reallyitsmema Posted January 22, 2020 #301 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Just now, S.A.M.J.R. said: According to the poster I quoted, the lawyer is saying the ONE released is at a "deceiving" angle. But there's been two released. I HIGHLY doubt there are 13 cameras that cover that corner of the deck. There might be 13 cameras on the pool deck, or even in that 1/3 of the deck, but there's no way there are 13 cameras looking at the same space. There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles. I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twins_to_alaska Posted January 22, 2020 #302 Share Posted January 22, 2020 7 minutes ago, KelSny1011 said: WOW..I didn't know that. Do you know if RCI ever tried to settle with the family? RC has had their videos the whole time... no reason for them to settle... from their statements they were just being politely quiet until pushed too far with the bad faith law suit and bad mouthing from the family/attorney. If the stepGF had taken the plea deal then that would have put a serious crimp in the lawsuit and the grasp for $$$. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akcruz Posted January 22, 2020 #303 Share Posted January 22, 2020 8 minutes ago, S.A.M.J.R. said: According to the poster I quoted, the lawyer is saying the ONE released is at a "deceiving" angle. But there's been two released. I HIGHLY doubt there are 13 cameras that cover that corner of the deck. There might be 13 cameras on the pool deck, or even in that 1/3 of the deck, but there's no way there are 13 cameras looking at the same space. 5 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said: There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles. I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident. https://nypost.com/2020/01/19/video-shows-grandfather-dangle-chloe-wiegand-before-fatal-fall-on-cruise-ship/ This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras. Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all. Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reallyitsmema Posted January 22, 2020 #304 Share Posted January 22, 2020 1 minute ago, akcruz said: https://nypost.com/2020/01/19/video-shows-grandfather-dangle-chloe-wiegand-before-fatal-fall-on-cruise-ship/ This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras. Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all. Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit. Thanks for the link. Really no way of knowing what they are considering "in the area" but I am sure that there are many distant cameras that have some glimpse of the whole incident, whether it is just showing them walking to the area or cameras on the outside of the ship showing the entire fall and more. There is more than the two that have been released and I hope none of them ever get released to the public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruiser_1977 Posted January 22, 2020 #305 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I was trying to think of a way to hedge this question without it being morbid but I don't think there is a way. There are also cameras that are trained on the outside of the ship. Wouldn't it seem that there is most likely video from outside looking toward the window? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Wheels Only Posted January 22, 2020 #306 Share Posted January 22, 2020 3 minutes ago, akcruz said: This is one if the articles that references the 13 cameras. Not saying I agree with the attorneys at all. Agree they are just grabbing at straws trying to come up with anything at this point, time to let it all go and drop this silly lawsuit. I've been on juries and I believe that if too many camera angles are shown, the jury will become "overwhelmed with info". If 11 of the 13 (or whatever) cameras barely show anything or don't show anything clearly "....these three pixels are Mr. Anello...", the jury will tune them out. Even if the final 2 videos are the 2 that most of us have seen, the jury might be brain dead at that point. The attorney is hoping that by claiming "...RCCL isn't showing all angles because they are trying to hide something...", a potential juror will side in favor of the family. 18 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said: There are cameras that record the outside of the ship from many different angles. I do not know if 13 is the actual number of cameras that could have recorded this incident, but I am sure not all of them are looking at the corner of the deck, many are looking at the other side of this accident. I'm fairly certain that there is a video of what happened outside. RCCL really wants to avoid releasing anything that shows the impact(s) but I'm willing to bet that there is video taken from the outside that shows Anello's head and upper body outside and shows Chloe being held outside. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulsacoker Posted January 22, 2020 #307 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I would think the Port would have multiple cameras, however this is Puerto Rico so camera condition might not been kept up with since the disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reallyitsmema Posted January 22, 2020 #308 Share Posted January 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, Two Wheels Only said: I've been on juries and I believe that if too many camera angles are shown, the jury will become "overwhelmed with info". If 11 of the 13 (or whatever) cameras barely show anything or don't show anything clearly "....these three pixels are Mr. Anello...", the jury will tune them out. Even if the final 2 videos are the 2 that most of us have seen, the jury might be brain dead at that point. The attorney is hoping that by claiming "...RCCL isn't showing all angles because they are trying to hide something...", a potential juror will side in favor of the family. I'm fairly certain that there is a video of what happened outside. RCCL really wants to avoid releasing anything that shows the impact(s) but I'm willing to bet that there is video taken from the outside that shows Anello's head and upper body outside and shows Chloe being held outside. If you have ever taken a bridge tour, you can see the monitors showing the different cameras recording the outside of the ship, there will be many videos. There will also be other angles, like a camera on the outside promenade deck, that also have some video of the incident. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taglovestocruise Posted January 22, 2020 #309 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Puerto Rico authorities must have some good evidence if they have charged the GF with manslaughter. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted January 22, 2020 #310 Share Posted January 22, 2020 The lawyer claims there are 13 cameras "in the area", not that there are 13 cameras pointed at the window where the accident happened. These interior cameras are mostly not pan/tilt movable cameras, so if they aren't pointed at the specific area, they won't show anything. I would be surprised if there were more than 2-3 cameras that showed a close/medium range view of the area around the window. The cameras along the side of the ship are of the pan/tilt type, and frequently, when in port, are pointed and zoomed in close on the gangways, so these may or may not show anything. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chengkp75 Posted January 22, 2020 #311 Share Posted January 22, 2020 4 minutes ago, taglovestocruise said: Puerto Rico authorities must have some good evidence if they have charged the GF with manslaughter. I believe the charge is negligent homicide, not manslaughter, unless it has changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare brillohead Posted January 22, 2020 #312 Share Posted January 22, 2020 4 minutes ago, chengkp75 said: I believe the charge is negligent homicide, not manslaughter, unless it has changed. Nothing has changed, it's still negligent homicide, which is appropriate for the circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare vacationlover_mn Posted January 22, 2020 #313 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I watched the video, and now wish I wouldn’t have 😞. So sad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandgeezer Posted January 22, 2020 #314 Share Posted January 22, 2020 1 hour ago, taglovestocruise said: Puerto Rico authorities must have some good evidence if they have charged the GF with manslaughter. Not everybody charged with a crime is convicted. In those cases I think the charging D.A.s thought they had good evidence too. Unless I’m missing something, it is still innocent until proven guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare bobmacliberty Posted January 22, 2020 #315 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I still don't see this ever going to court. Too much risk for Royal, no matter how much the evidence is on their side. You just never know with a jury. A juror or 2 who don't like big corporations and want to root for the little guy...a juror or 2 who also had a personal tragedy and can sympathize with wanting to blame Royal...one good (or potentially confusing) argument from the Plaintiff's attorney that makes a connection with a couple of jurors...etc. If Royal can't get the case dropped, I think they will settle somehow, likely with no admission of guilt. Guessing that's what the Plaintiff's lawyer, and maybe the family, are betting on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retiredgram Posted January 22, 2020 #316 Share Posted January 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, bobmacliberty said: I still don't see this ever going to court. Too much risk for Royal, no matter how much the evidence is on their side. You just never know with a jury. A juror or 2 who don't like big corporations and want to root for the little guy...a juror or 2 who also had a personal tragedy and can sympathize with wanting to blame Royal...one good (or potentially confusing) argument from the Plaintiff's attorney that makes a connection with a couple of jurors...etc. If Royal can't get the case dropped, I think they will settle somehow, likely with no admission of guilt. Guessing that's what the Plaintiff's lawyer, and maybe the family, are betting on. I think this will happen also. There comes a point, where it is better to settle than to continue to fight. We will never know the terms or how much was awarded, but it will be cheaper for RC than to continue to fight. As far as the GF, he has a life sentence even if he will never admit to doing something so stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare CruisingWalter Posted January 23, 2020 #317 Share Posted January 23, 2020 It's a sad situation where nobody will win. Anyone who has cruised even once on these ships knows it's near impossible to not realize a window is open, especially if you've taken the time to lean out the window. To hold your granddaughter outside a ship for over 30 seconds is reprehensible. To then claim the cruise line is in any way at fault is irresponsible. Again, nobody will win but there is absolutely no reason for Royal to admit any fault nor settle any claim with this family. The incident was wholly the fault of the grandfather. That won't bring back the child or ease the family's pain, but it is, what it is. An entirely avoidable situation. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNcruising02 Posted January 23, 2020 #318 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, twins_to_alaska said: If the stepGF had taken the plea deal then that would have put a serious crimp in the lawsuit and the grasp for $$$. That is exactly why I think he won't accept a plea deal. It would tank the parents' already sinking case. The GF held that poor little girl out a window. An accident would have been holding her up to the window and her lunging forward. Holding her out the window is a deliberate negligent act that nobody in his or her right mind would ever do with a toddler. Edited January 23, 2020 by TNcruising02 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cafedumonde Posted January 23, 2020 #319 Share Posted January 23, 2020 It is pretty obvious to me that Royal will fight this. Releasing the statement was unprecedented for a large corporation being sued. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRF Posted January 23, 2020 #320 Share Posted January 23, 2020 21 hours ago, akcruz said: For all those on this thread that are insinuating that in any way this was an intentional act by the GF, I strongly disagree and really dislike seeing such accusations. While I do believe the GF is solely responsible for this child's death I find it very hard to believe there was anything intentional here. HOW do you know that??????? Most have stated that it is a POSSIBILITY. Not that it was definite thing. You find it hard to believe, because you are a reasonable person. There ARE some very bad people in the world. 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkacmom Posted January 23, 2020 #321 Share Posted January 23, 2020 1 hour ago, SRF said: HOW do you know that??????? Most have stated that it is a POSSIBILITY. Not that it was definite thing. You find it hard to believe, because you are a reasonable person. There ARE some very bad people in the world. Maybe one in a zillion chance? There is absolutely not a bit of information anyone to believe this, unless maybe then had tendencies themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShillyShally Posted January 23, 2020 #322 Share Posted January 23, 2020 9 minutes ago, mjkacmom said: Maybe one in a zillion chance? There is absolutely not a bit of information anyone to believe this, unless maybe then had tendencies themselves. We had a local incident years ago where a grandmother intentionally dropped a toddler from a pedestrian bridge at a local shopping mall. No signs at all in advance that made anyone concerned. Again, you only get what news makes it into an article, never first hand, and who would ever say "I had concerns but I still let them watch my child?" after the fact? While I don't think this incident was intentional, I rarely rule it out. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaniDanielle Posted January 23, 2020 #323 Share Posted January 23, 2020 This whole thing is just sad 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruiser_1977 Posted January 23, 2020 #324 Share Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) Parents seem to now be saying it is physically impossible for the GF to have leaned out the window. I am 5'3" and if I tried I could get my shoulders past the window frame. Not sure what they are trying to say about his feet needing to be 7" off the floor 🤷♀️ David Begnaud the reporter is 5'9". Anello appears to be taller than him in their interview.... https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/ct-nw-royal-caribbean-cruise-ship-death-chloe-wiegand-20200123-2nmrsz3pnvbgjoi5ge7zmd3pqe-story.html Edited January 23, 2020 by JennyB1977 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Another_Critic Posted January 23, 2020 #325 Share Posted January 23, 2020 10 minutes ago, JennyB1977 said: Parents seem to now be saying it is physically impossible for the GF to have leaned out the window. I am 5'3" and if I tried I could get my shoulders past the window frame. Not sure what they are trying to say about his feet needing to be 7" off the floor 🤷♀️ https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/post-tribune/ct-nw-royal-caribbean-cruise-ship-death-chloe-wiegand-20200123-2nmrsz3pnvbgjoi5ge7zmd3pqe-story.html The family's rebuttal includes a statement the shows that GF was in violation of the Passenger Code of Conduct. "He told “CBS This Morning” in November that he was trying to stand Chloe on the window’s railing when she plunged from the open window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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