Done with HAL For Now

[iceman93]

Well, I just cancelled next summer's cruise and decided to get our deposits back rather than transfer them to another future booking.  I'm not liking the direction HAL is going regarding children's programming, so we'll just choose other vacation options for now.  Maybe once my youngest is out of the house, my wife and I will start sailing HAL again, but that's at least 12 years away.

 

I'm not trying to get anyone else to change their travel choices or to start a debate about kids on nice cruises, but I am saddened by this.  My wife and I started sailing HAL amost 25 years ago, when we were young and childless.  We fell in love with the elegant experience, and have rolled with the punches as things have changed over time--some for the better and some for the worse.  Then when we started having kids, they also enjoyed the HAL experience, part of which was their enjoyment of Club HAL.

 

On our last cruise we had some issues with the Club HAL staff, particularly the director who was a fairly nasty person (I wrote a letter to HAL about this and got a boilerplate reply).  But our littlest one still looked forward to future Club HAL experiences.  We originally booked a 14-day Alaska cruise on the Maasdam, but then found out that ship was dedicated to "EXC voyages" and so no children's programming would be provided at all.  Okay, kind of disappointing, but we switched to another sailing in Europe.

 

Now there's been all this drama lately regarding the video arcade and whether it will augment or replace Club HAL.  People seem to keep getting different answers from corporate, none of which includes a clear answer.  We got our Cruise Atlas in the mail last week, and it does not mention Club HAL at all.  There was a page with vague language about "a variety of supervised children's activities", which did not fill me with confidence.  What, specifically, would be offered on our sailing?  I wrote an e-mail to HAL a month ago and never got a response.

 

So this family of two adult 4-star mariners, and two kids (3-star and 2-star mariners themselves) are going to take our business elsewhere.  We book PS cabins, so it's not a small chunk of change.  HAL is of course free to do whatever they want, and perhaps they will be more profitable by shifting away from the family market.  But my fear is that the vagueness and uncertainty in this area is like the rest of the line--corporately there seems to be no strong vision for what HAL is or should be.  I used to get it--elegant, traditional cruising with wonderful itineraries, fantastic staff, good food, and enough on-board activities to keep one busy while still allowing plenty of opportunity to relax and enjoy amazing ports of call.

 

What is HAL today, and tomorrow?  I don't know, but not the cruise line for my family, unfortunately.

[Seasick Sailor]

I understood it was only Oosterdam currently, and Nieuw Amsterdam sometime in 2020 going to High Score? 

Perhaps we will see you on a future HAL cruise. I plan on being around 12 years from now😁

[wdw1972]

Just thinking out loud here, and I do understand your disappointment.  With all the increase in family cruising and additional amenities (like theme parks, go carts, zip lines, etc) being added to ships by other cruise lines, perhaps HAL is thinking it's better to get out vs try to compete for that market?  As a 4 star mariner myself, I prefer itineraries with as few kids as possible - so hope to never see HAL successfully attracting more families.  That said, a small number of well behaved children aren't a problem.  My son grew up on HAL (from age 10), and as an adult that's where he took his wife to propose (at dinner in the Pinnacle).  I took him on one of the bigger kid-friendlier lines once and he asked for his future cruises to be back on HAL - so I "get" that there are kids out there who can be a good fit for HAL.  We were thinking a HAL cruise would be a good option several years from now when my grandson (son's son) is around 8-10, but I guess I may have to keep HAL for myself and enjoy the many other trips we share together each year.

 

Sue/WDW1972

[knittinggirl]

Disney Cruise Line is good for kids.

[Loreto]

Last July I took my 10 year old grand daughter on the 7 day Alaska Explorer on the Oosterdam.  We, along with her mom, checked out Club HAL.  Grand daughter looked at everything and said "no thank you" and had a fantastic time with us.  Is Club HAL for parents who don't want to be with their children on a family vacation?

Karen

[TrolleyGirl]

8 minutes ago, Loreto said:

Is Club HAL for parents who don't want to be with their children on a family vacation?

 

I don't believe so, but I do believe it is a great option for families who have varied interests.  Perhaps mom & dad want to spend some time in the spa or in a mixology class.  Just maybe the little one wants to make new friends in Club Hal.  

[kazu]

12 minutes ago, Loreto said:

Last July I took my 10 year old grand daughter on the 7 day Alaska Explorer on the Oosterdam.  We, along with her mom, checked out Club HAL.  Grand daughter looked at everything and said "no thank you" and had a fantastic time with us.  Is Club HAL for parents who don't want to be with their children on a family vacation?

Karen

 

It might not have appealed to your grand daughter but it has definitely appealed to some CC friends’ children.  They enjoyed it there when they were younger and literally had to be dragged away.  FWIW - they had been on a number of lines, including Disney and the children liked Club HAL the best.

 

They were a close knit family who enjoy time together so Club HAL was for the children’s enjoyment not to avoid being with the children.

It’s a shame that HAL has to play with a “good thing”.

[Tom O.]

On my Holland America cruises, I have seen very few children. So, I suppose for HAL it is not cost effective to spend a lot on children's activities, when there are so few of them.

It could be worse, Viking Cruises doesn't allow anyone under 18 on their ships.

[kazu]

7 minutes ago, Tom O. said:

On my Holland America cruises, I have seen very few children. So, I suppose for HAL it is not cost effective to spend a lot on children's activities, when there are so few of them.

 

You see few children because Club HAL is successful.

Example - on one cruise we had 300 children.  You rarely saw a child unless they were in a HAL group somewhere during daytime peak hours on the ship.

 

On our Panama Canal cruise there were around 30 children in Club HAL, at least.  The group was out and about the ship at times (pizza, scavenger hunt, ice cream, etc.) but they were very well behaved and really, unless you were looking for them, you wouldn’t have seen them.

 

I had my eye out after hearing 1of4’s children rave about it (and my own DS rave about it on the Eurodam previously with her 2 children) to get an idea.  I was very impressed with what I saw.

 

I was equally impressed with what I saw on the Prinsendam.  There is no formal Club HAL there but there are counsellors.  They had those youngsters everywhere on the ship, well behaved, having fun and not bothering a soul.  Everyone stopped though to chat with them as they were so absolutely charming.

 

IMO, Club HAL was one of HAL’s best kept secrets.

[Seasick Sailor]

As I said above: I understood it was only Oosterdam currently, and Nieuw Amsterdam sometime in 2020 going to High Score.

The rest of the ships per the HAL blog are staying with Club HAL. (So far)

Nothing wrong with saying we enjoyed our Viking adult cruise. There are many, many cruise itineraries out there that are still kid friendly. 

[Cruising-along]

50 minutes ago, knittinggirl said:

Disney Cruise Line is good for kids.

Yes it is.  Just wish it wasn't so expensive...even with our DIL's employee discount it will be way more than our other cruises.  But since we're going with our children and grandchildren, that's all that counts.  

[Aquahound]

1 hour ago, TrolleyGirl said:

 

I don't believe so, but I do believe it is a great option for families who have varied interests.  Perhaps mom & dad want to spend some time in the spa or in a mixology class.  Just maybe the little one wants to make new friends in Club Hal.  

 

Agreed.  I think it's absurd to suggest that the kids club is for parents who don't want to be with their children. 

[MISTER 67]

1 hour ago, knittinggirl said:

Disney Cruise Line is good for kids.

And very expensive.

[iancal]

No surprise really.  Many businesses change their direction, their focus, etc. over time.   Change is constant.   HAL is no different.   We have dealt with many businesses for years only to have them change in a way that no longer appeals to us.  So we made a change of vendors...travel, financial, etc 

 

It is unrealistic not to assume change.  The trick is to either roll with it or move to another vendor that more closely meets your preferences.  Good to see that you are not resentful. Some people can be.  So much better to spend your energy on identifying an alternate cruise line experience and moving forward instead of moaning and groaning about the past or feeling resentful towards HAL.

Edited January 9, 2020 by iancal

[wesport]

Only book pinnacle suites. Wow. Nice. 

[Vict0riann]

But if they are trying to change their direction, shouldn't they be looking toward a younger demographic, i.e.  people with children?  Our daughters were "young adults" when they first cruised with us on HAL (we had used other lines when they were younger) and one, at least, still cruises with HAL.

[iceman93]

Interesting data point:  when I called to cancel the person on the other end of the phone was quite gracious.  She went over all the details (to make sure she was cancelling the right cruise, I suppose) and even joked that for what we were paying for the cruise we should just buy our own ship!  Exaggeration, of course, but then she asked if I minded saying why were cancelling.  I explained that there have been some changes to the kids' programs on board and so HAL no longer worked for our family.

 

She told me I was her second caller this morning who had cancelled a cruise for that reason, and then she asked if she could ask me a few more questions because she wanted to "run this up the flagpole".  I told her that the shift away from Club HAL, starting with the Maasdam, was troubling and that there's been a lot of confusion about the upcoming video game arcade and whether it will be a supplement to or a replacement for traditional Club HAL activities.  She hadn't heard that there was no Club HAL on the Maasdam or that the arcade concept was rolling out (not surprising, I suppose, but my impression is that in the past HAL reps were more knowledgeable about their product), and asked to put me on hold.  I told her that if she could confirm, and send to me in writing, that there would be the equivalent of Club HAL activities, counselors, etc. on my sailing that I would happily keep the booking.

 

She put me on hold for about fifteen minutes and then came back with the bad news: she spoke with several different supervisors and managers, none of whom gave her the same answer as to the future of children's programming on HAL ships.  She said she understood then why I was confused and disappointed, and she processed the cancellation.

[sail7seas]

2 hours ago, iceman93 said:

Well, I just cancelled next summer's cruise and decided to get our deposits back rather than transfer them to another future booking.  I'm not liking the direction HAL is going regarding children's programming, so we'll just choose other vacation options for now.  Maybe once my youngest is out of the house, my wife and I will start sailing HAL again, but that's at least 12 years away.

 

I'm not trying to get anyone else to change their travel choices or to start a debate about kids on nice cruises, but I am saddened by this.  My wife and I started sailing HAL amost 25 years ago, when we were young and childless.  We fell in love with the elegant experience, and have rolled with the punches as things have changed over time--some for the better and some for the worse.  Then when we started having kids, they also enjoyed the HAL experience, part of which was their enjoyment of Club HAL.

 

On our last cruise we had some issues with the Club HAL staff, particularly the director who was a fairly nasty person (I wrote a letter to HAL about this and got a boilerplate reply).  But our littlest one still looked forward to future Club HAL experiences.  We originally booked a 14-day Alaska cruise on the Maasdam, but then found out that ship was dedicated to "EXC voyages" and so no children's programming would be provided at all.  Okay, kind of disappointing, but we switched to another sailing in Europe.

 

Now there's been all this drama lately regarding the video arcade and whether it will augment or replace Club HAL.  People seem to keep getting different answers from corporate, none of which includes a clear answer.  We got our Cruise Atlas in the mail last week, and it does not mention Club HAL at all.  There was a page with vague language about "a variety of supervised children's activities", which did not fill me with confidence.  What, specifically, would be offered on our sailing?  I wrote an e-mail to HAL a month ago and never got a response.

 

So this family of two adult 4-star mariners, and two kids (3-star and 2-star mariners themselves) are going to take our business elsewhere.  We book PS cabins, so it's not a small chunk of change.  HAL is of course free to do whatever they want, and perhaps they will be more profitable by shifting away from the family market.  But my fear is that the vagueness and uncertainty in this area is like the rest of the line--corporately there seems to be no strong vision for what HAL is or should be.  I used to get it--elegant, traditional cruising with wonderful itineraries, fantastic staff, good food, and enough on-board activities to keep one busy while still allowing plenty of opportunity to relax and enjoy amazing ports of call.

 

What is HAL today, and tomorrow?  I don't know, but not the cruise line for my family, unfortunately.

 

+Iceman,

 

That is really too bad but thank you for sharing your  thoughs with us

  Some how  I have a feeling Disney ... When I wish upon a star Might be in your near future.   Please  let us know when you decide.  

[3rdGenCunarder]

Iceman, I'm sorry you felt you had to cancel, but I understand your decision.

 

Taking Club HAL off Maasdam made sense, as HAL is making that ship into an "expedition" ship with more lectures and "content" than the other ships. Those cruises are longer and are geared more to adults than families and HAL probably didn't expect to get many kids on that ship. 

 

I don't think the change from Club HAL to the arcade on the other ships is related to the Maasdam change. It's just some insanely stupid thing someone in Seattle who has never had a child or known anyone who had a child thought might be "cool." There were a lot of unhappy families when they tried this on Oosterdam. You were the second cancellation in one day that the HAL rep had for this reason. I wonder how many other reps are seeing these complaints and cancellations? I hope they're taking note of the pushback. 

 

[Walfam]

iceman93 -  All you can do is vote with your feet and your money.  We would have done the same thing, if we were in your shoes.

[Krazy Kruizers]

iceman93

 

I understand what you are saying.  The last couple of years HAL doesn't seem to know what direction they should take.

 

Changing the Club HAL to High Score doesn't seem to be a positive direction -- JMO.

 

Hope you find a cruise line you will like or another type of vacation.

[SumoCitrus]

I don't mean to be crass in saying this, but if you're done with HAL because they are not a good cruise line for kids, that's just solidified HAL as my choice of line. There's a reason I don't cruise Disney.

[baggal]

Whether or not you agree that HAL should change their marketing direction, its infuriating to ask a direct question and not receive a direct answer.  Makes you wonder about the company in general.

 

 

[taxmantoo]

16 minutes ago, Krazy Kruizers said:

iceman93

 

I understand what you are saying.  The last couple of years HAL doesn't seem to know what direction they should take.

 

Changing the Club HAL to High Score doesn't seem to be a positive direction -- JMO.

 

Hope you find a cruise line you will like or another type of vacation.

Club HAL is NOT going away.  High Score is an addition as explained on the HAL Blog page a while ago ...

 

The Kid’s Club/Club HAL is not going away on Holland America Line.

On Oosterdam only, we recently launched a new venue called High Score!, featuring a variety of popular arcade and table games. Regular hours during the day are for kids ages 7+ and family time is offered in the evening, with separate time slots. Times for each are published in the daily program and monitored by our staff.

Due to the high demand for family use of High Score! on Oosterdam’s recent Thanksgiving cruise, family hours were extended and supervised check-in was not available for ages 7 -12. We are pleased that many families were able to enjoy time together in this new venue over the holiday, but do understand that several guests were disappointed. We apologize for any disappointment this may have caused.

The Kid’s Club offers “check-in” supervised programming for each age group 3-6 and 7-12 for several hours a day, and again each evening from 7 p.m. – 10 p.m.

As always, we value guest feedback, particularly with new offerings. Many guests are enjoying High Score! on Oosterdam and the opportunity to spend dedicated family time in the venue. We will continue to monitor guest comments.

Nieuw Amsterdam is the only other ship scheduled to receive High Score in 2020, but will also still retain the Kid’s Club program.

[sail7seas]

Any theories as to why HAL has 'lost it's way'?     

 

SO many illogical changes and cut backs make little sense.  One has to really  take a 'close look before

 commiting much cash to a voyage.