Royal Caribbean Cruisers -- How Are Things Where You Are? (was "Routine" ​ 😁 ​day in lockdown... how was yours?)

[Luckynana]

10 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

Good afternoon.

It is 43°F and cloudy at 15.00pm in North East England.

It is a sad day today as it is 11 years today when my dad died.

It was a lovely church service today and Father David mentioned my dad during prayers.

Afterwards we went to the crematorium where the remembrance room is and we read the books of remembrance for today.

I hope everyone is well and all have a fantastic day.

Thinking of you today, Graham🙏

[brillohead]

2 minutes ago, dani negreanu said:

 

Thanks. Now I've got it, and I'm much more confident in positive results. 

 

I think you've meant Ray??

No, I meant J... she's still in regular contact with Ray's kids, and so she'd find out if I asked one of them to do a sibling DNA test with me.  So I had planned on waiting until she was gone, too, before asking one of Ray's kids to test with me.  

But now I don't have to deal with any of it, because Ray's definitely not my bio-dad.  

If Maury Povich's show had been a thing 50 years ago, J would have been an excellent guest on the show... she was evidently messing around with AT LEAST three different guys at the time I was conceived!  

 

 

[dani negreanu]

26 minutes ago, Lionesss said:

Be safe, Have fun

Enjoy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

15 minutes ago, Arzeena said:

Bon Voyage!

 

10 minutes ago, Momof3gurlz said:

I hope you have a great week on Oasis!

 

@Luckynana Maryann & Jim,

 

+ 4  😘

[Ocean Boy]

7 minutes ago, Luckynana said:

Oasis!!

Awesome, buon viaggio!!

[grapau27]

1 minute ago, Luckynana said:

Thinking of you today, Graham🙏

Thank you Maryann.

Wishing you an amazing cruise.

We were on Oasis 4 weeks ago after having to move from the Bella cruise due to Pauline's work commitments.

[jmh2006]

12 minutes ago, Luckynana said:

Thank you Sue.  See you next week!

See you next week!  Have a great trip this week!

[Sea Dog]

Brother and sister are having a very spirited conversation.

 

 

 

Edited March 5, 2023 by Sea Dog

[bobmacliberty]

8 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Brother and sister are having a very spirited conversation.

 

 

IMG_0561.MOV 73.05 MB · 1 download

 

 

 

🤣🤣🤣.  I like how they both stop for a second, and then both start yapping at each other again. 

[dani negreanu]

8 minutes ago, Sea Dog said:

Brother and sister are having a very spirited conversation

 

Quite a humanly behavior -- speaking at the same time, and not listening to one another....😉

[Jimbo]

1 hour ago, brillohead said:

 

 

 

Thanks for asking, Dani -- like I said before, I had no idea that people would be interested, but I'm more than happy to share my story.  Grab a drink and get comfy, because a whole novel is coming up! 

 

My birthmother, we'll call her J, got pregnant in high school.  She dropped out of school and got married and had my brother M, then almost immediately got divorced and moved back home with her parents.  My maternal grandmother was my brother M's primary caregiver in his formative years... J just wasn't ever mother material.  

 

J went to work at the post office and went back to night school to get her high school diploma, and she got pregnant with me.  I was born 5.5 years after my brother M, and the plan was to put me up for adoption all along.  I found out later that J wasn't even allowed to see me after I was born -- they whisked me out of the delivery room immediately after my birth, and refused to let her see me during her hospital stay after delivery.  (Adoption was SO brutal back then!) 

 

I also found out later that one of J's sisters was newly married when I was born and that sister had wanted to adopt me and keep me in the family, but J refused to allow it.  I'm not sure if J refused to allow her sister to adopt me because the sisters didn't get along, or if the source of the sisters' rift was the fact that she wouldn't let me be adopted and kept in the family.  (That aunt has since passed away, but I did get to meet her about 20 years ago, and she was the one who told me that she wanted to adopt me and J refused.)  

 

Eventually J married Ray, who was recently divorced with three kids of his own.  (This is why I thought that Ray was my birthfather -- my "non-identifying information" that I had in my adoption file stated that my birthfather was about a decade older than J, and married with three children.  The aunt that wanted to adopt me also told me that the whole family assumed that I was Ray's child.) 

 

J and Ray raised my brother M, but he didn't have a great childhood.  J and Ray were both alcoholics, and were at the bar with my brother M almost every night and driving home drunk with him in the vehicle.  My brother M moved to Arizona with his girlfriend (now wife) and her family immediately after they graduated from high school.  

 

I found J in the early 1990s with the help of a local adoption support group.  The group was a combination of adoptees and birthmothers who were either looking for or had found their missing relatives.  The non-identifying information that I had about J from my adoption file stated that she worked at the post office, had a son who was 5.5yo, and her father was a baker and her mother was a homemaker.  One of the people in the adoption support group knew someone who was a long-time postal worker, and they did some snooping for me and came back with J's name.  

 

My first clue that J wasn't the warm, touchy-feely type of person was her reaction to my phone call.  From talking to the birthmothers in the support group, I knew that most of them were keenly aware of their birth-child's existence in the world.  Most of them had similar experiences, being sent out of town to a "home for unwed mothers" and having the child removed from them immediately after birth and not being given an opportunity to say goodbye and grieve the loss of their baby.  Many of them "celebrated" their child's birthday every year, even just personally in their mind, taking note of what age the child would be, what stage of development, what might be going on in their lives, etc. 

 

But when I called J, I told her that I was born on <DOB> in <hospital name> and I was given up for adoption, and I had reason to believe that she was my birthmother.  Her response was, "Hmmmm, yeah, I guess that date sounds about right."  Needless to say, she wasn't pining over the loss of her baby girl!  But she did agree to meet with me, and we met at a park a few evenings later. 

 

She brought some photo albums to our initial meeting, and when I opened one and saw a Little League (baseball) team photo, I pointed right to one boy and said, "That's my brother!"  My half-brother M was about 8yo in the picture, and he looked EXACTLY like a picture of me at 6yo getting my picture taken before a dance recital.  We had the EXACT same scowl on our faces at getting our picture taken!  LOL  J also gave me an old picture of her at 4yo dressed in a little cowgirl outfit.  When I later showed the picture to my adoptive mother, her remark was, "I don't remember you having an outfit like that."  My adopto-mom thought that the picture of Little J was actually a picture of me. Interestingly enough, my own son was a clone of me around 5-6yo, too.  

 

When I asked J who my birthfather was, she gave me a name of "B.G." and said that she had heard that he had moved to California and died in a motorcycle accident.  I later tracked down BG's mother, who lived locally.  Stupid me, I thought that because BG was an only child, his mother would be happy to know that he had a child and she had a grandchild. 

 

Well, I called up the old lady, and it turns out that BG did move to California, but he wasn't dead, and his mother thought that there was no way I could be his child because she didn't remember any girlfriends named J.  (I didn't point out that the kinds of girls who got knocked up out of wedlock multiple times weren't exactly the type of girl you took home to meet your strict mother!)  I asked the old lady if BG had any other children, and her response was, "No, he never married."  (Again, I didn't bother to point out that my very presence on this earth was proof positive that one didn't need to be married to produce children!)  It was obvious that I wasn't going to get anywhere with her, so I ended the call and never contacted her again.

 

Over the years I had a distant relationship with J and her husband Ray, maybe seeing them once a year.  J was still a functional alcoholic, but Ray had gotten sober in the years between my birth and me finding J.  On one of her twice-a-year visits to my brother M and his family in Arizona, she told him of my existence.  At the time, he didn't want to meet with me.  (To give you an idea of how little J was involved in M's life as a young boy, he never realized she was pregnant, even though he was 5.5yo at the time of my birth.  J is 5'0" tall and weighed a whopping 100 pounds when pregnant with me, so the change in her body must have been BLATANTLY obvious, even to an oblivious little boy, but she just wasn't that important to M's life then.)  

 

It was about 5-6 years later that my brother M decided to meet with me.  He and his family were visiting from Arizona, and I went over to J's house and met him.  We talked for a couple of hours, and it felt very natural -- especially considering that it should have felt very awkward!  It turns out that he refused to meet me back in the beginning because he didn't want to "burst my bubble" if I was expecting some kind of fairy tale story of what a great mom J was when he was growing up.  He didn't even know me, and he was being a protective big brother!  I wouldn't say that M and I are "close" but we are definitely friendly and comfortable with each other.  If they're in town, they always call to see if we can get together for a meal, and it always feels very natural to talk to him.  Now that he finally joined the 21st century and got a cell phone, we send each other memes via text once in a while.  

 

So that leaves us with present day.  Ray passed away eight years ago.  For the past 20 years, I've assumed he was my birthfather.  I'd always planned on doing a sibling test with one of his kids from his first marriage after J passed away (she's "a lot to deal with" so I didn't want to rock the boat while J's still alive -- she's still in regular contact with Ray's kids). 

 

But the Ancestry.com DNA kits were on sale over the holidays, so I decided to gift myself with a test kit for Christmas (ya know, because the ten consecutive cruises I'd just taken weren't gift enough! LOL).  I figured that would be an easy way to confirm it without ever having to bring Ray's kids into the issue. I got the kit, spit in the tube, mailed it off, and waited.  My results came through in late January, when I was on Allure.  I gave it a quick once-over and didn't see anyone with Ray's surname, and figured I'd get into it more after I got back. 

 

In the meantime, Ancestry.com started a new beta program where they labeled whether your DNA matches were from Parent1 or Parent2.  Since I had some info on J, I started building her family tree until I found people in my DNA matches who had the same names in their family trees.  I was then able to determine that J was Parent2, so all the matches from Parent1 had to be from my birthfather’s family. 


I had two matches on the paternal side that were considered “first to second cousin” level, which actually includes: 

 

• 1st cousin
• Great-grandparent
• Great-grandchild
• Grandaunt/granduncle
• Grandniece/grandnephew
• Half aunt/uncle
• Half niece/nephew
• 1st cousin 1x removed
• Half 1st cousin
• 2nd great-grandparent
• 2nd great-grandchild
• Great-grandaunt/granduncle
• Great-grandniece/grandnephew
• Half grandaunt/granduncle
• Half grandniece/grandnephew
• 2nd cousin
• 1st cousin 2x removed
• Half 1st cousin 1x removed
• Half great-grandaunt/granduncle
• Half great-grandniece/grandnephew

 

Holy macaroni, what a mess!!!  Fortunately, the one I matched the most with (11% shared DNA, 758cM for those who follow such things) ALSO had a pretty decent family tree posted.  The way Ancestry.com shows family trees, if you choose to make them public, is that they don’t list the names or any information beyond gender of anyone who is listed as still living.  This family tree was what “made the case” for me.

In all the other DNA matches on the paternal side, in looking at their posted family trees, I kept seeing two different surnames over and over, we’ll call them A and B.  Every single paternal match had an ancestor named A or an ancestor name B, no exceptions.  This told me that where A and B met was where my family tree came together.  And the 11% DNA match with the family tree?  Her grandparents were John A and Abigail B.  BINGO! 

I was looking for a union between A and B, and I was looking for a DNA match, and I had them both in my 11% relative.  The ages/dates didn’t work out for A and B to be my great-grandparents, so they must be my grandparents.  And they were also 11%’s grandparents, which makes us first cousins, which is also what we matched as. 

So then I went down the rabbit hole….and what a trip it was!  John A had three different wives, and he had a passel of kids with each one.  And Abigail B had two different husbands, and she had multiple kids with both of them, too.  So I had to figure out which kids (or at least which boys) were the product of the John A and Abigail B union using only public records (mainly census data from 1930 and 1940) and whatever publicly posted family trees I could find on the internet. 

 

I finally narrowed it down to three boys:  Jack, Bill, and Chuck.  Jack and Bill both live in Alabama.  Chuck lived in Kalamazoo, Michigan.  I was born in Kalamazoo, Michigan.  So I was pretty sure Chuck was my bio-dad. 

I tried making contact with people on the Ancestry.com website, but nobody replied.  I tried making contact with people on FB, but nobody replied.  I really didn’t want to make the initial contact with a sibling….that’s a heck of a shock coming from a stranger, so I was hoping to make contact with a cousin or aunt or SOMEBODY a little more distant first, to hopefully lessen the blow.  But with nobody returning my messages, I finally bit the bullet and made contact with my suspected brother, R. 

And that’s where we are now.  I found out that Bill, one of the three brothers, actually lived in Michigan during the time of my conception, so there’s a chance that he’s the bio-dad, instead of Chuck.  (My 11% relative is Jack's daughter, and I would have matched her as closer family if Jack were my father.) I have ordered an AncestryDNA kit for my suspected brother R to take, but that takes about a month for results.  Yesterday R ordered a “sibling DNA test” for us that will be through a private lab, and we should get those results much sooner (within two business days of the samples hitting the lab).  So maybe as soon as Monday or Tuesday of next week (8-9 days from now), depending on how long it takes them to send us the collection kits and shipping time for us to return the collection kits.  If there is any ambiguity about our sibling relationship (it’s reported as a “probability range” and we’re only half-siblings, so I would expect us to be on the lower side of that range), then we’ll also do a paternity test with Bill. 

As for the accuracy of the DNA testing, according to their website:

An AncestryDNA® test can very accurately determine if two people are genetically related at the 3rd or 4th cousin and closer level. This is because AncestryDNA® test results are based on the scientific method that identifies people who share long segments of DNA. Usually this is only possible if two people have had a recent common biological ancestor.

 

The fact that I had matches to people with both surnames A and B in my list, plus my closest match had grandparents with those same surnames, plus the fact that all of R’s relatives have looked at my pictures and said, “yep, she’s one of us!”... I’m feeling pretty confident with the accuracy of the DNA results.  

 

Any other questions?  I'm an open book (full length novel, as you can see from the size of this post!).

Wow, you lost me at "Hello" 😉😲

 

That post was a lot like a reading a book, which I have had very little experience with in many, many years.

[A&L_Ont]

1 hour ago, brillohead said:

I refuse to believe it's NOT the Batmobile!!!!

I have a few friends there and I have seen this car a few times. The guy who took these photos does photography work for many car company’s but is here for Rolls Royce this year. He is a genuine car aficionado. 
 

 

I like this Rolls photo.

 

 

[BonTexasNY]

1 hour ago, Luckynana said:

Oasis!!

Have a fabulous cruise this week.  Counting the days until we all meet!

[Sunshine3601]

3 hours ago, Arzeena said:

Debbie, you have some great advice here about doing it one thing at a time.

Please tell me how the FB Marketplace works. I have a ton of unused and very gently used house stuff that I want to get rid off. Kate Spade dinner service, Lenox, cookware and other stuff. Things that I cannot pack and mail if I put it on ebay. Thanks.

It is very easy to post items on FB Marketplace.    I'm not sure that I am allowed to place a link to the site but basically type in face  book  marketplace on google it will show the site you need to click.   from there click on buy or sell at this screen you then click create new listing.

you will want to have pictures of your items on your phone or computer so you can post them on the listing.  

You may want to review some of the current listings to get an idea of what to write up.   People post all kinds of items.    

The first item I sold on this site was a used car and have been using ever since.

best to create a separate listing for each item you want to sell or give away.

you will then receive messages through FB or texts to your cell phone with people interested.   

I usually post on my listings - CASH or Venmo only and Must pick up, will Not ship

Good Luck!

[HBE4]

9 hours ago, brillohead said:

People seem to either repeat the mistakes or avoid them.  Breaking the cycle takes a lot of self-awareness

 

I know several families where both parents were raging alcoholics and some of the children become alcoholics and some never touch the stuff. Weird, since they grew up in the same household enviroment. The only thing I can think of is that those that choose to not repeat their parent mistakes must've had some other positive influence in their lives.

 

8 hours ago, brillohead said:

It's funny, I didn't really expect people to be so interested in this journey.  I initially posted about it because I just kinda felt the need to talk about it in general, kinda vent about it / get it out of my system.  I was honestly a bit surprised at how much interest this has generated.  

 

 

Speaking only for myself, you are the only person  I know that took this journey. That alone makes it interesting.

 

And sometimes it is very surprising what topics spark interest. I've seen some random topics that go on for pages and pages. That's the beauty of this thread.

 

 

[HBE4]

8 hours ago, taznremmy said:

@brillohead  We are an extended family here.  If we weren't, we wouldn't be checking in daily (when possible) to see what is happening.  I have met you (Navigator), but did not know any of this.  I am so happy for you that this is finally giving you some closure, and on such a positive note. I think I am safe in saying we all care, and are so happy for your results.  And remember, your 'new' family should be very proud of you and of your accomplishments.  As @Bailey & Sophie said....this is so exciting! 

Pat

 

Perfectly said.

[Sunshine3601]

2 hours ago, Luckynana said:

Yes.  I'm on my way to the Port now 😃

 

You are doing a b2b right?   Is this your first one?    

I hope you have an amazing cruise with beautiful weather and smooth seas😃

Bon Voyage🍸

[HBE4]

55 minutes ago, Jimbo said:

Wow, you lost me at "Hello" 😉😲

 

That post was a lot like a reading a book, which I have had very little experience with in many, many years.

 

I saw the lenght of the post & skipped right over it to read the rest of the thread.

 

I will now pour myself another cup of coffee, toast an English Muffin, spread some butter and jelly and go back to read that post.

Edited March 5, 2023 by HBE4

[brillohead]

1 minute ago, HBE4 said:

 

I saw the lenght of the post & skipped right over it to read the rest of the thread.

 

I will now pour myself another cup of coffee, toast an English Muffin, spread some butter and jelly and go back to read that post.

You might want to pack a lunch, too... it's a long one!  LOL

[HBE4]

4 minutes ago, brillohead said:

You might want to pack a lunch, too... it's a long one!  LOL

 

LOL, I'll do that during the intermission break.

[HBE4]

45 minutes ago, A&amp;L_Ont said:

I like this Rolls photo.

 

 

 

Certainly know how to tailgate in style.

 

[h20skibum]

2 hours ago, brillohead said:

Thanks for asking, Dani -- like I said before, I had no idea that people would be interested, but I'm more than happy to share my story.  Grab a drink and get comfy, because a whole novel is coming up! 

I got to the second paragraph, and thought I would need to grab a paper and pencil to graph everything.  Looks like someone already started one. 
 

 

Seriously, congratulations on your long journey of research and positive outcomes so far.

 

I have relatives with adopted children, and who put children up for adoption.  As far as I know, none of them have started down your journey.

[h20skibum]

2 hours ago, Luckynana said:

Yes.  I'm on my way to the Port now 😃

I didn't know about his knee...

Have a great cruise, Maryann.

 

2 hours ago, grapau27 said:

Good afternoon.

It is 43°F and cloudy at 15.00pm in North East England.

It is a sad day today as it is 11 years today when my dad died.

It was a lovely church service today and Father David mentioned my dad during prayers.

Afterwards we went to the crematorium where the remembrance room is and we read the books of remembrance for today.

I hope everyone is well and all have a fantastic day.

Graham, thinking of you today, on Remembrance Day for your dad.

[brillohead]

4 minutes ago, h20skibum said:

I got to the second paragraph, and thought I would need to grab a paper and pencil to graph everything.  Looks like someone already started one. 
 

 

Seriously, congratulations on your long journey of research and positive outcomes so far.

 

I have relatives with adopted children, and who put children up for adoption.  As far as I know, none of them have started down your journey.

Just wanted to clarify that my laughing reaction was due to the graphic you posted, not the serious part!  

[Sunshine3601]

24 minutes ago, HBE4 said:

 

I know several families where both parents were raging alcoholics and some of the children become alcoholics and some never touch the stuff. Weird, since they grew up in the same household enviroment. The only thing I can think of is that those that choose to not repeat their parent mistakes must've had some other positive influence in their lives.

 

Our youngest Son, Chris, never drinks alcohol.    For a while Eric and I thought maybe we turned him off alcohol.   Not that we are alcoholics in anyway but when the children were younger and we had house parties, picnics and beach parties with family and friends that included alcohol and sometimes we were all pretty buzzed by the end of the day.    We thought we broke him.

After he turned 21 and still had no interest in alcohol we asked him why and if it had anything to do with us drinking.      He then confessed that when him and his older Brother were 16 and 20 yrs. old and we let them stay at the shore house for a weekend by themselves that they had a couple of friends over and drank a bunch of different stuff (we all know mixing is never good) and he was very drunk and very very sick and never wanted to feel that way ever again.   To do this day he never had another ounce of alcohol.     

We were glad to hear that we didn't break him😇

 

[Arzeena]

@Sunshine3601

 

Thank you for that FB MP how to.🥰