Princess has finally updated its guidelines for sailing under CDC CSO

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, LACruiser88 said:

If this is the outcome, I think cruise lines will avoid sailing from Florida.  They are not going to pay millions in fines.

And if that happens, it will definitely not be a victory that Governor DeSantis can savor.

[bouhunter]

2 hours ago, CI66774 said:

They aren’t. They’re gonna get spanked with millions of dollars in fines for every sailing out of Florida that violates the law. Moreover, FL is going to win any challenge to this law so Carnival, etc. will have to pay up. It’s going to be costly for them.

Not likely.  If that were to actually happen they wouldn't bother sailing at all.

[memoak]

3 hours ago, CI66774 said:

They aren’t. They’re gonna get spanked with millions of dollars in fines for every sailing out of Florida that violates the law. Moreover, FL is going to win any challenge to this law so Carnival, etc. will have to pay up. It’s going to be costly for them.

No the cruise lines will just make it so hard for non vaccinated people to cruise that they wi stop trying. One cruise line has already said that non vaccinated cruisers will have to pay for tests, be tested daily and will not be allowed to engage in some activities. Or they will just move the states they cruise from. No way Florida comes out well in any scenario 

[Steelers36]

4 hours ago, kitty2264 said:

The link to the FAQ is confusing to me.  They very first two words of the FAQs are "These cruises".  I'm having trouble deciphering what are "these cruises"  Is there a list associated with the statement somewhere that I am missing?

I agree, but I think they mean 2021, in general - or at least out to what was the NOV date for No Sail order.  Or, perhaps until the CDC influence is gone or expired on Covid-19 protocols.  But, there still has to be the concern of the unvaccinated numbers and if it could halt a cruise prematurely.

 

[Steelers36]

On the FL ports.  There are too many cruise lines (Disney, RCL, Celeb, Aza, HAL, Carn, PCL, and more) and the built-up infrastructure of the ports is hard to re-produce - not to mention the hotels and associated outlying business services.  

 

This will be resolved in some way.  I don't have the magic ball answer, but this will get sorted out.  Its just too significant not to.

[Wishing on a star]

How does Princess and other cruise lines get around this, and ask about or require vaccination?   

First, I don't this thing is anywhere near 'over'.

I feel like there will have to be some kind of middle-ground agreement here.

 

I have no knowledge and no Crystal Ball...  

But, if FL does win this thing in the final ruling, and Cruise Lines decide that they can and should be able to ask about vaccination, then the next step would have to be that they file their own lawsuit.  

Cruise Lines - vs - State of Florida.

 

This thing is so complex...

We already have so many complaints and possible lawsuits out there.

Just read about people suing the airlines over the airlines mask mandate.

Say they 'cannot wear mask' and claim discrimination.

 

The cruise lines continue to be stuck in the middle here.  Caught in the crossfire!

Edited June 19, 2021 by Wishing on a star

[Cruising89143]

4 hours ago, CI66774 said:

They aren’t. They’re gonna get spanked with millions of dollars in fines for every sailing out of Florida that violates the law. Moreover, FL is going to win any challenge to this law so Carnival, etc. will have to pay up. It’s going to be costly for them.

I have a Celebrity cruise booked for August. There is no demand by Celebrity to present proof of vaccination. You are simply asked when booking if you’re vaccinated and if so will you present proof at check in. Those booking online will be contacted by Celebrity to ask the same questions. If you state that your not vaccinated or do not wish to present the card at check in then you’re considered unvaccinated and the limit for the number of unvaccinated guests stands at five percent. Some will be told that they have reached their limit on the number of unvaccinated guests on a particular sailing and will not be allowed to sail. Celebrity is not forcing anyone to show proof of vaccination. 

[Wishing on a star]

So, that would leave those who do not, or can not, show proof of Vaccination to show up at the Dock and simply HOPE that they are within the 5%, or whatever agreed percent...  Could be left off the ship.  And that could only be determined in real time, at boarding.  And would still mean that the cruise line would have to ask 'if you would like to volunteer' the information.

 

It would also still mean that there could be those refused service due to 'vaccine requirements'.  

 

I don't see this happening.

I think that there will be some middle ground ironed out.

 

 

Edited June 19, 2021 by Wishing on a star

[Cruising89143]

1 minute ago, Wishing on a star said:

So, that would leave those who do not, or can not, show proof of Vaccination to show up at the Dock and simply HOPE that they are within the 5%, or whatever agreed percent...  Could be left off the ship.  And that could only be determined in real time, at boarding.  And would still mean that the cruise line would have to ask 'if you would like to volunteer' the information.

 

I don't see this happening.

I think that there will be some middle ground ironed out.

 

 

You will be notified before sail date. It’s a chance one takes if they’re unvaccinated. 

[Wishing on a star]

Again...  this would not work if current FL law prevails.

it is still 'asking'.

It is still 'denying service'.

 

This thing is nowhere near over!

[Cruising89143]

5 minutes ago, Wishing on a star said:

Again...  this would not work if current FL law prevails.

it is still 'asking'.

It is still 'denying service'.

 

This thing is nowhere near over!

I will let you be the expert on what the cruise lines are doing. Celebrity is not requiring anyone to present their proof. Each person has a choice. 
 

Companies doing business in Florida, including Celebrity Cruises, should immediately cease to impose such discriminatory policies upon individuals,” Pushaw told TPG. “Companies that violate this law would be subject to a fine of $5,000 each time they require a customer to present a ‘vaccine passport’ for service.”

DeSantis and his team have used the term “vaccine passport” broadly in recent months to include any sort of proof of a vaccine, such as a vaccine card.

[memoak]

The cruise lines will not require proof of vaccination but if you do not volunteer the proof then they can and will charge you more and make it so expensive and take away so many choices  (separate dining areas , no entry into crowded areas like bars and events) that the unvaccinated will choose not to cruise. The cruise lines cannot take the chance on a widespread outbreak 

[Steelers36]

1 hour ago, Wishing on a star said:

How does Princess and other cruise lines get around this, and ask about or require vaccination?   

First, I don't this thing is anywhere near 'over'.

I feel like there will have to be some kind of middle-ground agreement here.

 

I have no knowledge and no Crystal Ball...  

But, if FL does win this thing in the final ruling, and Cruise Lines decide that they can and should be able to ask about vaccination, then the next step would have to be that they file their own lawsuit.  

Cruise Lines - vs - State of Florida.

 

This thing is so complex...

We already have so many complaints and possible lawsuits out there.

Just read about people suing the airlines over the airlines mask mandate.

Say they 'cannot wear mask' and claim discrimination.

 

The cruise lines continue to be stuck in the middle here.  Caught in the crossfire!

 

This has been suggested some days ago and I would give credit to the CC poster, but don't recall who it was.  Princess can ask us when it is time to respond to the health questionnaire - or before - to attest about vaccinations and even upload document proof like we do our passports.  This is HQ in Santa Clarita.  It's all done, save for those passengers without a smart device.  Or, they can email passengers not responded by a certain date and/or alert the TA.

 

Those dealing with it at the pier can be done as @cruisingator2 wrote about Celebrity.  Offer them to show the proof and be treated as a vaccinated passenger.  If choose not to, then they are treated as unvaccinated.  Once 2021 period passes (not sure of the date), the 95% threshold is going to go away.  I would not be expecting 95% vaccinated requirement in perpetuity. 

 

Edited June 19, 2021 by Steelers36

[Wishing on a star]

For now, each cruise line is coming up with their own policy.

It seems that Celebrity is not requiring, but 'asking'.    (is that not against the current FL legislation?)

Princess seems to be requiring vaccination.

I am not commenting on any one line or policy, one way or another.

 

We are talking about the ongoing lawsuit, and any FL fines.

And, it seems that this whole situation is ongoing.

This is not over.

 

If it is ruled that FL wins this lawsuit, then DeSantis will probably want to implement and enforce those laws and those fines.

 

IF...  IF this is what happens, Cruise Lines have three choices...  

1.  Comply 

2.  File their own lawsuit against FL if they feel that these fines are not legal

3.  Not sail from FL.

 

Edited June 19, 2021 by Wishing on a star

[Host CJSKIDS]

6 hours ago, CI66774 said:

They aren’t. They’re gonna get spanked with millions of dollars in fines for every sailing out of Florida that violates the law. Moreover, FL is going to win any challenge to this law so Carnival, etc. will have to pay up. It’s going to be costly for them.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, cruisingator2 said:

I will let you be the expert on what the cruise lines are doing. Celebrity is not requiring anyone to present their proof. Each person has a choice. 
 

Companies doing business in Florida, including Celebrity Cruises, should immediately cease to impose such discriminatory policies upon individuals,” Pushaw told TPG. “Companies that violate this law would be subject to a fine of $5,000 each time they require a customer to present a ‘vaccine passport’ for service.”

DeSantis and his team have used the term “vaccine passport” broadly in recent months to include any sort of proof of a vaccine, such as a vaccine card.

 

 

The big if in this is that the law is that businesses COULD be fined.  The law stipulates that a fine up to $5,000 may be administered against a business per occurrence and this is for each customer denied entrance. It’s not for asking whether you have been vaccinated,  it’s for asking to see proof of vaccine so perhaps the fines won’t be as large to begin with. 

 

It certainly will be interesting to see how this works out.  Princess may just go ahead with their guidelines as posted on this thread even from Florida.

[SailingSteve77]

I just got this sent to me from a CC friend in Tampa.  

 

https://www.tampabay.com/news/florida-politics/2021/06/18/federal-judge-sides-with-desantis-in-dispute-with-cdc-over-cruise-industry/

 

 

[CruisinFinsUp]

Yes, we will feature production shows, singers, comedians, musicians, lecturers, arts and crafts, bingo, classes, presentations and entertainment staff as a part of your onboard experience. This team will maintain physical distancing with guests while performing, and no onstage interaction with guests will be permitted.

Shared experiences and larger group events including indoor dancing, nightclubs, karaoke and singing groups, The Voice of the Ocean, behind-the-scenes tours, Captain’s Champagne Waterfall, and group renewal of vows will not be available during these cruises, with the exception of select instructor-led classes hosted with physical distancing.

 

So what does this mean exactly??  I guess we'll have to wait for the first cruises to see!   
 

No dancing in the piazza?  
Whats the definition of "nightclubs" - only the late night dancing or bars too?

Looks like we can sit in a bar or piazza and listen to musicians ... right? 
 

We are booked for NYE.  Does that mean no NYE celebration? 
 

I'm looking forward to hearing from folks who go on the first few cruises to hear exactly what actually happens on board.   The Princess explanations are a bit vague and open to speculation! 
 

 

[Babr]

2 hours ago, Wishing on a star said:

Again...  this would not work if current FL law prevails.

it is still 'asking'.

It is still 'denying service'.

 

This thing is nowhere near over!

I don't think it is considered denying service if they are still allowed to sail. They can volunteer their information to be in the group of vaccinated passengers who have fewer restrictions; but if they do not want to do that, they will be considered unvaccinated and subject to more onerous protocols. 
 

No asking; no denying of service.

 

I agree that it is not over, but many cruise line are moving forward with similar plans.

[Reydnn38]

On 6/17/2021 at 10:49 PM, caribill said:

 

 

Looks like all 2021 cruises are so designated.

 

Princess cruises sailing through 2021 are available for guests who have received their final dose of an approved COVID-19 vaccine at least 14 days prior to the beginning of the cruise and have proof of vaccination. Crew vaccinations will be in accordance with CDC guidelines.

I don't see our cruise to South America via the Diamond Princess on the list, unless I missed it. 😞

 

[kiwimum]

11 minutes ago, Reydnn38 said:

I don't see our cruise to South America via the Diamond Princess on the list, unless I missed it. 😞

 

We are also on the Diamond December 1st to South America and Antarctica.   My guess is the Diamond is not returning to a US port therefore does not fall under the jurisdiction of the CDC.  It appears all the cruises listed are closed loop, returning to the same port.   Maybe wrong.

 

Edited June 19, 2021 by kiwimum

[maggie777]

5 hours ago, memoak said:

The cruise lines will not require proof of vaccination but if you do not volunteer the proof then they can and will charge you more and make it so expensive and take away so many choices  (separate dining areas , no entry into crowded areas like bars and events) that the unvaccinated will choose not to cruise. The cruise lines cannot take the chance on a widespread outbreak 

How do you think the non-vaccinated will be easily identified once on board?

[memoak]

8 minutes ago, maggie777 said:

How do you think the non-vaccinated will be easily identified once on board?

There card or medallion can be input with the non vaccinated notice and you can be required to show it whenever you go into a venue. 

[ontheweb]

10 hours ago, memoak said:

There card or medallion can be input with the non vaccinated notice and you can be required to show it whenever you go into a venue. 

Every person carded to go into the theater? Every person carded to go into a swimming pool? Every person carded to join a trivia contest? etc. etc.

 

I can't see that working, plus it would take a lot of staff to do that.

[mthomp5]

19 hours ago, maggie777 said:

How do you think the non-vaccinated will be easily identified once on board?

I hope they distribute wrist bands to the vaccinated people.  No wrist band….then you should be wearing a mask.

[Thrak]

19 hours ago, maggie777 said:

How do you think the non-vaccinated will be easily identified once on board?

 

10 minutes ago, mthomp5 said:

I hope they distribute wrist bands to the vaccinated people.  No wrist band….then you should be wearing a mask.

 

See post #79 in this thread...