Will HAL sell Volendam & Zaandam?

[KirkNC]

1 minute ago, YXU AC*SE said:

 

Is this not 17 named ships ?    

1. Rotterdam (Borealis)
2. Amsterdam (Bolette)
3. Maasdam (Aegean Myth)
4. Veendam (Aegean Majesty)
5. Pacific Aria  (Aegean Goddess)
6. Pacific Dawn (Satoshi)
7. Oceana (Queen of the Oceans)
8. Costa Victoria (scrap)
9. Costa neoRomantica (Celestyal Experience)
10. Costa Atlantica (tsf to CSSC)
11. Costa Mediterranea (tsf to CSSC)
12. Carnival Fascination (Century Harmony)
13. Carnival Imagination (scrap)
14. Carnival Fantasy (scrap)
15. Carnival Inspiration (scrap)
16. Sun Princess (Pacific World)
17. Sea Princess (Charming)
18.  A yet-unnamed Costa ship (source: CCL's Q3-2019 results call -  https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/21632-five-ships-to-leave-costa-fleet-by-may-2021.html)

 

and, if I were a betting person?  19. Perhaps AIDAcara? (1996 construction, 1200 berths)   

 

Scott. 

I don’t know, the press release said they had disposed of 15 of the 19.  There was no mention of the names of any of the four.

[ger_77]

A purely selfish thought here, but I really hope the Volendam isn't sold before next year, or it will be the second one to have been sold from under us.  First it was the Rotterdam on which we were scheduled to sail, so HAL moved us to the Zuiderdam, which was re-deployed, so they rebooked us on the Westerdam which was cancelled and then not cancelled.  Now we're booked on the Volendam for November of this year for the trans-Atlantic out of Barcelona.  Fingers crossed.  LOL

 

Smooth Sailing! 🙂🙂🙂

[KirkNC]

Just now, ger_77 said:

A purely selfish thought here, but I really hope the Volendam isn't sold before next year, or it will be the second one to have been sold from under us.  First it was the Rotterdam on which we were scheduled to sail, so HAL moved us to the Zuiderdam, which was re-deployed, so they rebooked us on the Westerdam which was cancelled and then not cancelled.  Now we're booked on the Volendam for November of this year for the trans-Atlantic out of Barcelona.  Fingers crossed.  LOL

 

Smooth Sailing! 🙂🙂🙂

If it is you are officially bad luck 😜

[Tampa Girl]

57 minutes ago, DM6045 said:

 They could easily do them with one of the Vistas as the P&O Arcadia, Cunard QV &QE and Costa Deleziosa and Luminosa are all derivatives of the Vista Class and they have done world cruises / long cruises for years very successfully. HAL would probably have to drop its prices slightly to fill them but on the flip side they would be cheaper to operate.
If anything dropping the prices on their grand voyages wouldn’t be a bad thing for attracting more Brits/ Europeans on them (I know we’re not the target market) as on average the starting price for a world cruise for us on P&O, Cunard, Fred Olsen etc... is £10,000 (r/t UK) however on HAL its usually £19,000 (plus flights) a couple we cruise regularly with is fortunate enough to do a world cruise every year and a couple of years ago they did HAL as they are one of their favourite lines but said they wouldn’t do another with them as it simply wasn’t worth nearly double the cost plus flights and luggage over Cunard or P&O etc... the only thing they preferred was the smaller ship but they could have that on Fred Olsen or P&O Aurora for a-lot less... quite a few Dutch and Germans have said very similar to me also regarding the value.

I am not sure about "very easily" pertaining to substituting the Vista class ships for the R class.  There goes the downtown Shanghai port, among probably many others.  One of the attractions of the HAL Grand Voyages is that the smaller ships can get into ports that even the Vista class cannot.  And it is these less traveled ports that make HAL's Grand Voyages a cut above the other lines.  But that having been said, I don't see that HAL has any other choice if it sells the remaining two R class ships - unless it acquires a ship of similar size.  Good luck.

[Sir PMP]

2 hours ago, ger_77 said:

A purely selfish thought here, but I really hope the Volendam isn't sold before next year, or it will be the second one to have been sold from under us.  First it was the Rotterdam on which we were scheduled to sail, so HAL moved us to the Zuiderdam, which was re-deployed, so they rebooked us on the Westerdam which was cancelled and then not cancelled.  Now we're booked on the Volendam for November of this year for the trans-Atlantic out of Barcelona.  Fingers crossed.  LOL

 

Smooth Sailing! 🙂🙂🙂

You must have a bad reputation, as soon as you book  a cruise, Hal will sell that ship..😉

[dockman]

Some of the best cruises I have ever had were on Volendam and Zaandam.  For my taste the perfect size ships with real LP deck for walking, sitting.  Great crews and some wonderful itineraries.

[aliaschief]

Eventually they will be sold or scrapped. Just about all ships are for sale for the right price.

 

Who knows  when?🤔 Answer! We do not know!

[cricketcj1]

We hope its not Volendam as we are on it 1/4/22 74 nts.After 2 cancelations 20/&21 If they cancell this we are done with Holland & Princess .

[mcrcruiser]

For most  HAL long time cruisers  ,it is hard to let go of the smaller ships  & we also know as we sailed  on some of them ourself   . However ,when it comes to amenities ,variety of entertainment  ,cabin ammenities & over all appearance  we fell in love with the  new pinnacle class ships  . They seem to be just the right size for us  

 

 For you folks who desire the Volendam & Zandam  we do hope that HAL keeps them for a little while longer  

 

 Obviously  the  large cruise lines are building much larger ships because they are more proditable .

 

  There are other smaller cruise lines & their prices are so much higher . So it is all relative  ,smaller  higer cost ,larger lower cost 

 

  

[ger_77]

3 hours ago, Sir PMP said:

You must have a bad reputation, as soon as you book  a cruise, Hal will sell that ship..😉

It's starting to feel that way!  Seriously, being pushed around from pillar to post was getting a bit annoying.  Keeping our fingers crossed for the November TA to happen.

 

Smooth Sailing!  🙂🙂🙂

[mcrcruiser]

We figure that 2022 should be safe  to cruise ;but ,who really knows now with a new African strain  . Hoping that new covid strain stays in Africa   . It gets harder as we grow older ,now 82 we lost almost a year of our cruise lives already . There is no end in sight until enough people are vaccinated  with vaccines that cover these newer virus strains . 

 

 just that I do know that the word hoping in any business is really not a great word 

 

[Mary229]

23 hours ago, kevingastreich said:

The history of Holland America Line is quite interesting. They have survived and even thrived, in much worse circumstances than these.  It is quite the story.

I would think they were shut down for many years during the world wars when over 40 million and 80 million people died 

[kevingastreich]

49 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I would think they were shut down for many years during the world wars when over 40 million and 80 million people died 

Holland America Line has been in business going on 150 years now. They survived the war years in part by converting some of their ships into troop carriers to aid the Allies.  It is quite a fascinating story I recommend to anyone interested in maritime history. 

[Mary229]

5 minutes ago, kevingastreich said:

Holland America Line has been in business going on 150 years now. They survived the war years in part by converting some of their ships into troop carriers to aid the Allies.  It is quite a fascinating story I recommend to anyone interested in maritime history. 

Were they paid for that service or was that a donation to the war effort?

Edited January 13, 2021 by Mary229

[DAllenTCY]

All of the Matson Lines ships were also converted to US troop carriers during WWII, too.

 

My father joined the Merchant Marines on his 25 birthday, and spent the war sailing the Pacific Ocean.

 

David

[kazu]

4 hours ago, ger_77 said:

It's starting to feel that way!  Seriously, being pushed around from pillar to post was getting a bit annoying.  Keeping our fingers crossed for the November TA to happen.

 

Smooth Sailing!  🙂🙂🙂

 

Oh come on Gerry - didn’t you enjoy feeling like a ping pong ball? 😉 

 

No worries - I didn’t either.  My fingers are crossed that our cruise goes in November.  it looked like good timing when I booked it but these days, it’s hard to tell.  We’ve been bounced around enough - something good has to happen by November 🤞 

[Horizon chaser 1957]

On 1/11/2021 at 3:36 PM, Gail & Marty sailing away said:

Yes 4 ships are leaving CCL lets not forget    ( 9 brands )

Cruise line	Parent company	Passengers (thousands)[7]	Revenue (US$ millions)[7]	Passengers %	Revenue %
Carnival Corporation & plc		12,302.30	18,305.16	47.4%	39.4%
Carnival Cruise Line	Carnival Corporation & plc	5,716.5	4,166.89	22%	8.9%
Princess Cruises	Carnival Corporation & plc	1,667.5	4,228.85	6.4%	9.1%
Costa Cruises	Carnival Corporation & plc	1,560.6	2,235.62	6%	4.8%
AIDA Cruises	Carnival Corporation & plc	1,183.7	2,128.28	4.6%	4.6%
Holland America Line	Carnival Corporation & plc	831.5	2,589.60	3.2%	5.6%
P&O Cruises	Carnival Corporation & plc	623.4	1,031.85	2.4%	2.2%
P&O Cruises Australia	Carnival Corporation & plc	499.6	548.02	1.9%	1.2%
Cunard Line	Carnival Corporation & plc	169.6	823.79	0.7%	1.8%
Seabourn Cruise Line

Very informative. Thank you!

[Horizon chaser 1957]

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

Edited January 13, 2021 by Horizon chaser 1957

[TiogaCruiser]

35 minutes ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

Interesting thought.

[kazu]

10 hours ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

 

Very interesting supposition and entirely possible.

 

Selfishly, since we are itinerary based, I hope this is how the future unfolds.

[mcrcruiser]

12 hours ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

The test of time will tell all 

[iancal]

15 hours ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

I do not know.  We are in our late sixties.  We have an itinerary focus vs. floating amusement park.  

 

Since retiring we have been doing less cruising than we thought.   We want to spend far more time at many locations/areas than just a day stop or an overnight stop.  More often than not extended land tours punctuated by the occasional late booking cruise or AI to break things up.  We still like cruising. 

 

 The covid virus has made us even less inclined to cruise post covid, not more. .  We have three tentative land trips planned but are not even looking at cruises.   We do not expect to cruise again until late 2022 or 2023.

 

I believe that there will be more market demand for premium cruise lines.  The smaller, mass market cruise line ships have been increasing fares to the point where some customers may be taking a long hard look at what price delta and value proposition  would get them on to a truly premium cruise line.

Edited January 13, 2021 by iancal

[Fred321]

Looking at the itinerary for the 2023 world cruise there seems to be a significant number of tender ports and small ports scheduled which probably won't be doable with anything larger than the Zaandam or Volendam. Of course all plans are subject to change but right now it looks like they are planning to hold onto at least one of the R class ships.

[drowelf]

On 1/12/2021 at 8:44 PM, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The future of cruising is a question mark in more ways than one. Cruise lines and passengers have gradually moved from itinerary based cruises on actual ships to vacations on floating amusement parks with race tracks and water slides.

The response of so many governments to cruise ships during the pandemic has given cruising an undeserved bad name. In the new post Covid world, there’s a real possibility that most of the people that wanted to vacation in a floating amusement park will prefer vacations in amusement parks that won’t leave them stranded offshore in a disaster. The itinerary and ship life style cruiser may become a larger percentage of the remaining market and worth vying for. Getting rid of smaller ships before they see where the chips fall could be a mistake.

So true. We for one have never bought into the 'Ship as the Destination' concept. We cruise to visit new and interesting locations, the ship is simply our floating hotel that we ride to and fro to reach those interesting destination. As such, the largest ship we have ever sailed on are the Eurodam and its sisters. 

 

While I do wish that HAL would step up and restore some of the activities stuff, especially on Sea Days, I can always sleep in, read and keep myself entertained if necessary. 

 

Cheers, 

[fireofficer5]

But will HAL survive Carnival?

Edited January 16, 2021 by fireofficer5