MSC resume cruising

[Dermotsgirl]

17 minutes ago, wowzz said:

I can't see any possible way that either of those cruises will go ahead. Far too many unknowns,  and what do you do if you gave a case of CV19 mid Atlantic? 

Moley has already hinted that the winter Caribbean sailing schedule is in doubt - can't see why P&O would do a 35 night cruise in the current environment. 

I think P&O should announce the cancellation of the two 35 nighters ASAP, as such long cruises aren’t feasible right now. Its not fair for the passengers to be kept hanging on, waiting and wondering. 

[AndyMichelle]

8 hours ago, wowzz said:

Excellent post.

Shows that all this frenzy about a second wave, spikes caused by teenagers being too close together on a beach etc. is just silly.

I went to our favourite pub on Wednesday for a Ravi special. Next to us were a table of 10  people, obviously friends meeting up.  They spent 90 minutes or so , chatting, all closely bunched together. No need for any masks - but, if they stopped in the local M&S foodhall on the way home, for 2 minutes, they would need to wear masks.

Someone explain the logic of that! 

We are in danger of being led into a dictatorial state,  based on suspect science and an acquiescient public.

 

 

 

 

I would have walked out of that pub Wowzz. 

Our local won't let you sit together in the garden if you come from more than 2 households. 

The servers wear masks at all times and we feel safe as we know they are taking it seriously. 

You are probably right in all that you are saying, but if I took that risk, however small and someone close died, I would never forgive myself. 

Andy 

[grapau27]

4 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

I would have walked out of that pub Wowzz. 

Our local won't let you sit together in the garden if you come from more than 2 households. 

The servers wear masks at all times and we feel safe as we know they are taking it seriously. 

You are probably right in all that you are saying, but if I took that risk, however small and someone close died, I would never forgive myself. 

Andy 

In the restaurants and shops we visited in Liverpool yesterday none of the staff were wearing face masks.

All customers were instructed to wear masks at the shops entrances though and everyone complied.

Your local is being very responsible Andy and it is wrong if pubs Wowzz mentioned don't operate proper social distancing and then everyone gets locked down because of their inaction.

 

[AndyMichelle]

5 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

In the restaurants and shops we visited in Liverpool yesterday none of the staff were wearing face masks.

All customers were instructed to wear masks at the shops entrances though and everyone complied.

Your local is being very responsible Andy and it is wrong if pubs Wowzz mentioned don't operate proper social distancing and then everyone gets locked down because of their inaction.

 

There are 3 pubs in our village, all of a fairly equal standard, or so we thought. 

This one is privately owned and has won us over as customers going forward for their attitude towards covid. 

The food is bloody lovely too, but we had a different favourite before but have now changed allegiance. 

We were never big pub goers before but did like eating out and am happy to be supporting a local business in our own little way. 

Andy 

[grapau27]

2 minutes ago, AndyMichelle said:

There are 3 pubs in our village, all of a fairly equal standard, or so we thought. 

This one is privately owned and has won us over as customers going forward for their attitude towards covid. 

The food is bloody lovely too, but we had a different favourite before but have now changed allegiance. 

We were never big pub goers before but did like eating out and am happy to be supporting a local business in our own little way. 

Andy 

That is an excellent attitude by yourself and that pub deserves all the praise and custom it gets now and in the future.

[Son of Anarchy]

12 hours ago, molecrochip said:

Azura and Britannia will not undertake their repositioning voyages as planned. There was questions over whether they would sail empty of passengers on the previously scheduled dates. This is not happening.

 

12 hours ago, molecrochip said:

The intention is still to try but the ships won’t reposition as planned. They will travel later, if they go.

I'll stop dropping hints to the Ole Lady that Azura's repositioning cruise to Valletta in March is good value for money...

[terrierjohn]

10 hours ago, wowzz said:

I can't see any possible way that either of those cruises will go ahead. Far too many unknowns,  and what do you do if you gave a case of CV19 mid Atlantic? 

Moley has already hinted that the winter Caribbean sailing schedule is in doubt - can't see why P&O would do a 35 night cruise in the current environment. 

 

10 hours ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I think P&O should announce the cancellation of the two 35 nighters ASAP, as such long cruises aren’t feasible right now. Its not fair for the passengers to be kept hanging on, waiting and wondering. 

What Moley and P&O have said is that the scheduled re-positioning cruises will not go ahead, but the ships may sail to the Caribbean later.  If this might happen by the new year then why would P&O need to announce the cancellation of Ventura's round trip Caribbean cruises, which could also go ahead?

[Dermotsgirl]

26 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

 

What Moley and P&O have said is that the scheduled re-positioning cruises will not go ahead, but the ships may sail to the Caribbean later.  If this might happen by the new year then why would P&O need to announce the cancellation of Ventura's round trip Caribbean cruises, which could also go ahead?

The chance of those 35 night cruises going ahead is minute.

 

As everybody knows, we are in the middle of a global pandemic, which will get worse before it gets better. In any event, it’s not going to suddenly go away by the end of the year, with everything magically getting back to normal.

 

P&O have already cancelled up until 12th November, and another batch of cancellations is expected by most people. Indeed, some cruise lines have already cancelled the rest of the year.

 

That would leave the Ventura 35 night cruise on 3rd January to be one of the first P&O cruises. It would surely be more sensible to have a few short test cruises before undertaking such a mammoth and complex task as a 35 night cruise, in the ever changing seas of a pandemic. Will ports be open? What are their entry requirements? What happens if any of these requirements suddenly change? What if local lockdowns stop people travelling? What happens if there’s an outbreak onboard? What are P&O’s protocols? What would the onboard experience be like? And many more questions
 

In any event, there’s still the issue that the FCO are still advising against cruise ship travel for all U.K. citizens. There’s no sign of this changing in the near future.

 

These cruises will not happen, and P&O should do the decent thing and tell the passengers that they are cancelled. I hope they do this before the final balance is due.

 

 

[Adawn47]

11 hours ago, wowzz said:

Excellent post.

Shows that all this frenzy about a second wave, spikes caused by teenagers being too close together on a beach etc. is just silly.

I went to our favourite pub on Wednesday for a Ravi special. Next to us were a table of 10  people, obviously friends meeting up.  They spent 90 minutes or so , chatting, all closely bunched together. No need for any masks - but, if they stopped in the local M&S foodhall on the way home, for 2 minutes, they would need to wear masks.

Someone explain the logic of that! 

We are in danger of being led into a dictatorial state,  based on suspect science and an acquiescient public.

Yes, we need to take precautions, but too many  believe the fictional data fed to us by the government.  Look how long it took for the death figures for CV19 to be reduced because PHE decided that once you had tested positive for CV19, however you died, you would be included in the CV19 death toll.

Testing is up, cases of CV19 are up (no surprise because increased testing is being carried out in hotspots), but related hospital admissions are way down,  and deaths are in single figures.  

Having said all of that,  I still cannot see any way that cruising will resume  any time soon. I thought I should at least take cognisance of posting on a cruising forum. 

Sorry for the rant! 

 

 

 

Rant away wowzz. We all feel better after a nice rant😉. On a more serious note though, I hope the cases in your area stay low😷

Avril

[molecrochip]

40 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

Will ports be open? What are their entry requirements? What happens if any of these requirements suddenly change? What if local lockdowns stop people travelling? What happens if there’s an outbreak onboard? What are P&O’s protocols? What would the onboard experience be like? And many more questions

There is a dedicated Southampton team working through all of these issues. Carnival Corp have fleetwide protocols however each brand have their own individual protocols on top to meet local operating requirements/restrictions.

 

42 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

In any event, there’s still the issue that the FCO are still advising against cruise ship travel for all U.K. citizens. There’s no sign of this changing in the near future.

There is no proof of this. Based on previous FCO advice changes, only 48 hours notice will be given before any relaxation. Everyone knew that flights to Spain would restart before the government changed their advice.

 

Everyone is watching MSC closely at present. Hopefully that is successful. Carnival Corp then have their own restart trials with Costa and Aida early September. If these are successful then I expect P&O to attempt to restart before Christmas. That assumes that the current UK covid position doesn't deteriorate significantly. One final point: being successful doesn't mean zero cases - it means no significant/mass transmission and isolation protocols working.

[Dermotsgirl]

49 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

There is a dedicated Southampton team working through all of these issues. Carnival Corp have fleetwide protocols however each brand have their own individual protocols on top to meet local operating requirements/restrictions.

 

There is no proof of this. Based on previous FCO advice changes, only 48 hours notice will be given before any relaxation. Everyone knew that flights to Spain would restart before the government changed their advice.

 

Everyone is watching MSC closely at present. Hopefully that is successful. Carnival Corp then have their own restart trials with Costa and Aida early September. If these are successful then I expect P&O to attempt to restart before Christmas. That assumes that the current UK covid position doesn't deteriorate significantly. One final point: being successful doesn't mean zero cases - it means no significant/mass transmission and isolation protocols working.

I agree that it will be a key point when the Covid protocols are tested, when there is an outbreak onboard or an outbreak that is associated with people who previously sailed onboard.

 

In the case of MSC, they’re only doing 7 day cruises, and as far as I know, none of the other lines are thinking of starting up with long cruises, so there will not be any precedent regarding how the protocols would work on longer cruises.

 

P&O would be an outlier if theY really think they can do a 35 night cruise so soon after start up. I don’t think they’re going to do it, and I think they know they aren’t  going to go ahead with it. That’s why I maintain they should do the decent thing.

 

 

[AnnieC]

35 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

 

 

P&O would be an outlier if theY really think they can do a 35 night cruise so soon after start up. I don’t think they’re going to do it, and I think they know they aren’t  going to go ahead with it. That’s why I maintain they should do the decent thing.

 

 

Atlantic crossing, out of reach of helivac, during a pandemic. What could possibly go wrong?😱

[terrierjohn]

40 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I agree that it will be a key point when the Covid protocols are tested, when there is an outbreak onboard or an outbreak that is associated with people who previously sailed onboard.

 

In the case of MSC, they’re only doing 7 day cruises, and as far as I know, none of the other lines are thinking of starting up with long cruises, so there will not be any precedent regarding how the protocols would work on longer cruises.

 

P&O would be an outlier if theY really think they can do a 35 night cruise so soon after start up. I don’t think they’re going to do it, and I think they know they aren’t  going to go ahead with it. That’s why I maintain they should do the decent thing.

 

 

Are you booked on one of Venturas Caribbean cruises and worried about whether to pay the balance or cancel?

[terrierjohn]

5 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

Atlantic crossing, out of reach of helivac, during a pandemic. What could possibly go wrong?😱

Come on Annie be reasonable, mid Atlantic has always been out of helivac range, and even if someone falls ill with covid, they are very unlikely to need shore based hospitalisation before they actually reach the Caribbean or Southampton on the return.

[Dermotsgirl]

11 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

Are you booked on one of Venturas Caribbean cruises and worried about whether to pay the balance or cancel?

No.

I’m just an interested bystander 

[Dermotsgirl]

17 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

Atlantic crossing, out of reach of helivac, during a pandemic. What could possibly go wrong?😱

There’ll be a protocol for that! 😉😂

[Dorset cruise fan]

A question for Molecrochip: do you think there is any chance of Arcadia and Aurora having any short (7-14 night) cruises scheduled in January,  February and March? In the last couple of years that has happened with Oceana and Oriana (for different reasons) and there have been some good prices. We would certainly sign up for a Canaries or Med/Iberian or Northern European cruise on either of those if they offered one.

[Son of Anarchy]

13 minutes ago, Dorset cruise fan said:

A question for Molecrochip: do you think there is any chance of Arcadia and Aurora having any short (7-14 night) cruises scheduled in January,  February and March? In the last couple of years that has happened with Oceana and Oriana (for different reasons) and there have been some good prices. We would certainly sign up for a Canaries or Med/Iberian or Northern European cruise on either of those if they offered one.

As we now have space in our diaries, following the cancellation of Arcadia's worldie, we would certainly be up for a keenly priced cruise if new itineries were released for either ship.

[dritan]

Dipping my toe in the P&O water here😃.

Although I've only sailed P&O once before, I'd be really up for a short UK based cruise, if P&O went that route.  It would be good to see the UK's main line, follow where the Germany and Italian lines have lead.

 

What do you think is the main thing holding them back?  Current FCO guidance about cruising, complexity of protocols, concern that there would be little demand during winter?

[Bazrat]

1 hour ago, AnnieC said:

Atlantic crossing, out of reach of helivac, during a pandemic. What could possibly go wrong?😱

I see we’re your going on this what if they ran out of beer mid Atlantic I would have to drink peroni noooooooo

[Denarius]

2 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

Are you booked on one of Venturas Caribbean cruises and worried about whether to pay the balance or cancel?

I am.

I am due to sail on Azura in January. A few months ago, I would have rated my chances of doing so as good. In the light of P&Os decision to cancel all cruises until November, I now rate them as poor. And even if the ship sails, I am not sure that I want to be on it. It is not the covid risk which concerns me, but whether the cruise itself would be an enjoyable experience under whatever protocols P&O introduce in order to sail. I will therefore await details of these before I decide whether or not I pay my balance; if they are not available before my balance is due I will cancel anyway and lose my £50 deposit unlesss P&O defer payment like some other lines have done. I am not inclined to buy a pig in a poke.

[molecrochip]

4 hours ago, Dorset cruise fan said:

A question for Molecrochip: do you think there is any chance of Arcadia and Aurora having any short (7-14 night) cruises scheduled in January,  February and March? In the last couple of years that has happened with Oceana and Oriana (for different reasons) and there have been some good prices. We would certainly sign up for a Canaries or Med/Iberian or Northern European cruise on either of those if they offered one.

Given the cancellations announced already, I don't expect Aurora to sail until March and Arcadia to sail until April.

 

I still think that Ventura will be first with 'new' short cruises. I believe Iona and Britannia will sail for Christmas. I believe that Azura will also sail pre-2021 if P&O can resolve the legally required dry dock.

 

Ventura in Jan & Feb will really depend on how things progress. It may be that January is not possible by February is. There are ways they could change the route to avoid US mainland, a specific island etc.

 

I believe protocols will be based upon the concept of Coronavirus being ever present therefore test, control and manage will be the way forward. Even a vaccine wont be 100% guarantee.

[Dorset cruise fan]

Ah well, we won't be on board until 2022 then as the prices for Arcadia and Aurora for next year have gone through the roof. Unless there are some last minute bargains, but we often can't go last minute as can't co-ordinate our holidays. We have been looking at some river cruises so may try one of those.

[molecrochip]

4 hours ago, dritan said:

What do you think is the main thing holding them back?

The potential need to stop again. When you restart, you want to restart once.

 

If P&O has to stop again either because of a second wave or uncontainable outbreak onboard, then problems include PR damage, soaring costs with ship with full crew and even risk of legal action.

 

Go too late and customers desert you, stock market loses faith and you waisted money during prolonged zero revenue period.

 

There is only one chance to get it right. I’m glad picking that point is not my job.

[Ardennais]

19 hours ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I think P&O should announce the cancellation of the two 35 nighters ASAP, as such long cruises aren’t feasible right now. Its not fair for the passengers to be kept hanging on, waiting and wondering. 

Agree. There are other costs too associated with these cruises. Yellow fever vaccine, malaria tablets etc. The costs all mount up.

Edited August 22, 2020 by Ardennais