Does anyone else use "fuzzy accounting" when costing a cruise?

[orville99]

On 7/25/2020 at 2:30 AM, grandgeezer said:

 

We live in the U.S. Financially independent. Retired, pay taxes on pension. Pay full taxes on all of our Social Security (make to much money to be exempt). Pay full taxes on our IRA minimum distribution payments we receive. You have to take a minimum amount out when you turn 69 1/2. We pay more taxes now than before we retired, but we bring in more now than when we worked.

We're in a similar boat, but because of Covid, we were able to suspend our RMD for this year, so that will cut out a lot of tax. Also, the RMD age was recently raised to 72.

[bigrednole]

For us it is everything. If I am getting the benefit of $500 cc points to use, it still cost me $500. That money is mine still no matter how you look at it. I would compare this to being in a casino: I won $500 so if I lose it, it is the casino's money. That way of thinking in my realm is wrong. Once it is my money, it is MY money. 

 

I get you though being a project manager. You are given a $100,000 budget for the project, you get additional funding of $25,000. That gives you $125,000 for the project, but only $100,000 is from your company. It's just the way different people think about money. Some think about how much is actually leaving their bank account and others include cc points, airline miles, etc.

[grandgeezer]

4 hours ago, orville99 said:

We're in a similar boat, but because of Covid, we were able to suspend our RMD for this year, so that will cut out a lot of tax. Also, the RMD age was recently raised to 72.

We could have suspended ours also but there's an obscene amount of money in there mow and the boss wants an obscene amount of money at her fingertips and with nowhere to spend it, it's getting close. 

All the years of saving and smart investing affords a retirement life we never thought we would ever have. 

 

[firefly333]

Oh yea I was signing up for social security this year to start Jan 1st next year so it doesn't hit my taxes this year and starting minimum from my IRA. I guess instead of walking into social security office I will have to apply online.

 

..... best laid plans and all that gone astray. 

 

Lol at spreadsheets to take a cruise. Book it ... go, figure out what I want to shop for and bring enough cash. Take cruise.

 

I usually never plan ahead more than a month or two. All this pushing cruises forward and cancelling driving me crazy. Spreadsheets lmao. I'm with biker, just book last minute. Go. This planning started when my April 26 cruise got cancelled then my may etc... and I had to decide if I wanted a 2nd fcc. I decided no, too hard to use att.

 

Now I'm worried about my Feb b2b, first leg paid by the one fcc I took .... I'm thinking oh no more planning. Stop. Just let me cruise

Edited July 26, 2020 by firefly333

[pcur]

2 hours ago, bigrednole said:

For us it is everything. If I am getting the benefit of $500 cc points to use, it still cost me $500. That money is mine still no matter how you look at it. I would compare this to being in a casino: I won $500 so if I lose it, it is the casino's money. That way of thinking in my realm is wrong. Once it is my money, it is MY money. 

 

I get you though being a project manager. You are given a $100,000 budget for the project, you get additional funding of $25,000. That gives you $125,000 for the project, but only $100,000 is from your company. It's just the way different people think about money. Some think about how much is actually leaving their bank account and others include cc points, airline miles, etc.

 

I see cc points differently..  So, I buy $500 worth of groceries, travel, or restaurant visits:  expenses I am going to pay for anyway.  I get 500 - 1,000 points (restaurants and travel get double points).  I consider those points as "free money", because I can convert them to airfare or cash. 

 

Example:  right now we have (hopefully) 4 roundtrip flights to book between 2021 - 2022.  All of them are $5.60 per person since we are using points for them, and almost all the points come from our credit card points.  So, I spend money on what I need to buy, and I end up not spending money on airfare.

[Blizzard54]

On 7/24/2020 at 9:11 PM, pcur said:

 

I corral Mr. Pcur into the closet, and make him try on his pants and pick out shirts, etc. to take.  The way I get him to do this is I threaten to pick it ALL out myself and pack it.  He's usually cooperative, because he knows I will pack his, "I'm up, I'm dressed, what more do you want" shirt.  He hates the attention he gets wearing that shirt.

Have you been coordinating tactics with my wife?

[Blizzard54]

On 7/24/2020 at 10:34 PM, NHProud said:

I was wondering how you are doing .   It must be hard on you to be land based for months with no end in sight.  My TA called RCI today because they’ve not fully refunded our Pacific Coastal cruise .  I hope , you’ve had better luck than us. 

 

Not too hard : 

Pick a destination 

pick a stateroom 

factor in gratuities , port fees and insurance 

 

If the price is right , book it . Never longer than 2 weeks otherwise it is extremely boring .  

 

I think some some people get an adrenaline rush booking cruises , planning cruises and even canceling cruises.  I’m not referring to John. 

Being on land since Feb 7th started to become a strain but we are getting over it.  After spending about 3 weeks searching and inspecting,  we purchased a Class A RV/ Motorhome.  We will be taking it our for a short shakedown trip on Tuesday.  We plan on starting out with short getaways and build up to longer trips.  It should take care of our desire to travel until we can cruise again.  Then we may continue with some of each.  I am now getting quite an education on the different types of campgrounds/resorts for RV's.  Since it is all new to me it is more difficult than booking a cruise.  We will probably do some reservations and some drive up's.  If needed our rig can be fully self contained. 

 

I am still waiting for my taxes/fees to be refunded for that same Pacific Coastal and to get some of our t/f's on the PC before it.  Everything else that I had booked is either cancelled or shifted.  Our next scheduled cruise in April of 2021.  We have quite a bit of $ tied up with deposits and FCC's.  

      

[NHProud]

1 hour ago, Blizzard54 said:

Being on land since Feb 7th started to become a strain but we are getting over it.  After spending about 3 weeks searching and inspecting,  we purchased a Class A RV/ Motorhome.  We will be taking it our for a short shakedown trip on Tuesday.  We plan on starting out with short getaways and build up to longer trips.  It should take care of our desire to travel until we can cruise again.  Then we may continue with some of each.  I am now getting quite an education on the different types of campgrounds/resorts for RV's.  Since it is all new to me it is more difficult than booking a cruise.  We will probably do some reservations and some drive up's.  If needed our rig can be fully self contained. 

 

I am still waiting for my taxes/fees to be refunded for that same Pacific Coastal and to get some of our t/f's on the PC before it.  Everything else that I had booked is either cancelled or shifted.  Our next scheduled cruise in April of 2021.  We have quite a bit of $ tied up with deposits and FCC's.  

      

Congratulations on your new acquisition !   I hope , it brings you and Marilyn much joy !   How are things in your hometown ? Such craziness going on . Take care and be safe .  

 

We have a cruise booked for April 2021 , too.  If I remember correctly you are waiting for a vaccine before cruising again . You must have great confidence in the availability of a vaccine  or you know something we don’t .  

 

 

 

 

To OP : 

 

Anyhow , I must be missing something in all of these calculations. Isn’t the money you are saving from not being home a constant regardless of how much your cruise costs ?   Do you cancel your car insurance, too , and hope nothing happens to it ? How much are the annual fees for the Chase Sapphire card or is it the Chase Sapphire Reserve that you use ?   

 

 

 

 

Edited July 26, 2020 by NHProud

[chipmaster]

We've cruised enough and know how and what we spend on we've never been suckered by discounts, OBC, upgrades.   Those that do, are sucker, like the ones that go to Costco and come back with twice what they planned.

[Joebucks]

The truth is, a lot of people use fuzzy math to justify buying things they can't afford. The op's version was amusing and seems to be financially responsible, just trying to tip the scales in their favor 😉

[pcur]

5 hours ago, Blizzard54 said:

Have you been coordinating tactics with my wife?

It's the "herding cats instinct".....😉

[pcur]

3 hours ago, NHProud said:

To OP : 

 

Anyhow , I must be missing something in all of these calculations. Isn’t the money you are saving from not being home a constant regardless of how much your cruise costs ?   Do you cancel your car insurance, too , and hope nothing happens to it ? How much are the annual fees for the Chase Sapphire card or is it the Chase Sapphire Reserve that you use ?   

 

 

 

 

 

I only included groceries, lower utilities, less gas for the car, and an average for miscellaneous spending (since Mr. Pcur won't be near a Home Depot).  Plus, with Comcast if you are gone long enough you can put your account on a seasonal hold and they charge you a $25 fee to keep the account open.  If we are gone long enough I do put our cars in a "garaged" status with State Farm, but that's unusual.

 

We have the Chase Sapphire preferred, and I think the annual fee is $89.  It's money well spent because our points usually run between 25,000 - 150,000 at any one time, depending on our travel.  Any travel purchase earns double points.   Every 4 years I get a card, too, and add about 70,000 to the pot, then cancel the card.  Each point is worth .01 in cash or .0125 in travel if booked through their booking tool.  I transfer them to Southwest and British Airways, too.  Right now they have a point conversion special going on:  points for grocery and home improvement purchases can be converted to a statement credit at the higher .0125 rate.  I converted 38,000 points last month for a $475 statement credit.

Edited July 27, 2020 by pcur

[pcur]

2 hours ago, Joebucks said:

The truth is, a lot of people use fuzzy math to justify buying things they can't afford. The op's version was amusing and seems to be financially responsible, just trying to tip the scales in their favor 😉

 

I didn't even tell you all of it:  I also have an expenses spreadsheet that estimates out 3-5 years in the future.  I can see exactly what the additional expense of a cruise does to our budget that far out, after I plug in all the stuff I've listed above.  Reduce the credit card bill following the cruise, statement credits for expected redeemed points, no gasoline purchases for x number of weeks (Big Box shopping card),  etc.  The spreadsheet is coded to turn a bright color if the checking balance gets below a certain number, so it's visually obvious that something has to be adjusted.

 

More weridness.....................keeps my sanity on a fixed income.

[NHProud]

Pcur , I’m very impressed with your expertise. You enjoy what you are doing and good for you . 

 

The bottom line for us is the destination and the cost of stateroom as previously stated.  Husband is not that interested in cruising and would not repeat an itinerary .  He never asks what it costs because he trusts me .  

 

Love the cat . You should publish on Kindle Unlimited . Seriously !  

Edited July 27, 2020 by NHProud

[Johnamac123]

I do something very similar and I always cruise solo... I am also constantly checking for price drops with the aid of an email notifier. I save $$ this way... It also fills up my day while retired..

Edited July 27, 2020 by Johnamac123

[cruiselvr04]

I make a list of possible cruises for our vacation dates with prices and price per day per person.  I share with the DH and he picks the cruise.  I’m sure sometimes he picks on price but not always.  We splurged last summer and took a 2 week Viking River Cruise.   I use price per day since we often do longer then 7 days.  It puts the cost in perspective for us. ( We prefer $200 per day pp or less in a balcony.)   He picks excursions from a short list I give him after my tons of research.  

 

After that I figure out pretty exact costs but I don’t necessarily share that with him.  He knows the cost of the cruise and the amount of cash we take.  The rest I slide in so to speak as he pays the bills.  So he knows what we spend but I doubt he adds it up like I do.  One thing he likes for our budget with cruises is paying the majority of it before we go.  I think it helps him relax and enjoy it more and not sweat the little extras.  

 

 We are usually in our embarkation city and then he asks which ship are we on.  I now print an itinerary sheet for the cabin so he doesn’t have to ask me everyday “where are we going?.”  “What are we doing?”  He’s a busy guy, details are not his thing. I enjoy the planning and he enjoys what I plan.  It works for us.  We both love the cruises we take and have a great time together.

 

Yes I do fuzzy math!

[ldubs]

No fuzzy math.  Mrs Ldubs says you want to go on <insert name> cruise?  I say yes.  We go.   

[Bailey & Sophie]

 

I used to work at estate sales. We would go into a house and price everything for a public sale.

I remember once going through an office. The husband was a doctor, wife a stay-at-home mom. 

She kept track of every cent spent. EVERY.  Each year was in a spiral notebook. X amount on a skein of embroidery floss, x amt on a pair of socks. Total amt on groceries but then listed individually and price out cost per item. (A bag of apples cost x, but broken down each apple cost x.)

She also kept track of Christmas gifts - who gave what to them and the apx price. And what they gave and the value. She did this for over 50 years.

 

This "fuzzy math" and spread sheets remind me of this estate sale! 

[firefly333]

18 hours ago, Blizzard54 said:

 

 

I am still waiting for my taxes/fees to be refunded for that same Pacific Coastal and to get some of our t/f's on the PC before it.  Everything else that I had booked is either cancelled or shifted.  Our next scheduled cruise in April of 2021.  We have quite a bit of $ tied up with deposits and FCC's.  

      

Talk about refund of taxes. IRS owes me a refund. Filed in March. I was afraid it got mailed to wrong person or something. Called them and could hardly believe their answer. Felt like a crazy laughing.

 

IRS agent told me to start counting from August 1st 16 weeks, it should be issued by Nov 23, which she actually looked up to tell me was a Saturday. But my filing has now been assigned to someone.

 

Idk why but to me if I was telling someone that I think it's so ridiculous it would be hard to say.  Well at least she wasnt fuzzy. 

 

Covid has made the world go fuzzy... who needs fuzzy math, just turn on the TV.

Edited July 27, 2020 by firefly333

[pcur]

21 hours ago, NHProud said:

Pcur , I’m very impressed with your expertise. You enjoy what you are doing and good for you . 

 

The bottom line for us is the destination and the cost of stateroom as previously stated.  Husband is not that interested in cruising and would not repeat an itinerary .  He never asks what it costs because he trusts me .  

 

Love the cat . You should publish on Kindle Unlimited . Seriously !  

 

Well, thank you!  I love my rowboat kitty, too.  Very whimsical.

[pcur]

18 hours ago, Bailey & Sophie said:

 

I used to work at estate sales. We would go into a house and price everything for a public sale.

I remember once going through an office. The husband was a doctor, wife a stay-at-home mom. 

She kept track of every cent spent. EVERY.  Each year was in a spiral notebook. X amount on a skein of embroidery floss, x amt on a pair of socks. Total amt on groceries but then listed individually and price out cost per item. (A bag of apples cost x, but broken down each apple cost x.)

She also kept track of Christmas gifts - who gave what to them and the apx price. And what they gave and the value. She did this for over 50 years.

 

This "fuzzy math" and spread sheets remind me of this estate sale! 

 

My mother-in-law did that, too.  Maybe not down to the per-apple price.  She proudly showed me her ledger when I decided to move into my own apartment in college.  She dragged me into her office and proudly showed me her big ledger that went back to 1942:  Ever. Single. Penny. Recorded.

 

I thought she was nuts.  However, even back then I had a list of expenses. 

 

Now my "list" is a spreadsheet.  But, I've never balanced a checkbook.  I've always kept track of the expenses and deposits, and charges and payments on credit cards.  Now, if my spreadsheet matches the bank, I'm balanced!!!

 

 

[John&LaLa]

On 7/26/2020 at 12:03 PM, grandgeezer said:

We could have suspended ours also but there's an obscene amount of money in there mow and the boss wants an obscene amount of money at her fingertips and with nowhere to spend it, it's getting close. 

All the years of saving and smart investing affords a retirement life we never thought we would ever have. 

 

 

Interesting that there are all kinds of obscene definitions out there

[Bailey & Sophie]

40 minutes ago, pcur said:

 But, I've never balanced a checkbook.  I've always kept track of the expenses and deposits, and charges and payments on credit cards.  Now, if my spreadsheet matches the bank, I'm balanced!!!

 

 

 

I tried to balance the checkbook just once. It didn't work out so good. I then figured out that I could wait for 2 bank statements to be the same and I'd go from there. I was in college and just paid in cash for those months.

[mayleeman]

2 hours ago, pcur said:

But, I've never balanced a checkbook.  I've always kept track of the expenses and deposits, and charges and payments on credit cards.  Now, if my spreadsheet matches the bank, I'm balanced!!!

 

My mother and father married in 1945. She bounced several checks in the first few years when Dad handled the financed, and my father eventually figured out that the only cure was to make her balance their checkbooks.

 

In 1978, Dad died of a sudden hesrt attack at 53. My Mom was devaststed. But we got a huge laugh when she said a few days later: "They say there's a silver lining to everything. Here it is: I will never have to balance a %$@^&$@ checkbook again!"  And she didn't, for the next 48 years...

Edited July 28, 2020 by mayleeman

[Tim and Shauna]

Not fuzzy accounting at all. I am an accountant and I take into consideration everything you have pointed out to determine at net cost.