Formal nights getting really casual ....

On a recent mid August Alaskan southbound cruise from Whittier to Vancouver on Star Princess, I was stunned and surprised how casual the diners were especially the men on formal nights in the MDR. We've been on a number of Princess cruises and this one has to be the most casually dressed cruise we've ever seen on formal nights. If I have to guess, a good 30 to 40% of the diners in the MDR wore casual on formal nights. The area where we were sitting towards the back of the Anytime MDR with about 12 tables, a good majority of the men wore casual. I wasn't talking about wearing just a dress shirt. I was referring to cargo pants, running shoes, sandals, faded blue jeans, wrinkled Polos with long sleeve T shirt underneath, .... The ironic thing was the kids present especially the young boys were significantly better dressed than the men. Have you seen this trend on other Princess ships? I personally think Princess should just do away with these formal nights and go business casual each evening in the MDR since it's a pain and a chore to pack formal attire. Why bother with a cruise tradition when diners are no longer willing to dress up. Your thoughts and observations?

i agree

Not another thread on formal nights!!!:eek::roll eyes:

People, especially Americans, are sinking to the lowest common dominator. Oh, they will tell you "we're on vacation" and "it's hard to carry formal clothes anymore", but the reality is that they don't care about dressing or formality. They go to weddings and funerals in shorts and t shirts.

There may be people who do not feel obligated to wear anything but pajamas and underwear out in public. There are others who do not agree with that and will still dress-because it looks good and it helps serrate one from the pajamas and underwear crowd.

As you will see, though the pajamas and underwear crowd really don't care what they look like as long as they are comfortable. (Note, I am comfortable in real clothes so I am not sure what "I just want to be comfortable" means).

FWIW

The trend is toward more casual. I want to pack in one suitcase , especially when flying and paying for each suitcase.

Not another thread on formal nights!!!:eek::roll eyes:

Amen.

The flip side of your guesstimate would be that 60 to 70% still followed the formal night dress code to a certain degree, and by your own admission possibly higher for women. Yet you wish to cancel a tradition that the majority still enjoy under the presumption that every non-participant feels the same way as you do (that dressing nicer than smart casual is a "pain and a chore"). And Princess describes its non-formal nights as "smart casual" not "business casual" the latter being essentially a uniform of khakis with either a polo shirt or cotton work shirt--thus actually more restrictive than "smart casual" while less dressy at the same time. So if I read the original post correctly, what is being proposed is not just the elimination of formal nights but the strict conformity of what is worn every night in the MDR.

Just sailed with Celebrity. Saw the same thing in their MDR. I think maybe Princess could make one of the dining rooms stay formal, and have the others go casual. I do not mind dressing up (and I do make the effort to dress appropriately for the cruise) but I actually enjoy the meal more when I am less dressed up. Also, as some people noted - packing formal clothes is a hassle when your luggage is restricted.

My sons were on our last cruise. They all had dress clothes and ties. The older three had jackets. Their cousin showed up in jeans and a golf shirt. He was allowed in and served. On the less formal nights he actually wore a ball cap. In the interest of family harmony, I let it alone, but I felt that it was disrespectful. Unfortunately, he was not alone. I would agree that a sizable minority of people were well underdressed. It was hard telling my sons they had to dress up when much of the room was certainly not doing so.

On a side note:

Has anyone noticed the food seems a little more upscale on formal nights?

We have 3 formal nights on our upcoming cruise. We will dress for two of them for sure. We "may" skip one and eat in an alternate venue but, then again, we "may" dress for the third formal night as well.

It gets hot where we live - many days above 100° F - so we are used to seeing people out and about in shorts and sandals. It is acceptable dress in most dining establishments here. However, when we are cruising, we adhere to the dress standards of smart casual in the evenings and on formal nights we tend to dress properly for MDR.

We don't wear shorts and sandals to weddings and funerals as a rule although we have been to a wake in the park where anybody dressed up would have fallen over due to heat exhaustion. (I think it was about 110° F that day.) I have a cousin who is getting married in September and she has stated in the invitations that it will be an outdoor, casual affair. We would certainly dress in the casual manner requested for the affair but, unfortunately, we will be in Cabo San Lucas on that day. ;)

I personally think Princess should just do away with these formal nights and go business casual each evening in the MDR since it's a pain and a chore to pack formal attire. Why bother with a cruise tradition when diners are no longer willing to dress up. Your thoughts and observations?

*Princess earns revenue on the photos taken on formal nights. Believe it would be difficult for them to make a policy change with the possible outcome of lower revenue. *You mention Alaska, but I have not seen a large percentage of casual dressed men on my cruises in Europe, Hawaii, Mexico and the Caribbean. Men w/o a shirt and tie is usually less than 5%. Women seem to always be properly dressed. *It seems modification of recommended dress would be embraced by some and not embraced by some, what is the balance? *One DR always smart casual, others jacket and tie, no exceptions? Separate section in the DR for those not formally dressed? Traditional dining adheres to formal dress while in ATD formal is optional? Are these possible solutions? Personally I believe no one should be admitted to the DR's on any night dressed in shorts and "T". If you wish to dress that way there are other dining venues and other cruise lines that allow it.

Alaskan sailings tend to be less formal since most passenger tend to wear jeans/sweatshirts during the day on shore which doesn't leave much room in the suitcase for real formal wear. On the 3 Alaskan sailings I took I brought a long black skirt and sequin/dressy tops for the formal nights instead of gowns. The guys still have it easier than the ladies when it comes to formal nights since they can reuse the same jacket, trousers and shirt and even the tie.

MARAPRINCE

Formal nights have become way less formal. DH to longer takes his tuxedo.

LuLu

On a recent mid August Alaskan southbound cruise from Whittier to Vancouver on Star Princess, I was stunned and surprised how casual the diners were especially the men on formal nights in the MDR. We've been on a number of Princess cruises and this one has to be the most casually dressed cruise we've ever seen on formal nights. If I have to guess, a good 30 to 40% of the diners in the MDR wore casual on formal nights. The area where we were sitting towards the back of the Anytime MDR with about 12 tables, a good majority of the men wore casual. I wasn't talking about wearing just a dress shirt. I was referring to cargo pants, running shoes, sandals, faded blue jeans, wrinkled Polos with long sleeve T shirt underneath, .... The ironic thing was the kids present especially the young boys were significantly better dressed than the men. Have you seen this trend on other Princess ships? I personally think Princess should just do away with these formal nights and go business casual each evening in the MDR since it's a pain and a chore to pack formal attire. Why bother with a cruise tradition when diners are no longer willing to dress up. Your thoughts and observations?

I say - send 'em all to the Horizon Court, where they can be stark naked, for all I care !!! ;) :)

...VTX-Al

I say - send 'em all to the Horizon Court, where they can be stark naked, for all I care !!! ;) :)

 

...VTX-Al

Ew. Thanks for the image. :p;):D

I think the trend away from formal has more to do with luggage than culture. That said, the cultural aspects also weigh in. Princess used the tag line "Escape completely" in recent years. Escaping completely, to me, suggests not wearing a tuxedo to dinner.

Besides this, outside of a handful of fundraising events in ye olde home town - if that - who wears a tux anyway?

I would maintain some decorum though, no cargo shorts, sneakers, tee shirts, etc in the MDR. However, the days of the tux in the mass commercial cruising era should be at a merciful end.

Almost all of the cruise lines have become less formal in an attempt to attract younger cruisers and to keep pace with America's trend toward ever more casual dress.

Reason to keep formal nights - (follow the money)

Cruise lines also make $$ on the sale of formal night photos.

Keep the hair salons and spas happy by directing people to "Doll up" for the special evening.

As long as people still measure their success, style or having class by what they wear, there will always be a place for formal dress. :(

On a recent mid August Alaskan southbound cruise from Whittier to Vancouver on Star Princess, I was stunned and surprised how casual the diners were especially the men on formal nights in the MDR. We've been on a number of Princess cruises and this one has to be the most casually dressed cruise we've ever seen on formal nights. If I have to guess, a good 30 to 40% of the diners in the MDR wore casual on formal nights. The area where we were sitting towards the back of the Anytime MDR with about 12 tables, a good majority of the men wore casual. I wasn't talking about wearing just a dress shirt. I was referring to cargo pants, running shoes, sandals, faded blue jeans, wrinkled Polos with long sleeve T shirt underneath, .... The ironic thing was the kids present especially the young boys were significantly better dressed than the men. Have you seen this trend on other Princess ships? I personally think Princess should just do away with these formal nights and go business casual each evening in the MDR since it's a pain and a chore to pack formal attire. Why bother with a cruise tradition when diners are no longer willing to dress up. Your thoughts and observations?

You observed 2 things on Formal night. One is that there is an element in society that does whatever it feels like whenever it wants to. This is a rude and inconsiderate element. They had other options for dining on formal night where they could dress as they pleased.

The second thing you observed was a group of people dining in appropriate dress as requested by Princess, for formal night dining.

Given the percentage that you quoted on the casual dressers, the majority of cruisers who followed the dress request of Princess shouldn't need to give up the dressing up for those that don't want to dress up.

You can follow which ever group you choose.

We don't always dress for formal night dinner, but we never eat in the dining room if we don't participate.

The flip side of your guesstimate would be that 60 to 70% still followed the formal night dress code to a certain degree, and by your own admission possibly higher for women. Yet you wish to cancel a tradition that the majority still enjoy under the presumption that every non-participant feels the same way as you do (that dressing nicer than smart casual is a "pain and a chore"). And Princess describes its non-formal nights as "smart casual" not "business casual" the latter being essentially a uniform of khakis with either a polo shirt or cotton work shirt--thus actually more restrictive than "smart casual" while less dressy at the same time. So if I read the original post correctly, what is being proposed is not just the elimination of formal nights but the strict conformity of what is worn every night in the MDR.

It's The Agenda.

I've come to enjoy formal more and more as we get older and the boys begrudgingly dress up. Funny my girl never minded it, was a highlight :o Whether it was a one week or a two week European we never found the baggage issue to be limiting.

I always find these threads fun, I've never let what others choose to wear bother me much. As long as they aren't loud and obnoxious and deter from waiters doing their job it is all good to me :D

With only one formal on the short Alaskan cruises, is it worth the trouble to pack a suit?

I would just say that if Princess does not enforce the dress code, then there will soon be no more dress code anywhere on the ship. This isn't just about formal night in the MDR, it's about the manner of dress all over the ships. There are increasing numbers of passengers entering the Horizon Court in bare feet and no swimsuit cover-up. There are passengers in the atrium dressed the same way, men without a shirt and women who might as well be without one. As long as Princess tolerates it, these situations will increase. The inconsistency among the ships is another issue................I witnessed a gentleman in shorts being turned away from the MDR on the Royal yet saw the shorts tolerated on the Caribbean Princess. If Princess wants to maintain a level of decency and formality on their ships, then they need to consistently take control of their own policies. Passengers will adhere if necessary, but will refuse if allowed.

Just sailed with Celebrity. Saw the same thing in their MDR. I think maybe Princess could make one of the dining rooms stay formal, and have the others go casual.

Excellent idea! That way both parties would be happy.

I say - send 'em all to the Horizon Court, where they can be stark naked, for all I care !!! ;) :)

 

...VTX-Al

But the real truth is no one cares how you feel as it is up to the ship to make the decision.

I would just say that if Princess does not enforce the dress code, then there will soon be no more dress code anywhere on the ship. This isn't just about formal night in the MDR, it's about the manner of dress all over the ships. There are increasing numbers of passengers entering the Horizon Court in bare feet and no swimsuit cover-up. There are passengers in the atrium dressed the same way, men without a shirt and women who might as well be without one. As long as Princess tolerates it, these situations will increase. The inconsistency among the ships is another issue................I witnessed a gentleman in shorts being turned away from the MDR on the Royal yet saw the shorts tolerated on the Caribbean Princess. If Princess wants to maintain a level of decency and formality on their ships, then they need to consistently take control of their own policies. Passengers will adhere if necessary, but will refuse if allowed.

Fully agree.

No matter how much everyone complains, it is up to princess to enforce the rules. I don't have a problem with folks who come in decent clothes. But please not pajamas, or other things that don't belong in the dining room.

The way I see it is if some one at our table is going to dress horribly i can always change tables and leave it up to the staff how they choose to deal with them.

I also like the idea of allocating one dining room for formal attire, though admittedly not sure what logisitical problems that might create.

It would keep the tradition alive and easier to enforce for those that do like it, as well as preserve the revenue stream it creates for Princess. I may be in the minority here, but I actually do mind it when DH and I take the time and effort to dress up and those around us don't - and by that I'm referring to the blatant and obvious variety of disregard (ball caps, shorts, t-shirts, etc.)

There are times we intentionally don't bring any dressy attire as we don't plan to participate in formal night(s), but we also don't insert ourselves into the MDR on those nights either.

As others have said, it's up to Princess to enforce this.