They have destroyed the Crows Nest

[RedmondCruiser]

Our last cruise was on the Amsterdam in 2019.  We went to Alaska on the Westerdam for our first post Covid cruise.  We have been on the Westerdam several times before and there have been many changes.  Most of them bad. The reconfiguration of the Crows Nest seems ill thought out.  The Captains Quarter on the port side aft was an elegant space.  Now its a school room with desks ??  The Crows nest bar now has less than half the bar seats since they moved the espresso machine into it.  Why they didn't leave it on the starboard side is a mystery. I always enjoyed happy hour in the Crows Nest with great comradery and hor derves  being served.  Now no food and no happy hour in the Crows Nest.  The explorers lounge has been reconfigured and chopped up.  I know that cut backs are needed in attempting to get back to profitability, due to Covid, but some changes don't make sense.

 

Its not all bad.  The crew was fantastic, as always.  They made it great to be back.  The food was good.  The main dining room had fewer selections to choose from but the food was very good and the presentation was spot on.  Seems like there were many small things missing.  One change was a Pinnacle requirement that if you chose more than one starter there was a $7 charge.  Therefor it you wanted a soup and salad preceeding your meal you had to pay extra. I wonder if Seattle really thought through that one.  The food was fantastic though.

 

It was good to be back and now its time to book some longer cruises again.

[Florida_gal_50]

The extra charge for the pinnacle isn't new.  It's been talked about at length.  It's been at least 6 months. The school room with desks are for those that enjoy the coloring "classes" that they seem to really like to push.

[LocoLoco1]

If there’s a recent change it’s probably because ‘Corporate’ thinks it’s a way to make a little more $$. But methinks they guess wrong on occasion. 

[Mary229]

5 hours ago, RedmondCruiser said:

One change was a Pinnacle requirement that if you chose more than one starter there was a $7 charge.  Therefor it you wanted a soup and salad preceeding your meal you had to pay extra. I wonder if Seattle really thought through that one.  The food was fantastic though.

I agree.   Just raise the price for dinner and let people enjoy the meal without upcharges.  This doesn’t need to be complicated.  It certainly ruins the ambience to try to enjoy a special night out, all paid for, then need to discuss with the waitstaff payment.  

[cruisemom42]

Hot hors' d'ouvres in the bars pre-dinner were gone long before Covid...

 

The "crafts" room seemed well utilized on Westerdam in Japan. They had a lot of origami classes as well as the coloring, painting and mug-making. I can't really recall what that space was used for before?

[Florida_gal_50]

1 hour ago, Mary229 said:

I agree.   Just raise the price for dinner and let people enjoy the meal without upcharges.  This doesn’t need to be complicated.  It certainly ruins the ambience to try to enjoy a special night out, all paid for, then need to discuss with the waitstaff payment.  

It’s expensive enough already and it average at best.  Usually the only time I go there it’s to use a freebie. They are always running around like chickens with their heads cut off.  I don’t notice that in any other specialty.  That doesn’t deserve a price increase. 

[Florida_gal_50]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

Hot hors' d'ouvres in the bars pre-dinner were gone long before Covid...

 

The "crafts" room seemed well utilized on Westerdam in Japan. They had a lot of origami classes as well as the coloring, painting and mug-making. I can't really recall what that space was used for before?

At least those seem to be more worthwhile things to do.  It’s not my idea of fun but it’s more in than colouring 🙄.

[visagrunt]

3 hours ago, Mary229 said:

I agree.   Just raise the price for dinner and let people enjoy the meal without upcharges.  This doesn’t need to be complicated.  It certainly ruins the ambience to try to enjoy a special night out, all paid for, then need to discuss with the waitstaff payment.  

But remember, a great many people are dining in PG on HIA credits.  And while the charge is buried in the price of HIA, I imagine the corporate reasoning is, "if you're getting a 'free' specialty dinner, then the $7 or $15 supplements are easier to accept."

The recent change to "pay the difference" on the beverage packages strongly suggests to me that we will be seeing drink prices increasing in due course.

Edited May 30, 2023 by visagrunt

[Florida_gal_50]

6 hours ago, visagrunt said:

But remember, a great many people are dining in PG on HIA credits.  And while the charge is buried in the price of HIA, I imagine the corporate reasoning is, "if you're getting a 'free' specialty dinner, then the $7 or $15 supplements are easier to accept."

The recent change to "pay the difference" on the beverage packages strongly suggests to me that we will be seeing drink prices increasing in due course.

They already have.  A cosmo used to be at the $11 mark now it’s $12.  For a Canadian that’s over $16.  It’s not that expensive in the city I live in and the cruise line booze is cheap for them to buy.

[MISTER 67]

38 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

They already have.  A cosmo used to be at the $11 mark now it’s $12.  For a Canadian that’s over $16.  It’s not that expensive in the city I live in and the cruise line booze is cheap for them to buy.

 

38 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

They already have.  A cosmo used to be at the $11 mark now it’s $12.  For a Canadian that’s over $16.  It’s not that expensive in the city I live in and the cruise line booze is cheap for them to buy.

Back in the day drinks on cruise ships were a lot less than on land at your favorite restaurant or cocktail lounge. 

[St Pete Cruiser]

It was a special treat for me to return to the Noordam in March with its Crow's Nest still intact.  I had only been on the Noordam once before, May, 2012, and spent many happy hours there where we met in the Oak Room, a room just off the Crow's Nest with leather chairs and even a fireplace.  Yes, 2023 and it is still there.  Scenic cruising in New Zealand provided room all across the forward area and it was very well used.  Our Cruise Director gave his commentary from there and was available for questions.  When I located a beverage manager who was a long time Holland America employee, he told me that all of the Vista class ships were to be rebuilt, but the Noordam was spared only because its dry dock was delayed and now has been put off, hopefully for good.  There is a coffee bar with the regular bar.

[kazu]

10 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

Hot hors' d'ouvres in the bars pre-dinner were gone long before Covid...

 

A shame you never sailed on the Prinsendam.  They had hors d’oeuvres (mind you some might have been cold but delish) pre-dinner and at sail aways.  More like the HAL ships of old and missed by many of us. 

[Hlitner]

11 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

Hot hors' d'ouvres in the bars pre-dinner were gone long before Covid...

 

The "crafts" room seemed well utilized on Westerdam in Japan. They had a lot of origami classes as well as the coloring, painting and mug-making. I can't really recall what that space was used for before?

We posted on this topic during the voyage.  I finally accepted that putting in that Arts n Crafts room was a very good move (on the part of HAL) since we noticed that the room was well utilized (especially during sea days).  But we also had some major problems with how HAL seemed to go out of their way to destroy the atmosphere (and views) that many of us loved about the old Crows Nest.  We still cannot fathom (love this word on marine issues) why HAL put those two large (and ugly) monitor screens in the front/center of the room...thus spoiling the forward view..not to mention leaving less space for well-placed seating.  The bar area has been completely ruined (only 3-4 seats left) and could have been better designed for multiple purposes (i.e. coffee and a decent bar).  And finally, putting the Shore Excursions Office in the Crow's Nest was a ridiculous move.  That Office belongs on deck 2 or 3 in the vicinity of Guest Relations and other offices.

 

The good news is that HAL could easily modify the Crows Nest to bring back most of her prior glory.  This space could also benefit from the addition of some entertainment (i.e. a soft duo, piano bar, etc).  We love how similar space is utilized on the Seabourn ships (it is called the Observation Lounge) where it is also designed for multi-purpose without ruining the atmosphere and views.

 

Hank

 

Hank

[BobbiSox]

Sorry if this is off-topic a bit. I will never understand why anyone at HAL thinks that adults want to color with crayons. What's next? Hop Scoth on the sport's deck? 

[taxmantoo]

7 minutes ago, BobbiSox said:

Sorry if this is off-topic a bit. I will never understand why anyone at HAL thinks that adults want to color with crayons. What's next? Hop Scoth on the sport's deck? 

Can't wait to see something like this in the next HAL promotion... Trade your Beverage Card for a Coloring Book ??? Talk about Having It All 🤣

 

[Horizon chaser 1957]

13 minutes ago, BobbiSox said:

Sorry if this is off-topic a bit. I will never understand why anyone at HAL thinks that adults want to color with crayons. What's next? Hop Scoth on the sport's deck? 

Adult coloring was became quite a thing a couple of years ago, although the fad seemed to fade fairly fast. From HAL’s perspective, it’s a cheap and easy thing to offer, with the need to find skilled instructors like painting would involve.

[Tampa Girl]

19 hours ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

The extra charge for the pinnacle isn't new.  It's been talked about at length.  It's been at least 6 months. The school room with desks are for those that enjoy the coloring "classes" that they seem to really like to push.

It was changed on many of the ships (not on the R class, pre-pandemic.  I hope that they go back to the full bar and music of the original Crows Nest.

[albingirl]

Back to the Crow's nest.  Not only is that ruined, when they destroyed the libraries onboard, well, that was a heartbreaker.  I know that they are bringing them back on some ships, slowly, but it was so incrediible that something so easy became something so hard. Libraries were well loved on all my sailings, most especially the long ones.

[DaveOKC]

13 hours ago, Mary229 said:

I agree.   Just raise the price for dinner and let people enjoy the meal without upcharges.  This doesn’t need to be complicated.  It certainly ruins the ambience to try to enjoy a special night out, all paid for, then need to discuss with the waitstaff payment.  

Problem is HAL has increased the price of the Pinnacle alot over the past 2-3 years, to the point that it is no longer a good option for most people.  I think part of the problem is all the HIA packages with their free Pinnacle meals.  Without this, the Pinnacle would be a ghost town most evenings IMO.

[Cruiz'nBaers]

We loved the Crow’s Nest on the Zaandam in the summer of 2022.  It was our favorite place for before dinner and after show cocktails.  It was quite a busy place. On the Nieuw Amsterdam in the fall of 2021, it was more coffee shop than bar, not the same fun place as before.  If HAL would put just a little bit of entertainment up there, all of the Crow’s Nests would be hopping in the evenings.  Oh well, chaulk up another change for the worse to corporate.

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, albingirl said:

Back to the Crow's nest.  Not only is that ruined, when they destroyed the libraries onboard, well, that was a heartbreaker.  I know that they are bringing them back on some ships, slowly, but it was so incrediible that something so easy became something so hard. Libraries were well loved on all my sailings, most especially the long ones.

BOO!!!! on destroying the libraries. Our first HAL cruise was the Noordam for the Eastern Mediterranean, and the library was what most impressed me about HAL.

[BermudaBound2014]

5 hours ago, St Pete Cruiser said:

…..but the Noordam was spared only because its dry dock was delayed and now has been put off, hopefully for good.  There is a coffee bar with the regular bar.

Put off until when? That is a bit concerning if there is no dry dock on the schedule at all. 

[Florida_gal_50]

4 hours ago, DaveOKC said:

Problem is HAL has increased the price of the Pinnacle alot over the past 2-3 years, to the point that it is no longer a good option for most people.  I think part of the problem is all the HIA packages with their free Pinnacle meals.  Without this, the Pinnacle would be a ghost town most evenings IMO.

I agree.  I had zero problems getting my choice of booking times at any of the specialty restaurants on my last cruise.  Even a couple days before. I generally go around 6 so it wasn't like I was going at 9:30 at night.  A friend reported the same and he was on a 7 day cruise where I expect the bookings would be heavier.  It's even worse for Canadian's (or non americans) with the exchange.

[decrepit old man]

The Crow's Nest is always full of snooty looking people who think they own the place

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, decrepit old man said:

The Crow's Nest is always full of snooty looking people who think they own the place

I thought it was more people camping out and reserving the loungers in front of the windows.  I guess they must be more comfortable than their beds because many seem to spend the day sleeping there.