship. :)

[John&LaLa]

5 minutes ago, Tapi said:

True, we don't know how many are being recalled, but hopefully its enough to man at least one ship. 🙂

 

As long as we have a bartender, who cares about the rest of the ship😉🍹🍺

[notmyrealnameoremail]

Add a chef and a dishwasher and I'm good to go.

 

[livingonthebeach]

 

31 minutes ago, sandebeach said:

So far, comments coming in from travel agents and the hotel/travel industry urging the PortMiami Commission to urge the CDC to lift the ban on cruising. 

 

Bayley speaking now.  Thanks for the info!

[island lady]

14 hours ago, sandebeach said:

I am right there with you!

 

My "maybe cruise" B2B Harmony 11/29 and 12/6 pricing has not gone down at all...for months still the same.  And I am after final payment.  Not sure if that is a good sign or not.  

Edited September 10, 2020 by island lady

[A&L_Ont]

@sandebeachthanks for the link. 
 

Listening now. My feeling is the POM and the cruise lines are using “strong language” and emotion the get the CDC to start moving “now”.  
 

The key thing I heard was it took 14 weeks to hear back from the CDC the last time they submitted anything. If plans are submitted on September 21 they are afraid it could take another 14 weeks before they might hear anything back again. 
 

It certainly appears as though the CDC is in no hurry to jump to support the economy of Miami and Florida.  They are trying to stand united but against the CDC it seems to be a battle and they don’t know what tools they need to win. 

Edited September 10, 2020 by A&L_Ont

[livingonthebeach]

4 minutes ago, A&L_Ont said:

@sandebeachthanks for the link. 
 

Listening now. My feeling is the POM and the cruise lines are using “strong language” and emotion the get the CDC to start moving “now”.  
 

The key thing I heard was it took 14 weeks to hear back from the CDC the last time they submitted anything. If plans are submitted on September 21 they are afraid it could take another 14 weeks before they might hear anything back again. 
 

It certainly appears as though the CDC is in no hurry to jump to support the economy of Miami and Florida.  They are trying to stand united but against the CDC it seems a battle and they don’t know what tools they need to win. 

 

The conclusion was that as soon as the plans are submitted between Sept 18-21, Miami-Dade officials are going to get Congress involved to pressure the CDC into reviewing and coming to a conclusion ASAP.  Let's hope it works!