Should the Covid vaccine be required?

[Milwaukee Eight]

16 minutes ago, eaflorida said:

I would argue that Mandatory COVID Vaccines Violate Nuremberg Code.

How’s that. You have a choice. Nobody is forcing anyone here in the US to get the vaccine. 
 

M8

[ZoeyVictoria]

1 hour ago, WorldTraveler151208 said:

Do you think it's fair that the RCCL and Celebrity Cruises already require the Covid-19 vaccine for the Odyssey, Adventure, and Millennium cruises, given that currently in most countries younger people don't have the chance to get vaccinated even if they want?  For example in many European Union countries  and Canada, the vaccination process is very slow.  Most people will probably not be able to get vaccinated in the coming months, and Odyssey of the seas sailing in Israel and Greece since May will accept only fully vaccinated guests. Isn't that a kind of discrimination?

 

30 minutes ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Huh?

Apparently I am completely out of patience with the concept of “not fair” that not everyone will be able to participate in the first return to cruising.  Life isn’t always fair!

[LXA350]

1 minute ago, eaflorida said:

Not everyone in Israel wants to get vaccinated. In fact, lawsuits against mandatory vaccinations have been filed because without your green passport (vaccination proof) you can not do squat in Israel. 

 

You cannot be forced to get vaccinated, but when your employer can fire you, you can't attend University, Travel, go to concerts or Restaurants you will have no choice than to get yourself vaccinated eventually.

[eaflorida]

2 minutes ago, LXA350 said:

 

You cannot be forced to get vaccinated, but when your employer can fire you, you can't attend University, Travel, go to concerts or Restaurants you will have no choice than to get yourself vaccinated eventually.

THANK YOU!

[Sunshine3601]

43 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

Those under 16 do need a test, those over no. 

Everyone has to test negative within 72 hours to fly/enter the bahamas and st maarten.  

[ace2542]

4 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few

or the one.

[S.A.M.J.R.]

19 minutes ago, LXA350 said:

 

You cannot be forced to get vaccinated, but when your employer can fire you, you can't attend University, Travel, go to concerts or Restaurants you will have no choice than to get yourself vaccinated eventually.

Many businesses didn't enforce mask mandates, you think they're going to require customers to show proof of vaccines?  I also have a bridge I can sell you.

[LXA350]

1 minute ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

Many businesses didn't enforce mask mandates, you think they're going to require customers to show proof of vaccines?  I also have a bridge I can sell you.

 

You are speaking for the US, globally many countries will require people to be vaccinated especially once we reached the stage that everyone who could get the shot received it.

[BNBR]

Just now, LXA350 said:

 

Unfortunately to much dangerous "fake news" that is spread by people, which then also influences others to have such a absurd view about the Vaccinations

 

Yup, it's shocking how many people I know who believe this disinformation about the vaccines and refuse to take them. 

[LXA350]

Just now, BNBR said:

 

Yup, it's shocking how many people I know who believe this disinformation about the vaccines and refuse to take them. 

 

That's why the only way to get this large number of people thinking like this vaccinated is through the implementation of restrictions which includes that it will be mandatory at your work otherwise your employer can fire you, for traveling, attending concerts, traveling etc.

[FamilyCruiserUK]

I think the poll speaks for its self. Its the same as Yellow fever, which you need to travel to certain countries, its mandated.

 

As for the vaccine, mask wearing, social distancing being effective, i look at it this way.

 

10 people in a room 7 will die

However if you all wear a mask only 5 will die

However if you all wear a mask and social distance only 4 will die

However if you all wear a mask, social distance, and have the vaccine only 2 will die.

 

As with all serious illness's some people will die however we can help lower the number who will die by taking lots of little steps and all the steps put together will help life go on.

[M&A]

52 minutes ago, LXA350 said:

 

You cannot be forced to get vaccinated, but when your employer can fire you, you can't attend University, Travel, go to concerts or Restaurants you will have no choice than to get yourself vaccinated eventually.

Yes and children can not attend schools in the US and Canada unless they are vaccinated against many diseases.  Vaccinated against covid to go to school will be the next step.

[BNBR]

6 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

I think the poll speaks for its self. Its the same as Yellow fever, which you need to travel to certain countries, its mandated.

 

As for the vaccine, mask wearing, social distancing being effective, i look at it this way.

 

10 people in a room 7 will die

However if you all wear a mask only 5 will die

However if you all wear a mask and social distance only 4 will die

However if you all wear a mask, social distance, and have the vaccine only 2 will die.

 

As with all serious illness's some people will die however we can help lower the number who will die by taking lots of little steps and all the steps put together will help life go on.

 

The only thing inaccurate about your example is that you wouldnt have 2 deaths if everyone in the room was vaccinated.  The vaccines have stopped 100% of hospitalizations and death.  The 95% number is for symptoms, not death.

 

So in your example, you can eliminate the masks, eliminate the social distancing, and nobody will die if all are vaccinated.

 

In other words, if everyone on a cruise ship was vaccinated, then there is absolutely no reason they can't enjoy an entirely normal experience.  No masks, no distancing, etc.  Just... Normal.

 

Edited March 21, 2021 by BNBR

[FamilyCruiserUK]

2 minutes ago, BNBR said:

 

The only thing inaccurate about your example is that the vaccines have stopped 100% of hospitalizations and death.  The 95% number is for symptoms, not death.

 

So in your example, you can eliminate the masks, eliminate the social distancing, and nobody will die if all are vaccinated.

 

In other words, if everyone on a cruise ship was vaccinated, then there is absolutely no reason they can't enjoy am entirely normal experience.  No masks, no distancing, etc.  Just... Normal.

 

 

I havent seen that data yet here for the UK so am i am not sure if the 100% is correct. But if it is correct then that is good news

[BNBR]

7 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

 

I havent seen that data yet here for the UK so am i am not sure if the 100% is correct. But if it is correct then that is good news

 

In the clinical trials, every vaccine has shown 100% effectiveness in stopping hospitalization and death.  The debate is over "efficacy" and many misunderstand what that means.  That's the rate at stopping the disease completely, as in, no symptoms at all.  But they are all 100% effective against hospitalization and death (which is the entire point of a vaccine).

 

Here, don't just take my word for it:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2021/02/12/all-covid-vaccines-stop-death-severe-illness-column/6709455002/

 

"All seven COVID-19 vaccines that have completed large efficacy trials — Pfizer, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson, Novavax, AstraZeneca, Sputnik V and Sinovac — appear to be 100% effective for serious complications. Not one vaccinated person has gotten sick enough to require hospitalization. Not a single vaccinated person has died of COVID-19."

 

Edited March 21, 2021 by BNBR

[FamilyCruiserUK]

3 minutes ago, BNBR said:

 

In the clinical trials, every vaccine has shown 100% effectiveness in stopping hospitalization and death.  The debate is over "efficacy" and many misunderstand what that means.  That's the rate at stopping the disease completely, as in, no symptoms at all.  But they are all 100% effective against hospitalization and death.

 

Here, don't just take my word for it:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2021/02/12/all-covid-vaccines-stop-death-severe-illness-column/6709455002/

 

"All seven COVID-19 vaccines that have completed large efficacy trials — Pfizer, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson, Novavax, AstraZeneca, Sputnik V and Sinovac — appear to be 100% effective for serious complications. Not one vaccinated person has gotten sick enough to require hospitalization. Not a single vaccinated person has died of COVID-19."

 

 

Whilst that is good, trails do give an understanding if it will work or not  i would like the data from real world  vaccination programme before we throw out all the masks, social distancing etc. Will take a few months to collect.

 

All the while i am waiting for my time to be called forward for the vaccine which i will get right away. 

[Ourusualbeach]

13 minutes ago, M&A said:

Yes and children can not attend schools in the US and Canada unless they are vaccinated against many diseases.

Not sure about the other places but in Ontario all you have to do is to sign a waiver stating that you consciously or religiously  object to the vaccines, attend a vaccine education seminar and you are exempt.

[BritsAbroad]

1 minute ago, Ourusualbeach said:

Not sure about the other places but in Ontario all you have to do is to sign a waiver stating that you consciously or religiously  object to the vaccines, attend a vaccine education seminar and you are exempt.

Well...I guess thats one way for a country to clear out the gene pool #NaturalSelectionInAction

[BNBR]

13 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

 

Whilst that is good, trails do give an understanding if it will work or not  i would like the data from real world  vaccination programme before we throw out all the masks, social distancing etc. Will take a few months to collect.

 

All the while i am waiting for my time to be called forward for the vaccine which i will get right away. 

 

We do have significant real world data as well.  Notably Israel.  Their data and research has been comprehensive.  They actually show efficacy rates better than the trials. 

 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-vaccine-from-pfizer-biontech-was-97-effective-at-preventing-illness-in-israel-11615479851

Edited March 21, 2021 by BNBR

[orville99]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

 

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. 

 

Edited March 21, 2021 by orville99

[not-enough-cruising]

22 minutes ago, Ourusualbeach said:

Not sure about the other places but in Ontario all you have to do is to sign a waiver stating that you consciously or religiously  object to the vaccines, attend a vaccine education seminar and you are exempt.

I’m not sure about all 50 states, but many (mine included) have eliminated the religious and conscientious exemptions on vaccines for public schools. 

[MommaBear55]

35 minutes ago, Ourusualbeach said:

Not sure about the other places but in Ontario all you have to do is to sign a waiver stating that you consciously or religiously  object to the vaccines, attend a vaccine education seminar and you are exempt.

In Maine schools, it has to be a religious exemption. But to work, there was no religious exemption, and I had to have : HepB, and Flu, and demonstrate I was immune to chicken pox and MMR, or have the vaccine. 

[Billy Baltic]

55 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

I think the poll speaks for its self. Its the same as Yellow fever, which you need to travel to certain countries, its mandated.

 

As for the vaccine, mask wearing, social distancing being effective, i look at it this way.

 

10 people in a room 7 will die

However if you all wear a mask only 5 will die

However if you all wear a mask and social distance only 4 will die

However if you all wear a mask, social distance, and have the vaccine only 2 will die.

 

As with all serious illness's some people will die however we can help lower the number who will die by taking lots of little steps and all the steps put together will help life go on.

I wouldn’t like to be in a room with you 😳

[davekathy]

2 hours ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Their ship, their rules. Simple 

 

Want to cruise, get vaccinated. Your choice. 
 

M8

Agree. No matter their age. 

[BNBR]

2 minutes ago, davekathy said:

Agree. No matter their age. 

 

Vaccines aren't likely to be approved for young children until late this year and possibly until 2022.  

 

It's extremely unlikely cruise lines will require vaccinations for children too young to even receive them.

 

When the vaccines are approved and deemed safe for children, we'll see.  My guess is it still won't be required by cruise lines for children, but they'll obviously make that decision based on the current state of affairs at the time.